# Carry a gun get shot



## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Lawyer for the Baton Rouge man who police shot and killed " it's open season on people who carry a gun "

The video clearly showed the man resisted arrest. The police were there acting on a report (anonymous)of a man matching his description who threatened a person with a gun. Shooting him 6 times ? Damn !! After the first two shots in the chest, was 4 more necessary ? It's questionable IMO. 

The mans right hand could not be seen and it appear he did have something in his right pocket that a police officer removed after shooting the man. 

Ok, now we have a guy in Maryland who told a cop he had a gun and a right to carry it and was shot while getting his ID out like the cop asked. That's the girlfriend story. Cop said he told him to not move. The cop shoots him 3-4 times ? 
So when you're carrying a gun concealed or not and a cop approaches I suggest you pucker up real good and kiss his ass. If you have a hearing problem, it might be best you don't carry a gun.

When the threat is stopped, how can you justify the extra rounds ? I mean two in the chest and there's no gun outside the pocket........then 4 more in the back ?

Sounds like someone's trigger happy.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

I would suggest if you are a young male with a rap sheet you do not resist the cops.
And if the cop tells you something, comply.


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## stevekozak (Oct 4, 2015)

Im guessing you might want to do some more reading.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

rice paddy daddy said:


> I would suggest if you are a young male with a rap sheet you do not resist the cops.
> And if the cop tells you something, comply.


And if you don't, the cop can keep shooting you even though you are not a threat. Or you can be complying but the police officer perceive you're not complying.

At the time of each shooting the cops didn't know they had prior arrests.

The Maryland case the guy only had a couple misdemeanors. Had a good job for past 12 years and just got a promotion. Not what I would call a criminal. Had a carry permit as well.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

stevekozak said:


> Im guessing you might want to do some more reading.


You're missing the point. Some cops see a gun and they squeal like a girl and wanna start shooting people, had a sheriff deputy himself say that. So scared they're gonna get shot they get jumpy and draw their weapon when they really shouldn't.

Example......I bought car from a family member who at one time reported the car stolen.

I tag and title the car in my name.....actually bought tags for two years.

One day I was pulled over for speeding. Cop runs the tag and it comes back stolen.

Cop comes over the speaker telling me to open my door from the outside with both hands and directed me out of the car at gun point.

I didn't appreciate that.........he could've easily "said" he saw a gun and I moved the wrong way or just simply stumbled.....

I was nervous......I had two 20 something yr old punks pointing .40 cal Glocks at me. Through no fault of mine whatsoever.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Oh.....and I wasn't speeding and I didn't get a ticket for speeding. For the record.


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## mooosie (Mar 26, 2016)

That's scary! I was driving up to my boat on Lake Erie one Saturday morning and I have to go through this little town called Atticia , it is a speed trap and I know it so I was driving slow. I passed a cruiser parked and here he came turned on the siren and pulled me over and asked to see my license I showed it to him and he said oh Florida ! I asked him why he pulled me over and he said he just decided to run my plate and it came back that my license ad expired ! I laughed at him and left! Slow day in Atticia !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

There is no way around it, the video that I've seen at least is very concerning and I say that as somebody who generally sides with law enforcement on issues like this one. Still, from the other point of view, the man had a gun and was resisting arrest. I don't know if he went for that gun, an officers gun, or if he was just making things difficult by resisting arrest. I am going to wait for the investigation to be completed before I make any judgement calls.

At that the bottom line is even if law enforcement is 100% wrong you don't fight them in the streets. All your going to do is justify everything they do to you. File a complaint with the department, do an open records request for all camera footage and radio traffic related to your arrest, win in criminal court, then take it to civil court.


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## Illini Warrior (Jan 24, 2015)

Maryland or Minnesota? ... the two cop shooting aren't related in anyway - circumstances aren't even close ... 20+ years of serious felonies - illegally carrying and threatening people - assaults & resists cops - just blow the SOB away and call it a job well done .... latest one (MD or MN???) is looking like a cop with a twitchy trigger finger ....


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> You're missing the point. Some cops see a gun and they squeal like a girl and wanna start shooting people, had a sheriff deputy himself say that. So scared they're gonna get shot they get jumpy and draw their weapon when they really shouldn't.
> 
> Example......I bought car from a family member who at one time reported the car stolen.
> 
> ...


Sounds like they did their job with the information at their disposal.
You didn't "appreciate" that they have a set protocol for dealing with possible criminals, which you were for all they knew.
They didn't ticket you because they realized the mistake after safely handling the situation in which nobody received any injuries.
Your assumptions about their reasoning are irrelevant.

Sometimes we get into situations, through no fault of our own, and have to comply until we are given the opportunity to communicate.
The time for the trial is NOT on the side of the road. That's how you end up beaten or dead. They had reason to believe you were a criminal due to the stolen report, and treated you as such until the scene was secure.

Don't be so butthurt over it.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> Sounds like they did their job with the information at their disposal.
> You didn't "appreciate" that they have a set protocol for dealing with possible criminals, which you were for all they knew.
> They didn't ticket you because they realized the mistake after safely handling the situation in which nobody received any injuries.
> Your assumptions about their reasoning are irrelevant.
> ...


They put me at risk over a car....... That they sold me a tag for TWICE. The car was reported stolen over 2 years prior and the tag was registered in my name less than .5 miles from my house.........

Yet these jackasses didn't think they could be making a mistake ? Maybe tell me to step out of the car without pointing guns at me ?

I'm not butthurt......they are just plain idiots and it's easy to see how they make mistakes.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

I use to have much respect for cops until I had a few interactions with them. 

Most only associate with other cops.......they aren't friendly and think they're cool because they're a cop......

They are the janitors of the justice system.

If they don't get the respect they think they deserve.....they get down right nasty. They step all over the constitution on a daily basis. 

My lawyer told me if I wanted to see peoples rights being violated just watch episodes of the show " Cops "


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## jim-henscheli (May 4, 2015)

I support law enforcement. I support most LEO, but this is what it comes down to; the days of all lawmen being fair, decent people, interested in enforcing the laws as they are on the books, and seeking change those laws using a just and democratic system of checks and balances, are over. They may have never existed, but regardless, today we are faced with a law enforcement community AND military split fairly down the middle and comprised of the above mentioned individuals on one side, and a bunch of alinksyite radicals with no regard for our civil rights in the other, they are the brown shirts.
I use as an example my recent work in private security; I encountered a guy the other day who said, and I quote,"after the military and police I went private security so I could stop hearing about people's civil effing liberties". He is one of the bad ones.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Im not saying all cops are bad. I know better than that......but like the Muslims, the good ones better step up and clean house. And no, I do not think all Muslims are bad people.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Kauboy said:


> Sounds like they did their job with the information at their disposal.
> You didn't "appreciate" that they have a set protocol for dealing with possible criminals, which you were for all they knew.
> They didn't ticket you because they realized the mistake after safely handling the situation in which nobody received any injuries.
> Your assumptions about their reasoning are irrelevant.
> ...


Quoted for the Truth!



> I was nervous......I had two 20 something yr old punks pointing .40 cal Glocks at me. Through no fault of mine whatsoever.


I resent this statement. They aren't 20 something year old punks, they are law enforcement professionals that graduated from an extended training academy to pin that badge on their chests and holster those .40 cal glocks. If you think your rights where violated in that situation then you have no concept of what your rights are. They ran your plate and it came back stolen, that means probable cause right there and then. You mentioned watching COPS to see peoples rights violated, how about all the episodes where the officer is assaulted or almost assaulted when dealing with a stolen car? Their response of getting on the loud speaker and putting you at gun point was appropriate and reasonable given the situation. I'm sure you where released after they ran your VIN, got a return, and saw it was clear. And you people talk about millennials being entitled!


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> Quoted for the Truth!
> 
> I resent this statement. They aren't 20 something year old punks, they are law enforcement professionals that graduated from an extended training academy to pin that badge on their chests and holster those .40 cal glocks. If you think your rights where violated in that situation then you have no concept of what your rights are. They ran your plate and it came back stolen, that means probable cause right there and then. You mentioned watching COPS to see peoples rights violated, how about all the episodes where the officer is assaulted or almost assaulted when dealing with a stolen car? Their response of getting on the loud speaker and putting you at gun point was appropriate and reasonable given the situation. I'm sure you where released after they ran your VIN, got a return, and saw it was clear. And you people talk about millennials being entitled!


The cops are part of the government. By their mistake I was held at gun point. You don't see the Problem ?

Do you think if one of them accidentally shot me and then found my legal concealed carry gun that they would man up ? Or would they say I reached for my gun ?

Cops get paid to do a job that they chose to do. That doesn't give them a right to protection at the expense of my life.

Sorry for the edits, using a phone to post.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> The cops are part of the government. By their mistake I was held at gun point. You don't see the Problem ?
> 
> Do you think if one of them accidentally shot me and then found my legal concealed carry gun that they would man up ? Or would they say I reached for my gun ?
> 
> Cops get paid to do a job that they chose to do. That doesn't give them a right to protection at the expense of my life.


You're right they are part of the government. They had probable cause to detain you and given the hazards associated with the situation they had the right to hold you at gun point. I'm going to guess that you complained to the department about it and they told you to buzz off.

Doesn't matter if they "manned up" or not. The encounter you described was likely recorded on a dash cam, video doesn't like. As far as "manning up" goes lets talk about former Tulsa Reserve Deputy Robert Bates thats doing time now accidentally shooting a suspect.
Tulsa ex-deputy convicted of manslaughter moved to prison - Richmond Times-Dispatch: Ap
Or former Oakland BART officer Johannes Mehserle who served time for accidentally shooting Oscar Grant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Oscar_Grant
Or former Charleston Police Officer Michael Slager who's going on trial for murder for shooting Walter Scott
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/08/u...ged-with-murder-in-black-mans-death.html?_r=0

Bottom line is police are held to a high standard and are held accountable for their actions especially when deadly force is involved. Again, it sounds like your harboring a personal bias due to your experience.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

rice paddy daddy said:


> I would suggest if you are a young male with a rap sheet you do not resist the cops.
> And if the cop tells you something, comply.


Beat me to it RPD.

Advice to everyone; don't fight and/or resist arrest with LEO.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> You're right they are part of the government. They had probable cause to detain you and given the hazards associated with the situation they had the right to hold you at gun point. I'm going to guess that you complained to the department about it and they told you to buzz off.
> 
> Doesn't matter if they "manned up" or not. The encounter you described was likely recorded on a dash cam, video doesn't like. As far as "manning up" goes lets talk about former Tulsa Reserve Deputy Robert Bates thats doing time now accidentally shooting a suspect.
> Tulsa ex-deputy convicted of manslaughter moved to prison - Richmond Times-Dispatch: Ap
> ...


Dash cam ? Where is the dash cam for the Baton Rouge shooting and the Maryland shooting ? Body cans fell off in Baton Rouge. Black man was just shot and killed here about two weeks ago, no dash cam no body cam.

Thanks for proving my case with all the accidental shootings the police have made. I appreciate that.

Why wouldn't I hold a personal bias based my experience ? Lol !!!

I drove the car around for two years !!!! 3 miles from where it was reported stolen ! But yet they couldn't find this stolen car .......

They are CLOWNS !


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Slippy said:


> Beat me to it RPD.
> 
> Advice to everyone; don't fight and/or resist arrest with LEO.


The guy in Maryland didn't resist. He had a pistol permit. Cop says he failed to obey a command. Shoots the guy multiple times then doesn't try to save the guys life, lets him bleed out. Cop watched the guy basically die while holding him at gun point. Watch the video.

The guy never had the gun in his hand. The guy even told the cop he had a gun and a permit to carry it.

Link to the video.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...traffic-stop-aftermath-broadcast-on-facebook/


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

This is sounding like a guy who is already locked up in my twit filter.


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## Real Old Man (Aug 17, 2015)

Operator6 said:


> Dash cam ? Where is the dash cam for the Baton Rouge shooting and the Maryland shooting ? Body cans fell off in Baton Rouge. Black man was just shot and killed here about two weeks ago, no dash cam no body cam.
> 
> Thanks for proving my case with all the accidental shootings the police have made. I appreciate that.
> 
> ...


First for the record, the incident that you are harping on did not occur in Maryland. It happened in Minnesota - a big difference.

Secondly since it's quite obvious that like several other prior posters on this site, you have never been in the Law Enforcement field, you have no concept of what it takes to pin on the badge and serve the community.

Thirdly, if your car was reported stolen two years ago, but some how it miracusouly ended up legally in your possession, it is the responsibility of the original reporting party - the lad or lass that filed the stolen police report - to contact the original police department so that the car information can be removed from NCIC. Lucky for you a local PD stopped you and not some out of state Highway Patrol or you would most likely have been treated to a ride in the back of their cruiser and a stay at their house while things got sorted out.

Fourth, I do know what it's like to be on the receiving end of a man with a gun call and I was treated by a very large east coast police Dept officer with great respect. Yes, I was carrying, yes I did find out who placed the call and we found that my key fob had been mistaken for the barrel of a revolver.

So as to these two incidents, we'll have to wait and see how things shake out. Remember Little Mikee Brown's friend said that bad old Police Officer shot Mikie when he had his hands raised. "Eye witnesses" sometimes lie thru their teeth cause it's all about the money.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Real Old Man said:


> First for the record, the incident that you are harping on did not occur in Maryland. It happened in Minnesota - a big difference.
> 
> Secondly since it's quite obvious that like several other prior posters on this site, you have never been in the Law Enforcement field, you have no concept of what it takes to pin on the badge and serve the community.
> 
> ...


Yes it is Minnesota, not much difference. Both are cold and full of Yankees.

Ok, the car was recovered by the police 12 hrs after it was reported stolen. It was towed and the owner went to the police impound yard to claim it.

Yes I agree, I'm lucky aren't I........lucky those super cops that found a stolen car for the SECOND time almost three years after it was found the FIRST time driving around the same neighborhood didn't get scared and shoot me, yeah I guess I'm lucky. Never mind rights.....I want Luck. Lucky lucky !

The same car I bought two tags for.....and had titled in my name by the state.......yeah that stolen car. Lol !

No, I've never been in law enforcement. To be a cop you have to go along to get along. I'm not that type.....+ they don't make enough money, but I guess like the old saying goes......you get what you pay for.


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## stowlin (Apr 25, 2016)

White people get shot all the time; no one cares. The fact this guy had a permit will not be an issue; its the color of his skin that matters.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Trigger happy cops will also kill your dog. 

Has happened here several times. Cops looking for a misdemeanor suspect went through a mans closed gate and when his old lab that couldn't hardly even walk started toward the cop barking, the cop pulls his gun and shoots the dog. Turns out the suspect wasn't in the yard. Dude shot a 12+ year old grey chin crippled dog. 

Here kitty kitty.......put these pink panties on, you're a policeman now !


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

If they shoot my dog, I'll be shooting them....make no mistake


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Just do not give the cops a hard time. Be polite and compliant. Courts rooms and lawyers can sort things out and no one gets excited and shoots. Having said that, sometimes things go wrong in any profession. Lets wait and see what the evidence is or is not. If the officer truly screwed up the courts should handle it, not the media or mobs. Then again the courts do screwy things too.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> The guy in Maryland didn't resist. He had a pistol permit. Cop says he failed to obey a command. Shoots the guy multiple times then doesn't try to save the guys life, lets him bleed out. Cop watched the guy basically die while holding him at gun point. Watch the video.
> 
> The guy never had the gun in his hand. The guy even told the cop he had a gun and a permit to carry it.
> 
> ...


I stand by my earlier advice, not to fight with LEO. The Maryland case (Freddie Gray) has proven in court that the LEO were no t guilty.

I had not seen the video of Diamond Lavish Reynolds from Minnesota which doesn't show what happened up to the shooting of Philandro Castile.

Regardless, the thug community of black lies has created an environment where LEO are nervous as hell in some neighborhoods.

But remember most of the time LEO stop people is to enforce STUPID ASS LAWS PASSED BY LIBTARD POLITICIANS WHO RUN THESE MUNICIPALITIES AND HIRE, TRAIN AND REQUIRE LEO TO ENFORCE SAID STUPID ASS LAW.

AND SINCE BLACK PEOPLE VOTE OVERWHELMINGLY LIBTARD, THEY ARE PARTIALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE POLITICAL AND LEGISLATIVE COMMUNITY THEY HELPED CREATE


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Camel923 said:


> Just do not give the cops a hard time. Be polite and compliant. Courts rooms and lawyers can sort things out and no one gets excited and shoots. Having said that, sometimes things go wrong in any profession. Lets wait and see what the evidence is or is not. If the officer truly screwed up the courts should handle it, not the media or mobs. Then again the courts do screwy things too.


I understand what you're saying, perfectly clear and it's not that I disagree. BUT, the police officer must understand and respect that I do not have to be nice and it shouldn't be an unspoken requirement that I be nice or else. I'm required to comply with lawful orders.

What part of the law says I have to meet the definition of what some 50,000 a year cop dictates as nice ? His gun ?


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

The sad part is that we used to be a mostly polite society. Now, not so much. I guess people take politeness for a sign of weakness. And they assume you're probably a metrosexual. I am still mostly polite because that's how I was raised. BUT if they want to make either of the previous assumptions, they will find out how wrong they are. 

To me it's really sad how far we have fallen.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

inceptor said:


> The sad part is that we used to be a mostly polite society. Now, not so much. I guess people take politeness for a sign of weakness. And they assume you're probably a metrosexual. I am still mostly polite because that's how I was raised. BUT if they want to make either of the previous assumptions, they will find out how wrong they are.
> 
> To me it's really sad how far we have fallen.


Tell me about it. I stopped by a food truck parked at a gas station that's suppose to have these monster Cajun burgers that are 5 star. So I pull in and order then sit down at a couple picnic tables set up.

Two detectives drive up and order then sit down at the table next to mine. I offer a hello guys, I hear these burgers are the best around what do you guys think ?

They look at each other like I asked a question in a foreign language.

I never did get an answer out of either one.

Both of them were fat slobs and I'm in great shape........so I eat my burger and comment to myself that it's great burger.

I get up and tell them to have a nice day and don't eat too many of those burgers or you might get fat.

They just sat there trying to figure out what just happened...... Lmao ! Just unfriendly, I hate the freakin world attitudes they have toward anyone not " Code Blue "


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> I understand what you're saying, perfectly clear and it's not that I disagree. BUT, the police officer must understand and respect that I do not have to be nice and it shouldn't be an unspoken requirement that I be nice or else. I'm required to comply with lawful orders.
> 
> What part of the law says I have to meet the definition of what some 50,000 a year cop dictates as nice ? His gun ?


Do what you want. I want to walk home and kiss my wife and hug my children. If you want to make a point go ahead but its your call if your willing to take a chance on bodily injury or death to prove your point.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Operator6 said:


> You're missing the point. Some cops see a gun and they squeal like a girl and wanna start shooting people, had a sheriff deputy himself say that. So scared they're gonna get shot they get jumpy and draw their weapon when they really shouldn't.
> 
> Example......I bought car from a family member who at one time reported the car stolen.
> 
> ...


The cop pulls you over for a minor violation. As soon as the car comes back stolen, that instantly elevated it to a felony stop. The cop responded just as he was trained, and just as he should have done. Whether you "appreciated" it or not, he was correct.
Traffic stops are some of the most possibly deadly situations for an officer.

As someone else has already mentioned, your attitude may get you seriously hurt some day.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

BLAH BLAH how tragic. If it would have happened in Chicago we wouldn't have heard a thing. Either one.

Bottom line if your carrying a gun keep you F'in hands in plain sight around the gestapo.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Camel923 said:


> Do what you want. I want to walk home and kiss my wife and hug my children. If you want to make a point go ahead but its your call if your willing to take a chance on bodily injury or death to prove your point.


That's an interesting perspective. Sounds like they've scared you into submission. Just as well, those who are scared to exercise their rights do not deserve any rights.



rice paddy daddy said:


> The cop pulls you over for a minor violation. As soon as the car comes back stolen, that instantly elevated it to a felony stop. The cop responded just as he was trained, and just as he should have done. Whether you "appreciated" it or not, he was correct.
> Traffic stops are some of the most possibly deadly situations for an officer.
> 
> As someone else has already mentioned, your attitude may get you seriously hurt some day.


Came back stolen uh huh.... Well well just who said it was stolen ? More of the same type idiots back at the station ? You don't think the state issuing a title and for two years the county selling me 700.00 worth of tags on a stolen car is incompetence ?

And if it was still listed as stolen then why did it take a traffic stop to find it almost three years later when the vehicle has been driven in a 5 miles radius on a daily basis ?

It's points to incompetence and innocent people paying for the police officers mistakes in the name of them having to protect themselves.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Breaking news 2 Dallas Police Officers Shot During Protests. I can't find a link for it yet, I saw it initially on facebook then the Fox News Alerts. Best wishes to the officers, their family's/friends and co workers.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Operator6 said:


> That's an interesting perspective. Sounds like they've scared you into submission. Just as well, those who are scared to exercise their rights do not deserve any rights.
> 
> Came back stolen uh huh.... Well well just who said it was stolen ? More of the same type idiots back at the station ? You don't think the state issuing a title and for two years the county selling me 700.00 worth of tags on a stolen car is incompetence ?
> 
> ...


Depends on what the issue is about and is it worth it to me. Just because you or someone else wants to jump off the bridge does not mean I will and calling me chicken will not change my mind.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Multiple officers shot at ?Black Lives Matter? protest in Dallas | WPMT FOX43

Enough of this shit already! I know I just cursed, after a weekend of our officers getting pelted by mortar fireworks and reading the crap I've had to read on the internet I'm done with it. I hope the jerk that did this gets taken alive, put on trial in front of the whole nation then gets "justice" in the form of a needle in their arm


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## admin (Apr 28, 2016)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> Breaking news 2 Dallas Police Officers Shot During Protests. I can't find a link for it yet, I saw it initially on facebook then the Fox News Alerts. Best wishes to the officers, their family's/friends and co workers.


There is a live feed on CBS.
CBSN - Live Streaming Video News Channel - CBS News


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Look up how many times cops have raided the wrong house and shot innocent people. The cops have traded smart police tactics with the swat team and MRAP.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Cricket said:


> There is a live feed on CBS.
> CBSN - Live Streaming Video News Channel - CBS News


Thanks for sharing the link for everybody. I don't have the stomach for it right now, I'm sick of "peaceful protests" turning the United States into a Middle Eastern hellhole.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Camel923 said:


> Depends on what the issue is about and is it worth it to me. Just because you or someone else wants to jump off the bridge does not mean I will and calling me chicken will not change my mind.


What exactly did I do that was so bad it might get me killed ? Not be nice ? I hope your definition of nice and the next officer you interact with is the same.

If not you might be killed. Think about that.......


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Operator6 said:


> Look up how many times cops have raided the wrong house and shot innocent people. The cops have traded smart police tactics with the swat team and MRAP.


The cops raided my girlfriend's house with me inside, I lived exactly right next door. They were looking for a house down the street and got the wrong address. Pulled me out at gunpoint, multiple guns, multiple angles. In fact one cop was in my driveway resting on the hood of my car pointing a gun directly at the window I peeked outside of...I complied and when they started to put me in handcuffs on the porch, I said are you arresting me? Once they said yes I said what for? The cop I was looking at while I said that shook his head no towards the cop that was physically handcuffing me, and they never actually got the handcuffs on me. Thankfully even though my girlfriend at the time had two dogs in the house they did not shoot the dogs, or shoot me, or shoot my girlfriend, even though they did enter her house. Because I complied we ended up standing in the street surrounded by cops, "protected".... while we stood there listening over the cop radio that they had gotten the wrong address.

I will just add this, they were looking for a white male who was supposedly involved in a domestic dispute of some kind


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

SGG said:


> The cops raided my girlfriend's house with me inside, I lived exactly right next door. They were looking for a house down the street and got the wrong address. Pulled me out at gunpoint, multiple guns, multiple angles. In fact one cop was in my driveway resting on the hood of my car pointing a gun directly at the window I peeked outside of...I complied and when they started to put me in handcuffs on the porch, I said are you arresting me? Once they said yes I said what for? The cop I was looking at while I said that shook his head no towards the cop that was physically handcuffing me, and they never actually got the handcuffs on me. Thankfully even though my girlfriend at the time had two dogs in the house they did not shoot the dogs, or shoot me, or shoot my girlfriend, even though they did enter her house. Because I complied we ended up standing in the street surrounded by cops, "protected".... while we stood there listening over the cop radio that they had gotten the wrong address.
> 
> I will just add this, they were looking for a white male who was supposedly involved in a domestic dispute of some kind


That is OK if it is a new newspaper boy. It is totally unacceptable for those who have the power to terminate lives.

You handled the situation magnificently, though.


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Denton said:


> That is OK if it is a new newspaper boy. It is totally unacceptable for those who have the power to terminate lives.
> 
> You handled the situation magnificently, though.


I will admit that I was nervous as shit. I had literally 15 minutes before, been across the street at my other neighbor's house buying a bag of weed. If my brother next door at my house hadn't called me to tell me there were cops swarming everywhere, I would have already smelled like weed. I had literally just loaded a bowl to smoke the bong with my girlfriend, and was bong to the mouth, lighter to the bowl when my brother called me.

That was actually one of my prouder moments, coming out of that without a scratch.
I originally thought they were after me because I had been buying some marijuana, LOL, but I still complied


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Probably said too much. But that's what happened


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

I think one of the primary issues with Operator's traffic stop is that he is unaware that the police department and the DPS are NOT the same entity, and the police have no idea that he's been paying for the vehicles title/registration.

From their POV, they received a "stolen" report, regardless of how old, and then they had to respond in a certain way, as dictated BY THEIR DEPARTMENT, not by themselves. They were following protocol. They are trained to draw their firearms when a felony car theft is the situation. Until they know the occupant is NOT a threat, they must be cautious.

Yes, you damn well better be "nice", regardless of what YOU think that means. The time to have your hissy-fit is in the courtroom, not the roadside. Your "right" to not have a gun pointed at you does not trump their right to self defense when they've been given reason to believe you could be dangerous.


As for the original purpose of this thread, the officer that shot the valid CCW carrier appears to have committed murder. We will know for sure as the days play out.


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> I think one of the primary issues with Operator's traffic stop is that he is unaware that the police department and the DPS are NOT the same entity, and the police have no idea that he's been paying for the vehicles title/registration.
> 
> From their POV, they received a "stolen" report, regardless of how old, and then they had to respond in a certain way, as dictated BY THEIR DEPARTMENT, not by themselves. They were following protocol. They are trained to draw their firearms when a felony car theft is the situation. Until they know the occupant is NOT a threat, they must be cautious.
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you and everyone else that said he should have calmly complied

I think his point is our system is so stupid that they should have already had the situation about the stolen car figured out, so as not to endanger the life of a compliant citizen


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

SGG said:


> I think his point is our system is so stupid that they should have already had the situation about the stolen car figured out, so as not to endanger the life of a compliant citizen


I can totally understand that frustration. Somebody dropped the ball somewhere, and it ruined his day. They were only doing their job with the facts they had.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> I think one of the primary issues with Operator's traffic stop is that he is unaware that the police department and the DPS are NOT the same entity, and the police have no idea that he's been paying for the vehicles title/registration.
> 
> From their POV, they received a "stolen" report, regardless of how old, and then they had to respond in a certain way, as dictated BY THEIR DEPARTMENT, not by themselves. They were following protocol. They are trained to draw their firearms when a felony car theft is the situation. Until they know the occupant is NOT a threat, they must be cautious.
> 
> ...


How many people have you heard of that steals a car and gets it titled, tagged and insured ?

He knew I had valid insurance ( his computer told him that )on the car and the tag was current based off the stickers on the tag.

How can all that be true but then the car is supposedly STILL coming back stolen from 3 years prior ?

If it was true then why haven't they been looking for this stolen car for the past three years while it's been driving around in basically the same neighborhood it was reported stolen in ???

Maybe it's all a result of the great police work ?

Yeah, I better be nice because if I'm not, I might get shot huh ?

What mistake did I make ?


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

Kauboy said:


> I think one of the primary issues with Operator's traffic stop is that he is unaware that the police department and the DPS are NOT the same entity, and the police have no idea that he's been paying for the vehicles title/registration.
> 
> From their POV, they received a "stolen" report, regardless of how old, and then they had to respond in a certain way, as dictated BY THEIR DEPARTMENT, not by themselves. They were following protocol. They are trained to draw their firearms when a felony car theft is the situation. Until they know the occupant is NOT a threat, they must be cautious.
> 
> ...


Agree on all counts. Operator had a bad day, the shooting in Minnesota appears to have been a bad shoot and the cops will have a bad day, the shooting in Baton Rouge appears to have been a good shoot, if a little overly so, and the perp had a bad day and now it appears the Dallas police had a bad day because of an out of control sanctioned militant group is allowed and encouraged to operate by a dysfunctional and out of control segment of the population and government.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Operator6 said:


> Maybe it's all a result of the great police work ?
> 
> Yeah, I better be nice because if I'm not, I might get shot huh ?
> 
> What mistake did I make ?


Perhaps this exercise had nothing to do with the "alleged" stolen car. Maybe these $50k a year guys have a sense of humor and just remember you from the hamburger joint?


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> How many people have you heard of that steals a car and gets it titled, tagged and insured ?
> 
> He knew I had valid insurance ( his computer told him that )on the car and the tag was current based off the stickers on the tag.
> 
> ...


What my good friend Op6 is pointing out is that the multiple branches/departments of government are overwhelmingly incompetent and over-reaching.


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## Targetshooter (Dec 4, 2015)

there are good cops and bad cops out there , you just have to play it cool at the time and have your day in court .


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Slippy said:


> What my good friend Op6 is pointing out is that the multiple branches/departments of government are overwhelmingly incompetent and over-reaching.


What he's pointing out to me is his ignorance of inter-departmental communication.
The officers have their records. The DPS has their records. They are NOT the same database.

My wife could call the cops and say our car was stolen just to get back at me.
Until they sort it out, even though I'M THE LEGAL OWNER, they will treat me as a potential criminal during initial interaction.
Op, you need to get this through your head, or you're ALWAYS going to have bad interactions.
They are under no obligation to take unnecessary risks for the sake of your feelings.
All potential threats are treated as potential threats until the risk is removed.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> What he's pointing out to me is his ignorance of inter-departmental communication.
> The officers have their records. The DPS has their records. They are NOT the same database.
> 
> My wife could call the cops and say our car was stolen just to get back at me.
> ...


I'm pointing out that there are clowns that have badges and they make mistakes on a regular basis and it seems to me that if you're going to treat people like " criminals " then you better make sure you're information is current and correct.

If you're a cop you should consider that a 3 yr old report of a stolen car probably and most likely wouldn't have insurance, current tags and be driving around 1/2 mile from where it was reported stolen.

Maybe when they find a stolen car and return it to the owners they should remove it from the stolen list.

Maybe they should stop issuing tags to stolen cars and transferring the titles.

Incompetence combined with idiots with badges and pistols equal the public at risk, not being protected and served.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> I'm pointing out that there are clowns that have badges and they make mistakes on a regular basis and it seems to me that if you're going to treat people like " criminals " then you better make sure you're information is current and correct.
> 
> If you're a cop you should consider that a 3 yr old report of a stolen car probably and most likely wouldn't have insurance, current tags and be driving around 1/2 mile from where it was reported stolen.
> 
> ...


I suggest you attend the next local citizens academy if your not already blackballed by local law enforcement. It might open your eyes to the challenges they face.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> I suggest you attend the next local citizens academy if your not already blackballed by local law enforcement. It might open your eyes to the challenges they face.


No thanks, their challenges are no excuse for incompetence all the way from the bottom to the top.

Affirmative action and unions have changed the game, common sense does not prevail in government.

Thank God the DMV doesn't carry guns,etc ,etc.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

****NOTE TO SELF: Check with admins about the possibility of adding a Beating A Dead Horse simile, like I have seen on other forums. We seem to desperately need one.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> No thanks, their challenges are no excuse for incompetence all the way from the bottom to the top.
> 
> Affirmative action and unions have changed the game, common sense does not prevail in government.
> 
> Thank God the DMV doesn't carry guns,etc ,etc.


Spoken by somebody who doesn't have a clue. If you think its that bad then I suggest you apply to be an officer to make things better. God knows almost every department in the United States is short staffed enough.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> Spoken by somebody who doesn't have a clue. If you think its that bad then I suggest you apply to be an officer to make things better. God knows almost every department in the United States is short staffed enough.


Oh I have a clue and I just explained it to you. You're response to that is that I become a cop ? How does that address affirmative action and the unions making the police department hire clowns that only got the job because they're a minority ?

I have a successful business, do you think it got that way by hiring someone because of the color of their skin or not being able to terminate based off performance rather than transferring them around the department ?

Looks like you don't have a clue....


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## T-Man 1066 (Jan 3, 2016)

Slippy said:


> Beat me to it RPD.
> 
> Advice to everyone; don't fight and/or resist arrest with LEO.


I realize i'm late to the party, but that is what I teach my 15 year old boy. Don't run don't show off your ego or your law knowledge or whatever. Do what they say, make sure they are aware AND GIVE YOU THE OK before reaching for anything, everybody goes home and the courts will sort it out.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

T-Man 1066 said:


> I realize i'm late to the party, but that is what I teach my 15 year old boy. Don't run don't show off your ego or your law knowledge or whatever. Do what they say, make sure they are aware AND GIVE YOU THE OK before reaching for anything, everybody goes home and the courts will sort it out.


Be sure to teach him that the police often lie to citizens in the course of an investigation/interrogation. They are not required to tell you the truth.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Operator6 said:


> Be sure to teach him that the police often lie to citizens in the course of an investigation/interrogation. They are not required to tell you the truth.


That is correct.^^^^

Which leads me to my next advice to the youngsters;

Know the 4th and 5th Amendment and Miranda v. Arizona


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## T-Man 1066 (Jan 3, 2016)

Definitely. Those that don't use their rights don't have any.


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## Gunn (Jan 1, 2016)

Sorry I am late to this party, I just found my invitation. First most cops are now "Revenue Enhancement Officers", but I really don't believe they get up everyday and say "Goody Goody I Get To Shoot Someone Today". There has to be a reason they are apprehensive out there. Can It just possibly be they have had to many fellow officers shot for pulling a thug over? I don't care how much money the get or don't get, it is not enough. Op6 is upset he got pulled over on an old vehicle warrant. If you need a LEO, call the DMV get them to help you. I have been pulled over several times by mistake. While carrying a concealed firearm. In my state your CCW is linked to your drivers license. They walk up and ask if I am carrying? I answer, they say to just keep my hands in plain sight. The problem is not me, OP6 or the LEO's, it is the thugs that have made them gun shy. 

I worked in the ED/Trauma of a major hospital for several years, I can not tell you how many LEO's came in shot, too many. The thugs come in crying that they have a bad mommy or daddy, a missed spent childhood... There is always a reason they had to shoot the cop. It is not their fault, BS. Thugs are thugs. Until we clean up the riff raff, it will be this way. I am not saying innocent people are not being shot by Wyatt Earps, they are. We hear about it when it happens. How often do we hear about the thug shooting a cop? In the city of that major hospital never. If you heard about the cop shootings happening maybe you would understand. I need to go to the ED, I just fell off my soap box and got a boo boo.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

I have a theory that cops should be paid on commission like salesmen. They should get five bucks or so for writing a traffic ticket. Maybe a hundred for catching a wanted felon etc. The pay structure is set up like communism. Everybody makes the same money even though some of them work harder than others. Not much incentive to do good work. I may forward this idea off to Obummer. He might can implement it as he nationalizes all the local police agencies.


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

bigwheel said:


> I have a theory that cops should be paid on commission like salesmen. They should get five bucks or so for writing a traffic ticket. Maybe a hundred for catching a wanted felon etc. The pay structure is set up like communism. Everybody makes the same money even though some of them work harder than others. Not much incentive to do good work. I may forward this idea off to Obummer. He might can implement it as he nationalizes all the local police agencies.


Thats a conflict of interest. Cops do not sell anything like salesmen. If you want incentive then pay over time, like most departments already do.

Imo the incentive for good work should be that you get to keep your job.


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

And another early this morning.

Man with gun dies after officer-involved shooting in SE Houston


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## Real Old Man (Aug 17, 2015)

inceptor said:


> And another early this morning.
> 
> Man with gun dies after officer-involved shooting in SE Houston


When checked in BeenVerified, turns out Mr. Braziel has a long history of abusing chemical substances. Also since he was a guest of the Texas Department of Corrections, that makes him a convicted Felon. Should he have had the pistol - no. Did he get confused and make a stupid decision - you betcha. Did he pay for it - yep.

Should we go back to the old days and give the bad guys the first shot before we even get our weapons out of our holster. That's what happened in Dallas.


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

https://theconservativetreehouse.co...lse-media-narrative-now-driving-cop-killings/


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

SGG said:


> https://theconservativetreehouse.co...lse-media-narrative-now-driving-cop-killings/


SGG,good find.

The truth is starting to come out as it often does in these cases.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

bigwheel said:


> I have a theory that cops should be paid on commission like salesmen. They should get five bucks or so for writing a traffic ticket. Maybe a hundred for catching a wanted felon etc. The pay structure is set up like communism. Everybody makes the same money even though some of them work harder than others. Not much incentive to do good work. I may forward this idea off to Obummer. He might can implement it as he nationalizes all the local police agencies.


Sounds like a theory from an ex LEO sitting out on the back porch on a hot North Texas afternoon, while taking a couple long and slow drags off one of them funny cigarettes that Hulio from down the street sells.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

a watchman said:


> sounds like a theory from an ex leo sitting out on the back porch on a hot north texas afternoon, while taking a couple long and slow drags of one of them funny cigarettes that hulio from down the street sells.


One word, GLAUCOMA?!?!


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Slippy said:


> SGG,good find.
> 
> The truth is starting to come out as it often does in these cases.


I was originally very concerned, as a concealed carry license holder. I don't know if racism had anything to do with it (hard for me to determine if I'm a "racist"), but I didn't quite trust the original media story and now it seems possibly there is no reason we should have. As if we should never trust the mainstream media.....

If it had been me as that Diamond girl in the driver seat I would have started recording, as a black woman, as soon as we got pulled over, not after my significant other got shot


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

A Watchman said:


> Sounds like a theory from an ex LEO sitting out on the back porch on a hot North Texas afternoon, while taking a couple long and slow drags of one of them funny cigarettes that Hulio from down the street sells.


(SSG takes his funny cigarette and takes a long slow drag, then takes a notebook out labeled "Why I Don't Trust The Government")

Oh wait....


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## Operator6 (Oct 29, 2015)

So you're out in public and you hear a guy/see a guy shooting, do you pull your firearm and engage or do you retreat ? Keep in mind if there are police in the area you may become a victim of friendly fire.


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

Operator6 said:


> So you're out in public and you hear a guy/see a guy shooting, do you pull your firearm and engage or do you retreat ? Keep in mind if there are police in the area you may become a victim of friendly fire.


I have never struggled with this scenario. My gun and concealed carry license are to protect me and my girlfriend only. I would immediately try to retreat if I could and if the threat became immediate to me and my girlfriend I would not hesitate to use it.


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## SGG (Nov 25, 2015)

I see your like, Operator6. What would you do?

I'm not trying to be a hero and lose my life in the process. If only my girlfriend sees me as the hero, and we live, or she alone lives because of my actions, that is all I need


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## Real Old Man (Aug 17, 2015)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> Spoken by somebody who doesn't have a clue. If you think its that bad then I suggest you apply to be an officer to make things better. God knows almost every department in the United States is short staffed enough.


Most departments go thru an extensive vetting process to ensure that qualified folks are hired. They do what they can to rid their departments of dead wood and folks with any kind of an Axe to grind.


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

If you have a cc permit and you try to aid the LEO's on scene, keep this is mind. I had almost forgotten this happened.

Details on Deadly Shootout at Maryland Station Starting to Emerge in Court Papers - News - POLICE Magazine


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## stowlin (Apr 25, 2016)

https://www.bing.com/images/search?...&thid=OIP.M86f00f315632bea9f8c59844286c3054o0

Three upstanding brothers right


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