# It's SHTF for real, folks



## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

I know a lot of members here think the people of Puerto Rico are lazy leeches who are undeserving of hurricane aid. I've been there, and I disagree. True, some are welfare queens, but most are hardworking American Citizens, who try to cope with a corrupt government, the likes of which boggles the mind. My heart goes out to them in this terrible crisis; a crisis that all of us as preppers should be able to identify with: the complete loss of electrical power.

/rant off, sorry

Our local professional baseball team has a long standing association with PR, starting with the Great Roberto Clemente back in the 50's, and are putting together a relief effort for the island. They are hoping to get what everyone here would expect: canned food, bottled water, batteries, garbage bags, etc.

So I put together my own personal relief package of those items to take down to the ball yard. It was, oh I don't know, one twentieth of my stored goods. My sister-in-law, who is a good person, wanted to contribute but had to go to the grocery store to buy all the items she is donating. She just can't understand what I've told her repeatedly, that she needs to store food and water for HERSELF. That she could become one of those desperate people due to any number of circumstances.

Does anyone have a good argument to convert the non-prepper to common sense?

Puerto Rican CEO: Local government 'corrupt' and 'totally inexperienced' in Maria cleanup | Fox News


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## Redneck (Oct 6, 2016)

sideKahr said:


> Does anyone have a good argument to convert the non-prepper to common sense?


Nope. Gave up a long time ago.

Our church youth group came over last night. I fed them red beans & rice and boiled shrimp. They put together a bunch of health kits, that we will send to our denomination's relief team, that will send them on down to the island.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

'Puerto Rico cop' says officials are starving citizens | Daily Mail Online

The relief is there. Getting it to the starving is the problem.


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## 23897 (Apr 18, 2017)

[QUOTE/]Does anyone have a good argument to convert the non-prepper to common sense?
[/QUOTE]

Only this:

http://darwin-online.org.uk/converted/pdf/1859_Origin_F373.pdf

Fangfarrier

Sent from my iPhone using Technology whilst it still exists.


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Thanks, FF. Very good. LOL.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Docks and ports are full of supplies but less then 20% of the truck drivers will show up for work. So there your supplies sit. It's not our fault but it's clearly the lazy people's own fault that their country men are starving. Sending more stuff to just rot on the ships and docks isn't doing anybody one darn bit of good.

This will happen in the states also when the SHTF. As a driver I'm not leaving the safety of my BOL and family to haul stuff for the unprepared. Let alone risk my life with gang members looting supplies for profit.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Chipper said:


> Docks and ports are full of supplies but less then 20% of the truck drivers will show up for work. So there your supplies sit. It's not our fault but it's clearly the lazy people's own fault that their country men are starving. Sending more stuff to just rot on the ships and docks isn't doing anybody one darn bit of good.
> 
> This will happen in the states also when the SHTF. As a driver I'm not leaving the safety of my BOL and family to haul stuff for the unprepared. Let alone risk my life with gang members looting supplies for profit.


Fellow at work is PR. We've been getting reports from him, as his grandmother has a landline. As it turns out, landlines are the only decent means of communication as the cell towers were destroyed.
With communications out, logistics is all screwed up. On top of that, as you said, people are worried about their families' safety.

Temporary cell towers have been placed along major roadways, but once people found out about that they jumped in their cars and sped to them in order to make calls. As you can imagine, they burned valuable fuel in order to go and overload the system.


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## SanAntonioPrepper (Apr 10, 2017)

Regardless of where the hangup is (getting the supplies to the island or getting the supplies that were delivered distributed) the fact remains there is a hangup. A chain is only as strong as the weakest link. This hangup//bottleneck/weak link is causing people to die and to suffer. 

Its not that people do not have some degree of sheltering in Puerto Rico because of the hurricane, its they have not power and running water or food storage because of it. This, and their are hangups and inefficiencies in the system. Always has been, probably always will be. 

With Puerto Rico, we are looking at a mirror example of these conditions here in the mainland US if an EMP were to strike. After seeing what we are seeing, still trust any government (on any side of the isle) to "get to us" and "take care of us after the fact"?


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## Jammer Six (Jun 2, 2017)

SanAntonioPrepper said:


> With Puerto Rico, we are looking at a mirror example of these conditions here in the mainland US if an EMP were to strike.


No, we're not.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Food for thought: if there was a major military base in PR, would some bull dozers and military convoys make a difference?


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## Tired_Yeti (Oct 1, 2017)

sideKahr said:


> Does anyone have a good argument to convert the non-prepper to common sense?


Argument? No.
Only personal experience. Hurricane Ike created some preppers. Hurricane Harvey created some preppers. Hurricane Irma is creating preppers. Most people are afraid to "look like a fool" to others and they see it as a waste of money. Until they are caught vulnerable and left suffering, they won't get it. Your sister may very well expect that you'll take her in during a disaster so why should she prepare? Besides, how will she get all her preps over to your place if that's were she's going?
I can't read her mind, but those kind of thoughts are pretty common.

Personally, I don't prep because someone warned me. I prep because I have, personally, been caught alone and without resources. I've been trapped in empty buildings, I've been caught out in the ice and snow of winter--on foot--without food, money, or even a knife. So I learned the hard way. My motivation to prepare is real. Verbal and visual warnings are usually not heeded. Only the VERY wise among us actually learn form others' mistakes and stay motivated by it.

_"The more you know, the less you carry. The less you know, the more you carry." - Mors Kochanski_


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

I heard the union truck driver were doing some kind of a sit down at the sea ports.

Military trucks and drivers are being deployed for aid distribution.

I think PR is looking at this as a windfall to bail out the territories corrupt political actions for decades.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

While I feel sorry for anyone that goes thru a hurricane and suffers damage, any damage, I feel they should have known they are putting themselves in the path of destruction and possible death. Some of these people are wealthy and have million dollar places on the beach. But when we, the taxpayer bails any of these people out, we are simply subsidizing their lifestyle. Are we really willing to to say, live the good life with tropical breezes and all, but don't worry, we'll pull you fat out of the fire when something bad happens. The island have hurricanes every few years. Are we going to just continue to let them live the life they choose and not take any responsibility for the choices. BTW, I feel the same about my brother-in-law in FL, and some other relatives down that way. It's like playing with matches and burning your house down and expecting your neighbors to foot the bill for repairs.


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

Can Trump just take the damn island over, via some UN BS rule? we had a Navy base there for years. They wanted us gone, we left, and boy are they missing that. But the drivers down there are going to get payback from the man upstairs. Deal with the strike issues later. Get the blessed supplies out to the people.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Unless I am there to personally hand goods over to the starving/needy there is no way in hell I'd send anything let alone one can of corn to P.R. It will not reach those who need it,

The government is corrupt beyond corrupt, and many of the people are corrupt as well.
@sideKahr,

You know I think you to be the best of the best, and I know that you will work hard to replace what you gave away and will be fine. I hope your charity gets to those in need.

I am now going to call my Congressman and let him know that not one more dollar of foreign aid should be sent from the tax coffers of the USA


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

I do not know a way to do it, I have tried several ways on several occasions to get folks to understand. I would say if she does not get it by now she never will.


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

Camel923 said:


> Food for thought: if there was a major military base in PR, would some bull dozers and military convoys make a difference?


Ft Buchanan is there. There are backhoes and bull dozers , no idea why roads should be closed for over a week . I see the highways are now open though some areas have lost bridges so unless they have a high clearance vehicle they cannot drive across the rivers.

As to getting drivers who are in country to work not sure what is going on .


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

Steve40th said:


> Can Trump just take the damn island over, via some UN BS rule? we had a Navy base there for years. They wanted us gone, we left, and boy are they missing that. But the drivers down there are going to get payback from the man upstairs. Deal with the strike issues later. Get the blessed supplies out to the people.


What are you talking about . UN??? Puerto Rico is American .


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## Tired_Yeti (Oct 1, 2017)

paraquack said:


> While I feel sorry for anyone that goes thru a hurricane and suffers damage, any damage, I feel they should have known they are putting themselves in the path of destruction and possible death. Some of these people are wealthy and have million dollar places on the beach. But when we, the taxpayer bails any of these people out, we are simply subsidizing their lifestyle. Are we really willing to to say, live the good life with tropical breezes and all, but don't worry, we'll pull you fat out of the fire when something bad happens. The island have hurricanes every few years. Are we going to just continue to let them live the life they choose and not take any responsibility for the choices. BTW, I feel the same about my brother-in-law in FL, and some other relatives down that way. It's like playing with matches and burning your house down and expecting your neighbors to foot the bill for repairs.


What makes you think those people didn't pay taxes?
You think YOUR tax money is the only money being sent? Their getting the services their taxes paid for. When the SHTF for you, you'll help too that you paid for.

When Hurricane Harvey hit us and I was wading hip deep in flood water dragging a raft to help with boat rescues, I didn't see any wealthy affluent people. I saw destitute people whose houses were ruined and their property destroyed.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

SOCOM42 said:


> I heard the union truck driver were doing some kind of a sit down at the sea ports.
> 
> Military trucks and drivers are being deployed for aid distribution.
> 
> I think PR is looking at this as a windfall to bail out the territories corrupt political actions for decades.


I was told that the drivers were demañding to be paid $50 an hour or else they would not drive.


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## Jammer Six (Jun 2, 2017)

I heard they weren't going to drive until President Trump is removed from office.


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Slippy said:


> Unless I am there to personally hand goods over to the starving/needy there is no way in hell I'd send anything let alone one can of corn to P.R. It will not reach those who need it,
> 
> The government is corrupt beyond corrupt, and many of the people are corrupt as well.
> @sideKahr,
> ...


I agree with you, Slippy. The only reason I'm participating is that the owner of the ball club and his staff are personally accompanying the goods down by air and handing them out. Otherwise, the people probably wouldn't get them.

There was an unexpected bonus; I met and got to talk with Omar Moreno and Steve Blass. A blast from the past.


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## Redneck (Oct 6, 2016)

Slippy said:


> Unless I am there to personally hand goods over to the starving/needy there is no way in hell I'd send anything let alone one can of corn to P.R. It will not reach those who need it,


I'm Methodist now (been Southern Baptist & raised Episcopal) and we have UMCOR, the United Methodist Committee On Relief. With them, if you specify a specific crisis, then 100% of your donation goes there. They stock all sorts of kits, such as cleaning, hygiene & school, and that is what our youth group collects donations for, purchases the goods & then packs up.
@Slippy, I know where you are coming from as I too don't trust people. Trouble is such a cynical heart keeps folks from seeing the good (Jesus) in you. I'd rather half my donations get to those that need it than none. When in doubt, I go with the standard question... what would Jesus do? Would he do nothing if he couldn't personally hand over the goods to those in need? Is that what He expects from me? Best thing I know to do is put my trust in organizations setup to handle such a crisis. Goes back to that thing called faith. Even with UMCOR, if my donation/efforts were somehow wasted, I can live with that. I couldn't live with myself for not helping. When my time comes for judgement, I figure I'd rather have this deed on my ledger than nothing at all. We are in a fight with evil and sitting on the sidelines is a victory for Satan.

UMCOR Home - UMCOR


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## Illini Warrior (Jan 24, 2015)

Prez Trump is flying into the PR and the Virgin Islands today - meeting the people and the relief workers - usual handshake stuff .... looks like some special time with the US military down there ....

in regard to the donation situation - if you want your $$$$$ going to TX or FL you better find a specific organization with that guarantee - seeing a whole lot of PR and Mexico and nothing else ....

seeing all kinds of negativity about PR - even Prez Trump commented about the lack of them pulling up their big boy britches and getting things done ....


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Illini Warrior said:


> Prez Trump is flying into the PR and the Virgin Islands today - meeting the people and the relief workers - usual handshake stuff .... looks like some special time with the US military down there ....


Hey, Illini. Are you aware that your sig line is malfunctioning. All I can see is the code to produce the sig, and not the signature itself:

COLOR="#FFA500"] *SIZE=5]I[/SIZE]* llini *SIZE=5]W[/SIZE]*SIZE=3]arrior[/SIZE][/COLOR


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

ANOTHER issue.. delivering frozen food or refrigerated goods (insulin, milk, meat) to stores with NO power....!!!!


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