# Help: Panic buy?



## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

This forum has been particularly good to me. I really appreciate it.
My church prepper group met Monday night and the shooting in Vegas
was our topic. Members said don't panic buy. I can't help but be
panicked. We just started prepping in July. We spent some savings
on a Ruger 1022 and a RIA 1911 with a 22 kit. I don't really have a 
defensive shotgun or rifle. I really fear whats going on will make
things worse for us here in CA. And no I can't move.

I just ordered a 1000 rounds of 45 acp sellior and bellot from 
SGAmmo for $233 plus shipping. I also got a case of 3,250 rounds
of 22 a few weeks back fro about .05 a round. My wife is open
to opening up the credit card and getting more ammo. Shotguns
I think will be safe for some time. By that I think we'll be able to
buy them for a long while yet. Rifles though are getting ugly
to get here in CA. Gun makers are managing to produce rifles
for us within the law, but its not easy.

So I'm thinking about an M1A my local gun shop stocks and is still
legal in CA. I can only get 10 round magazines for it. I shot one
at the range in August and it kicks like a mule but I'm pretty big
and can handle it. My wife didn't shoot it but saw me do so and
thinks she can handle it. 

a) Is the M1A the best choice for me in CA?
b) Do I break out the plastic and buy one? 
c) SG Ammo has a brass ammo for .37 a round - good deal?

I don't want to panic but when you don't have something you
think you should it feels like panic.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

I have an M1A, but I don't live in a place like Stockton. 

I'd suggest the M1A SOCOM, I think.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

How far away do you think you will engage a target? That would maybe change your choice.


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Hard to beat a 12 Ga in a crowded, urban setting where long range shots aren't required. Even so, a .223 semi auto is a nice thing to own.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

I'd get what you can while you can.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

You can still get a Mini-14 in CA, right? That tight little Ruger would get you a much more manageable recoil package(.223) in a design that should pass the CA smell test.
If an AR isn't on the radar, that's my next best choice for similar firepower.
I used to subscribe to the idea that "a shotgun is a beginner's weapon".
But after hearing a shotgun expert discuss the merits, I think I now agree with him. It's an expert's gun. You have to know where EVERY SINGLE BB is going.
Is it a point-n-shoot gun? Yes. But is it safer for a newbie? Not really. If you load it with buckshot, you're sending 9 rounds down range with every shot, and you're accountable for each one.
With a zeroed rifle, your shot goes where the crosshair shows. You know where you're sending rounds.

To answer your other question, do NOT go into debt over this.
Once you break that seal, you will quickly wish you hadn't.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

I am not panic buying and would recommend that others do not panic buy as well. I have a feeling that the Vegas Shooting is going to be determined as a "political terrorist" attack like the Scalise shooting was. I do not own an M1, but I would like to.
I strongly suggest that you give this site, "Ammoseek" a check for ammo when looking to buy.....

https://ammoseek.com/


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Like I told our liberal friend Gus here at PF, where I live your first 5 gun purchases should be made within a few months of each other .... and are considered a starter pack.


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## White Shadow (Jun 26, 2017)

If you want something that your wife can also comfortably fire you may want to check out something in 7.62x39. Has plenty of punch for an urban distance and can be very soft on the shooter. I have a SKS that my wife likes so much she declared it hers.

Disclaimer - The SKS is the first and only gun I have that shoots 7.62x39 and it is fairly heavy so lighter rifles may not be so soft. I'm sure others here can help out there.

Since you can only have 10 round mags there anyways an SKS may not be a bad idea with the internal 10 round magazine. While they are more expensive than they used to be, the SKS can also still be had a lot cheaper than something like the M1A. Classic Firearms is still selling nice condition Serbian SKS rifles for $429. https://www.classicfirearms.com/yugo-sks-semi-auto-762-39-original-condition-pti


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

It will take awhile before Congress and most states can move to restrict and prohibit more weapons than they do now. It is coming. You have time yet. Better to focus on what you feel your needs are. Then you will be ready to purchase when the deal is right.


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

We already have some rules going in place this January.
We'll need a license to buy ammo. No mail order ammo.
No reselling of ammo. That is bad because I bought some
from people in my church group. After January we can't
unless we take it to a gun store and present our license
first. 

Recent changes to AR configurations hurt my head to 
figure out. To buy a new AR means having a gun you
can't change the magazine with until you take apart
the gun. Or you have to have some sort of cover in 
place of a hand grip. Like I said the rules just make my
head hurt. The M1A and I suppose the Mini 14 are 
some how exempt right now. Don't know how long that
will take. Open bolt maybe? Don't know and have a 
hard time figuring out. I know ammo wise I'd rather buy
223 then 308. 

As for distance someone asked? Boy that is a good question.
We live in a pretty suburban area. Though my bug out is to a
golf course (where I work). As you can imagine lots of open 
space there?


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

well Stockton I am not sure how much an m1a runs or what laws you are looking at for ownership of a rifle.
you have a 45 so why not look for something there that is cheaper maybe a hi point 45 carbine?
https://www.classicfirearms.com/mks-hipoint-45ts-45acp-rifle-pack-kit-4595tspro
or if I remember they do make a rifle conversion still for the 45 -mec-tec maybe?
1911 Carbine Conversion Unit - MechTech Systems, Inc. MADE IN USA
or while not fancy a decent bolt or lever action may be ok.


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

Do not go into debt is my advice. 

You have weapons and I think enough ammo . Others will tell you to order another ton or two. 

Put your money on something that is more likely to affect you .

Folks in Vegas that were in the kill zone with guns or with out could do nothing but duck, look for cover and concealment, then run . Rifles have a big draw back for most people in that they do not have them on their person most of the time.


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## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Gun purchasing has already picked up. Prices will probably soon follow. How long it will last is a toss up. Don't panic but do start or increase your gun fund. If you're going to be limited in quantity of guns, make sure your wife can handle them too. Has she been practicing?


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## ND_ponyexpress_ (Mar 20, 2016)

call me crazy..., but I don't believe the senate dems up for election in Trump states want a gun control bill to vote on.. have a hunch the swamp will toss them bump stocks to ban as an olive branch


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

Gun shop will hold it for me until tonight.
I think its a pretty good deal. 
Buds has it at $1348 and shop will sell it 
to me for $1299.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/12582

The one I'd get is black synthetic not this color.

PS this doesn't require debt. It reduces what we
have saved for emergencies which we prioritize in
paying back.


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## Ragnarök (Aug 4, 2014)

Don't Panic first of all. There's nothing to be concerned about right now....In 3 more years you should be concerned. 

I would wait till you can afford a shotgun and get one second hand if that works for you. Since this is cheaper than buying new the process will go faster and you will be less stressed out when you get the shotgun. 

You see a trend if you take the time to reason it out. People panic over stupid stuff and then relax over time.

Another little gem...Oregon does not have sales tax.


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## Ragnarök (Aug 4, 2014)

Stockton said:


> Gun shop will hold it for me until tonight.
> I think its a pretty good deal.
> Buds has it at $1348 and shop will sell it
> to me for $1299.
> ...


You can go a long way with $1300..maybe take a step back and reconsider your options. I'd say you are better off with 2 shotguns and another rifle for $1300 and it can be easily done.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Stock up on .22 LR and a gun or two to choot em.


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

Spend some time and money at a range and get proficient with the weapons you now have.
It will be money well spent for you and wife


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Stockton said:


> Gun shop will hold it for me until tonight.
> I think its a pretty good deal.
> Buds has it at $1348 and shop will sell it
> to me for $1299.
> ...


I believe you have already made up your mind and can afford the peace of mind it affords. Congratulations on your new purchase, I think it is awesome.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Stockton,

Time is getting short so better buy some ammo now. An ammo-less rifle is just an expensive stick.

(Slippy thinks he may just open up a new business located on the border of CA in Arizona, Nevada and Oregon.

*Slippy's Ammo-Land and Pike Emporium*  has a nice ring! :vs_wave



Stockton said:


> We already have some rules going in place this January.
> We'll need a license to buy ammo. No mail order ammo.
> No reselling of ammo. That is bad because I bought some
> from people in my church group. After January we can't
> ...


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

All about nothing. This will come to nothing other than some panic buying for a month. Come of guys, you sound like rookies. The market was already slow and looking for a boost (do not beat me for being honest) and it is ready to keep up with this. All good buds.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Have more than I need . Not rushing out to buy anything. Few parts I want to finish a couple no hurry. However mind has been on riding and not guns for a bit. The subject being up front right now could cause an uncontrollable huge to buy something.


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## Hemi45 (May 5, 2014)

You'll never be sorry you bought that M1A. Another upshot is you can add a Rem 700 (or similar bolt action) in .308 down the road and share ammo between the two. There are many great options, too many to delve into here, but rest assured that Springfield is on the list. Get that plastic out and buy it now ... while you still can. The fact that you're in CA makes it a no-brainer in my book.


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## 8301 (Nov 29, 2014)

Stockton said:


> . My wife is open
> to opening up the credit card and getting more ammo.
> .


Sounds like you have a good basic load out of ammo. Do not use credit to build your preps.

A lot of people would agree that 500 rnds for each defensive pistol and 1000 rnds and 6+ mags per semi-auto rifle. Since 22lr is so handy I could see having an extra brick or two. With your CA mag limits I could see adding a few more mags or taking a road trip to AZ and picking up a few 30 rnd mags.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Chuckie Shoomer has been talking to the LV shooting victims in Heaven. He says.they say Bump Stocks aint nice. Better get it now if you want one.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Well I knew this would happen. All this gun talk , took a ride into town this morning knowing full well LGS would have nothing I wanted and no real deals I was interested in. That did not work out. Soon as I walked up he handed me a stripped lower and said you are going to want one or two. Well he was right I saw the price and took two. Worst case all I expected to bring home was a couple boxes of 308's to waste this weekend.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

I have fired many weapons in my life, some good, some bad.
At the moment I have more than just a few rifles in my safe.
Not one is an Armalite design. No AR15, no AR10.
The last rifles I would get rid of, in order are:
AKM
M1 Garand
Mini 14
M1A Standard Model 

This is not simply theoretical. My Army Basic Training weapon was the M14. My issue weapon in a stateside unit was an M14.
For my overseas all expense paid vacation I was issued an M16.
When I could finally afford it I got an M1A.

Of course, I'm so Old School I believe every serious rifleman should own at least one lever action 30-30.


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## Knotacare (Sep 21, 2016)

I like this site ..you can compare prices just about everywhere GunBot 17hmr rimfire ammo


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

rice paddy daddy said:


> I have fired many weapons in my life, some good, some bad.
> At the moment I have more than just a few rifles in my safe.
> Not one is an Armalite design. No AR15, no AR10.
> The last rifles I would get rid of, in order are:
> ...


Good post. My Pops was Big Red One from 65-66 and his assigned weapon was an m14. He talked very fondly about it. He was also the man to by me my first whitetail rifle.....a 30-30.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

I unloaded a bunch on the sons last year. It was time to let someone else care for them. I did have a few parts still around. Yesterdays great price on a couple stripped lowers was to much to pass up.
Swapped out an upper receiver from a VooDoo barrel that was laying around . I wanted to save that upper receiver for something else. Had a new bolt minus the extractor in the pile. Some magpul furniture in a box some where.
few parts it turns into another AR. Get this one done then do the other. It never ends why fight it. I do get to put some blame n the wife, she did suggest acquiring a few more.


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## maine_rm (Jun 24, 2017)

Can't go wrong with a marlin 3030


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

maine_rm said:


> Can't go wrong with a marlin 3030


About 20 years ago, one of my co-workers was chronically short of cash because he liked beer. I mean, he REALLY liked beer.
Occasionally he would offer to sell me one of his guns, that he got when his dad died.
I never made the offer, I never suggested price, I let him do so.
One of the guns I got from him was a Marlin 336 Texan in 30-30. The Texan was a low production model, it had a straight grip butt stock like a Winchester. :vs_box:
He said he wanted $100, I was glad to help the old boy out. :tango_face_smile:
It serial number dates to 1974.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

maine_rm said:


> Can't go wrong with a marlin 3030


 You are correct, at the right price for most people needs. Our old model 336's have taken a lot of deer over the years fro up close to 100-150 yards. Second son took his fist deer with one at almost 150 yards.


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

The marlin 30-30 and shotguns are not yet in jeopardy
for California. Semi automatics in particular those the
left call evil black rifles are. This state is capable of some
great evil towards gun owners. I realize the national
politics are relatively safe with our congress and president.
The NRA has given up on CA politics. The only thing 
they do for us is file law suits.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

We have no idea what current events effect on price and or availability will be. Most likely it will mean a rise in prices on most items some may even be banded before you know it.
I can only speak from where I sit. There are great buys on good to outstanding bolt action rifle with and with out good scopes include around here. Pick you caliber wide range offered.
AR type rifle are easy to come by from entry level low cost to how much you got. Parts local and on line can be had, quality are price cover a lot of ground. I expect to see prices creep up.
Low end AK47's selling for more than a better AR by $100 now. Hype goes a long way.
This is the mistake I see so many make. They want an AR. They see in their mind nice AR with a full rail low profile gas block and pop up or good Iron sights from a know manufacture. Fit and finish is great.
Then they go shopping and see a DPMS for a couple to several $100 less. They settle for the lower cost. What they got was a bear bone AR with old round Colt style front hand guards most likely an A2 front sight . At first they are happy and even brag the deal up.
Little time goes by. Now they know why so many of us have free float full rails, ditch the A2 front sight and high gas block. They go shopping many now settle again for a cheap rail system that does not mount well or requires work to get it right and they still over paid for it. Once they figure it out they drop some cash on the right stuff.
They by a low profile gas block 60--90 dollars depending on a lot of things, They drop $120-250$ on a rail system depending again on a lot of things. They buy a different trigger guard another 8-$10 buck. 
Some good pop up or hard mount iron sights $75- $200. Do the math and back up.
If they had purchased what they really wanted in the first place by smart?educated shopping they would have had the one they wanted for less right from the start. Same applies when trying to assemble one for parts.
Not including shipping on this.

PSA 16" Classic M4 Freedom Upper with BCG and Charging Handle

Basic upper A2 front sight low end colt type hand guards but at least it has BCG and charging handle. $259

Compare that to this.

PSA 18" Rifle Length .223 Wylde 1/7 Stainless Steel 15" Lightweight M-lok Upper With BCG, CH, & MBUS Sight Set - 516446673

$60 more you get full rail BCG charging handle and pop up front and rear sight. 
And most likely you end up with the AR you saw in your heart and not on the deal of the day ad.
Good luck no madder what route you take. If you are not armed arm your self. If you are take it up a notch or two.


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## NoSnowFlakes (Oct 2, 2017)

As others stated, we don't know if or how much gun/ammo prices will rise. But you can count on more gun laws sweeping the nation, if not now, in 2-3 years when Trump gets a more liberal house and senate. Or gets replaced by a libtard. I'd start stocking up on whatever you can AFFORD now. I just bought almost 2,000 rounds of various ammo from SGAmmo, their prices are hard to beat. Whether you need to get more guns or more ammo do it soon.. Especially if you're in gun restrictive states like Illinois or Cali.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Today local place: Just examples of what can be had without going into a panic and not over spending. They had some less know brand shot guns so low they could not publish price.
Savage Axis XP with scope $309
Mossberg Patriot with scope $309
Mossberg youth super bantam with scope $309
Marlin 336W 30-30 $399
Remington 700 ADL syn scope included $369
870 express pump $309
Remington 12ga or 20 ga Model 11-87 synthetic Semi-auto $549.
Ruger AR-556 basic model $599
Century Arms RAS47 with Magpul furniture $679
Savage MSR AR-10 308 or 6.5 Creedmoor $1149.
M&P M2.0 9mm or .45 ACP $499


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

posted twice ?


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## modfan (Feb 18, 2016)

If I was limited to capacity and versatility. I would look hard at a Remington 1100 12ga with a rifled slug barrel. I like throwing big chunks of lead down range.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

modfan said:


> If I was limited to capacity and versatility. I would look hard at a Remington 1100 12ga with a rifled slug barrel. I like throwing big chunks of lead down range.


 Shot Gun can cover a wide range of needs. This one is semi auto and affordable Remington 12ga or 20 ga Model 11-87 synthetic Semi-auto $549.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

maine_rm said:


> Can't go wrong with a marlin 3030


I used that exact rifle to take a 220lb 8 point buck. My biggest boy to this day.


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## maine_rm (Jun 24, 2017)

RedLion said:


> I used that exact rifle to take a 220lb 8 point buck. My biggest boy to this day.


It is a great rifle and shot many deer with that. Have to have a hammer extender


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Regarding Marlin lever rifles of all calibers - in 2010 Remington bought Marlin and moved production from Connecticut to Ilion, New York. The Marlin work force, for the most part, did not follow.
From then until sometime in 2014, all Marlin 336's were put together by Remington workers from parts brought over Connecticut. These rifles are of questionable quality and should be avoided. They are known among Marlin aficionados as "Remlins". 
From 2014 on, quality has improved. If you buy one of these you should be OK.
For Marlin purists only the North Haven, CT rifles are worth the money. These are also known as JM rifles, from the JM proof mark on the left side of the barrel. If you are looking at a used one to buy, look for this stamp.

Something I usually don't do is link to another forum, but since Marlin Owners belongs to the same company that owns Prepper Forums I'm going to do this for anyone who has or wants a Marlin. There are also some other great sections there (nothing about prepping). I've been a member there since it started, same name as here.
www.marlinowners.com/forum/forum.php


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

AR 15's do breed it is a fact. Few needed parts ordered. When they arrive two more will come to life. Sadly there will still be parts left over. Long as there are parts laying around they will come to life.
The cost was lower to order complete upper than the needed parts . been at this a while i feel a price increase coming on parts. It seems the number of items out of stock have risen quickly. That does not mean they sold out , it could mean they are holding stock back for a price increase.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

For someone that wants/needs an AR but is on a tight budget. Start here then find a low cost complete upper. No skills needed to assemble.
Of course the lower must ship to FFL and there will be a backround check cost along with shipping but still a darn good start. When you find the upper you want no FFL required for that.
PSA AR-15 Complete Blem Lower - Classic Edition - No Magazine - 37202


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

I really don't like it when someone asks for help on what they should buy or do but already has their mind made up on what ever they are going to get -what is the point?
the guy obviously wants the m1 and has already bought the darn thing.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Medic33 said:


> I really don't like it when someone asks for help on what they should buy or do but already has their mind made up on what ever they are going to get -what is the point?
> the guy obviously wants the m1 and has already bought the darn thing.


 He needs more, we must help. Don't want him to be without.


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

Medic33 said:


> I really don't like it when someone asks for help on what they should buy or do but already has their mind made up on what ever they are going to get -what is the point?
> the guy obviously wants the m1 and has already bought the darn thing.


When I started the thread I was 50/50. The thread moved
me away from buying it. I was not going to use my emergency
reserve or debt to buy it. Only being able to sale something
I didn't need returned me to buying it. A person I knew well
wanted something I had. He was willing to pay for it. It was
more than I needed for the rifle. It moved me back into the
buy column.

I wanted to address some suggestions about other guns. In 
particular level and bolt rifles and shotguns. Most of those
are safe in California. Semi automatics are not. By this I mean
the state politicians are restricting them. Chances are a 
semi automatic like the M1A may not be available to us soon.
The bolts and shotguns will. I think the levers will too.

Now my new question? How many rounds will it take me to 
gain proficiency in the M1A? I know we are all different. My
only other rifle shooting is with a Ruger 10-22 I got last 
summer. I ordered 1080 rounds of 7.62 x 51 ammo. I hope
that is more than enough. I hope some can be stored and
I won't need a lot more.


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## maine_rm (Jun 24, 2017)

I would say within 15 rounds you should be in a 10 inch group at 100 yards offhand more you practice the better you'll be. I would start at 25 yards just to be on paper then move out depending on what your terrain allows. I don't really know about gun ranges? don't have any around here just a lot of land!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Keeping cost down and getting what you want. May not come out prefect but it can be done. Two parts I ordered showed up today. All I need now is Lower parts kit. I have plenty of Mags.
18 inch SS 5.56. MAGPUl Flip up sights, MAGPUL stock and buffer tube, MAGPUL trigger guard And 15 inch rail system free float. When finished it will come in at $470 That is tax and shipping included. Now you can currently buy an AR for close to that. However it will not be the same weapon.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Keeping cost down and getting what you want. May not come out prefect but it can be done. Two parts I ordered showed up today. All I need now is Lower parts kit. I have plenty of Mags.
> 18 inch SS 5.56. MAGPUl Flip up sights, MAGPUL stock and buffer tube, MAGPUL trigger guard And 15 inch rail system free float. When finished it will come in at $470 That is tax and shipping included. Now you can currently buy an AR for close to that. However it will not be the same weapon.
> 
> View attachment 56769


Nice. I would lap the barrel as well.


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

Smitty901 said:


> Keeping cost down and getting what you want. May not come out prefect but it can be done. Two parts I ordered showed up today. All I need now is Lower parts kit. I have plenty of Mags.
> 18 inch SS 5.56. MAGPUl Flip up sights, MAGPUL stock and buffer tube, MAGPUL trigger guard And 15 inch rail system free float. When finished it will come in at $470 That is tax and shipping included. Now you can currently buy an AR for close to that. However it will not be the same weapon.
> 
> View attachment 56769


CA so called AR's must have fixed magazines unless
they have an open bolt. This made the Mini 14
and M1A my only really good options. They are 
selling AR-15 variants with devices that open
the breech (if I said that right) to eject the magazine
legally. It just seemed wrong to me.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Stockton said:


> CA so called AR's must have fixed magazines unless
> they have an open bolt. This made the Mini 14
> and M1A my only really good options. They are
> selling AR-15 variants with devices that open
> ...


 CA is a mess. Little hope of saving it. Not just about guns about everything going on in that state. But it is a sign of the times.


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## Stockton (Jun 21, 2017)

Smitty901 said:


> CA is a mess. Little hope of saving it. Not just about guns about everything going on in that state. But it is a sign of the times.


Yes I know. I'm trapped in it. There is no easy
way out for me. Our careers have us stuck here
so we have to make do. There is good here. The
bad just gets all the attention.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

The 18 inch AR is done. Box I had put away had a high end lower with trigger kit in it. Pictures latter I am shooting in to night.
6.9 empty
7.10 with 30 round Mag
Cold and rain out . Took it out to the 25 meter AR zero. I have sinned ran out of targets so stuck this blurry printed copy up.
Move rear sight 6 left . Not worried about the little bit of stacking going on they were quick shots. Not bad out of the parts packages.
5.56 62gr Federal


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> The 18 inch AR is done. Box I had put away had a high end lower with trigger kit in it. Pictures latter I am shooting in to night.
> 6.9 empty
> 7.10 with 30 round Mag
> Cold and rain out . Took it out to the 25 meter AR zero. I have sinned ran out of targets so stuck this blurry printed copy up.
> ...


Have fun and tell us how it goes.....


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

The finished product, if anything related to an AR is ever finished. The fully extended length is 37 1/2 inches. If need be it could be used as is ready to work.


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## 8301 (Nov 29, 2014)

Since CA is about to start really limiting where you can buy ammo without being on some kind of list I'd try to get some more shells before January along with a few more mags. As I mentioned before I'd conceder a trip to AZ or NV and get a few higher cap mags. Bury the hi cap mags deep and forget about the $40 three of them cost. Think of it as a long term prep that will hopefully never be needed. The 1000 shells you currently have is great but since I'd suggest never getting below 1000 shells you want some to play with.


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## Robie (Jun 2, 2016)

The Vegas shooting will not change anything except maybe some "bump stock" law...that I never knew existed.

No need to panic....relax....think about your needs and...buy wisely.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Stockton said:


> Now my new question? How many rounds will it take me to
> gain proficiency in the M1A? I know we are all different. My
> only other rifle shooting is with a Ruger 10-22 I got last
> summer. I ordered 1080 rounds of 7.62 x 51 ammo. I hope
> ...


We had 7 weeks of training with the M14, out of 8 weeks of BCIT (Basic Combat Infantry Training). We went to the range multiple times each week and burned a lot of ammo.
On Qualification Day I fired Expert, scoring on targets ranging from 25 meters to 500 meters. With the iron sights that came with the rifle, soldiers of my era did not have all the high-zoot stuff of today. Iron sights and a two point web sling were our tools for marksmanship. This is in no way meant to illustrate my proficiency, I am an average rifleman, rather to stress the inherent accuracy of the rifle.
So, YOU can do it. An M1A is simply an M14 that is semi auto only.
I would strongly recommend you not buy any "tactical" model like a SOCOM, or waste money on a National Match or Loaded model. The wood stocked Standard Model is more accurate than you probably are. 
We were started on a paper target at 25 meters. The Army makes a special size target for this. Then we combat zeroed the rifle for 100 meters, if I remember correctly. That way, with the trajectory of the 7.62 NATO round, if you aimed for center mass of your enemy the bullet should strike the torso at any range out to 500 meters.
How many rounds will you need to become baseline proficient? That varies per individual, but probably several hundred.
Just remember, when you start at 25 yards, begin with your rear sight adjusted all the down. Count the number of clicks up it takes to hit the target. When you shift to 100 yards, count the number of clicks you add to your first number. REMEMBER this number. The same for windage left or right. Remember your number of clicks. That way, if your rear sight is ever moved or disturbed for any reason you can instantly set it back for a 100 yard zero.

Interesting M1 Garand and Springfield M1A factoid - when looking thru your sights, the front sight blade is as tall as a man standing 200 yards away. A quick and dirty range finder. For human targets, anyway.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

good answer RPD,good answer!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Wife and I have a ride to go on. I will be putting the 18 inch to a good test with both 5.56 62gr and .223 55gr. some time in the next week or so. But for now it looks like a winner.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Back from our ride, the parts were here. They are done close enough to be brothers. The uppers deserved better lowers so they have Huldra lowers . Now I have parts left over. Does this ever end?
Added it all up again with the better lowers they came out to $490 each . That is not bad for the product.


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