# Quick relocation bug out strategy pre-conflict



## Mr_K (5 mo ago)

Plan is to get a strategy to quickly bug out BEFORE any conflict.

This is 1 sentence ,but I'll bet a whole book can be written on it.
So many topics to cover.
*Anyone with good threads / reading on this topic ?*

Questions one should ask one selves :

how to detect when to bug out ,smelling upcoming conflict
when to decide to bug out
where to bug out
be mobile with financials , strategy , crypto , opening accounts ahead , ... ?
making sure you can travel
what if you miss the window(s) of opportunity , stay/travel ?

Let's face it. Prepping to stay home is very nice , but medically near to impossible. A very nice video exists (will post it when I find it back) from a medical point of view on this topic created by a doctor. Bottom line here is that you need this to survive. I'd prefer staying in a location where medicines , doctors and medics are around. I know for sure there are in my lifetime loads of events where I would have died without them (dental issues included) . Most of them are smart enough to bug out before conflicts arise. I'd follow them for sure of go where others are.

As such plan A should be : bug out before any conflict starts


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

I disagree. Bug out, where, why, how, far far too complicated. You cannot realistically carry enough, you abandon your community (strength in numbers), very hard to defend a mobile lifestyle, and become a homeless refugee in masses of refugees.

In my case, leaving tens of thousands of dollars of valuable life-time preps and the safety of my home, multiple vehicles, weapons, etc. would be a recipe to fail and die, and leave all my preps behind for looters. To me that would be completely foolish.

Yes, books have been written on this not-novel subject. Why don't you just relocate now, with all your preps so you can "bug in," which is far more safe? If you think your location is prone to disaster, find somewhere that is more stable and move there, now. Build a safer environment and stronghold.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Please explain, "Medically near to impossible." 
"Need this to survive." Need what?
What would have old farts, like me do?


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## Real Old Man (Aug 17, 2015)

First nothing should be set in stone. One must be flexible and ready and able to respond to what ever life throws at them.

Gathering Intel is a must. You base your plans - stay go permanent or temporary - on your best estimate of the situation.

But remember what works for Joe may or may not work for you


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## Spenser (5 mo ago)

paraquack said:


> Please explain, "Medically near to impossible."
> "Need this to survive." Need what?
> What would have old farts, like me do?


I can only assume that he is referring to individuals with medical problems that require regular treatment and meds.

*Mr. K* I think you are not taking something into consideration. I will use my state of NY for example. In April of 2020, I think we were hitting like 5,000 cases a day and by the end of the month hospitals were lacking necessary PPE, meds, and available bed space. EMTs were told not to resuscitate heart attack victims somewhere along this time period.

New York state has a population of ~ 21 + million, so in short hospitals were over run by 1/140 of the population of NY. In a bad SHTF scenario that number would be exponentially greater. Instead of having to wait hours if not the whole day to get seen by a Doctor ( prior to Covid) plan on waiting not hours but days to be seen.

United states and pretty much the entire world is set up to handle the daily mishaps and medical issues of patients that statistically would occur on any given day, but a major natural disaster, the world is pretty much screwed. Look how long it took the former POTUS to send a military medical ship to NYC, and due to it being Covid, and not physical trauma, the protocols to be allowed to get in as a patient on that ship ended up having like a very small fraction of patients onboard being treated for non covid related conditions.

Some natural disasters you have no choice to bug out. Right now I am thinking of that video of a house floating down a flooded area, and imagining Mr Lemonaid riding it out in the home and setting up base where ever the home settles when the flooding is gone.


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

Spenser said:


> Look how long it took the former POTUS to send a military medical ship to NYC, and due to it being Covid, and not physical trauma, the protocols to be allowed to get in as a patient on that ship ended up having like a very small fraction of patients onboard being treated for non covid related conditions.


President Trump was among the farthest ahead on the Covid crisis, farther along the learning curve than almost everybody, including prominent Dems who were still partying in public without masks, well into the crisis. President Trump very quickly deployed the 2 Navy medical ships to both coasts, when it appeared necessary. They were not utilized, as it turns out, because as President Trump said early on, it was mostly a big hoax on the American people. It was designed to destroy the thriving economy, collapse society, and allow for election fraud thru mail-in ballots and harvesting frauds.



Spenser said:


> Some natural disasters you have no choice to bug out. Right now I am thinking of that video of a house floating down a flooded area, and imagining Mr Lemonaid riding it out in the home and setting up base where ever the home settles when the flooding is gone.


If you choose poorly, you will be endlessly dealing with natural disasters, economic crisis, and political crisis. If you choose wisely, you can thrive and not face these things. There's probably "good locations" that are relatively free of these plights which would FORCE you to "bug out," in 30-40 states. Just be smart about where you pick. Don't live in densely populated areas, and/or near hurricane prone areas, areas prone to massive fires, floods, chemical spills, nuclear reactors, etc.

I'll use your statement from a different thread as a talking point.



Spenser said:


> I left Rhode Island to get away from the flooding and went to Calif
> I leave Calif to get away from the earthquakes, gang violence & smog and went to Texas.
> *Flooding, wildfires, tornados, hurricanes, hail storms, sinkholes, erosion and drought* all occur in the state.(rated # 1out of the 50 states for the most natural disasters"
> I tried Florida only to be hit by a Cat 4 Hurricane
> I ended up in NY and was greeted by a crap load of snow fall. ( & no not the Big Apple no skyscrapers here where I live)


Your "picker" is terrible. All dense populations prone to various widely known natural disasters and terrible politics (deprivation of liberties) and taxes (economic crisis).

Rhode Island - well known harsh weather and atrocious leftist politics and bad taxes;
California - maybe one of the worst states for natural disasters and leftist politics and taxes;
Florida - mostly coastlines, extremely prone to hurricanes which essentially force one to "bug out" annually and lose all assets left behind.
New York - extreme weather, extremely bad politics and taxes...

You've picked 3 densely populated solidly blue states and 1 purple swing state, all plagued with regular widespread natural disasters. This does not reflect a very good history of selecting criteria for where to reside. It would be hard to pick worse places to be blunt. The places you've picked are the antithesis of a "prepper," and more aligned with a 25 year old who wants to live in a trendy growing area, ALL FOUR of which were coastline states, indifferent to any and all natural disasters and terrible politics.


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

To the OP, you're in Europe. 


Mr_K said:


> *Greetings from Europe* , land of the !(free) and the !(brave) 🥴 *well on the way on our path of self destruction .
> Trying to learn something on this forum how to get around this mentally , financially , physically.*


You are seemingly seriously limited by geography, politics, population density, and terrible economics with high costs of living and high taxation, and controlled borders in all directions (whether land country borders, or sea). All of these are likely to get worse.

If you want advice, it's time to relocate to somewhere sane and less densely populated, less prone to violence and war, more liberties and freedom. Maybe that's somewhere in Europe, or you may need to expand your search vastly.

"Bugging out," and "surviving" in densely populated mostly leftist political run Europe, where you are not allowed to own guns or defend yourself generally speaking, during a natural or man made disaster, like war, would be a suicidal fiction.


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

Many parts of the world are prone to, and growing more prone to, extreme risks of war, famine, political violence, terrorism, economic depressions, high taxes, political corruption, mass refugee migration and mixing of incompatible cultures (religious zealot muslims with peaceful catholics, etc.), etc. 

Pretend you're standing in the WTC buildings on 9/11/01 and you see the first plane impact. Do you stay and wait out the resolution, and be a victim of one of the largest singular terrorist attacks in history, or should you leave?

Pretend you're standing on the beach of Thailand on December 26, 2004. You hear of about a big off-shore earthquake and a Tsunami coming in. Do you stay and wait, and be part of the QUARTER MILLION lives lost that day? 

We are all watching the world, and our individual nations/states etc. subject to massive seemingly TSUNAMI of overwhelming problems. It's time to get out of the building, get off the beach, and seek safety.


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## KellyDude (11 mo ago)

There's some fun info here: Urban Survival Site


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## Spenser (5 mo ago)

MrLemonade said:


> They were not utilized, as it turns out, because as President Trump said early on, it was mostly a big hoax on the American people.


Tell that to my dead mother lemonade that died in 2020 of complete organ failure that Covid was a hoax.

I didn't infer that the previous POTUS was being lazy and took forever to get the ships out, I was saying that a real SHTF the world as a whole is not prepared, not enough people in medical field compared to world population, not enough medical beds, and too much bureaucracy, which is probably why it took so much time for former POTUS to get the ships to us. Not sure about U lemon, but 3/4 a mile from me they were using freezer trucks and U-Haul type truck to store the dead as the morgues already had bodies in body bags stacked on top of each other several feet high.

Oh and MR Lemonade, you seemed to have taken an offence from what I mentioned, and it seems you have a man crush on former POTUS. 

I don't consider him, nor any movie star, or musician to be anything more then a person, and I set NO MAN on a pedestal 

God, Wife, Country, kids, and dog.


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## Cellcounter10 (10 mo ago)

Mr_K said:


> Plan is to get a strategy to quickly bug out BEFORE any conflict.
> 
> This is 1 sentence ,but I'll bet a whole book can be written on it.
> So many topics to cover.
> ...


I would look to Southern states. Alabama and Mississippi have cheap land, low taxes, conservative leadership and lower cost of living in general. I would buy there, and build to bug in, not out.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Spenser said:


> Tell that to my dead mother lemonade that died in 2020 of complete organ failure that Covid was a hoax.


I won't speak ill of the dead, nor cause you further pain by offering an opinion about your situation that you won't want to hear... My sympathies to you and yours on your loss.

But COVID was indeed a large and overplayed experiment in exactly how not to respond to a new and fast-spreading disease.
Known safe treatments were ignored and admonished, reputable doctors were silenced and put out of business, control of our lives was ceded over to world governments, all for a disease that caused respiratory inflammation and was treated by administering inflammation-inducing protocols.
Most people who succumbed to the illness did so as a result of delayed treatment and the wrong course of treatment being administered, and many provided such treatment under duress knowing what they were doing was ineffective or even counterproductive.
I hope we, as a species, never repeat the failures we witnessed over those 2+ years.


As to the topic at hand...
Bugging out should be a last resort, and only once you're convinced that your current situation is unlivable.
Fire or flood approaching? Bug out.
Grocery stores running out of food? Stay put.
These are just examples... but you are much better off with everything you've gathered during your preparations than you would be with just what you can carry or load into a vehicle.

Your first plan should be fortification and defense.
Your second plan should be attack and repel.
Your third plan should be retreat.
Only you can decide when each plan must be put into action.


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

Kauboy said:


> I won't speak ill of the dead, nor cause you further pain by offering an opinion about your situation that you won't want to hear... My sympathies to you and yours on your loss.
> 
> But COVID was indeed a large and overplayed experiment in exactly how not to respond to a new and fast-spreading disease.
> Known safe treatments were ignored and admonished, reputable doctors were silenced and put out of business, control of our lives was ceded over to world governments, all for a disease that caused respiratory inflammation and was treated by administering inflammation-inducing protocols.
> ...


100% agreed. 

I also won't disparage the individual deceased, even though Spenser brought it up and a shot at President Trump (who was more right than all the "experts" or the Dems on any of it), but I will say that the overwhelmingly bulk of those having died of Covid, did not die of Covid but instead some other co-morbidity for which nearly any serious illness would have been terminal. But this isn't a Covid thread, it's a thread about "bugging in" vs. "bugging out." As Kauboy said, you should fortify in a location long term with plans to weather most storms. Leave, at that point, only if the alternative of staying put is going to be death.

In my current location, God willing, I situated myself in a location that is sane and defendable, with sufficient supplies so that there's really just not much that could unseat me (that isn't impacting the rest of the region, like a nuclear war, for instance). 

If you're constantly having to flee due to (XYZ) that occurs predictably or regularly, then you're just in a poor location and should relocate permanently. One example is the SE Gulf of the United States where every year they are boarding up and fleeing due to seasonable hurricanes. 

OP is in unknown but self-described collapsing parts of Europe. The writing is on the wall and it's time to flee and relocate permanently in a safer sane area, with less population density.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Here we go again. Remember that where ever you plan to bug out to is somebody else's back yard and bug in area. It will be the big question on how this intrusion will be handled. I guarantee you won't like the outcome. Use your imagination. 

No you won't be welcomed with open arms, hugs and kisses. You are a threat and draw on my/our neighborhood resources. I can't get over how many sheep think. They will have much of a chance just running out in the country and surviving. Nuff said??


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## MrLemonade (5 mo ago)

Chipper said:


> Here we go again. Remember that where ever you plan to bug out to is somebody else's back yard and bug in area. It will be the big question on how this intrusion will be handled. I guarantee you won't like the outcome. Use your imagination.
> 
> No you won't be welcomed with open arms, hugs and kisses. You are a threat and draw on my/our neighborhood resources. I can't get over how many sheep think. They will have much of a chance just running out in the country and surviving. Nuff said??


Yup, a moment of critical thinking would lead anyone to understand when they "bug out," they are essentially a refugee on their own, entering new and probably hostile areas who are NOT welcoming of more strain, more crime, more desperate foreigners, more problems, more drain on local resources, etc. 

Flip the script, OP. If your neighboring 5 states/nations had a crisis and tens of millions of fleeing refugees who don't speak your language or share your values, who have no assets and are starving and desperate, showed up in your town, how would it be handled and viewed? Probably not favorably.


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