# Everybody Knows - "Don't barter ammunition"



## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Video from Viking Preparedness on bartering ammunition. He talks a pretty good angle why you should.


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

To each his own, me? NEVER!

SHTF, there will be no general source of ammo, you may never be able to replace it.

Like all my other preps, I plan on trading nothing, 

Based on my everyday life, I have everything I will need for five years.

Each week items are added, really nothing new just fortifying what I already have. 

I did add 3k of 9MM and 30 Carbine to the mix a couple of weeks ago.

Mostly buy food items.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Me, either. Not that I am worried about it being used against me, but that I will need it.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

I have said it before.. after SHTF you will be able to get plenty of ammo and guns from those fellowers with the blue helmets. 

Shoot straight and true


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

He makes a very valid point, but it would be hard for me to do.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Well in my world the neighbors have told me to my face. Their plan is to take what I have. Yep, their plan for survival is to come over in mass and take what they want. So I'm not going to give them ammo, [email protected]@. Did he not even think someone might be out of ammo. Keeping the gun as a visible threat. Just hoping to find that one round he needs to be back in action, against YOU. Maybe things are different in never never land where he lives.

Horses, don't get me started.

I have numerous other issues with things he said but I'll stop.


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## Tennessee (Feb 1, 2014)

I can understand his reasoning for trading but I don’t agree. He even brought up one of the reasons I think it’s not good ideal to barter ammo. And that’s because the word will get out that you have ammo. For me that puts a big target on your back. I choose to fly under the radar. I don’t want folks to know what I have.

Now after things have calm down and some law and order has been established the maybe I will.


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## Targetshooter (Dec 4, 2015)

What ammo I have saved is what I keep , I will use something else to barter , my skills , or " I do have extra hand tools I have collected " , and I do look for other things to barter with and try to get extra . " no food , no medical , no ammo ,no guns , no water will be bartered " .


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## acidMia (Aug 3, 2016)

I like the idea of a prepared neighbourhood, and the thought that his neighbours will fight the 'bad guys' before they get to him. But in reality, I think you can only 'train' and prepare someone so much. The rest is on them and if they don't wanna, they ain't gonna. They can agree with him, and shoot the shit, but are they really preparing on the scale and scope that he's hinging on? Time will tell, I guess. But I'd rather not rely on my neighbours so heavily. No fear of them, but no trust in them either.


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

I would have no problem bartering ammo.. or even a weapon or 2.. I have rounds of ammo I have no weapon for and have several weapons with odd calibers and little ammo. for all I know I may run across something I need unexpectedly...


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

My neighbor says, if you are with me, and save food with me, we will survive.. Otherwise, you are on your own..


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Chipper said:


> Well in my world the neighbors have told me to my face. Their plan is to take what I have. Yep, their plan for survival is to come over in mass and take what they want. So I'm not going to give them ammo, [email protected]@. Did he not even think someone might be out of ammo. Keeping the gun as a visible threat. Just hoping to find that one round he needs to be back in action, against YOU. Maybe things are different in never never land where he lives.
> 
> Horses, don't get me started.
> 
> I have numerous other issues with things he said but I'll stop.


Looks like when SHTF you are going to need to take what ever action you deem necessary to stop your neighbors plans for you prior to the implementation of said plans. WOW. I do not envy your situation.

No one will want ammo from me as I will have a unique way of giving it to them if necessary. It would be an extraordinary set of circumstances for me to consider bartering ammo (medicine that my wife or kid would die without).


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Best keep your bartering private. Some cities and states that will get you in the crowbar hotel.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

He points out he was special forces and that special forces goes into an area as a team of twelve to train indigenous people. When they do that, they are a team, and not a man or a man and his wife. They are also backed by the U.S. army, and not just one household backed by whatever is in it.
Tribes are going to be more unified in belief system and common norms, mores and taboos than will some neighborhoods in the U.S. 

Yes, I'd rather the fight be taken away from my home, as he says, but what his nice little world doesn't understand is that some of us may have neighbors who are the people you'd prefer to have a away from my home in the first place.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

I'll put it this way...

There is not a thing I own that I would not freely trade away to keep my children fed. Take that as you wish.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

I have learned over Lo, these many years that you can't trust anybody. I am confident that I will will have plenty of what I need. I don't need what anyone else has. I will not need to barter and if it ever were to get that bad, I have enough to share.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Denton said:


> He points out he was special forces and that special forces goes into an area as a team of twelve to train indigenous people. When they do that, they are a team, and not a man or a man and his wife. They are also backed by the U.S. army, and not just one household backed by whatever is in it.
> Tribes are going to be more unified in belief system and common norms, mores and taboos than will some neighborhoods in the U.S.
> 
> Yes, I'd rather the fight be taken away from my home, as he says, but what his nice little world doesn't understand is that some of us may have neighbors who are the people you'd prefer to have a away from my home in the first place.


He point blank said that if you have bad neighbors you need to move.

His point is simple. Barter ammo with people in your immediate area if they need it so they will have ammo to engage the enemy hopefully before you are required to.

The rest fluff.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> I'll put it this way...
> 
> There is not a thing I own that I would not freely trade away to keep my children fed. Take that as you wish.


That may be the way guns are confiscated one day. Turn in your gun and in return you get food.

Know a person with a gun and snitch, you get food and medicine.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> That may be the way guns are confiscated one day. Turn in your gun and in return you get food.
> 
> Know a person with a gun and snitch, you get food and medicine.


When I state that I would freely trade, I should emphasize that the trade will be fair.
Trading freedom for food is not equitable.
If that is the offer, I will violently *TAKE BOTH*.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

Anything you trade to somebody that helps them survive could cause you harm if you take the narrow view. 

If you trade them food it will make them strong and health
if you trade them nails they have better shelter
if you trade them booze it could give them courage to kill you

so in my opinion.. ammo is just another form of payment


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Chipper said:


> Well in my world the neighbors have told me to my face. Their plan is to take what I have. Yep, their plan for survival is to come over in mass and take what they want. So I'm not going to give them ammo, [email protected]@. Did he not even think someone might be out of ammo. Keeping the gun as a visible threat. Just hoping to find that one round he needs to be back in action, against YOU. Maybe things are different in never never land where he lives.
> 
> Horses, don't get me started.
> 
> I have numerous other issues with things he said but I'll stop.


_*IF*_ I had any ammo and _*IF*_ I happened to be in West WI, I'd help Chipper deal with his idiot neighbors.


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

But slippy if I wanted to trade a cask of Jefferson's presidential select for some 22 rounds you would be OK with it right?


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

If not I have some drinking to do.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

baldman said:


> If not I have some drinking to do.


Welcome to my world...:vs_wave:


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

My vast stores are for my use. I intend to keep it that way, yet I realize the value of my stores, and in a crisis will make intelligent decisions as applicable.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

baldman said:


> But slippy if I wanted to trade a cask of Jefferson's presidential select for some 22 rounds you would be OK with it right?


I'll give you a better deal plus I have CCI mini mags. Plus I have 6 women and I'll share. While we get drunk and entertain the ladies we can talk about how we will set slippy up and take over his property.

Give me a call dude if SHTF. Sorry slippy.......:vs_lol:

That's about how it would go.......


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

I don't think I would have any interest in an assault on Slippy Lodge. There are much, much softer targets.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

csi-tech said:


> I don't think I would have any interest in an assault on Slippy Lodge. There are much, much softer targets.


That dog wont hunt.


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

Can't do it I still need genuine slippy pikes.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

baldman said:


> Can't do it I still need genuine slippy pikes.


Of course I was joking about Slippys place but you get the idea.

Made a trade with a good neighbor and a friend of a friend hears you have ammo to trade. Next thing you know they kill you and tell everyone you moved away........or whatever they want to say. WROL so that's that.


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

I want them to come after my shit . Then I will decorate my genuine slippy pikes with them.


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

The rub is... my neighbors have more grain than we do.. and we have plenty.. if they need stuff, I will deal with them (mutually beneficial to be neighborly) because eating all of what we have won't be our main concern, losing it will be.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

When there is a storm and the power goes out for more than an hour, or a tree falls across the road, my doorbell rings. If crap really does go South, break out the generator, the barbecue grill and a venison ham a deck of cards and invite err'body over. Give until it hurts and give a little more. People remember kindness.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Slippy said:


> _*IF*_ I had any ammo and _*IF*_ I happened to be in West WI, I'd help Chipper deal with his idiot neighbors.


 Appreciate it Slip. One big mistake the idiots made was they told me. I don't plan on looking over my shoulder all the time.


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## Ragnarök (Aug 4, 2014)

You could stock broad heads and bolts for trade. Maybe even have extra recurve bows for a sweet trade.

I would trade ammo to a friend but i would be very cautious about even engaging a stranger in that trade in that scenario.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

ND_ponyexpress_ said:


> I would have no problem bartering ammo.. or even a weapon or 2.. I have rounds of ammo I have no weapon for and have several weapons with odd calibers and little ammo. for all I know I may run across something I need unexpectedly...


Kind of my thinking as well. I prep some ammo for the possibility that I may barter some of it. Also, you never know what can occur and what item or services that you may need to barter for. Just yesterday I was just thinking about cost would I pay for medical care that my Daughter may need? Where do you draw the line if their life is in balance?


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

I live in a rural area but I do have about 4 or 5 close neighbors. If the SHTF and after a while they prove themselves some what trustworthy (I don't trust anyone except my maker). then I would probably trade with them. Probably create a security agreement where we would come to each others aid.


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

if the rational is to not trade with them because they may kill you with it later..... then the belief that killing them before they have a chance to kill you isn't far behind!


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## SGT E (Feb 25, 2015)

There's a family of four just down the street...the wife has died of starvation...Dad ain't far behind...they have pretty much given everything to their two kids so that they can live...He comes to you and notices your family is all alive...No weight loss....Looking pretty Healthy!...He asks if he can trade for a couple of 12 gauge shells in 00 buck or a couple slugs so he can try to kill a deer he keeps "SEEING" in the woods behind his house ...You oblige him. Would it be any different with a couple of .22 shells....a .357 round or a 30-30 round?

Now will he take a chance on that Deer he may or may not have seen or knowing your a 100% sure thing...Take a chance on you.

When it gets bad....You have no friends and neighbors...It's DOG EAT DOG! Your neighbor's lives for your kids....No brainer there! Doesn't matter if he was a prepper or wasn't.
No Ammo Barter!! You do not let people get close to you after SHTF...Period!


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

ahh.. but the difference between you and I ... I know the neighbors down each street.. for 10 miles...


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

ND_ponyexpress_ said:


> ahh.. but the difference between you and I ... I know the neighbors down each street.. for 10 miles...


Most people who are murdered are done so by people they know and have trusted in one way or another.

Just say'n


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

yup.. so why not kill them first? that is the logical conclusion to this scenario.


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## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

I have a friend I've known for 40 years. He has friends that I don't know. If I barter him ammo, sooner or later others will find out where he got his and then there will be many pounding on your door. No matter how secretive you try to be, words slip out. If nothing else, they will just follow my bud to see where he gets his ammo. jmo.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Bartering ammo is no difference than bartering food. If you barter, people will know you have something. Long story short, either you barter or you don't. Its how you barter. Don't barter close to home if you are not close to and trust your neighbors. When things chill out and theres bartering fairs in the local town/village then use your best judgement.


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

I would not barter ammo with anyone that I did not know well.
Unless of course there was an item that was really needed, really needed.


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## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

Thats the sticker, people you know well. what about wives and girls friends? We all know women can't keep a secret. Some men too, for that matter.


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## SGT E (Feb 25, 2015)

ND_ponyexpress_ said:


> ahh.. but the difference between you and I ... I know the neighbors down each street.. for 10 miles...


Ahh but will your neighbors watch you feed your kids and let theirs starve and die without killing you? It don't matter if you know them for 500 miles and 50 years...If killing you will save their kids...your dead! And if you can't fathom this...then your not a parent!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

MaterielGeneral said:


> Bartering ammo is no difference than bartering food. If you barter, people will know you have something. Long story short, either you barter or you don't. Its how you barter. Don't barter close to home if you are not close to and trust your neighbors. When things chill out and theres bartering fairs in the local town/village then use your best judgement.


 Food don't shoot back.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Food don't shoot back.


You got a point there Sir. :vs_lol:


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## SGT E (Feb 25, 2015)

Operator6 said:


> You got a point there Sir. :vs_lol:


Well then there's Pinto Beans and grean Onions....I beg to differ....Some food does shoot back!


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## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

True that!!


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## Moonshinedave (Mar 28, 2013)

Like about everything else I'll be playing it by ear ( I know pretty lame answer). I'm not planning on running out nor even low on ammo, but I can't say down the road a sack of seed potatoes or perhaps a water pump for my truck might be worth a few rounds of ammo, and I assure you I won't be trading unarmed.


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

SGT E said:


> Ahh but will your neighbors watch you feed your kids and let theirs starve and die without killing you? It don't matter if you know them for 500 miles and 50 years...If killing you will save their kids...your dead! And if you can't fathom this...then your not a parent!


closest neighbor is 3 miles to the north.. and they have 20k bushel of grain and peas in the bins.. just like us... next closest is 4 miles to the south.. and that's wife's cousin... after that it is 5 miles east.. and they have less grain.. but still 8-10k bushel. 5 mi SE there is a cattle rancher with full bins as well.. 1 mi SE of them is a family with chickens, goats, home schooled and prepped.. other than that.. nobody to the W for 10 miles.. nobody else S for 12 miles.. ... long story short.. I know all their names, faces, pets, children..We won't starve! I would prefer to have them all armed.. even at the expense of some of my ammo. because they are simply an extension of my defensive perimeter, and I am their's. we are all in the same foxhole and aren't each others enemy.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

ND_ponyexpress_ said:


> closest neighbor is 3 miles to the north.. and they have 20k bushel of grain and peas in the bins.. just like us... next closest is 4 miles to the south.. and that's wife's cousin... after that it is 5 miles east.. and they have less grain.. but still 8-10k bushel. 5 mi SE there is a cattle rancher with full bins as well.. 1 mi SE of them is a family with chickens, goats, home schooled and prepped.. other than that.. nobody to the W for 10 miles.. nobody else S for 12 miles.. ... long story short.. I know all their names, faces, pets, children..We won't starve! I would prefer to have them all armed.. even at the expense of some of my ammo. because they are simply an extension of my defensive perimeter, and I am their's. we are all in the same foxhole and aren't each others enemy.


I hope you have a communication plan with them either now or for after SHTF.


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

I am always reminded of what Kay said in the first Men in Black movie when discussing ammo bartering.

Kay: People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it.

I never say never but shit goes bad I am inclined to keep what ever stores I have to myself. Particularly in the initial stages.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Some folks are expressing concerns about being "that guy" when it comes to who others get their ammo from.

I feel obliged to again lend some knowledge passed on to us by a former member.
As PaulS once replied when discussing bartering, never be "the guy". Be the guy who "knows a guy". "I think I know a guy who can get that" should become your mantra.
Your trading should NEVER be done at home, or in private. Your trading should NEVER be done at the point where both parties have "the goods" at the same time.
Become the "Red of Shawshank prison" in you neighborhood. Your entire survival relies on your reputation as the guy who can get things and never fails on a deal.
Meet, make an agreement, take payment, schedule a meeting at a later time to deliver "the goods". Don't use the same meeting place too often, and never approach from the same direction. Always double back, be sure you're never followed, be unpredictable in your route.
Done right, nobody ever finds out where you live, that you're *actually* "the guy", and your side of the trade is always tucked safely away before you meet again, decreasing the chances of a double-cross, since you don't have their payment on you anymore.
Killing you would put a huge burden on any future needs they may have that you could no longer get, and not knowing where you have your stash means no reward for doing so. Keeping you alive is in their best interest.

This provides for a near-perfect scenario where it doesn't matter *what* you're trading, as long as you remain good on your agreement.


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## TacticalCanuck (Aug 5, 2014)

Its hard to know in the long term what one would do. Short term no way. And the longer out you go the more valuable it becomes. Trading a farmer a box of 50 rounds for a large basket of grain and some meat a year into the chaos would be a great deal. 

To survive long term we will need others who are ready to survive. 

Look at nazi occupation and see the tricks and tactics they used to get people to tell in each other. They took everything and controlled its distribution. To think that the controlling government wouldnt do that here is a failure in logic.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> Some folks are expressing concerns about being "that guy" when it comes to who others get their ammo from.
> 
> I feel obliged to again lend some knowledge passed on to us by a former member.
> As PaulS once replied when discussing bartering, never be "the guy". Be the guy who "knows a guy". "I think I know a guy who can get that" should become your mantra.
> ...


I am going to stand with Kauboy on this one ....... its worth a reread in this thread.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> Some folks are expressing concerns about being "that guy" when it comes to who others get their ammo from.
> 
> I feel obliged to again lend some knowledge passed on to us by a former member.
> As PaulS once replied when discussing bartering, never be "the guy". Be the guy who "knows a guy". "I think I know a guy who can get that" should become your mantra.
> ...


People aren't stupid....the guy who can get you things, has things or they are close by.

Dope dealers have been using that tactic for years.......

You might get away with it a time or two......IMO it would catch up to you.

While it might not be in the criminals best interest to kill you, where does that leave you ? Dead....that's where.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> While it might not be in the criminals best interest to kill you, where does that leave you ? Dead....that's where.


I'm sure this sounded profound when you wrote it, but that is the dumbest thing I've ever read.
If this method is followed, nothing is gained from the kill. Even the worst criminals wouldn't bother.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> I'm sure this sounded profound when you wrote it, but that is the dumbest thing I've ever read.
> If this method is followed, nothing is gained from the kill. Even the worst criminals wouldn't bother.


Dope dealers try to rob other dope dealers on a regular basis. Sometimes they win and sometimes they loose.

It would be the same SHTF but WORSE with almost every desirable item you could imagine.

It probably sounds dumb because it doesn't dovetail with your scenario, but that's fine if you want to ignore it.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

You responded to my scenario with a situation out of context with my scenario. That's why it sounded dumb.
You should have nothing of value on you when you deliver the goods, and have already collected your fee prior.
No reason to kill you. You don't have their payment anymore.
Get it now, champ?


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> You responded to my scenario with a situation out of context with my scenario. That's why it sounded dumb.
> You should have nothing of value on you when you deliver the goods, and have already collected your fee prior.
> No reason to kill you. You don't have their payment anymore.
> Get it now, champ?


What you don't understand is that people will kill you for not having anything. In the 80's in New Orleans armed robbers in the French Quarter would kill you for NOT having any or enough money on you.

They were desperate people, crack had just started taking over. They would get very angry when they didn't get what they wanted. 
When SHTF you will find desperate people.

I really do find it amusing that you think a person has to have a reason to kill you. That's cute.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Operator6 said:


> I really do find it amusing that you think a person has to have a reason to kill you. That's cute.


 Sadly your last line is the way our world has become


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Operator6 said:


> You got a point there Sir. :vs_lol:


 My God by instilling a belief in right and wrong in me. makes in nearly impossible not to try to help those in need. Both now and post STHF . Trying to help others does not mean I will be a door mat or an easy mark. We will feed others when the need and ability arises.
Other than standing next to us when all heck breaks lose ,there in not much value in handing ammo over to someone else. At least in my way of think at this time.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> My God by instilling a belief in right and wrong in me. makes in nearly impossible not to try to help those in need. Both now and post STHF . Trying to help others does not mean I will be a door mat or an easy mark. We will feed others when the need and ability arises.
> Other than standing next to us when all heck breaks lose ,there in not much value in handing ammo over to someone else. At least in my way of think at this time.


Just an opinion, Jesus said something to the effect about helping others and not looking for credit because God our father in heaven will know. Help those in need but try to do it unanimously or donate to a church that helps the community after SHTF.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

MaterielGeneral said:


> Just an opinion, Jesus said something to the effect about helping others and not looking for credit because God our father in heaven will know. Help those in need but try to do it unanimously or donate to a church that helps the community after SHTF.


 After SHTF it will be up to each of us to do it directly. No more hiding behind government hands out and red cross.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> After SHTF it will be up to each of us to do it directly. No more hiding behind government hands out and red cross.


Yes, no more gov hand out. Traditionally it was the church that helped the needy until the government wanted in on the action.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> What you don't understand is that people will kill you for not having anything. In the 80's in New Orleans armed robbers in the French Quarter would kill you for NOT having any or enough money on you.
> 
> They were desperate people, crack had just started taking over. They would get very angry when they didn't get what they wanted.
> When SHTF you will find desperate people.
> ...


Then I guess you'll be sure to kill everybody you meet when that time comes, if that's what you think is going to happen.

I find it amusing that you think that will be common in a scenario where EVERYBODY will be depending on EVERYBODY else.

I've realized that once you enter a topic, you won't give up on it, so whatever you say bro, you're right, the world will be shit. Not sure why you want to actually survive it. Oh well.


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## 1775Firearms (Aug 16, 2016)

I would have to agree that trading ammo would most likely not be at the top of my list. Once it is gone it would be very difficult to replace, and I would also be concerned about someone coming back with the ammo I traded them and trying to take more by force. Friend and family know what I have and they are welcome to bring their assets and skills to help out, but giving away essentials would be a last resort .


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

1775Firearms said:


> I would have to agree that trading ammo would most likely not be at the top of my list. Once it is gone it would be very difficult to replace, and I would also be concerned about someone coming back with the ammo I traded them and trying to take more by force. Friend and family know what I have and they are welcome to bring their assets and skills to help out, but giving away essentials would be a last resort .


Not everyone buys AMMO for every weapon they own. The surplus is great bartering. Its how you barter, when you barter. You have to know when, where, and how soon to barter. And just make sure you are not the person that is bartering. You are the person that knows a person that may have????


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