# What to learn and plan from the ammo shortage



## thomasdangerpowers (Mar 2, 2012)

Go around town while there is a shortage on ammo and see what others around you are stockpiling and do the same. You can also sell some of your extra ammo while people are lining up fighting to buy it, then re invest the money into other preps


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## bennettvm (Jan 5, 2013)

You can find ammo online - just need to do a little research. I put in about 5-10 mins online every other day and have plenty stocked up. Right now, I sell any extra ammo I pick up. 

22lr ammo is in the 30 cent per round range right now. That is $150 for a brick of 500. I have 10-12 bricks I picked up for $25 each. I have sold my extra bricks for $75-$85 in the past few weeks. That money goes right back into my prepping.


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## CoastalGardens (Jan 1, 2013)

thomasdangerpowers said:


> Go around town while there is a shortage on ammo and see what others around you are stockpiling and do the same


I also buy much of mine online.

As for the above, I am thinking of taking a different approach. 30-30, 30-06, and 300 WIN is pretty easy to find at most stores in my area. I'm thinking of getting something one one of those calibers, so I won't have to 'fight' so much for ammo stock. The standard 9mm, 22lr, 223, and 308 sells like hotcakes, even online. Sometimes I can't even finish checking out and it's already sold out from underneath me (especially when it's a good price.)


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## AquaHull (Jun 10, 2012)

I thought I was gouging at $35 for 525


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

CoastalGardens said:


> I also buy much of mine online.
> 
> As for the above, I am thinking of taking a different approach. 30-30, 30-06, and 300 WIN is pretty easy to find at most stores in my area. I'm thinking of getting something one one of those calibers, so I won't have to 'fight' so much for ammo stock. The standard 9mm, 22lr, 223, and 308 sells like hotcakes, even online. Sometimes I can't even finish checking out and it's already sold out from underneath me (especially when it's a good price.)


When I recently bought a Ruger American, I went with the intent of getting a .308. Ammo availability 1st, then power 2nd helped me make my choice. 30.06 is not cheap but it is available and I am picking it up a few boxes at a time. Several places like luckygunner sell it in 200 round packages also.


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## thomasdangerpowers (Mar 2, 2012)

yeah I look online but I can't find the type of 9mm and 5.56 online I want to stock up on for myself. I have bought and sold ammo I find in shops because I get there early and go often, plus save on shipping cost. I have made some "serious coin" selling ammo and buying silver while precious metals are down


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## CoastalGardens (Jan 1, 2013)

inceptor said:


> When I recently bought a Ruger American, I went with the intent of getting a .308. Ammo availability 1st, then power 2nd helped me make my choice. 30.06 is not cheap but it is available and I am picking it up a few boxes at a time. Several places like luckygunner sell it in 200 round packages also.


Sounds like what I will be planning... if I can't get 308 easily it may be time to go with a 30.06 that is reliable yet not overly expensive. How is the Ruger?


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

CoastalGardens said:


> Sounds like what I will be planning... if I can't get 308 easily it may be time to go with a 30.06 that is reliable yet not overly expensive. How is the Ruger?


I have been too busy to take it to the range yet. Hopefully I can go there in the next week or two.

The other reason I choose 30.06 is it too is a popular round. It's just not a popular as .308.


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## CoastalGardens (Jan 1, 2013)

inceptor said:


> I have been too busy to take it to the range yet. Hopefully I can go there in the next week or two.
> 
> The other reason I choose 30.06 is it too is a popular round. It's just not a popular as .308.


Thanks- I'll be keeping an ear out for any experiences and an eye out for a good deal. Not in a super fast hurry to purchase in this market!


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

The only thing I've seen really out of line is 223. Yes 22LR, 308 and 9mm are a little higher but not like 223. That stuff went from 300/325 per 1000 to 650/750.

I guess diversity is a good thing. 45 ACP has not moved much; and while I abandoned the caliber a few years back I've decided I might pursue it again. Low end
1911's are under $500 (GI Models) or just over $500 with some features (Rock Island Armory) and relatively available compared to some other things. I'll probably
get one in the next few months and stock up on at least 300/400 rounds of 45 ACP. 

The one thing I don't want to get caught short of next time is primers. I had about 1000 and have reloaded 600 since this all began but they've doubled in price
too. When things return to normal I'll stock on at least 10k of those little buggers.


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## AvengersAssembled (Dec 13, 2012)

Luckily I was able to stock up a bit before all this, but not enough so that I have any extra to sell. It just takes a little extra looking, but it is there to find, unfortunately not at the prices before though!


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## Karsten (Nov 13, 2012)

My USP and Fed Ex guys hate me from a couple month worth 150 pound shipment every couple weeks. I am still stocking up on .38 Super HP as I found a supplier. 

Karsten


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

inceptor said:


> I have been too busy to take it to the range yet. Hopefully I can go there in the next week or two.
> 
> The other reason I choose 30.06 is it too is a popular round. It's just not a popular as .308.


I wouldn't say .30-06 is less popular than .308, it's just not as popular with preppers or the guys stockpiling ammo. Most of those people see it as a hunting round which it does very well but it did start life as a military round. I think popularity of the rifles themselves are very comparable but semi-auto rifles are mostly chambered for the .308 (the exception being the Garand which is no longer built). Personally if I was buying a bolt gun I'd go .30-06 over the .308 just due to the fact that it would do better with bullets weights over 180gr. There is nothing a .308 can do that the .30-06 can't. I think your selection of the .30-06 was a wise choice especially in the current ammunition drought and the ammunition will be available everywhere after the drought is over.

-Infidel


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## buckyn8 (Mar 3, 2013)

I just picked up a 3006 in a multigun purchase last week and thought about selling it. After what you all discussed, I think I am going to hold onto it.


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## rickkyw1720pf (Nov 17, 2012)

What suprised me was how many people bought $1000+ guns and didn't have more than a couple 20 rnds boxes for them. When ever I purchased a new gun my next step was to get a good supply of ammo for that gun, I never looked at how much ammo I have, but as how many rnds per gun. if I purchased another 5.56x45 rifle I would purchase more ammo for that rifle. I sold some rifles and the ammo I had for that rifle to friends as a complete package. Anything you purchase from the stores can disappear just as fast as the ammo and guns did. So while so many people were scrambling to find ammo I just thought of it as a good time to sell off my wolf ammo I bought years ago that I decided awhile back that I didn't want as part of my stores.


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## 1895gunner (Sep 23, 2012)

I reload everything I shoot except for the 22's. Same thing goes for me though; stock up when you can and standardize. I have three calibers of center fire rifles with multiples of each caliber in rifles by the same manufacturer. I have spare parts on hand and more spare parts in the other rifles. I continually search for and buy components (primer/powder/bullets). I have tons of brass in each caliber. 

While many can't find ammo to shoot I'm at the range almost every weekend since deer season ended.

Good video, thanks for sharing your thoughts,

1895gunner


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

This is something I learned the hard way from the current shortage. I need to keep a good supply of components on hand at all times. I don't stockpile large quantities of ammunition, I keep a few hundred rounds loaded generally but I almost always have components on hand to load more. This shortage caught me with my pants down and I am woefully understocked on components. I have been able to find everything I need except bullets, .224" bullets specifically is what I need and they are completely wiped out everywhere I have tried to get them. I have one last place to check tomorrow on my way home from work but if they've got them I'll end up paying quite a bit more than I would have anywhere else (his prices are notoriously high). When things get back to normal I plan to spend a significant amount to stockpile components and am planning a large scale purchase of primers and powder for me and a few friends that load. I plan to order 48lbs of powder and 75lbs worth of primers to get the most of the hazmat fees. Bullets (.224") I'll be ordering in the 5000+ range. I will not be in this position again.

-Infidel


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## Montana Rancher (Mar 4, 2013)

I've been doing this for a long time and here is my system:
Every Election Day I buy a new fire arm with clips and a thousand rounds of ammo and THEN i go vote. The price always seems to spike after the election, this year I purchased a upgrade Romanian AK47 for $680 (the normal ones were $495) I could sell it for a huge profit but I have several 1200 round cases of ammo and wanted the extra fire power.
IF we make it 2 more years the prices will be down to more sane levels, and you can exercise your right to vote and your right to veto all in the same day.
Anyone here ever heard of the "liberator", it was a single shot .45 pistol dropped to the French resistance in WW2, if your cant get ammo or guns now, learn from history.


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## Sr40ken (Nov 21, 2012)

I learned some time back, and have reloaded for quite a while. I have minimum 1000 rounds for the handguns 2000 for the Mini and building. I started the .308 in the middle of this mess but doing fair with it.I have a reserve of powder and consumables, do I have enough?, nope.


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## joec (Nov 12, 2012)

Well this is what I learned however some quick explanation. First I'm a life time member of the NRA and didn't hear from them over 30+ years. Now as soon as Obama won the first time he ran for office supplies started drying up and this in my opinion was all the propaganda coming out of the NRA. We went about 2 years before supplies got back to pre Obama levels however more guns and ammo bought in that period due to the constant barrage of propaganda out of the NRA. Well at that point I decided to not be caught again by it so stocked up over the next 1.5" years and learned to make my own knowing what would happen next time if he won a second term. Well it has happened so be prepared as before to see prices jump substantially when stock come back. This time it will come back with even a bigger sticker shock but I was prepared and now can produce for my needs for at least the next 2 years easily and with out changing my shooting habits. Those that did, Oh well as the boggy man Obama has been the best thing to happened to gun, ammo, accessories makers and the NRA in decades. It was unfounded last time and is this time as nothing being submitted really has much of a chance of passing as written.


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## GTGallop (Nov 11, 2012)

Ammo = Currency


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## nightshooter (Mar 9, 2013)

A lot of whats going on is Vinders and others that have deep pockets have loaded up on ammo and will sit on it till they can see when they can make a mint on it. It all happened before with the Cinton High Capacity Magazine Ban. I remmber seeing USGI M14 mags going for $100.00 each. Capitalism is another word for GREED.


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

nightshooter said:


> Capitalism is another word for GREED.


So what's the alternative, Socialism?

I am a Capitalist at heart. Not all Capitalists are greedy. Rape, pillage and plunder are not on the agenda for a lot of people.

I like our free market society. In the free market any product is worth what people are willing to pay. I know what I am willing to pay for a lot of things and what I refuse to pay. That doesn't mean I want to end Capitalism, it means that I will speak with my wallet.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

DHS socking up on a 24 year war supply does not help they first option on ammo as does the Military.
I stocked in the past have what I can live with but will keep adding but the curve on cost averaging is got a heck of a rise in it.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

For some time we tried to tell people Obama would come for the guns. We were called all kinds of names made fun of the whole tin foil hat thing.
Oh Obama does not want to take any guns, Obama can't do it we have the constitutions to stop him. We warned over and over of what was coming .
Well look around he is here. We are once again warning you of what is coming Government agency training local police to do their dirty work in going after Us citizens. They are creating a whole new form of federal LE agency, one that side steps all constitutional protections we once had. 
Oh you'll never see Drones used on US soil, really look up.
Look at the shelf's and wake up. 
Clearly you can't sell the kids to buy ammo and weapons don't spend you last buck doing so. But by all means if you have some left over after getting by, Get something even a few boxes is better than nothing, one hand gun one shot gun is better than a stick.
If it does not get turned around it is coming.
Just 6 months ago I had countless people tell me there are so many guns available there will always be some to buy, they will never pass another ban of any kind.
They will do as they please the Constitution as all but been voided. Obama appointments Unconstitutional what was his reply. so what I did it . Nothing you can do about it.
Look how fast ammo dried up, I am betting SHTF food will be gone in a flash. What does it take for S To HTF? Ask the people in the many country's it has.


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## joec (Nov 12, 2012)

Smitty901 said:


> For some time we tried to tell people Obama would come for the guns. We were called all kinds of names made fun of the whole tin foil hat thing.
> Oh Obama does not want to take any guns, Obama can't do it we have the constitutions to stop him. We warned over and over of what was coming .
> Well look around he is here. We are once again warning you of what is coming Government agency training local police to do their dirty work in going after Us citizens. They are creating a whole new form of federal LE agency, one that side steps all constitutional protections we once had.
> Oh you'll never see Drones used on US soil, really look up.
> ...


Got to love the short term memory loss. Actually this happened before he ever took office in 2008 and lasted about a year or so. Now the Connecticut shooting took place in November and that is what set this off however Obama has followed the lead on this I have my doubts this was something he would of pursued prior to Connecticut. As for unconstitutional please point those out as it gets a little tiresome hearing the same old BS with out any facts to back it up, especially if it has been upheld by a court not a charge.


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## LunaticFringeInc (Nov 20, 2012)

I have learned a number of things since the 94 AWB, 2008 ammo shortage as well as the current ammo shortage. Ill start from the begining and work my way to the current situation.

From the 94 AWB...

1. If you have one of those high capacity semi autos, you might want to lay in a good stash of magazines! They were sure hard to come by after the ban went into effect and they were very proud of them when you could find them for sale. Even in todays world after the ban has expired look at what the cost of high capacity mags will cost you today and the availability of them today with something like P-Mags.

2008 ammo shortage...

1. I realized that until I have enough ammo to last me a life time I do not have enough ammo. As soon as the shortage ended I made it my mission in life to not just have a good supply but to buy a little something every payday without fail. Since I reload I have mainly concentrated on things that cant be reloaded like 22 long rifle or things that could be purchased cheaper than I could reload them for such as 7.62 x 39. Thats not to say I didnt cash in on a few good deals on commercially loaded 9mm or 45 ACP. That mind set has really paid off in dividends in the current ammo shortage.

2. About the time that ammo started running short....so did reloading components! While I had a good supply it wasnt nearly enough to make me comfortable and in some cases I found my self lacking. Now I keep no less than 9000 primers on hand, 16-18 lbs of powder on hand at all times. While bullets and brass wasnt nearly as scarce I now keep a pretty good supply of that on hand as well.

3. Ammo aint getting any cheaper! While the shortage ended after about 10 months or so the prices never went back to normal and in many case were a good bit higher. My take is if you want it, better get it while the getting is good, its only going to go up in cost. I think back now to the days of 1.49 cent a 20 round box of 7.62 x 39 in 1995 and I wished I would have bought a couple of pallets!!!

The current ammo shortage...

1. I didnt notice this the last time but I sure notice it now, not such a bad idea to have some of the less common prepper calibers on hand and a gun to shoot them with. 223, 308, 7.62 x 39, 9mm and 45 ACP have been pretty hard to come buy in much of any quantity. Yes its available but the prices are usually considerably higher and stocks are thin. But the supply of 30-06, 270, 30-30 and 243 have been pretty decent and the prices have remained pretty steady. Maybe there is something to be said for keeping one extra caliber on hand or perhaps even traveling the less beaten path. Glad I have a couple of guns in those calibers although I never intended for it to be my primary go to guns, but in this day and age you never know...

But there is something else among all these events I have come to realize...having a black powder weapon is still kind of relevant! I havent seen near the limited supply of black powder that I have seen on other powders in the worst of times. Unfortunately I have an in line at the moment and I have seen some limited supplies of W209 primers. Sabots and bullets have been fairly easy to come buy even in times of scarcity. As such the last year has made me think long and hard about adding a flint lock capable of firing patched balls or at least minis. Flints very unlikely to be a real commodity as it abounds here in the US in great supplies. Black Powder from commercial sources hasnt seen much in the way of limited supply. Lead has been pretty available. As long as you got those three your in the shooting business no matter how tough it gets for everyone else around you. I am kind of thinking that maybe a flint lock aint so obsolete after all and might actually be kind of an asset.


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Diversify. I was so into streamlining. I was prepared to dump 7.62x39, 45 ACP, but no more. I'm adding both back to the mix, adding .308 and 300 WM too.


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

LunaticFringeInc said:


> The current ammo shortage...
> 
> 1. I didnt notice this the last time but I sure notice it now, not such a bad idea to have some of the less common prepper calibers on hand and a gun to shoot them with. 223, 308, 7.62 x 39, 9mm and 45 ACP have been pretty hard to come buy in much of any quantity. Yes its available but the prices are usually considerably higher and stocks are thin. But the supply of 30-06, 270, 30-30 and 243 have been pretty decent and the prices have remained pretty steady. Maybe there is something to be said for keeping one extra caliber on hand or perhaps even traveling the less beaten path. Glad I have a couple of guns in those calibers although I never intended for it to be my primary go to guns, but in this day and age you never know...
> 
> But there is something else among all these events I have come to realize...having a black powder weapon is still kind of relevant! I havent seen near the limited supply of black powder that I have seen on other powders in the worst of times. Unfortunately I have an in line at the moment and I have seen some limited supplies of W209 primers. Sabots and bullets have been fairly easy to come buy even in times of scarcity. As such the last year has made me think long and hard about adding a flint lock capable of firing patched balls or at least minis. Flints very unlikely to be a real commodity as it abounds here in the US in great supplies. Black Powder from commercial sources hasnt seen much in the way of limited supply. Lead has been pretty available. As long as you got those three your in the shooting business no matter how tough it gets for everyone else around you. I am kind of thinking that maybe a flint lock aint so obsolete after all and might actually be kind of an asset.


I'm in total agreement here, can't get components for .223 can't get 7.62x39 ammo but I can load all the 6.5x55 Swede, .35 Rem or .280 Rem I could need. .30-06 is another great one to have in the arsenal seems the ammo is still available in quantity and Greek M2 Ball is $98 for 200 rounds through the CMP. After the panic ends .30-06 will be available everywhere ammo is sold if it isn't right now.

Muzzleloaders are a great idea also, I have somewhere near 10,000 209 primers so that's not an issue for me and I like the reliability of the inline over the flintlock. I've never tried it but I've heard that blackpowder is fairly easy to make (maybe someone else can weigh in on this) in which case there's no worries about where powder is coming from. A good bullet mold would be worth it's weight in gold in a bad situation so that's something that should be picked up now while they're available.

-Infidel


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## LunaticFringeInc (Nov 20, 2012)

> I've never tried it but I've heard that blackpowder is fairly easy to make (maybe someone else can weigh in on this) in which case there's no worries about where powder is coming from.


The process for the most part isnt that difficult and the components fairly available, but thats not the hard part. The hard part is not having a boo-boo in the process of making it which is pretty easy to do if your not extremely careful. If your lucky you will only screw up once and not live to suffer the consequences of surviving a explosive mishap. Personally I would much rather buy it than make it, big time! I still make solid propellant rocket motors though using the same Recipe Hamas uses even today...thats a lot safer than making gun powder!


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## StarPD45 (Nov 13, 2012)

I guess I'm old 'cause I remember learning how to make black powder in grade school. Textbooks actually had things beside PC crap back then. You could actually learn from them.


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## LunaticFringeInc (Nov 20, 2012)

StarPD45 said:


> I guess I'm old 'cause I remember learning how to make black powder in grade school. Textbooks actually had things beside PC crap back then. You could actually learn from them.


Aint that the truth! The things our science teacher taught us back then would have got him his head served on a silver platter before sun down these days. But man did I learn a lot in the process! In fact his class was so cool many of us took it as an elective the following years even though we had the required science class requirements met. Now that there says a lot. Todays kids are as dumb as a box of rocks! They got potential to be sure, public school systems just dont require them to use it anymore...


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## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

The problem in making your own black powder isn't in the making of it, it's in making it with consistency. I have made lots of it in the past but getting the same results from batch to batch is harded than you might think. You can make it and it is very likely still going to shoot a bullet fast enough to kill but maintaining accuracy at a given range is what launching bullets is all about for me. Water is going to be at a premium in a SHTF senario and cleaning that black powder gun may not happen as often as necessary. For me there are too many drawbacks to black powder for it to be worth considering at this point. If I needed to I could always make it and use it in a "pipe" gun or a hand grenade made from pipe but I would never consider using it for anything like hunting or a firefight. A crossbow would be faster onthe reloads and give nearly the same effective range.


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