# The red lense



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

For those of you who plan long treks, nighttime operations, etc., how many of you have considered red lenses for your flashlights?

If you aren't familiar (I'm sure you all are, but just in case) red lensed flashlights allow visibility with less risk of compromising your position. I'm not 100% on the science, but basically red light doesn't travel as far, and is harder to see.


----------



## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

Red light is used because your eyes won't be affected by nite blindness, vs white light. Thought you would know this already. Maybe I was thinking of someone else. My bad.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

1skrewsloose said:


> Red light is used because your eyes won't be affected by nite blindness, vs white light. Thought you would know this already. Maybe I was thinking of someone else. My bad.


Yea, I've been told that as well, but, and I'm speaking only for myself here, it doesn't work. It takes less time to recover from than white light, but not significantly, maybe a few seconds worth.

But that is in addition to the other reasons I mentioned.


----------



## Spice (Dec 21, 2014)

It does work, but it works best for faint signals. Astronomers use this trick a lot, because they need to look for faint bits of light in the sky. When you use a white light, your ability to see faint signals is literally impaired for *hours*, but if you use a red light the faint sensitivity comes back in minutes, not much longer than the obvious recovery. It's because the pigment you use for dim light vision (rhodopsin) is less sensitive to reds.

You can also use the cheap red film they sell in auto stores to jury-rig a red taillight to cover a normal light source to do this low-budget.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Red sharpie works well too


----------



## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Good suggestion, RED is DEAD.


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Red lens is also used because red and black tend to blend. That is why so may emergence lights have gone away from using red paint and lights. 
Mini cemlights stored in your mouth are effective as a light to read maps at night. Lot of tricks for seeing in the dark.
While red does help , Blue is used to protect night vision


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Red lens is also used because red and black tend to blend. That is why so may emergence lights have gone away from using red paint and lights.
> Mini cemlights stored in your mouth are effective as a light to read maps at night. Lot of tricks for seeing in the dark.
> While red does help , Blue is used to protect night vision


Yea, I have better luck with blue and green for preserving night vision


----------



## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

Slippy said:


> Good suggestion, RED is DEAD.


LOL so no shit I argued this for hours with a guy until we tested it. Blue/green blends with other ambient sources stars fireflies whatever red is harsh and stands out like a sore thumb while its less intense at a distance its also plain as day red and black dont mix to me and night is shades of gray anyways(for the most part) so we put out two headlamps on a two tree at 150m one red lense one green while red wasnt as bright not much we both agreed it was hostile plain and simple the green was like could be a reflection of the moon on water or something anyways my two cents.


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Yea, I have better luck with blue and green for preserving night vision


 When LED's started showing up in the field they became a big issue. Even with red lens covers they would show up at long distances. Having night vision issued to every solider changed thing a lot. I can remember when we had one pair for fire team.
Night vision is a game changer .


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> When LED's started showing up in the field they became a big issue. Even with red lens covers they would show up at long distances. Having night vision issued to every solider changed thing a lot. I can remember when we had one pair for fire team.
> Night vision is a game changer .


Yea it is. Nothing quite like watching an entire company air assult in to an objective and sweep it, especially when you are among them! 15% illumination and the enemy can't see us, but they can hear us. Funny as hell watching them try to figure out what's going on.


----------



## duncan1371 (Apr 27, 2015)

No one has mentioned that it was also intended to make contour lines show up easier on maps.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

duncan1371 said:


> No one has mentioned that it was also intended to make contour lines show up easier on maps.


That's because it wasn't. In fact there is a special red lense map that is now available because it does the exact opposite of what you just said.


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> That's because it wasn't. In fact there is a special red lense map that is now available because it does the exact opposite of what you just said.


 Correct. That is why the mini chem light in the mouth worked so well.
When using red light the contour line could not be seen, so they modified the maps for that reason.


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Yea it is. Nothing quite like watching an entire company air assult in to an objective and sweep it, especially when you are among them! 15% illumination and the enemy can't see us, but they can hear us. Funny as hell watching them try to figure out what's going on.


 The early mono ones did not shut off on their own when you flipped them up it was like Having a flash light on your head.
Darn I miss the tools I use to get to use.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Correct. That is why the mini chem light in the mouth worked so well.
> When using red light the contour line could not be seen, so they modified the maps for that reason.


Exactly. Current red light maps use red/brown instead of red. The brown pigment allows you to still see the lines which are still slightly faint, but easily visible.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> The early mono ones did not shut off on their own when you flipped them up it was like Having a flash light on your head.
> Darn I miss the tools I use to get to use.


I never had to deal with those. We had a couple pvs 5s, mostly pvs 7s, and a few pvs 14s. All switched off when flipped up, but sometimes they fail to come back on without flipping the knob again.


----------



## tinkerhell (Oct 8, 2014)

I've heard that red preserves your night vision, and blue works good for map reading.

You could do alot worse than keeping one of your eyes closed to preserve night vision


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> I never had to deal with those. We had a couple pvs 5s, mostly pvs 7s, and a few pvs 14s. All switched off when flipped up, but sometimes they fail to come back on without flipping the knob again.


 The mono took some getting use to but I like it. Many out there have no idea the amazing things they are missing. I remember when we had one PV4 per platoon. We ruled the night then.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

tinkerhell said:


> I've heard that red preserves your night vision, and blue works good for map reading.
> 
> You could do alot worse than keeping one of your eyes closed to preserve night vision


I actually do this. My left eye is slightly photosensitive, so it's been closed more than its been open. But my natural night vision is pretty good as a result.


----------



## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Yea it is. Nothing quite like watching an entire company air assult in to an objective and sweep it, especially when you are among them! 15% illumination and the enemy can't see us, but they can hear us. Funny as hell watching them try to figure out what's going on.


 What is cool looking at night is a Infantry company with all of their PAC-4's mounted and on scanning every inch of an area. . Looks like something out of a Science fiction movie.
Outdated now but they sure were cool at the time


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> That's because it wasn't. In fact there is a special red lense map that is now available because it does the exact opposite of what you just said.


As a matter of fact, it was. I was serving a few years before you, youngun.


----------



## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Red light wreaks havoc on my eyes. I used to use it a lot in the Navy when working on deck or the bridge at night. Now my tired eyes can't hack it. Red light is a short wave link, which is why the Navy likes it. My eyes are becoming far sighted, I need reading glasses now. I've found that blue works well for me. Not as stealthy but at least I can see with it. I have a tri-color backlit keyboard at home. Red/Violet/Blue; red is fuzzy as crap, violet a little better, blue is clear as a bell with out my glasses. 
Amazon.com: Azio Large Print Tri-Color Backlit Wired Keyboard (KB505U): Computers & Accessories

To much technese for me tonight but maybe some of you would like to read this. 
human anatomy - Does red light preserve your night vision? - Biology Stack Exchange


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Denton said:


> As a matter of fact, it was. I was serving a few years before you, youngun.


Serving before me doesn't make you any less wrong. Go ahead an pull out one of your old maps and take a look under a red lense. Stuff disappears. 
That's why there is a whole new map designed to work with red light.

Red light wasn't designed to work with maps, maps were changed to be used with red light.


----------



## CWOLDOJAX (Sep 5, 2013)

Boss Dog said:


> Red light wreaks havoc on my eyes. I used to use it a lot in the Navy when working on deck or the bridge at night. Now my tired eyes can't hack it. Red light is a short wave link, which is why the Navy likes it. My eyes are becoming far sighted, I need reading glasses now. I've found that blue works well for me. Not as stealthy but at least I can see with it. I have a tri-color backlit keyboard at home. Red/Violet/Blue; red is fuzzy as crap, violet a little better, blue is clear as a bell with out my glasses.
> Amazon.com: Azio Large Print Tri-Color Backlit Wired Keyboard (KB505U): Computers & Accessories
> 
> To much technese for me tonight but maybe some of you would like to read this.
> human anatomy - Does red light preserve your night vision? - Biology Stack Exchange


But red lights at sea can be fun! Especially at "darken ship" settings. Me and my fellow helo bubbas enjoyed the challenge of playing spades in red light. LOL


----------



## HuntingHawk (Dec 16, 2012)

Don't forget that the military also uses blue lights. The reason is hydraulic fluid is red so hard to see with a red light.


----------



## Salt-N-Pepper (Aug 18, 2014)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Yea, I've been told that as well, but, and I'm speaking only for myself here, it doesn't work. It takes less time to recover from than white light, but not significantly, maybe a few seconds worth.
> 
> But that is in addition to the other reasons I mentioned.


I'm an astronomer, I assure you red light is much easier to recover night vision from. I've read the science, and I can tell from 30 years worth of experience in working under the reds that it works.

To me, light discipline is just like radio discipline. Use the BARE minimum to get the job done, and always keep the signal strength at the absolute lowest possible.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Salt-N-Pepper said:


> I'm an astronomer, I assure you red light is much easier to recover night vision from. I've read the science, and I can tell from 30 years worth of experience in working under the reds that it works.
> 
> To me, light discipline is just like radio discipline. Use the BARE minimum to get the job done, and always keep the signal strength at the absolute lowest possible.


Oh, I'm not saying it doesn't work for anyone, just not for me in a noticeable capacity.


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Serving before me doesn't make you any less wrong. Go ahead an pull out one of your old maps and take a look under a red lense. Stuff disappears.
> That's why there is a whole new map designed to work with red light.
> 
> Red light wasn't designed to work with maps, maps were changed to be used with red light.
> View attachment 10832


I'm thinking I didn't quite understand what you said, and yes, the maps were designed to be readable with red light; not red light was designed to work well with maps. :smilet-digitalpoint

That's funny. Someone said the Army created red light? "And on the first day, the Army created light. And the Army said it was good." :highly_amused:

Sorry; another night of more pain than sleep. Wait until tomorrow; I'll probably be posting in all symbols and special characters.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Denton said:


> I'm thinking I didn't quite understand what you said, and yes, the maps were designed to be readable with red light; not red light was designed to work well with maps. :smilet-digitalpoint
> 
> That's funny. Someone said the Army created red light? "And on the first day, the Army created light. And the Army said it was good." :highly_amused:
> 
> Sorry; another night of more pain than sleep. Wait until tomorrow; I'll probably be posting in all symbols and special characters.


Lol ok, well to clarify, I understood you to mean that the red light was introduced into military use to make contour lines easier to see. Since contour lines disappear on a regular map, but are visible on a red light map, I disagreed with your statement, as the red light map came long after the use of red light by the military.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

duncan1371 said:


> No one has mentioned that it was also intended to make contour lines show up easier on maps.


This is your original post that I was referring to.


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Lol ok, well to clarify, I understood you to mean that the red light was introduced into military use to make contour lines easier to see. Since contour lines disappear on a regular map, but are visible on a red light map, I disagreed with your statement, as the red light map came long after the use of red light by the military.


Nope. The maps were made to work with red light at night so that we wouldn't lose our night vision while we looked at the map after taking it and the compass from the lieutenant.


----------



## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Jakthesoldier said:


> I actually do this. My left eye is slightly photosensitive, so it's been closed more than its been open. But my natural night vision is pretty good as a result.


Jak,
You would be a natural on September 19 (International Talk Like a Pirate Day http://talklikeapirate.com/ ). Ayyyy Matey!:joyous:


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> This is your original post that I was referring to.


That's not me, man. I don't run sock puppets on any forum. Furthermore, Duncan and I don't even look alike, and I don't know how you could get us confused. He's the one with money, and I am the one who has the perfect face for radio.


----------



## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Denton said:


> That's not me, man. I don't run sock puppets on any forum. Furthermore, Duncan and I don't even look alike, and I don't know how you could get us confused. He's the one with money, and I am the one who has the perfect face for radio.


Don't sweat it Duncan, they confuse me with Sloppy all the time...


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Slippy said:


> Jak,
> You would be a natural on September 19 (International Talk Like a Pirate Day The Official site for International Talk Like A Pirate Day - September 19 ). Ayyyy Matey!:joyous:


Lmao People also me all the time if something is wrong with my eye. Especially working in a hospital.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Denton said:


> As a matter of fact, it was. I was serving a few years before you, youngun.


Ah, well you responded, as shown here. Maybe that's where I got confused.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Denton said:


> Nope. The maps were made to work with red light at night so that we wouldn't lose our night vision while we looked at the map after taking it and the compass from the lieutenant.


There, see? We are on the same page. Top to bottom of your post lol


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Ah, well you responded, as shown here. Maybe that's where I got confused.


That's me. Leave poor ol' Duncan out of this, man. Got a beef with me, keep it with me. Want to square off, face to face? Come look me up. Want to know where I am? Hanging out with Slippy. You'll find us at the location he listed on his profile! :21:


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> There, see? We are on the same page. Top to bottom of your post lol


Good. Come on over and hang out with us. Slippy has Knob Creek. Good stuff. Better than Maker's Mark.


----------



## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Denton said:


> Good. Come on over and hang out with us. Slippy has Knob Creek. Good stuff. Better than Maker's Mark.


Well I had some of this
View attachment 10836
Saturday but I had one of these smokin' on the grill
View attachment 10837
and wa-la, one thing led to another and no more of either.

But the beauty is, we can get more! Y'all come on over...its 5 o'clock somewhere....PS Don't tell Mish...


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Slippy said:


> Well I had some of this
> View attachment 10836
> Saturday but I had one of these smokin' on the grill
> View attachment 10837
> ...


Man I'm glad Shoots is too busy to read this right now. We'd be halfway there already lol.


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Denton said:


> That's me. Leave poor ol' Duncan out of this, man. Got a beef with me, keep it with me. Want to square off, face to face? Come look me up. Want to know where I am? Hanging out with Slippy. You'll find us at the location he listed on his profile! :21:


No squaring up unless it's back to back with zombies all around. Then I'd square up with you any day. Not over who said what about maps at least lol


----------



## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Ah, well you responded, as shown here. Maybe that's where I got confused.


I just re read this... I sounded like an ass. I'm sorry there was an intent/action disconnect.

Just meant to say that when you responded I got it mixed up, and here is what I mean *quote insert*


----------



## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Jakthesoldier said:


> I just re read this... I sounded like an ass. I'm sorry there was an intent/action disconnect.
> 
> Just meant to say that when you responded I got it mixed up, and here is what I mean *quote insert*


The beautiful thing about screwups and misunderstandings among friends is that we all poke fun at one another and we all laugh about it. We HAVE to have fun. If not, we die with a frown.


----------



## GTGallop (Nov 11, 2012)

Denton said:


> We HAVE to have fun. If not, we die with a frown.


If I die with a frown, bury me upside down.
That way the world can kiss my ass and I'll be smiling the whole time.


----------



## jdbushcraft (Mar 26, 2015)

Denton said:


> The beautiful thing about screwups and misunderstandings among friends is that we all poke fun at one another and we all laugh about it. We HAVE to have fun. If not, we die with a frown.


No! There must be petty bickering and nothing said should be taken in the context it was intended! Do neither of you understand how the internet works? Now is when someone should say that crown royal is better and you aren't really bbqing but actually grilling and it would be better smoked... Sheesh..


----------



## jdbushcraft (Mar 26, 2015)

Those both do look darn good though. ;-)


----------



## 17th Irregular (Apr 26, 2015)

I don't know maybe its just because of price to quality ratio but I like my Night vision monocle.


----------



## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

like why don't you just , like mix the red and blue lenses together and make like a fabulous purple light- nah, doesn't work so well just looks goofy.


----------



## duncan1371 (Apr 27, 2015)

In my defense on the red lense for maps. I never had to deal with the old maps just the ones that it worked on. But thank you for the info.


----------



## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Red light was also a pain to use in tracing color coded wires at night inside equipment. Sometimes you just had to guess.


----------

