# What I've Been Up To



## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

I haven't died, I've been busy making some changes in my garden to try to make growing food viable here where water is so expensive.

The garden established by the previous owner of the house is small. It includes five 4 by 12 foot raised beds and two smaller beds that are approximately 30 inches by 10 feet. For some reason that I will never understand, they f filled them with soil from this property. When I say soil, I'm speaking in the loosest possible way because the "soil" is pretty much pure sand. It's an actual wonder that things grow in it, but some things (big sagebrush, antelope bitterbrush, rabbitbrush, purple sage, a variety of wildflowers and grasses, both native and invasive) do well. The entire 24 acres is covered in plant life.

I almost could have understood them filling the boxes with sand (it's expensive to have topsoil delivered and the topsoil that the neighbor had hauled in looked like...wait for it...sand) if I could have seen evidence that they'd made any efforts to improve the "soil," but there was no evidence whatsoever. The soil still looked like plain sand.

A conversation I had with @JustAnotherNut got me thinking outside the box (this is a pun, you'll see) a little bit about what I could do to improve the water holding capacity of my soil and so that's what I've been doing for the past several weeks.

Since I hadn't had a garden her the last few years, the whole thing was an overgrown, weedy mess. Remember the invasive grasses I mentioned? The garden was covered in cheat grass, which is annoying for humans, but terrible for dogs as it can burrow in between their toes. So the first order of business was to get rid of the cheat grass. I weed whacked it down then raked it and hauled it out of the garden. No doubt there are millions of seeds left behind and I'll have to stay on top of pulling it all season. I'm hoping I don't have to resort to using Round-Up.

After the cheat grass was whacked down, I pulled it up by the roots out of the beds the best I could. Then I started to dig. I removed all the soil from the first of the smaller beds, then layered in cardboard and straw, using the removed soil to fill in around the straw. Then I topped it off with bagged garden soil and compost. On the first bed, it didn't occur to me to water each layer as I laid it in and that turned out to be a little bit of an issue, but eventually I did get good moisture down to the bottom of the bed. It helped that we've had an unusually we spring here in the shrub steppe.

I repeated that process on the second small bed, watering after each later. When both beds were ready, I transplanted my tomato, pepper and cucumber starts into the beds.

I finished the small beds by myself but was relieved when my husband showed up to help me with the larger beds. We handled these a little differently. We dug out the dirt and laid down cardboard but then, instead of layering straw, we put in some rotting wood he had hauled over from the other place. We filled in around the wood with the best of the soil we had removed (I had amended the soil over the course of several years so that the top several inches no longer resembled pure sand) and then topped it off, again, with bagged garden soil and compost.

For one of the beds, I tried something completely crazy. Instead of pulling up the roots of the grasses that had been whacked down, I cut holes in it and planted pumpkin seeds. Then I soaked the bed and mulched it, first with cardboard, then with a layer of straw. Because the wind blows incessantly here, I put chicken wire over the top of the straw. My thinking was that the grass stubble will compost underneath the heavy mulch. We'll see, I guess.

We finished two of the larger beds before he had to go back to western Washington. I'm going to start digging the third bed today. I don't have rotted wood, so after putting down the cardboard, I'll add some straw, then branches from some dead trees that my husband took down while he was here.

Everything I've planted so far has gone into the ground later than a person would normally plant here, so I'm hoping for a good yield. Any yield at this point, really. Hopefully the work we've done so far will give us the results we expect in terms of soil improvement.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

I have photos to go with this, but they aren't uploading. Any thoughts on that?


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## Redneck (Oct 6, 2016)

paulag1955 said:


> I have photos to go with this, but they aren't uploading. Any thoughts on that?


I upload to a third party site, then post the link here by typing









Good luck on the garden. I can't imagine having a garden in such a climate.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

******* said:


> Good luck on the garden. I can't imagine having a garden in such a climate.


It's a challenge. I want to have a well drilled so that I feel free to use water a little more freely, but it's sooooooo expensive.


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## MountainGirl (Oct 29, 2017)

paulag1955 said:


> It's a challenge. I want to have a well drilled so that I feel free to use water a little more freely, but it's sooooooo expensive.


Nice to see you back, glad to learn your hubs escaped the crud. 
Lotta work ahead of you there, glad you're getting it ready in case you need it later, iykwim.


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## Chiefster23 (Feb 5, 2016)

Sounds like you got off to a great start considering your climate and available materials. Good luck and keep us posted.


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## Michael_Js (Dec 4, 2013)

paulag1955 said:


> It's a challenge. I want to have a well drilled so that I feel free to use water a little more freely, but it's sooooooo expensive.


Good to hear from you! Are you running city water now? Do you collect rain runoff? Yes, we had a well priced - about $22K!!! We run off a spring, but it's never been officially "registered" and doesn't originate on our property - but has been in use since the mid 40's!

Best of success! Our garden is going slowly...been weeding and planting whenever it's not raining - which has been far & few between!!

Peace,
Michael J.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

Michael_Js said:


> Good to hear from you! Are you running city water now? Do you collect rain runoff? Yes, we had a well priced - about $22K!!! We run off a spring, but it's never been officially "registered" and doesn't originate on our property - but has been in use since the mid 40's!
> 
> Best of success! Our garden is going slowly...been weeding and planting whenever it's not raining - which has been far & few between!!
> 
> ...


We'd be lucky to get away for less than $28,000 over here based on how much my neighbors paid a couple of years ago. They'd probably have to go 275 to 300 feet deep if we drilled at the lowest point of our property. Then after we pumped it to the surface, we'd have to pump it another 100-150 feet to the house. I've just started looking in to rain harvesting. I calculated that we could collect as much as 15,000 gallons a year from the roofs of the house and garage. That seems incredible for an area that only gets an average of 12 inches of precipitation annually.

ETA: We're on a community water system that's woefully inadequate for current use and owned by a company that seems to be bent on charging as much as possible for the least possible level of service.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

MountainGirl said:


> Nice to see you back, glad to learn your hubs escaped the crud.
> Lotta work ahead of you there, glad you're getting it ready in case you need it later, iykwim.


Thanks! We're looking at different ways we can expand the garden.

We have three large willow trees directly to the west of the garden. I love them because, you know, trees in the desert, shade, bird habitat and all that. But based on the number of willow roots I dug out of the bed this morning, I think they're going to have to go. And two of the beds are even closer to the trees! I can't afford to water non-food producing trees. So that would be one area we could expand into. There's also a space to the east between the current garden and another fenced-in area (I think the previous owners used it as a dog run) we could fence in and use. Then we could use the former dog run as a chicken coop with a gate into the garden. Could be useful for the hens to have the run of the garden in a bad grasshopper year.


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## MountainGirl (Oct 29, 2017)

paulag1955 said:


> Thanks! We're looking at different ways we can expand the garden.
> 
> We have three large willow trees directly to the west of the garden. I love them because, you know, trees in the desert, shade, bird habitat and all that. But based on the number of willow roots I dug out of the bed this morning, I think they're going to have to go. And two of the beds are even closer to the trees! I can't afford to water non-food producing trees. So that would be one area we could expand into. There's also a space to the east between the current garden and another fenced-in area (I think the previous owners used it as a dog run) we could fence in and use. Then we could use the former dog run as a chicken coop with a gate into the garden. Could be useful for the hens to have the run of the garden in a bad grasshopper year.


Hope you rethink cutting down the willows, especially if their white willows (medicinal properties). If they're large they're self-sustaining (no additional watering required) & already part of the ecosystem. Kinda surprised that you have willows at all as they usually require a LOT of water. Even over here the only place they grow are around the lakes. Maybe by your other garden would be better? I know having all things that need watering close together cuts down on chores, and keeping fences/pens together might be cheaper...but, your garden, your world. 

Have fun!


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

Hey, glad to see you back. I sure hope your efforts pay off with a good harvest and don't forget to put a good layer of mulch on top of the soil too, to slow evaporation. AND get a compost pile going so you have more organic matter to amend those beds next year. That can include clean up in the chicken coop & run...….plus once the garden is harvested, let the chickens in there to work those beds, by scratching & turning it for you....plus adding their fertilizer in the process. 

My collection of rain water consists of some buckets under the eaves of my coop/greenhouse.....total roof space of about 10x12 but much of it's wasted without a gutter, but those buckets can get filled after a 30 minute shower, if that long. It doesn't take much to get a lot, as long as you have a better way of storing it. You can also use that collected rain water, to water the chickens and other pets or animals to save on usage with the water company or well.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

MountainGirl said:


> Hope you rethink cutting down the willows, especially if their white willows (medicinal properties). If they're large they're self-sustaining (no additional watering required) & already part of the ecosystem. Kinda surprised that you have willows at all as they usually require a LOT of water. Even over here the only place they grow are around the lakes. Maybe by your other garden would be better? I know having all things that need watering close together cuts down on chores, and keeping fences/pens together might be cheaper...but, your garden, your world.
> 
> Have fun!


I have been agonizing over those trees since we bought the place. It almost seems like a crime to cut them, but my space is limited. the other location would just be a small addition to what's already here; maybe three additional raised beds. The willows are austrees, which is a hybrid of white willows and Hankow willows. I don't suppose there's any way to know if they have any medicinal properties, and I'm not sure why they grow here without supplemental water. Also not sure why the previous owner thought it would be a good idea to plant them right next to the garden.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

JustAnotherNut said:


> Hey, glad to see you back. I sure hope your efforts pay off with a good harvest and don't forget to put a good layer of mulch on top of the soil too, to slow evaporation. AND get a compost pile going so you have more organic matter to amend those beds next year. That can include clean up in the chicken coop & run...&#8230;.plus once the garden is harvested, let the chickens in there to work those beds, by scratching & turning it for you....plus adding their fertilizer in the process.
> 
> My collection of rain water consists of some buckets under the eaves of my coop/greenhouse.....total roof space of about 10x12 but much of it's wasted without a gutter, but those buckets can get filled after a 30 minute shower, if that long. It doesn't take much to get a lot, as long as you have a better way of storing it. You can also use that collected rain water, to water the chickens and other pets or animals to save on usage with the water company or well.


My plan is to mulch with straw and also with cardboard as feasible. It's pretty hard to mulch some of the closer spaced plants. I never would have thought of letting chickens work the soil in the fall. That's a great idea. We do have to figure out how to give them protection from overhead predators, though. Lots of hawks around here and sometimes an eagle or two will linger into the summer months.


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

paulag1955 said:


> My plan is to mulch with straw and also with cardboard as feasible. It's pretty hard to mulch some of the closer spaced plants. I never would have thought of letting chickens work the soil in the fall. That's a great idea. We do have to figure out how to give them protection from overhead predators, though. Lots of hawks around here and sometimes an eagle or two will linger into the summer months.


I've seen some have some kind of netting that you could put up over the top of the dog run and/or garden. OR provide some kind of an overhead shelter of some sort, that the chickens can get under for protection.

You'd be surprised how smart chickens can be (if they choose). Even here where I am in Tacoma, there are hawks & bald eagles and if my chickens are outside when they are flying overhead, my birds will disappear by hiding either under the eaves of the house, or back into the coop, or some other spot out of sight. I really doubt I'd have a problem here, just because of the size of my yard with a couple of trees, fences and sheds for obstacles any predators know there's not enough room for them to take off from.

With one exception, but wasn't a predator. We did have a Canadian goose end up in our backyard & couldn't get out. Somehow it had injured it's leg just enough to limp but not serious. So hubs had caught it and took it to a nearby field...&#8230;...and eagles are much bigger than a goose.


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

paulag1955 said:


> My plan is to mulch with straw and also with cardboard as feasible. It's pretty hard to mulch some of the closer spaced plants. I never would have thought of letting chickens work the soil in the fall. That's a great idea. We do have to figure out how to give them protection from overhead predators, though. Lots of hawks around here and sometimes an eagle or two will linger into the summer months.


oh and btw...&#8230;.it's probably just easier to use only the mulch, straw or grass clippings over the top of the soil & around the plants...&#8230;.cardboard works better either on the bottom of the bed, or over the top after the season is over. But if you have chickens, then cardboard is out.

Another thing...&#8230;&#8230;..if you can make some kind of clear topper, hoop, row cover or something to provide protection, it can help extend your growing season.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

JustAnotherNut said:


> Even here where I am in Tacoma...


Funny story about Tacoma. My grandmother raised her family there and continued to live there up until she had a stroke and came to live with us near Renton (I around 11 so still living at home). She was not very happy with this and complained a lot about Renton not being Tacoma. In the winter she would tell us that Tacoma was warmer. In the summer she would tell us that Tacoma was cooler. Food was cheaper. People were nicer and so on.

But I digress.


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

paulag1955 said:


> Funny story about Tacoma. My grandmother raised her family there and continued to live there up until she had a stroke and came to live with us near Renton (I around 11 so still living at home). She was not very happy with this and complained a lot about Renton not being Tacoma. In the winter she would tell us that Tacoma was warmer. In the summer she would tell us that Tacoma was cooler. Food was cheaper. People were nicer and so on.
> 
> But I digress.


Well, I don't know about the differences in weather cause that's a crapshoot around the Sound......but I'd probably agree atleast somewhat about the food prices, since Renton is King county with higher tax rates & cost of living. But I'd guess her complaints were more about missing her own home and the loss of independence.


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

Just in case you wanted to see some of my mess...…..trying out the berm/swale with plenty of straw mulch.....which has a lot of grain seed in it, which I'm allowing to grow so the chickens have some free food. I planted 3 rows of taters with bush beans in between which are doing ok given the wet weather we've had.....and that's not counting all the volunteers coming up everywhere else from last year. I finally gave up on the beets & carrots & pulled them up for now. I'll try replanting in another month or so for a fall crop.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

I mean... This was in the mid 60s so I don't know how much of a difference there was back then, but you are right. I wasn't about food prices or the weather at all.


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## Chiefster23 (Feb 5, 2016)

Funny you should mention beets and carrots. Here in PA I am also having problems with both my beets and carrots. I’ver replanted several times without much sucess. A buddy is also having the same issues so it’s not just me and you. I wonder why.


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## JustAnotherNut (Feb 27, 2017)

Chiefster23 said:


> Funny you should mention beets and carrots. Here in PA I am also having problems with both my beets and carrots. I'ver replanted several times without much sucess. A buddy is also having the same issues so it's not just me and you. I wonder why.


In all my years of gardening, I've discovered that there is always a few crops that don't do much of anything, a few that provide abundantly and others that fall somewhere in the middle of the bang or bust...&#8230;.and it seems it's usually the same or similar crops with everybody.

Last year and possibly this year as well...&#8230;.potatoes are going crazy. My peas are doing pretty good this year but taking forever to get there. They were planted around St Patty's and just now flowering & putting on pods. I've gotten one picking so far with plenty more promised.

Green beans......so far, the bush are doing ok but my poles are struggling. Some are growing fine while others look like they've been torched. May be the soil but I can't get out there until it dries out. Hopefully later this week. Beans are usually my reliable bumper crop


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