# Wild rabbit before the first frost???



## Kauboy

So, I'll be taking the family to a national forest here in Texas in the coming weeks, and found out that there are some areas where hunting is allowed. For one of the areas, the county's regulations apply, and that means only rabbits and hares can be hunted during this time of year.(no closed season in any Texas county)
I called up the local office to confirm this, and the lady on the other end asked my why I'd want to hunt rabbits this time of year. I didn't want to scar the poor dear for life by saying I wanted to teach my 7 year old daughter how to kill something with her very own gun, so I just mentioned we'd like to have some for dinner.
She then informed me that you shouldn't eat rabbits before the first frost.
She mumbled something about parasites, and that the frost is supposed to kill them.

Well, I'm not one to just accept someone at their word without evidence. So, I turned to the best reference I know of, the internet. I found various views on the matter. Some claimed "bugs" burrow into their skin and infect the meat. Others claimed there is a blood-born pathogen that can infect the person dressing out the animal, and others mentioned something about a digestive infection.
Still, MANY others said they've been hunting and eating rabbit their whole lives with no worry about the time of year.

In my own little brain, I started to pick apart the possibilities. Firstly, if there were bugs burrowed into the skin, a frost would have no affect on them since the rabbit's body temperature would sustain the bug through the frost. No real benefit to waiting there. The pathogen would likely be less inclined to survive in an overheated environment, and certainly wouldn't survive a 160 degree cook out. Eating a dead pathogen is just as worrisome as eating no pathogen. And finally, the digestive infection would likely be confined to the digestive tract, and unlikely to ever be part of my meal... and I mean ever.

So, I turn to some of the finest folks I know online.
What is your take on this? Many may have been told from past generations that it was a bad idea, but I'm looking for more than hearsay. I'm looking for facts.

If I take precautions against eating obviously infected animals, ensure the meat is thoroughly cooked, and wear gloves during the butchering, am I really at any risk?


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## Jakthesoldier

So, rabbits are warm blooded. Their body temp won't fluctuate enough to kill anything. Proper cooking will kill parasites, if their are any. 

Strange concept though. Never heard of anything like that before.


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## hardcore

I am here in the deep south, growing up that is what I was told. "don't eat the wild rabbit till after the first frost because of worms". I always followed that, but really I just don't know if that is true or just bs.


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## Tennessee

Here in Tennessee you can't legally hunt rabbits in the summer and fall. Growing up I was always was told that the cool weather would kill the wolf worms. Now I don't know for sure why or if cool weather kills them, but believe there is truth in the saying. Growing up I rabbited and squirrel hunted all the time and skinned thousands of rabbits and squirrels. And I never skinned a rabbit or squirrel after we had cold weather and found a worm. But I've seen worms in squirrels in late fall.

If i found a worm i would discard the animal or use it for bait. Not worth taking the chance in eating it.

Maybe you should listen to your elders.


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## Prepared One

I have heard this all my life. Even when living in Chicago as I recall. Never heard any of the supporting evidence that the statement is indeed fact. I would be interested to hear the answer to one of the great mysteries of life Kauboy :joyous:


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## Slippy

If you can legally harvest rabbits, then by all means its OK to do so. Since it is summer and hot in TX, be safe and wear gloves after the rabbit is shot. If upon inspection you find worms, ticks or other insects on the rabbit, dispose of it immediately. No sense exposing your daughter to a disease. 

If the rabbit is insect free, go ahead and skin it and remove the guts. If you notice ticks/insect/worms after skinning, dispose of it immediately. To be safe this time of the year, why risk eating it in the field, take it home and freeze it just to be safe. When you cook it, cook the meat thoroughly. 

Chicken Fried Rabbit soaked in buttermilk is pertinary good.


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## Disturbed12404

Don't want to steal the thread here Kauboy, but I had never heard of this, but then again no one in my family other then my enjoys wild game. We have a rabbit here at work who comes and goes. It's not game season yet, but i've been debating trapping this guy and trying rabbit for the first time. Aside from rights and wrongs of taking him out of season. Mid summer in Jersey is about 80-90ish degrees. Safe enough to have killed these worm you're talking about?


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## Spice

The only rabbit risk I've heard talked about around here is Tularemia (rabbit fever). Infections with it are more common in warm weather. There's a risk of transmission if you get rabbit fluids in a skin break - I read poking oneself with a bone while skinning is the most common route. I'd wear gloves to clean .


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## tango

In the south, the rule is, only shoot rabbits in months with an 'r'


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## Slippy

tango said:


> In the south, the rule is, only shoot rabbits in months with an 'r'


And it is considered good practice to add oysters to your rabbit dish during those months...


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## Prepared One

Why Oysters Slippy?


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## Medic33

never really thought of it but it is something I had always been told and followed I wish my dad was around to ask he would know, basically what spice has said (Tularemia) the animal is basically just a carrier and not effected by the disease and you catch it by inhaling the Bactria when skinning it. but there are places were they don't really get a hard frost -so I think it all has to do with preparation cleanliness and cooking the stuff well done , those that may not understand this think about tics and fleas most house pets that spend time outside when it gets cold don't have a problem with the bugs any more It also may have something to do with our digestive system not being what it used to be and conditioned eating packaged foods we just don't have the resistances we used to have. I would say call and ask the wild game commission and ask them what is up with this or do as your elders have always told you and don't eat that stuff till after the frost. best thing don't find out the hard way why you not suppose to do this.


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## Ralph Rotten

Kauboy said:


> So, I'll be taking the family to a national forest here in Texas in the coming weeks, and found out that there are some areas where hunting is allowed. For one of the areas, the county's regulations apply, and that means only rabbits and hares can be hunted during this time of year.(no closed season in any Texas county)
> I called up the local office to confirm this, and the lady on the other end asked my why I'd want to hunt rabbits this time of year. I didn't want to scar the poor dear for life by saying I wanted to teach my 7 year old daughter how to kill something with her very own gun, so I just mentioned we'd like to have some for dinner.
> She then informed me that you shouldn't eat rabbits before the first frost.
> She mumbled something about parasites, and that the frost is supposed to kill them.
> 
> Well, I'm not one to just accept someone at their word without evidence. So, I turned to the best reference I know of, the internet. I found various views on the matter. Some claimed "bugs" burrow into their skin and infect the meat. Others claimed there is a blood-born pathogen that can infect the person dressing out the animal, and others mentioned something about a digestive infection.
> Still, MANY others said they've been hunting and eating rabbit their whole lives with no worry about the time of year.
> 
> In my own little brain, I started to pick apart the possibilities. Firstly, if there were bugs burrowed into the skin, a frost would have no affect on them since the rabbit's body temperature would sustain the bug through the frost. No real benefit to waiting there. The pathogen would likely be less inclined to survive in an overheated environment, and certainly wouldn't survive a 160 degree cook out. Eating a dead pathogen is just as worrisome as eating no pathogen. And finally, the digestive infection would likely be confined to the digestive tract, and unlikely to ever be part of my meal... and I mean ever.
> 
> So, I turn to some of the finest folks I know online.
> What is your take on this? Many may have been told from past generations that it was a bad idea, but I'm looking for more than hearsay. I'm looking for facts.
> 
> If I take precautions against eating obviously infected animals, ensure the meat is thoroughly cooked, and wear gloves during the butchering, am I really at any risk?


No rabbit before 2 frosts! That's what I was always told. Tis done because of the fleas. They have tapeworm and worms all the time, you just gotta look for them. But during the warm season they got fleas that carry all manner of bad things; bubonic plague, hantavirus, and I think lyme disease or a similar condition.

I've hunted rabbit year round and never got fleas or worms, but I advise against it. There's a lot to look for; is their fur plush 
nd full or ratty and rough? Are the rabbits healthy overall? Once you skin 'em are they free of egg blisters in the epidermis? Did you find tapeworms in their intestines?

I've shot a few rabbits that looked so bad from fleas & worms that I wouldn't even feed them to the dogs.


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## Slippy

tango said:


> In the south, the rule is, only shoot rabbits in months with an 'r'





Prepared One said:


> Why Oysters Slippy?


I was making a reference to the old advice of only eating Gulf of Mexico oysters in months that end in the letter R. I had never heard that about rabbits but it was common about oysters. Now a days, I think that most of the oysters are farm raised and can be controlled for certain bacteria and crap. But I generally wait until at least Nov or Dec to eat those Appalachicola Oysters. Which is my favorite time to go the beach. Very few crowds that time of the year east of Panama City FL or west of Pensacola, FL.


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## Arklatex

I learned this as a youngun. Daddy made the mistake of giving me a pellet rifle as a b day present. A couple friends had them too. So we go out and find stuff to shoot at. We found some cottontails and each of us stayed out long enough to get one. We bring em back to the house all proud and my buddies dad asks us what were gonna do with em? Well we didn't really know... We were 9 or so and didn't think about it before we killed em. That was our first lesson on how to skin and dress rabbits. He talked us through the process and one of the rabbits had one of those big ass nasty worms under its skin. Then we got the lecture on why we don't kill rabbits in the summer. He made us bury that one rabbit but we still cooked and ate the other two. He also had us process the skins. I still have that soft skin somewhere in a box of memories. That man taught us several lessons and to this day none of us have forgotten them. One of them is don't kill rabbits in the summer because they get those big as nasty worms on them.

Look at the video Tennessee posted.


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## oddapple

Summer meat nasty. If you lived that way you would know it's more than worms and bugs. It seems pretty sad that a bunch of people who never gave a crap or did anything but mindlessly consume, are getting ready to run over and rape what's left of nature because the grasshoppers noticed they're out of summer. Unfortunately, they're about out of nature too.


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## RNprepper

http://health.utah.gov/epi/diseases/tularemia/factsheet.pdf
http://www.cfsph.iastate.edu/FastFacts/pdfs/tularemia_F.pdf
DNR - Tularemia

The problem is with Tularemia (rabbit fever) which is more prevalent in the spring and summer months when insect vectors such as deer flies are present. This is the time when it spreads between animals. Transmission to humans occurs more in the fall during rabbit season, due to cuts from butchering. Tularemia can spread to pets, as well, and it is the bad bug-a-boo that can be shed in cat feces which is why pregnant women are not supposed to clean the litter box.
Take a good look at the picture of the infected liver. My dad always inspected the livers, particularly, when butchering rabbits, and I am sure this is what he was looking for, although he didn't actually know what the infection was. Look for other signs of illness like behavioral changes. A lazy, easy to kill rabbit is a sick rabbit.


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## Kauboy

Thanks for the responses guys. Keep 'em coming if you have them.
With regards to the worms or the Tularemia infection, what causes these to be of no concern after a frost? Does the animal itself die off from them?
Also, to those in more arid or tropical climates that may never see a frost, are rabbits just off limits entirely?


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## bigwheel

Kauboy said:


> So, I'll be taking the family to a national forest here in Texas in the coming weeks, and found out that there are some areas where hunting is allowed. For one of the areas, the county's regulations apply, and that means only rabbits and hares can be hunted during this time of year.(no closed season in any Texas county)
> I called up the local office to confirm this, and the lady on the other end asked my why I'd want to hunt rabbits this time of year. I didn't want to scar the poor dear for life by saying I wanted to teach my 7 year old daughter how to kill something with her very own gun, so I just mentioned we'd like to have some for dinner.
> She then informed me that you shouldn't eat rabbits before the first frost.
> She mumbled something about parasites, and that the frost is supposed to kill them.
> 
> Well, I'm not one to just accept someone at their word without evidence. So, I turned to the best reference I know of, the internet. I found various views on the matter. Some claimed "bugs" burrow into their skin and infect the meat. Others claimed there is a blood-born pathogen that can infect the person dressing out the animal, and others mentioned something about a digestive infection.
> Still, MANY others said they've been hunting and eating rabbit their whole lives with no worry about the time of year.
> 
> In my own little brain, I started to pick apart the possibilities. Firstly, if there were bugs burrowed into the skin, a frost would have no affect on them since the rabbit's body temperature would sustain the bug through the frost. No real benefit to waiting there. The pathogen would likely be less inclined to survive in an overheated environment, and certainly wouldn't survive a 160 degree cook out. Eating a dead pathogen is just as worrisome as eating no pathogen. And finally, the digestive infection would likely be confined to the digestive tract, and unlikely to ever be part of my meal... and I mean ever.
> 
> So, I turn to some of the finest folks I know online.
> What is your take on this? Many may have been told from past generations that it was a bad idea, but I'm looking for more than hearsay. I'm looking for facts.
> 
> If I take precautions against eating obviously infected animals, ensure the meat is thoroughly cooked, and wear gloves during the butchering, am I really at any risk?


Bumped into what is called a Wolf Worm in a rabbit one time. It looked just like a little candy Root Beer barrel. Very disgusting to look at but the rabbit tasted ok. Cant recall what time of year it was but think it was winter. They also have a lot of fleas.


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## hawgrider

Michigan's rule of thumb. No rabbits before the first HARD killing frost. Taught by many of died in the wool hunting elders. Their word is good enough for me.


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## Disturbed12404

So the best time is between first and last heavy frost? 

Again, is this only primarily evident in wild rabbits ?


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## oddapple

Disturbed12404 said:


> So the best time is between first and last heavy frost?
> 
> Again, is this only primarily evident in wild rabbits ?


Look, you want to kill something to try it, whether it could have young or not, and after this whole thread you repeat the same question again - give the world a break and eat the draino


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## Kauboy

oddapple said:


> Look, you want to kill something to try it, whether it could have young or not, and after this whole thread you repeat the same question again - give the world a break and eat the draino


Seriously man, we still have no idea what you're saying.
Did you just tell him to eat Draino because he asked a question about hunting rabbits?

Is it too much to ask that you use normal phrases and statements? If your mind really runs on this vocabulary, I can't imagine the pain of those who deal with you in everyday life.


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## paraquack

I'm beginning to hate quotes. I always see things I don't really want to.


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## MisterMills357

Leviticus 11
6.....the rabbit also, for though it chews cud, it does not divide the hoof, it is unclean to you;
7.....and the pig, for though it divides the hoof, thus making a split hoof, it does not chew cud, it is unclean to you.&#8230;
Leviticus 11:6 The rabbit, though it chews the cud, does not have a divided hoof; it is unclean for you.

I am not saying, don't eat it, but I am saying be cautious with it. There is something unclean about the rabbit, and I am not sure what it is. 
Cook it thoroughly, just in case there are parasites.
I read some of the other posts in this, and there seems to be seasons when rabbits are diseased. 
But, in the end, the Bible calls them unclean and that is good reason to be cautious.

BTW: I eat pigmeat all the time, and it is another unclean food. I just make sure that it is well cooked, and with ham, I know that it has been cured.


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## 1skrewsloose

Same with fish, hate to ice fish. But the flesh is much firmer. Have to pick the proper time of year. Do what the DNR says!


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## 1skrewsloose

At one time at all times of the year I would harvest whatever was in the road ditch. Cook in the oven till fell off the bones, no one ever got sick, but enjoyed the heck out of it!!


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## Mad Trapper

Fleas and mites can also be an issue. They will transfer to you quick.

I'd wear gloves and dunk in cool water for a couple hours before dressing. Inspect well when dressing, parboil , then cook well done.

Dress away from campsite to avoid the fleas and such.


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## 1skrewsloose

RNprepper said:


> http://health.utah.gov/epi/diseases/tularemia/factsheet.pdf
> http://www.cfsph.iastate.edu/FastFacts/pdfs/tularemia_F.pdf
> DNR - Tularemia
> 
> The problem is with Tularemia (rabbit fever) which is more prevalent in the spring and summer months when insect vectors such as deer flies are present. This is the time when it spreads between animals. Transmission to humans occurs more in the fall during rabbit season, due to cuts from butchering. Tularemia can spread to pets, as well, and it is the bad bug-a-boo that can be shed in cat feces which is why pregnant women are not supposed to clean the litter box.
> Take a good look at the picture of the infected liver. My dad always inspected the livers, particularly, when butchering rabbits, and I am sure this is what he was looking for, although he didn't actually know what the infection was. Look for other signs of illness like behavioral changes. A lazy, easy to kill rabbit is a sick rabbit.


Pretty much the same here about deer, easily approached, not spooked, leave them alone.


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## sparkyprep

In South Florida, we don't hunt rabbits in the summer, due to worms.


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## bigwheel

One of the oldest boys pals got a virus in his eye which come from breasting out Doves. It started out making him miss a lot of easy shots on bambis then he went plumb blind for a while. Those beasts of the field can kill folks..just as it say in the Good Book. 

Ezekiel 39:4
Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.


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## Kauboy

Does anyone have an answer for why frost takes care of these issues?
Does the animal itself die off?
Surely parasites and bacteria inside the animal would not be affected by the cold outside.
So, why is it safe after the frost?


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## oddapple

I couldn't say it's helping the wrong people who also haunt this place.


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## Kauboy

What does that mean?


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## Jakthesoldier

I think oddapple is against harvesting during mating/birthing season. Which, in rabbits, can be 24/7/365


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## Medic33

well kuaboy, I think it is the fact that the parasites do not stay in the animal (tics, fleas, mites ect.) get their fill and then drop off when it's cold they then die. and the animals clean themselves regularly. most flying insects except fly's (cause I have seen them in my un heated shed at -10)
most internal diseases are neutralized when you cook the meat to a certain temp for a short period of time. 
*neat fact *yellow jackets(the little mean ones that live in the ground) the whole hive dies off each winter- I always thought that was odd.


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## oddapple

"I think oddapple is against harvesting during mating/birthing season. Which, in rabbits, can be 24/7/365"

No, it means just exactly what I said.
clown fish knows that.


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## PaulS

Proper cooking will kill all the parasites. Never eat parts that are connected to the main central nervous system. Bury that deep!


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## Kauboy

oddapple said:


> "I think oddapple is against harvesting during mating/birthing season. Which, in rabbits, can be 24/7/365"
> 
> No, it means just exactly what I said.
> clown fish knows that.


I'm being completely honest. I don't know what you meant by it.
Are you against hunting rabbits?
Are you against hunting rabbits during a specific time of year?
Are you against hunting rabbits who might have offspring?
Who are "the wrong people"?
What part isn't helping them?

Your phrasing comes across as cryptic, and requires clarification most of the time.


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## Kauboy

Medic33 said:


> well kuaboy, I think it is the fact that the parasites do not stay in the animal (tics, fleas, mites ect.) get their fill and then drop off when it's cold they then die. and the animals clean themselves regularly. most flying insects except fly's (cause I have seen them in my un heated shed at -10)
> most internal diseases are neutralized when you cook the meat to a certain temp for a short period of time.
> *neat fact *yellow jackets(the little mean ones that live in the ground) the whole hive dies off each winter- I always thought that was odd.


I fully agree about external parasites. However, most folks reference "worms" or "wolves" or some other parasite that actually burrows through the skin and sticks around as the reason they shouldn't be eaten.
How would a frost take care of these?

Thanks Paul. Fully cooking the meat seems like the big catch all.
Check the liver and other organs for abnormalities and cook to 170 degrees.


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## Medic33

well I honestly don't know
best answers
try it and find out 
or 
just don't eat that shit.


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## 1skrewsloose

Before the advent of the DNR or whatever its called in your state, American Indians would harvest what they could anytime of year. jmo.


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## topgun

Prepared One said:


> I have heard this all my life. Even when living in Chicago as I recall. Never heard any of the supporting evidence that the statement is indeed fact. I would be interested to hear the answer to one of the great mysteries of life Kauboy :joyous:


Here in Michigan the rabbit season starts around September 15th. When I was younger and hunted those critters, we waited until the colder weather of late November or early December, because we heard those "old wives tales" too. The only difference I noticed is that the rabbits seemed to have less fleas in the colder weather. They always seemed to have them though, so I'd always gut and skin um and put them in plastic bags, before putting them in my game pouch in my hunting vest. I'd never bring my hunting vest directly into the house either. It got hung up outside until I was sure the fleas were gone.


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## Medic33

1skrewsloose said:


> Before the advent of the DNR or whatever its called in your state, American Indians would harvest what they could anytime of year. jmo.


well I guess your not native American then cause that is false-they had very specific times they harvested game animals -you must be thinking of cave man


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## Farmboyc

Medic33 said:


> well I guess your not native American then cause that is false-they had very specific times they harvested game animals -you must be thinking of cave man


I request you show proof Medic33.

I believe in lean times native Americans ate whatever was avaliable.


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## Medic33

show proof? like what?
ware's your proof we did? 
nobody will argue that the native American peole are extremely close to nature and know when to hunt what.
some animals were/are taboo too such as some plains tribes would/will not eat fish or any creature that came/comes from the water.


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