# Ebola in Spain in health care worker



## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

THIS is not a good development. Technically, unless this nurse really blew it, she should have been safe. I am hoping it is a needle stick or obvious break in PPE management, but I have a hunch, they will not figure out how she got it.

BBC News - Ebola outbreak: Nurse infected in Spain


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Oh great!


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

My thoughts exactly. Kind of blows the premise that in a highly controlled, modern facility, it should not spread.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Ice Queen said:


> THIS is not a good development. Technically, unless this nurse really blew it, she should have been safe. I am hoping it is a needle stick or obvious break in PPE management, but I have a hunch, they will not figure out how she got it.
> 
> BBC News - Ebola outbreak: Nurse infected in Spain


By not figuring it out it opens the door to many more OSHA regulations and compliance issues if it were here. They may still propose a rules change. Why let a panic or crisis go to waste?


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

More facts are starting to dribble in. Nursing assistant, not nurse, but I don't know what that means in Spain. Sounds like she has been ill for a week, which means a lot of contacts. Sounds like she is very ill, which doesn't bode well for her to remember all those contacts. This is not a good situation.


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

BTW 8 are symptomatic with Marburg. 1 dead. Uganda.


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## pheniox17 (Dec 12, 2013)

The CDC & The UN Are Forced to Admit That Ebola is Airborne -

I don't wanna start another Ebola thread (anyone else more than welcome)

Anyone know if this source is relyable??


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

She was working with an Ebola patient???? She's sick for a week???? WTF????


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## Jeep (Aug 5, 2014)

Sockpuppet said:


> The simplest and most basic premise to remember with regard to infection control:


Well that puts me and the wife in jeaopardy


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

pheniox17 said:


> The CDC & The UN Are Forced to Admit That Ebola is Airborne -
> 
> I don't wanna start another Ebola thread (anyone else more than welcome)
> 
> Anyone know if this source is reliable??


It's difficult for me to accept information from a source like this.
There is no citation given in the article, and every link within it only loops back to another article from the same site.

There is such a small distinction between what we call "airborne transmission", and what we know to be true already, that infection can spread via aerosolized liquid.
It won't be a shocker when they finally say it's airborne, I just don't find any link in this article that they intend to.


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

I suspect this nursing assistant blew it in terms of using her PPE. Airborne and Aerosolized are TWO different things, but, to be honest, they are on a continuum. There is no black and white sharp dividing line. It's gray. Thus far, there has only been one instance of an Ebola like virus Reston spreading by what appears to be airborne spread from monkey to monkey. So far, it APPEARS that it does not spread airborne, but, let's dissect that. Airborne spread, would mean that the virus was able to float on tiny dust particles, living there for a day or more, and able to float from one area to another. Thus far, it seems that Ebola does not do that. But it DOES aerosolize. It is present in high concentrations in saliva, blood and feces. Less so in sweat, vomit and tears. Highly present in semen, for up to 3 months after a person survives Ebola! If some one in the high state of infection, coughs, sneezes, spits or vomits within in a given range of you, YES, you could get Ebola. That is not considered airborne. Airborne is when you walk into an airport, and there on the air currents, floats a few virons of Ebola. That is a big difference. But if you entered a room where some one with Ebola is spewing 24/7, I would say the air is FULL of AERSOLIZED VIRUS. 

If Ebola was that readily airborne, it would be all over the world and we would know it. It would be a movie like scenario. People would be dropping like flies. That said, people drop like flies from Norovirus, which is not airborne either, but aerosolized. It's just darn hardy, which Ebola is not known to be. I think, if you had to go into a patient room who has Ebola, it is wise to use SCUBA. I wouldn't feel real safe taking care of a patient without it, but that said, most of the doctors and nurses in Africa do not have SCUBA and they use N95 masks and even in an environment loaded with virus, most have emerged OK. I have home care set ups for myself, and they do not contain SCUBA because I can't afford a $1000 hood and electric filter. I suppose I could drop that if it gets more threatening, but right now, I have other things to drop a thousand bucks on. Chances are, if I buy one, it will sit unused, forever. Plenty of health care workers have cared for Ebola patients with set ups using N95 masks. I think you are OK with those. You can use those cheap masks to put over your N95 to give it a longer life and protect even further from spray.

In terms of addressing how the nation and world handles this, we are very late to get a start on this. I feel that it is time to start a 21 day period of isolation either before people leave hot zones, or before they enter here from a hot zone. If we don't do this soon, we will have hot zones all over and it will require isolation for every nation. Technically, it would help greatly to confine all those exiting west Africa to a 21 day isolation period in a hotel near the airport and then to board the plane right from the hotel. I am not saying lock them in, but I am saying they need to be disease free before they travel to any where in the world. There are economic and ethical considerations for this kind of action. Because of that, it seems it will be very slow to be implemented, or, even worse, it won't be implemented.

So, my advice is to keep prepping, maybe up the pace a bit in terms of getting what you need for a year of isolation. Mostly that is food and basic medical supplies. I do NOT think that basic services such as water and utilities would go down due to an Ebola outbreak, even a very severe one because workers can use PPE to keep those kinds of services going. I think the medical system will hold up for quite a while, but, frankly, when this blows, and we have numerous cases, well...we will have to see. I do have some basic medications stored up. I don't think ammo is a huge priority, if you have at least some. They are not killing each other in Africa, where they have few resources, I hope we will be as well mannered.

I am thinking, we still have significant time to prep. I see a window of 6-12 months before we have a huge issue and that could change if the world acts and gets aid to Africa. They will not flee if they have decent hospitals set up. If we give them decent care and work to improve conditions there, we will be safer. The better they have it, the safer we are and this should have been done a long time ago. That said, I don't know if we will act soon enough. For us, as preppers, keep in mind, the time to prep is now, because when it blows, what is available depends on how badly people panic. Hoarding can limit what you can get. It will get more dicey when infections start to pop up in highly populous third world countries. First of all, we don't always get accurate reports from these nations until it's a big problem. Secondly, it will spread quickly there. Third, people are highly mobile. So once this cat is out of the bag, it's out. Spend your money wisely, don't get into debt, because this situation is unpredictable.

In terms of when you pull kids out of school or stop going to work or whatever, I feel we are a long way off from that. I hope we don't have to make those decisions, but, we should think about how we will do those things, in the rare event, that it could happen.

I am still on dark yellow alert, which maybe I should call yellow-5, but if more cases pop, I go into orange-1 mode, which means I will up the expenditures on prepping supplies and make sure all my family has their plans set. When I hit Red, it's no one in without 21 day quarantine, which will be a bummer for any family members who lag on getting here. It gets very cold and my garage isn't going to be a comfy place to sit it out. God, I hope we don't get to this, but watching this play out, I am not feeling very secure. If something happens to change my opinion, I will let you know. Check points at the airports, do not cut it.


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

One more thing, now is the time to get any overdue medical checks or procedures done. Get your physical, get your mammogram, colonoscopy etc. I am some one who believes in MOST vaccinations. If you are overdue for tetanus, diphtheria, pertussis, get those done! Get your flu shot. If you are older, get a pneumonia shot too.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Well, already the uk is hot two weeks before the prognostications of those who have been wrong so far.
Also, since there is a lot of mud around the thing about "well it was the vaccinated kids who got sick and the unvaccinated ones didn't, i'm not going down telling these people to vaccinate - especially now. I think people have the right to decline, especially dubious and "forced" medicine of any kind.
How do you think they would feel if they were told how much money and medical time is spent "ensuring their compliance" and how telling them anything to get them to cooperate is now considered standard practice for that ilk? They would probably be a bit put off....to say the least.


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

I believe in most vaccines. I don't like the HPV and don't feel it should be forced on people. It would be the pits to survive Ebola only to die of tetanus.


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## Ice Queen (Feb 16, 2014)

Brincindofovir, an antiviral, used off label for Ebola, has been administered to Duncan in Dallas, and also to Ashoka Mukpa, the NBC photographer, in Nebraska. Let's hope this drug shows promise.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Apples and oranges. No comparison. Unless they start putting out tetanus toxoid full of virus, cancer, fungus and other trash?
I guess I should be specific and say "nothing under this, the previous or next administration, especially made after the new "test one and the rest should be ok" who cares $$$ malfeasance that is going on seemingly with intent and no fear of reprisal. Not at a time in politics and politicized, industrial medicine when agreessive population control is the theme.
But the real thing if it were available and clean? I'd look at it. I also don't think i'd post what vacc's we do use because the devil is a moron and doesn't need anymore ideas.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

There's not a shred to show it's anything but smoke and Duncan died. 
Tamiflu is losing ground too. Dang! They have si much trouble getting a worthwhile anti-viral!


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

So it sounds like a second nursing assistant in Spain has Ebola. WTF. Medical staff at the Spanish hospital are complaining the equipment is not up to date, etc. Ten minutes ago I was slightly concerned about Ebola in the US. Now... We count on the idea that someone with Ebola like symptoms and having been in a circumstance to be infected with Ebola would high tail it to the hospital. But what if there was an immigration status problem. Would they be so willing to turn themselves over and possible legal reprisals? I'm not worried yet, but my concern level has gone up a notch or two.


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## indie (Sep 7, 2013)

Now they're saying she may have touched her face with her ebola glove: Doc: Spanish woman touched face with Ebola glove.


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