# Black Holes Where Americans Disappear



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Chicago police are detaining Americans at an abuse-laden 'black site' - Business Insider

This is something to read and consider.

Most of us who have been around for a handful of decades and have bothered to read history realize this nation is not immune to going down the road of tyranny. Not since we stepped off the constitutional path many, many decades ago.

Where do you think it all ends? Nowhere good. Our country is not the same country I knew as a kid. Assuming I live another fifty years, I wonder what I will see.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

Denton said:


> Chicago police are detaining Americans at an abuse-laden 'black site' - Business Insider
> 
> This is something to read and consider.
> 
> ...


This is simply the logical extension of SWAT tactics. No one should be surprised.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Everyone should be surprised. This is (still) the united states of America.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Funny a brit newspaper, not one independent us story. kind of reminds me of the rolling stones story of rape on the UVA campus that turned out to be false.


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## TacticalCanuck (Aug 5, 2014)

Clearly an affront to your rights if it's true.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

If true, it is just the tip of the ice berg.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Why would anyone think that AG Eric Holder would uphold the Constitution and rule of law?


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## Seneca (Nov 16, 2012)

A black site? by the sounds of it, it may be more appropriate to call it a black an blue site.
Bare bulbs and rubber hoses anyone?
I think it bears watching to see which way this goes, either it is or it isn't.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

TacticalCanuck said:


> Clearly an affront to your rights if it's true.


 Rights?? Seriously?? It's affront to basic humanity. Cause once this happens it's all down hill.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

oddapple said:


> Everyone should be surprised. This is (still) the united states of America.


Are you sure?  How would you know if it wasn't?


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Where is our little buddy the ACLU and their red hearing leftist watch group the southern poverty law center? 

If this story is true I would think some lawyer would make some pretty good cash and some former inmates would have a new
entitlement train.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Ripon said:


> Where is our little buddy the ACLU and their red hearing leftist watch group the southern poverty law center?
> 
> If this story is true I would think some lawyer would make some pretty good cash and some former inmates would have a new
> entitlement train.


All things are made possible by the NDAA. The last twenty years or so have been pretty detrimental to what was originally created.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

but, but, but, this is all being run by cops! They're the good guys! LOL

This is made possible by blind faith in LEOs supporting a corrupt political establishment.


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## Arklatex (May 24, 2014)

Here's what the liberals say:

http://www.msnbc.com/politicsnation/chicago-police-department-speaks-homan-square-facility

http://chicago.suntimes.com/news-ch...ice-deny-report-secret-interrogation-compound


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

I think people here are going to have to fight just to keep everywhere from turning into a "low performance area" and that as long as people remember the difference, it's hard for people to complain. When you have a predominantly victim and muslim crowd you have to have a way not to process every single person every single time. 
But outside of a swamping nest of democrat going berserk no, I have seen "secret question/deal" centers in the south and it's a dirty, ugly business that shouldn't be for financial gain and running the dope or on regular citizens.


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## TacticalCanuck (Aug 5, 2014)

Chipper said:


> Rights?? Seriously?? It's affront to basic humanity. Cause once this happens it's all down hill.


Not sure what to say. I certainly think its wrong. Seriously wrong. Dangers from within seems?


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> but, but, but, this is all being run by cops! They're the good guys! LOL
> 
> This is made possible by blind faith in LEOs supporting a corrupt political establishment.


cops dont have black sites nor they operate or participate in black ops. you need to get your facts straight and maybe direct that accusations to the 3 letter agencies in the federal government. here you go again with your BS about cops and SWAT.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

A little background. I've been using a 60,000 SWAT raids a year figure. It seems I have become out of date and the figure is now 80,000.

https://www.rutherford.org/publicat...ice_in_america_now_a_military_occupying_force

There is a word for this: Corruption


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## Illini Warrior (Jan 24, 2015)

can't believe so many people are buying into this BS .... thanx for supporting all the wrong people

I can't believe they managed to take a pic of the building without showing the CPD signage .... there's a huge sign on the building .... notice the parking lot - only parking lot on the Westside without a security gate & barbed wire - no secret those are cop cars

big time CIA black ops center ....


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> A little background. I've been using a 60,000 SWAT raids a year figure. It seems I have become out of date and the figure is now 80,000.
> 
> https://www.rutherford.org/publicat...ice_in_america_now_a_military_occupying_force
> 
> There is a word for this: Corruption


it does not matter is the figures are 180,000 swat raids or 1,000,000,000. if they have search warrant then it is legal. that is not corruption. do not twist the meaning of corruption to justify your bias and hatred towards cops. the truth is, one day long ago you called the cops because someone bothered you. and when the cops told you the person could not be prosecuted because he has mental issues, you got mad because things did not go in your favor. get over it, you need to cowboy up and understand that not everything will go your way. if you cant handle that, maybe you need a shot of testosterone to help you out.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

You have to understand where some folks on this forum are coming from. Anything dealing with cops - automatically jack booted nazi thugs. Anything dealing with the federal government - new world order conspiracy. The FED - an unconstitutional acency set up by international jew bankers to control everyone's life in the world. 

And don't dare argue facts with some foks cause one or more of the mods will ban you from speaking the truth


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

It may pass legal muster because the judges are corrupt. Every judge signing a no knock warrant for a simple search is violating the 4th amendment. They've essentially condoned the destruction of the Bill of Rights.

How long do you think it will be before the break down your door and shoot your dog, or maybe shoot you? Do you think just because you are a cop you are immune?


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Diver said:


> It may pass legal muster because the judges are corrupt. Every judge signing a no knock warrant for a simple search is violating the 4th amendment. They've essentially condoned the destruction of the Bill of Rights.
> 
> How long do you think it will be before the break down your door and shoot your dog, or maybe shoot you? Do you think just because you are a cop you are immune?


Diver: did the cops break down your door or did they politely knock and wait for you to come to the door.


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## Seneca (Nov 16, 2012)

It might be some kind of training center? who knows what it is! and therein lies the rub. 

The minute they won't come out and say what it is they are doing in the building all (you know what) breaks loose. Speculation runs rampant and eventually there is a consensus within the speculation and presto you have a black site run by the police. 

I don't even live around there and now I'm curious, as to what may be going on in there.


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> It may pass legal muster because the judges are corrupt. Every judge signing a no knock warrant for a simple search is violating the 4th amendment. They've essentially condoned the destruction of the Bill of Rights.
> 
> How long do you think it will be before the break down your door and shoot your dog, or maybe shoot you? Do you think just because you are a cop you are immune?


no one is immune Diver. but lets be reasonable, do you think the swat team will raid your house for no reason at all? a judge will sign a search warrant based on the statement of probable cause presented to him. if the affiant lied and falsified the information to reach probable cause, then you could complain and sue. if your house gets raided they will leave you a copy of the warrant. read it, use it to your advantage. but to just say that cops will just raid your house is stupid. yes, cops make mistakes and hits the wrong house from time to time, cops are not perfect. but see you are not reasonable, what you want is impossible. what you want is all cops to go away because long time ago when you called the cops, things did not go your way. now you say warrants are issued because judges are corrupt? do you have proof of that? what does a judge get by signing a bad warrant? what is a judge going to gain by having my house raided?


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## James L (Feb 7, 2015)

mhans827 said:


> no one is immune Diver. but lets be reasonable, do you think the swat team will raid your house for no reason at all? a judge will sign a search warrant based on the statement of probable cause presented to him. if the affiant lied and falsified the information to reach probable cause, then you could complain and sue. if your house gets raided they will leave you a copy of the warrant. read it, use it to your advantage. but to just say that cops will just raid your house is stupid. yes, cops make mistakes and hits the wrong house from time to time, cops are not perfect. but see you are not reasonable, what you want is impossible. what you want is all cops to go away because long time ago when you called the cops, things did not go your way. now you say warrants are issued because judges are corrupt? do you have proof of that? what does a judge get by signing a bad warrant? what is a judge going to gain by having my house raided?


conspiracy I tell you....


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

OK, I reread the article; figured maybe I missed something. Seems I didn't. The article is not about SWAT or SRT, nor is it about cops in general.

A broken record is making it easy for the tune to not be heard.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

No It's not about cops in general. SWAT is in the bldg as well as Gangs. But more important it was a half a$$ed report without any details and just a whole bunch of generalizations that you all pick up that it's a black ops type facility where a civilians rights have no place. And that's a bunch of horse hockey.

Diver is a broken record on hating cops and no knock warrants and SWAT. But instead of addressing or highlighting issues that can be effectively dealt with by an ordinary citizen, most of what get's posted on this site is meant to incite others to revolt.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

SARGE7402 said:


> No It's not about cops in general. SWAT is in the bldg as well as Gangs. But more important it was a half a$$ed report without any details and just a whole bunch of generalizations that you all pick up that it's a black ops type facility where a civilians rights have no place. And that's a bunch of horse hockey.
> 
> Diver is a broken record on hating cops and no knock warrants and SWAT. But instead of addressing or highlighting issues that can be effectively dealt with by an ordinary citizen, most of what get's posted on this site is meant to incite others to revolt.


You don't know what the facility is, Sarge. Just as I can count on Diver to attack all cops, all the time, I can count on you to defend all things "authority."

I really think you two could start a very lucrative podcast. Seriously. I am in no way kidding! Yeah, I know, money isn't everything, but it sure buys a lot of stuff!


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## Illini Warrior (Jan 24, 2015)

Seneca said:


> It might be some kind of training center? who knows what it is! and therein lies the rub.
> 
> The minute they won't come out and say what it is they are doing in the building all (you know what) breaks loose. Speculation runs rampant and eventually there is a consensus within the speculation and presto you have a black site run by the police.
> 
> I don't even live around there and now I'm curious, as to what may be going on in there.


contrary to what you see on TV - like Chicago PD - the special police units don't work upstairs in the regular police precinct houses .... that's what's works out of this building ... it has a crime lab unit, SWAT and gang crimes ect ect .... I'm guessing they got the building for a song

everybody is laughing around the city at the stupidity .... I think they need to investigate the stables where they house the police horses .... it really stinks out there


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

Denton said:


> You don't know what the facility is, Sarge. Just as I can count on Diver to attack all cops, all the time, I can count on you to defend all things "authority."
> 
> I really think you two could start a very lucrative podcast. Seriously. I am in no way kidding! Yeah, I know, money isn't everything, but it sure buys a lot of stuff!


That's well put and expresses what I would hope to be the right level of skepticism for the average person.

I obviously don't know what is going on in that building, but I believe we have extensive violations of basic rights going on in the country, especially by SWAT which is in the building. Chicago is known for corrupt politics. (Does IL have a former governor who isn't in jail?). Put that together and I find the idea expressed in the article credible.

The fact that any American should find such a thing credible is a comment on the state of trust in government that I never would have dreamed of 20 years ago.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Diver said:


> That's well put and expresses what I would hope to be the right level of skepticism for the average person.
> 
> I obviously don't know what is going on in that building, but I believe we have extensive violations of basic rights going on in the country, especially by SWAT which is in the building. Chicago is known for corrupt politics. (Does IL have a former governor who isn't in jail?). Put that together and I find the idea expressed in the article credible.
> 
> The fact that any American should find such a thing credible is a comment on the state of trust in government that I never would have dreamed of 20 years ago.


Thing of it is, some of us _could_ see such a thing headed our way. We knew the direction the country was headed, we just didn't know how and who would put the pieces together that would make such things believable to people outside our little research and study community.

You blame the cops, as if they know more than the average citizen. They do not. They are taught exactly what to do, they are not taught to be constitutional experts. You rail at the cops, but in doing so, you rail against our fellow countrymen. All the while, your blinding anger causes you to ignore the real threat.

Am I saying there aren't some cops that are bullies, or are knuckle-draggers or are not blood thirsty? OF course not; they are human, and there are humans who are all those things. What I am saying is, in general, cops aren't going to even begin to take your rants seriously when they feel nothing but hatred aimed at them.


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## Arklatex (May 24, 2014)

Illini Warrior said:


> can't believe so many people are buying into this BS .... thanx for supporting all the wrong people
> 
> I can't believe they managed to take a pic of the building without showing the CPD signage .... there's a huge sign on the building .... notice the parking lot - only parking lot on the Westside without a security gate & barbed wire - no secret those are cop cars
> 
> big time CIA black ops center ....





Illini Warrior said:


> contrary to what you see on TV - like Chicago PD - the special police units don't work upstairs in the regular police precinct houses .... that's what's works out of this building ... it has a crime lab unit, SWAT and gang crimes ect ect .... I'm guessing they got the building for a song
> 
> everybody is laughing around the city at the stupidity .... I think they need to investigate the stables where they house the police horses .... it really stinks out there


I'm with him on this. Most likely nothing to worry about. It's well known to the locals, apparently.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

Denton said:


> Thing of it is, some of us _could_ see such a thing headed our way. We knew the direction the country was headed, we just didn't know how and who would put the pieces together that would make such things believable to people outside our little research and study community.
> 
> You blame the cops, as if they know more than the average citizen. They do not. They are taught exactly what to do, they are not taught to be constitutional experts. You rail at the cops, but in doing so, you rail against our fellow countrymen. All the while, your blinding anger causes you to ignore the real threat.
> 
> Am I saying there aren't some cops that are bullies, or are knuckle-draggers or are not blood thirsty? OF course not; they are human, and there are humans who are all those things. What I am saying is, in general, cops aren't going to even begin to take your rants seriously when they feel nothing but hatred aimed at them.


You are correct. Being the target of people who are fed up with corruption goes with being the face of that corruption.

Clearly judges that sign the warrants, legislators who make everything a felony and others are actors in this little drama. Cops will remain the face of it.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Diver said:


> You are correct. Being the target of people who are fed up with corruption goes with being the face of that corruption.
> 
> Clearly judges that sign the warrants, legislators who make everything a felony and others are actors in this little drama. *Cops will remain the face of it*.


Yes, they are the face, the face that keeps on receiving the spit and profanity that should be directed elsewhere. Why spit at ourselves?


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Denton said:


> You don't know what the facility is, Sarge. Just as I can count on Diver to attack all cops, all the time, I can count on you to defend all things "authority."
> 
> I really think you two could start a very lucrative podcast. Seriously. I am in no way kidding! Yeah, I know, money isn't everything, but it sure buys a lot of stuff!


perhaps if you'd googled the Homan square chicago pd and read the article by a chicago news outlet you would be better able to converse. hell even the chicago lawyers don't have an issue with Homan specifically. CPD as a whole some. but you want to brand it a black hole just cause some limey twit wrote an article. you really do have an issue almost as bad if not worse than diver.

always stirring the pot


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## Arklatex (May 24, 2014)

SARGE7402 said:


> perhaps if you'd googled the Homan square chicago pd and read the article by a chicago news outlet you would be better able to converse. hell even the chicago lawyers don't have an issue with Homan specifically. CPD as a whole some. but you want to brand it a black hole just cause some limey twit wrote an article. you really do have an issue almost as bad if not worse than diver.
> 
> always stirring the pot





Arklatex said:


> Here's what the liberals say:
> 
> http://www.msnbc.com/politicsnation/chicago-police-department-speaks-homan-square-facility
> 
> http://chicago.suntimes.com/news-ch...ice-deny-report-secret-interrogation-compound


I guess yall missed post 14?


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Nothing illegal happens to anyone - except to those who illegal things happen. All is above board and on the books, except those who are not. In those cases, there are no cases.

All is well, thus sayeth the apologist of all things authoritarian. Anyone who dare claim otherwise is doing nothing but stirring the pot. 

Seriously, you two would host one stellar podcast! Y'all would have to record from different locations. Otherwise, Diver would be afraid of police brutality.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

Denton said:


> Nothing illegal happens to anyone - except to those who illegal things happen. All is above board and on the books, except those who are not. In those cases, there are no cases.
> 
> All is well, thus sayeth the apologist of all things authoritarian. Anyone who dare claim otherwise is doing nothing but stirring the pot.
> 
> Seriously, you two would host one stellar podcast! Y'all would have to record from different locations. Otherwise, Diver would be afraid of police brutality.


The difference can be answered with a series of questions:

What is the role of Law enforcement in a free society such as the founders envisioned in our Constitution?

What is the role of Law enforcement in a tyrannical state, such as Stalinst USSR?

In which country are you more likely to have your door broken down in the middle of the night, your family roughed up, etc. Today, The USA or Russia? (Hint: I know the answer to that one and you should too.)

What does that make us on a continuum between a free society and a tyranny? What does that makes the cop?

I suspect most of us would be in agreement on the first two questions. We part company on where we are on the spectrum between freedom and tyranny, though many might agree the trend is not good.

If the trend is negative, then each cop needs to decide what he wants to do with his own future.


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> The difference can be answered with a series of questions:
> 
> What is the role of Law enforcement in a free society such as the founders envisioned in our Constitution?
> 
> ...


so tell us here.... how many times has a cop broken down your door in the middle of the night and roughed you up? from the way you talk about SWAT they just go on a raid spree without a warrant. give us numbers here, how many times has your house been raided by SWAT


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Well hope they aint pulling this stuff on any innocent black folks. Obummer and Eric X. would be on that with a big federal investigation quick.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

mhans827 said:


> so tell us here.... how many times has a cop broken down your door in the middle of the night and roughed you up? from the way you talk about SWAT they just go on a raid spree without a warrant. give us numbers here, how many times has your house been raided by SWAT


SWAT hits 80,000 homes a year here in the US. The comparison to Russia is unfavorable.

My personal situation is not your concern, though SWAT raids occur in my neighborhood and SWAT raids on the wrong address happen. Your concern is are we moving toward a more tyrannical state and what will be your role if we are?


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Diver: don't know where you get your numbers from but that most anti cop organization - the aclu only quotes a figure about half of what you do. https://www.aclu.org/blog/criminal-law-reform/another-day-another-124-violent-swat-raids

My question is did you pull this number out of your butt?

And the way you talk like you're some sort of self appointed expert on SWAT we've all got to wonder did you have a bad day with SWAT once upon a time? Or have you ever ridden along with them? Or do you make this stuff up as you go along.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Swat only came got one of my neighbors and he was dealing meth. Surprised it took so long for the law dogs to figure it out.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

bigwheel said:


> Swat only came got one of my neighbors and he was dealing meth. Surprised it took so long for the law dogs to figure it out.


before I came to the big city we were treated to a look at the new small scale meth lab. Really it consisted of a two liter soda bottle. Hard part is getting sufficient sudafed - a chemical used to make meth. New Shake and Bake Meth Method Explodes


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Color me slow, but why the rub over SWAT/SRT?


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## James L (Feb 7, 2015)

SARGE7402 said:


> before I came to the big city we were treated to a look at the new small scale meth lab. Really it consisted of a two liter soda bottle. Hard part is getting sufficient sudafed - a chemical used to make meth. New Shake and Bake Meth Method Explodes


Tweakers here would leave them in rural mailboxes for a few hours while they "cooked". The first few times county got reports of exploding mailboxes we were perplexed. Thought it was kids and fireworks. That is SCARY stuff.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

James L said:


> Tweakers here would leave them in rural mailboxes for a few hours while they "cooked". The first few times county got reports of exploding mailboxes we were perplexed. Thought it was kids and fireworks. That is SCARY stuff.


I never heard of no cook leaving his goods in some strangers mail box. Teenagers do that. Usually using strips of tinfoil covered with muriatic acid in a tighltly sealed soda bottle. It will scatter and flatten a mail box like nobodys business.

@Sarge7402..yeppers making that stuff is getting real simple. Seems to recall they call it the Nazi Method. Guess thats how old Adolf made his. The meth head neighbor said he did not need any steekne Psuophede. He could make a good batch out of a mineral block cow licking cube. Course he coulda been lying but I dont think so. The stuff is devastating all the small towns in these parts.

Methology 101: Old-school meth labs give way to "shake and bake" | Riverfront Times


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

Denton said:


> Color me slow, but why the rub over SWAT/SRT?


SWAT violates the traditional interpretation of the 4th amendment. Under the precedent of the first 175 years of our history, the subject of a search warrant was assumed to be law abiding and given the opportunity to answer the door, receive the warrant, and allow the search to occur.

With the advent of SWAT the subject of the search is presumed guilty and a violent home invasion is permitted to accomplish the search. This change was originally justified for an extremely small number of highly violent individuals. At 80,000 a year they are routine.

Traditional 4th amendment is gone. Furthermore, if they hit your house in error, there is generally no compensation for the damages that occur.

The revolution was fought over this and other issues. Imagine yourself as a MA colonist and a half dozen British soldiers show up in the middle of the night, kick in your door, toss your home and rough up your family. The Bill of Rights was mostly in response to British abuses, but those abuses are returning the the US today.


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> SWAT hits 80,000 homes a year here in the US. The comparison to Russia is unfavorable.
> 
> My personal situation is not your concern, though SWAT raids occur in my neighborhood and SWAT raids on the wrong address happen. Your concern is are we moving toward a more tyrannical state and what will be your role if we are?


here's how things work diver. If I was called to hit anyones house, I will check the search warrant. If warrant is approved, the raid is a go. if there is no warrant, there will be no raid, its that simple. Again, if there are 1,000,000,000 SWAT raids a year, as long they have the warrant I'm ok with that and so should you. there is nothing tyrannical with serving search warrant. The problem here is we loosely use the term tyrannical and not even know what is it all about. have you ever fought tyranny before. I mean a real fight with the govt.? standing infront of armed troops trying to get rid of tyrant who ruled a country for 20 years and killed so many?

as for your personal situation, I expected that you would evade my simple question. to be blunt, I was not concerned about you being raided, I know you have never been raided. you simply hate cops or any form of LE. there are many people like you in this country that likes to talk a lot of smack but has no real facts, and your gripes against the police are baseless. Also, these 80,000 raids, do you mind telling me what are they for? what crimes?


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

mhans827 said:


> here's how things work diver. If I was called to hit anyones house, I will check the search warrant. If warrant is approved, the raid is a go. if there is no warrant, there will be no raid, its that simple. Again, if there are 1,000,000,000 SWAT raids a year, as long they have the warrant I'm ok with that and so should you. there is nothing tyrannical with serving search warrant. The problem here is we loosely use the term tyrannical and not even know what is it all about. have you ever fought tyranny before. I mean a real fight with the govt.? standing infront of armed troops trying to get rid of tyrant who ruled a country for 20 years and killed so many?
> 
> as for your personal situation, I expected that you would evade my simple question. to be blunt, I was not concerned about you being raided, I know you have never been raided. you simply hate cops or any form of LE. there are many people like you in this country that likes to talk a lot of smack but has no real facts, and your gripes against the police are baseless. Also, these 80,000 raids, do you mind telling me what are they for? what crimes?


You are the kind of cop who would set up a SWAT raid on my house just because you don't like me. Do you really think I am going to share any personal information with a thug like you?


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

Diver said:


> You are the kind of cop who would set up a SWAT raid on my house just because you don't like me. Do you really think I am going to share any personal information with a thug like you?


 see there you go again with your assumptions about me. do you really think I am that stupid to draw up paper work to raid your house because I dont like you... I have been in this game for a long time diver. and if you really think I will be going after you because I call you out all the time in this forum, then you are really clueless when it comes to LE. please do not comit a crime diver, you are not that smart, you will get caught easily.


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## James L (Feb 7, 2015)

bigwheel said:


> I never heard of no cook leaving his goods in some strangers mail box. Teenagers do that. Usually using strips of tinfoil covered with muriatic acid in a tighltly sealed soda bottle. It will scatter and flatten a mail box like nobodys business.
> 
> @Sarge7402..yeppers making that stuff is getting real simple. Seems to recall they call it the Nazi Method. Guess thats how old Adolf made his. The meth head neighbor said he did not need any steekne Psuophede. He could make a good batch out of a mineral block cow licking cube. Course he coulda been lying but I dont think so. The stuff is devastating all the small towns in these parts.
> 
> Methology 101: Old-school meth labs give way to "shake and bake" | Riverfront Times


Because of the chances of exploding...they would find a rural house....when the owner leaves they put it in the mailbox for a few hours....then return and pick it up if it hasn't exploded.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

The British troops had valid warrants under the law at that time. The other significant feature of these warrants is they were general in nature as they were issued by judges in England. As a result, troops invading colonial homes had every legal right to do what they were doing under law at that time. The use of general warrants has not yet caught on for SWAT raids, but they have crept into use for electronic surveillance based on the FISA courts, so that aspect of the 4th amendment has fallen by the wayside as well. At this point all that is needed to completely remove any fiction that the 4th amendment still applies is to bring the general warrants being issued by FISA courts together with SWAT capabilities.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

mhans827 said:


> see there you go again with your assumptions about me. do you really think I am that stupid to draw up paper work to raid your house because I dont like you... I have been in this game for a long time diver. and if you really think I will be going after you because I call you out all the time in this forum, then you are really clueless when it comes to LE. please do not comit a crime diver, you are not that smart, you will get caught easily.


I think you are a thug. I don't trust you and don't want anything to do with you. I have no idea how low you will stoop but I think you would be perfectly comfortable as a member of the KGB.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Diver said:


> I think you are a thug. I don't trust you and don't want anything to do with you. I have no idea how low you will stoop but I think you would be perfectly comfortable as a member of the KGB.


Diver: you really need to get a grip on your emotions. And you're still making wild unfounded accusations. You're depiction of MH is just downright rotten. What you don't realize is that the Judiciary was not an independent coequal branch of government in colonial days. Everyone got their marching orders from the King - and though he might act like one BHO isn't our first king. Under our current system there has to be a law written and voted on by your elected representatives (legislative branch) before the Police - Executive Branch - can even think about enforcing it; and no search warrant's can be issued unless and independent judge, justice of the peace, magistrate, clerk of the court - Judicial Branch - approves the issuance of it. So what you think all cops want to do to you - break down your door and invade your space - requires a great conspiracy.

No offense Diver, you're not worth anyone's time or efforts. However, the paranoia that you exhibit here on this site could be used against you when it comes time to renew your permit to own and keep a long gun. It could definitely be construed as a sign of a mental unbalance.


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

SARGE7402 said:


> Diver: you really need to get a grip on your emotions. And you're still making wild unfounded accusations. You're depiction of MH is just downright rotten. What you don't realize is that the Judiciary was not an independent coequal branch of government in colonial days. Everyone got their marching orders from the King - and though he might act like one BHO isn't our first king. Under our current system there has to be a law written and voted on by your elected representatives (legislative branch) before the Police - Executive Branch - can even think about enforcing it; and no search warrant's can be issued unless and independent judge, justice of the peace, magistrate, clerk of the court - Judicial Branch - approves the issuance of it. So what you think all cops want to do to you - break down your door and invade your space - requires a great conspiracy.
> 
> No offense Diver, you're not worth anyone's time or efforts. However, the paranoia that you exhibit here on this site could be used against you when it comes time to renew your permit to own and keep a long gun. It could definitely be construed as a sign of a mental unbalance.


permit to own and keep a long gun. hmmm.....


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## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

OK, the personal attacks stop right here, right now.


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## 6811 (Jan 2, 2013)

hey prepadodo.... go f**k yourself...


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## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

Um, no, that's not the way this works.


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## Arklatex (May 24, 2014)

Yowza!!! Mhans827 if you can read this: it's been nice knowing you! Good luck and farewell, stay safe and continue keeping the scumbag child molesters off our streets!


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Diver said:


> SWAT violates the traditional interpretation of the 4th amendment. Under the precedent of the first 175 years of our history, the subject of a search warrant was assumed to be law abiding and given the opportunity to answer the door, receive the warrant, and allow the search to occur.
> 
> With the advent of SWAT the subject of the search is presumed guilty and a violent home invasion is permitted to accomplish the search. This change was originally justified for an extremely small number of highly violent individuals. At 80,000 a year they are routine.
> 
> ...


Special Weapons and Tactics has not a danged thing to do with whether or not an arrest warrant is issued. Not a thing.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

HOLY COW!! Did I miss this thread! It sure went South in a hurry. Remind me not to cook Ramen noodles anymore. Mish, I apologize for calling you a Poopy Pants.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

csi-tech said:


> HOLY COW!! Did I miss this thread! It sure went South in a hurry. Remind me not to cook Ramen noodles anymore. Mish, I apologize for calling you a Poopy Pants.


Yeah, it went south. It was not meant to be a cop-bashing thread, or a thread meant to accuse SWAT teams of running around like Central American death squads.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

I understand, I was outside the room, heard MH shout "ALLAH HU AKBAR!" and boom. It was over.


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