# California Drought - Lie



## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

MID Weather Data Summary

Right now I sit in a home in central California. Its raining outside. That is a good 
thing and not all that common. You no doubt have heard about the "drought" in
CA and several years have been below average and a problem.

However the link above shows, as of right now, 11.72 inches of rain this year,
and that was thru yesterday. Its going to be at 11.92 tomorrow plus what ever
happens before I stop typing. This goes thru the end of June and I doubt there
will be much more - but only God knows.

The FACT is the NORMAL rainfall for Modesto, CA is about 12 inches and 2014/15
is going to hit about 12 inches.

The only reason "drought" is a news is because the people of CA can't manage
their water (meaning they can't elect people that manage their water). They are
releasing millions of acre feet of water to save fish in a river, and moaning about
having to conserve at their homes. Its really sad.

By the way a standard subdivision of "homes" in suburban areas of CA use the
exact same amount of water as an acre of farm land - you wouldn't know that
by listening to the news. Urban high density areas uses more but serve more
people too.

I'm guessing the LIE is to impose some more regulation, more government, and 
collect more money. Isn't that why they usually lie?


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## Hawaii Volcano Squad (Sep 25, 2013)

Ripon said:


> MID Weather Data Summary
> 
> Isn't that why they usually lie?


They don't know what the Truth was if it smacked them upside the head.
If you see their lips moving they are lying or kissing a$$.


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## Spice (Dec 21, 2014)

Perhaps you should consider the whole area where California collects its precipitation before you draw conclusions. Lying politicians don't reduce the snow cover in the mountains, and neither the farming nor the fishing interest water use has jacked up fast enough to explain the pitiful state of the reservoirs. Both the snowpack and the low reservoirs are real (and I'd bet dollars to peanuts the aquifer levels are actually down too, but I haven't seen the visual evidence on that).


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Its just the lie is that we're in a drought. We're not. The state had a dry year in 2013/14 sure, but this year is normal. The people / politicians just don't manage it properly. Its funny I have acreage in nearby NV in the middle of the desert. Yet I've cultivated several hundred acres for farming and am not having any trouble irrigating those acres with water. Maybe perhaps because we manage the water we get; something the people of CA haven't figured out since they want to save every minnow and bug they can.



Spice said:


> Perhaps you should consider the whole area where California collects its precipitation before you draw conclusions. Lying politicians don't reduce the snow cover in the mountains, and neither the farming nor the fishing interest water use has jacked up fast enough to explain the pitiful state of the reservoirs. Both the snowpack and the low reservoirs are real (and I'd bet dollars to peanuts the aquifer levels are actually down too, but I haven't seen the visual evidence on that).


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

People don't want the truth. They want whatever is easy. There is no drought, only mismanagement. For the California government it is all about money and manipulation.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

So... wrong.
there is a massive drought going on. My parents are ranchers in Shasta county, and it's been brutal for years. This year they can't even use half of their summer ranges because there is no growth for the cattle to eat. They are already using water tankers to water the cattle because none of the reservoirs have water. This usually doesn't happen till late July to late August in normal years. You are fortunate to have somewhat normal rainfall where you are, but one small county not having water does not account for there being no drought. 

By the way, my mother is the district 3 supervisor. She deals with farmers and ranchers all over the district that have little to no water to supply their crops and herds.

She has told me that most of the other districts are hurting as well, especially since water from the northern parts of the state is commandeered for southern parts of the state, for the cities and for central/south central agriculture.


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## firefighter72 (Apr 18, 2014)

You should put up a rain catch then. So should all the hippies out there.


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## Salt-N-Pepper (Aug 18, 2014)

Ripon said:


> The FACT is the NORMAL rainfall for Modesto, CA is about 12 inches and 2014/15
> is going to hit about 12 inches.


SO... are you saying that Modesto, CA needs no more than 12 inches of rain to maintain your current lifestyle with green lawns & watering? 10 inches of rain is considered a desert.

I highly doubt that's the case. If it isn't, then what you are talking about is rain in places that you don't live.


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## Salt-N-Pepper (Aug 18, 2014)

All due respect, this is NOT the color of a landscape that can exist on 12 inches of rain per year, while supporting the 6th largest agricultural county in the entire state of California, the largest truck crop producing state in the union.


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## Spice (Dec 21, 2014)

Besides...if your idea of 'managing water properly' means 'draining every last drop out of the rivers' I would suggest that does not constitute good sustainable resource management. When you reach a point where it seems like ridiculous waste to let *water* flow in a *river* where it keeps alive things like *fish* ... well, doesn't that seem like a bit of an extreme position, and I'd suggest there's a problem there.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Also consider that even one to two years of "average" to above average rainfall does not constitute the end of a drought. It takes years to replace the water lost in a single year of drought. Reservoirs must be refilled, ground must reach is proper saturation levels, and actual rivers and lakes must return to their normal levels to end a drought. Also, while you may have received a "normal" amount of rain, you are not considering runoff from snow that did not fall all winter capping the mountains in their customary 10-15 feet of hard pack which accounts for over 50% of the state's total water. The water doesn't just come from rain, it comes from springs, runoff, rain, and snow hard pack.


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## Salt-N-Pepper (Aug 18, 2014)

Spice said:


> When you reach a point where it seems like ridiculous waste to let *water* flow in a *river* where it keeps alive things like *fish* ... well, doesn't that seem like a bit of an extreme position, and I'd suggest there's a problem there.


What are you talking about, wife? Water for fish? Fish don't need no stinkin water, we have lawns to keep green! Screw the fish, who needs fish anyway? All they do is swim around all day, they don't have jobs, they don't add to the economy... we are better off getting rid of the dad gum freeloaders!


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

We get 4.5 inches a year in the desert.

CA is pathetically managing the water it gets. Yes Modesto's 100 year ave is 12 inches. It's also the bread basket of the Central Valley made that way by our fore fathers that managed water effectively.



Salt-N-Pepper said:


> SO... are you saying that Modesto, CA needs no more than 12 inches of rain to maintain your current lifestyle with green lawns & watering? 10 inches of rain is considered a desert.
> 
> I highly doubt that's the case. If it isn't, then what you are talking about is rain in places that you don't live.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Just a little more evidence as to why you are mistaken.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

In case that didn't get it across...


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## Salt-N-Pepper (Aug 18, 2014)

Ripon said:


> We get 4.5 inches a year in the desert.
> 
> CA is pathetically managing the water it gets. Yes Modesto's 100 year ave is 12 inches. It's also the bread basket of the Central Valley made that way by our fore fathers that managed water effectively.


The technical definition of a desert is 10 inches of rain a year or less, so you are in a near desert. Your city relied 100 percent in the past on groundwater for it's municipal supplies, but that changed in recent years. Your aquifer is replenished (60 percent of the recharge) by agricultural drainage from surface water that comes, you guessed it, from the mountains. All kinds of details about where your water comes from can be found here:

Groundwater in the Modesto Irrigation District

Your water supplier seems to think you all are in a drought:

2015 Drought Information

Your government seems to think you are in a drought, since you had exceedingly low snow levels in the mountains where your water comes from:

http://water.ca.gov/waterconditions

I dunno, man... that's a lot of people saying that you are in a drought... and since your ground sources are replenished by water coming from the mountains for agriculture, and there's no snow up there... sound to me like there's a drought.

But what do I know? I live in an area that gets an average of 46 inches a year, so, yeah, not really into dry...


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## shooter (Dec 25, 2012)

I live in California there is a drought. Do we manage our water well no, but does that mean there is not a drought no. Could CA become more efficient with its water usage heck yes. Cities like Sun Valley installed water storage tanks during the last drought and found more effective ways to use their rain run off besides sending it into the ocean. However the fact that the majority of cities in So Cal and in the central valley require water that comes from the Sierras, Shasta or out of state means when those areas have a slight drop in rain it can spell trouble for those other areas. Look at Shasta lake its friggen empty, look at Folsom Resavior its empty. And there was no snow in Tahoe this year which is needed to fill many of the lakes and rivers that feed the central valley and SO Cal. 

My uncle has a ranch up near Red Bluff south of Shasta, 1 of his ponds has dried up another is at 10% and the 3rd is at 50%. That includes all the rain he got this year. However he got no run off from the mountains to help refill those ponds the last 3 years.

There are many ways Ca could fix this problem, But it requires money the state does not have and people willing to give up there green yards in the desert or near desert areas. It mean collecting rain run off and not letting it all flow back into the ocean, it means desalinization planets for come cities. And most of all it means people have to admit there is an issue and start thinking smart. 

Remember the state is using 50-100 year old water works to support its self and the population as grown a bit since then and it seem more people want to move here every year.


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## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Government is inherently incompetent, and no matter what task it is assigned, it will do it in the most expensive and inefficient way possible.
Charley Reese, American syndicated columnist


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

Salt-N-Pepper said:


> What are you talking about, wife? Water for fish? Fish don't need no stinkin water, we have lawns to keep green! Screw the fish, who needs fish anyway? All they do is swim around all day, they don't have jobs, they don't add to the economy... we are better off getting rid of the dad gum freeloaders!


Somebody is sleeping in the den tonight!


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

How much rain you get in YOUR area has nothing to do with the amount of water used. Most of the water in california does not come from rain fall on the area where the water is used.

I just watched a news show that showed a person putting a gauge down a well used to measure depth of ground water... the result was the ground water was down 15 feet from normal and had fallen 1 foot in 3 months.

this is not an either or...it is a both and\

I mean california is BOTH in drought and suffering mismanagement


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

There is mounting evidence that current 'drought' conditions is just the area returning to normal. The past 100 years or so have been exceptionally wet, historically speaking.


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## MI.oldguy (Apr 18, 2013)

Jakthesoldier said:


> In case that didn't get it across...


I remember that sign.born near Modesto,raised mostly in Modesto,on a farm.you have to know this,the central valley of California with mostly the rest was always an arid area fed mostly by the Hetch Hetchy reservoir,originally to feed San Francisco.https://www.c-win.org/big-water-projects-california.html,(next to Yosemite valley from snow pack runoff)the Sacramento delta and the central valley project that was implemented in the 1930's and 40's to draw water from dams,streams and rivers via canals,etc.to produce the bounty of fruits,nuts,veggies and the livestock the area is(soon to be was)known for.this also includes wells on farms and ranches that draw from the aquifers underneath the valley.if the area does not have enough rain and snow,there's no runoff to to go to the dams and the aquifer.look it up,the central valley has as of late been pumping well water it mostly depends on so much due to no snow pack in the sierras that some areas near Modesto,Crows landing,Turlock etc,(ie;the San Joaquin valley have subsided three to four feet in some areas.http://ca.water.usgs.gov/projects/central-valley/land-subsidence-monitoring-network.html this started in the 1950's I do have relatives in the Shasta area and its not quite as bad there as the valley.but,they are fighting for water as of now,facing the same challenges as,their water bill doubling and the large fines for water overuse that of course,the rest of the state is facing.the water situation there has been mismanaged for years since I and a lot of farmers and citizens of the central valley feel that southern Ca (Los Angeles) has decided to tap water from there years ago (the California aqueduct)that should have never have happened.also,the mismanagement of the delta due to an endangered species known as the delta smelt which has all but disappeared like 194 in 2013 and about 2-3 in 2014 which are federally protected (and there is way past due legislation on this subject currently).what a bunch of idiots,like Jerry Brown (AKA Moonbeam)the governor of Ca.and his bunch of cronies that rule the state.they must look way ahead and screw the sierra club who want nothing to do with new dams etc.these people are mostly the reason this situation exists,that they should have looked ahead in the 1960,s and, also due to the changing environment thats happening everywhere.


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## jimb1972 (Nov 12, 2012)

Spice said:


> Perhaps you should consider the whole area where California collects its precipitation before you draw conclusions. Lying politicians don't reduce the snow cover in the mountains, and neither the farming nor the fishing interest water use has jacked up fast enough to explain the pitiful state of the reservoirs. Both the snowpack and the low reservoirs are real (and I'd bet dollars to peanuts the aquifer levels are actually down too, but I haven't seen the visual evidence on that).


Much of California is naturally a desert, I think we are just seeing the end of a period that was wetter than normal more than a "drought" There was a reason for the lower population of native americans in the southern part of the state before it was settled by immigrants.


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## slewfoot (Nov 6, 2013)

Maine-Marine said:


> How much rain you get in YOUR area has nothing to do with the amount of water used. Most of the water in california does not come from rain fall on the area where the water is used.
> 
> I just watched a news show that showed a person putting a gauge down a well used to measure depth of ground water... the result was the ground water was down 15 feet from normal and had fallen 1 foot in 3 months.
> 
> ...


Damn, for once I can agree with everything Maine- marine had to say.
We are originally from that part of the world and use to take trips to California to camp, fish and go boating, Last August We were back there for the first time in 28 years and the rivers ,lakes and reservoir's were damn near dry.


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Of course they do. This means higher fees, more government, and ever more powerful organization that doesn't do anything except constantly get bigger? Do they have plans to better manage the water supplies - sure take control over private ground water supplies, sure regulate usage, but increase supplies by collecting more run off - no. Even so-cal water agencies are giving rebates to people that install rain collection systems but here in nor-cal its just a means of obtaining more bureaucracy. There is not one plan for a new reservoir in CA. Gov. Moonbeams solution is a $25,000,000,000 (yes thats a "B") means of taking Shasta water (since there are few people there) and tunneling it under the SJ Delta and pumping it to So Cal to water lawns. The is the "ONE" proposal and by the way if you put a yard sign against that idea you'll be fined. Sadly even a "French" company said it would be cheaper for CA to take excess water from Washington state and pipe it under the Pacific Ocean along the coast to So Cal...in fact its 1/8th the cost but they won't even consider that. Desalination - good enough for arabs but not CA's coastal cities. A damn? OMG not a damn? Can't have a damn. That might negatively impact a beetle some where. This is what I mean by incompetent miss management. Yes we had "normal" rainfall this year but as pointed out snow packs are low, last year was really low, and the year before low. It will take a few normal years to get things back to normal.

BTW my home town, Ripon, abandoned the 80-120ft aquifers of ground water decades ago and went to the 500' range. No change in those deep water reservoirs.



Salt-N-Pepper said:


> The technical definition of a desert is 10 inches of rain a year or less, so you are in a near desert. Your city relied 100 percent in the past on groundwater for it's municipal supplies, but that changed in recent years. Your aquifer is replenished (60 percent of the recharge) by agricultural drainage from surface water that comes, you guessed it, from the mountains. All kinds of details about where your water comes from can be found here:
> 
> Groundwater in the Modesto Irrigation District
> 
> ...


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

slewfoot said:


> Damn, for once I can agree with everything Maine- marine had to say.


Looks around for lightening............


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## Piratesailor (Nov 9, 2012)

it's been said... never let a crisis go to waste.

And if there isn't a crisis, make one.

"rules for radicals".


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## pheniox17 (Dec 12, 2013)

I live on one of the driest continents on earth...

We went through a record drought a few years ago... That was followed by record rains... A lot of areas are still affected by the lack of rainfall...

But before the floods (locally) a report came out our main drinking water source (a dam) was built for flood management not for providing water... 

The largest factor that also came out from our water crisis was population growth... Most of this infrastructure was built in the 1970s... More than 40 years later who would have thought that the population would be as it is today... 


So are they lying to turn this to a politial issue... Of course... Is it worse or better than they are saying?? No idea... 

But there is a problem... Look at other enviromental figures... Native population (fauna), look at wildfire intenstaty and freqiency (sp) and heat/humidity patterns in weather.... 

Also look at population growth over the past 10 years... 20 years and 50 years.... 

All these factors combined with mismanagment... There is the problem...

But if you want to dig deeper look into rain catchment areas and average rainfall.... And how much of that rainfall makes the catchment areas... 

But you want green grass, and have good rainfall go grab a rainwater catchment system.. And solve the problem yourself


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## GTGallop (Nov 11, 2012)

Ducey urges steps to protect AZ water supply Gov. Doug Ducey urges steps to protect Arizona water supply - ABC15 Arizona


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## GTGallop (Nov 11, 2012)

I tried to add more to that but the site is gimpy at best on my phone.

Any ways.......... Ducey was quoted as saying that he won't stand for Arizona to continue to be punished and penalized for water rights because of Californias "Decadent Abuse" of a natural resource. They live in a hot, arid climate and it is time they started acting like it.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 25, 2014)

It's all the snow pack, and Cali didn;t have ne this year, and last years was tiny. 

Yes, you are in a drought. As a prepper I would have expected that you would be looking at this as a scenario to prep for.


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