# How does one prepare for this as a defender?



## Kauboy

*This thread is part of the "Coming Civil War" group of threads.
Please see the Primer/Premise thread --> HERE <-- for context and links to other related topics.*

The fight is coming. For reasons not yet understood, your area of operation is about to be under siege. You might be an apartment dweller downtown. You might be in a townhouse out in the suburbs. You might be on the backside of the back 400 out in the sticks. But the fight is coming to you whether you want it or not. Pretending you're totally immune is a recipe for disaster. You might be an extremely unlikely target, but you might be a target nonetheless.

How do you prepare to defend your home? What can you gather now? What can you plan now? What can you have ready for quick deployment that will aid in the defense of you and yours?
What are you biggest weaknesses? What are your strengths? Is everyone on the same page? Do they know what they need to do if the time comes?
Where is the line that *shall not be crossed*?

Do you have weapons to defend yourself?
Do you have enough ammunition?
Do you have enough food?
Do you have fire extinguishers? Yes, plural!
Do you need/have firewood?
Is all of this already inside or within line of sight of your windows? If it's out of sight, it isn't really yours. A barn 15 acres away is called a tinder box waiting for a match
If the enemy can get to your outbuildings, consider them indefensible. You can't risk running to save the chicken coup if it means leaving your family back in the house, potentially unprotected.
How long can you hold out?
What are your plans and routes for retreat? Does your family know where to meet if you are split up?
What are your contingencies when these routes are blocked?

Do you have neighbors willing to form a rotating patrol group? You might not be able to join the fight in the city, but you can damn sure protect your small town. How will your group communicate? If you're in "the 'burbs", do you know your streets? Can you effectively communicate where new flare ups are happening and how to call for backup or report to authorities exactly where you are?


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## stowlin

Been taught, told, and read that no position is impenetrable and if enemies are sufficient it will be over run. It’s just my wife and I so nearly impossible to cover every access direction though our little farm makes one way in and out most likely. Fortunately we can trek away the opposite direction and it puts me in a path to my boat. Guess you could say we are runners not fighters. That doesn’t mean I wouldn’t strive to remove a bad apple from the basket given a clean shot.


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## Smitty901

Hard to defend anything with low numbers. You will need a good offense. Make any attempt to encroach on your space expense for them right away. This could get real nasty real fast. Best to be ready now and not put it off. This area is well armed by a number of good people. Most of them have family to protect and are the type that will do so at all cost. Best for the liberals to stay in the big city where they are supported .


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## dwight55

My plan is to stay put . . . too old to be doing a lot of trucking with full load out.

Not much I can do but defend the homestead . . . do my best to decimate the opposition as they come.

Just make it easier for the next group to resist.

As the song goes, . . . "this world is not my home . . . I'm just a passing thru . . . my treasures are laid up . . . somewhere beyond the blue"

And I'm probably as ready as I'll ever get.

May God bless,
Dwight


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## jimcosta

*Kauboy:* Once again I applaud you. You have hit another home run.

Our group set out to defend a rural site. We planned hard for it and then came back and worked our plan. We are still tweaking.

Defending your place with a surefire plan is not for everyone. To do so vigorously requires a strong leader or two with vision, defenders that can be called in later to assist, dedication to planning and the time it takes, the recognition of the impending danger, and most of all, the overwhelming will to survive.

The will to survive is extremely enhanced in us younger ones, especially those with kids we still feel a responsibility for. Us older ones that have enjoyed a long life and are tired may not be motivated as much.
First we have to appreciate that developing an all-out plan to win is not in the cards for everyone.

But for those that may be dedicated to make it through the chaos as safely and easily as possible have the best tool they could possibly have - *You.*

Your opening question is an excellent outline of major areas to plan for. What you left out of that outline can easily be seen by those that follow your lead simply by looking at the completed plan and spotting the missing puzzle pieces.

Thank you Kauboy for broaching the possibility that some of us here at the website needs to relook their situation and proceed further in their plans. I tip my hat to you.


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## AquaHull

I'm old, with little family and I'm all out of f's to give.

Bring it on.


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## Notold63

There is my wife and I, and my 2 adult sons and wives are planning on meeting here if the SHTF. I believe that I have enough food for everyone, enough firearms to arm everyone if my sons and family if for some reason my sons and families arrive unarmed, and as for ammo, that is a matter of perspective. Some may say I might have more then I need, but there are people out there who think one box of ammo is more than enough. I have some firewood but am ordering another cord of wood next month. We have a porch in the front of the house and I will start stacking the firewood along it to act as and additional bullet barrier for the house. We have a steel front door. We have a couple of fire extinguishers but will pick up a couple more this week. We have a spring fed lake within 1/2 mile of us, a hand pulled wagon to transport buckets of water back to the house to filter it through a Berkey system in addition to a couple of water barrels to collect water runoff from the gutters. Also have a couple of fireplaces and a rocket stove. I live on the edge of a wooded park.

With enough men and strong determination, any defensive position can be overrun. IMO the determination is an important factor. If you can make it too expensive in men lost to overrun your home then just maybe the attackers will move on to easier targets. If not then all I can do is plan evacuating to a different location, or take as many of the bastards I can with me.


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## Prepared One

I have food, water, and enough supplies to last me 2 years or more. Enough ammo and guns to get the job done certainly. But, I m an army of one, and a 61 year old at that. Not going to run although that is part of my contingency planing. No, I think I will oblige you to come and get it. I am an old pissed off man with nothing more to lose so take your best shot. That's not bravado or Rambo talk, that's just the way it will be. 

I will attempt to team up with like minded here in my neighborhood of course, and lay low as much as possible. I am on the outskirts of a major city so that helps, I am not in the thick of it. I have scouted my area well and know all avenues of egress and ingress. I am prepared for fire with pumps and plenty of extinguishers. Plenty of barbed wire and razor wire, some surprises for the unaware, and a plan to defend the house and my shit. It will take a team to survive I know, but I am prepared in my mind to go it alone if I have too. It's not ideal to be sure, but it's what I got.


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## SOCOM42

AquaHull said:


> I'm old, with little family and I'm all out of f's to give.
> 
> Bring it on.


I too am to old to run an gun, my fight will be here protecting me and mine.

If it is a real SHTF situation there will be a minimum of 6 of us, not counting the women.

There are LP, OP positions already built, fire lanes are to be assigned as needed.

We have a river and a swamp to protect two sides, not likely to be assaulted from that direction, but will be observed.

The key here is the mobility within our area to place unexpected overwhelming firepower on the OPFOR.

I, we may not come out of it alive, been there before, but I will fight, and there will be no quarter given.

I really don't expect much, if any engagement, here in the woods, but we are prepared for it if needed.

I have no worry about sufficient ammunition or food, meds, and other needs.

I remember the old German position we held during the Berlin crisis, 2 foot thick walls with MG ports,

no we weren't safe in it, had already been defeated by tank fire that is my guess and overrun.

We were an OP/holding action if the commie hoards came our way.

Looks like we will be repeating the scene here.


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## CapitalKane49p

Staying put until the last possible moment. Going to be sneaky, quiet as a mouse and if it comes to it more viscous than a cornered wolverine with a hangover. 

Godspeed


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## rice paddy daddy

I will act like the Viet Cong.
There are beaucoup woods around here. 
Kill a few, fade away. Sneak back later and kill a few more. Fade away again.

If you plan on “fortifying “ your property, get the list titled Murphey’s Laws of Combat and study the one that says - make it too hard for the enemy to get in and it will be too hard for you to get out.


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## jimcosta

Based on the opening statement I interpreted this thread to become a help aid and discussion about *DEVELOPING* one's defense plan more rather than a "I'll show you mine if you show me yours" type end of conversation.

For instance, just this morning someone sent me an article on Skunk Spray used by Israel to stop protests. I did a search and found a product one might put near the front entrance when shooting is heard in the neighborhood. Just another option for defenders. See: Link

So let me begin a discussion for those that have not prepared yet and could use another good push.

First assess your real defensive needs, including the ideal minimum number of persons required.

Secondly continue to develop a set of plans, that being 
1) Just for your household;
2) Your household and a few added to it;
3) In conjunction with your immediate neighbor;
4) Your neighborhood.

Thirdly work at all plans at the same time. You may not have to inventory for Plan 3 now but at least jot down thoughts as they occur to you. Be creating in your mind first.

Fourthly, expand your imagination. Look beyond the problem and your shortages. Seek help and solutions. Envision more defenders, a stronger defensive position, more money, more . . .

And lastly, focus on* Security* with various levels of plans. 
Why? Because those plans is what what will give you confidence to approach others. You may not have to reveal your plans but if you say "Got it covered" enough then others will want to partner with you. Now you are no longer alone.


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## Murdock67

rice paddy daddy said:


> I will act like the Viet Cong.
> There are beaucoup woods around here.
> Kill a few, fade away. Sneak back later and kill a few more. Fade away again.
> 
> If you plan on "fortifying " your property, get the list titled Murphey's Laws of Combat and study the one that says - make it too hard for the enemy to get in and it will be too hard for you to get out.


If I were going to plan for something like the upcoming democrat apocalypse, I think the above would be a good idea.


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## The Tourist

_My plan is to stay put . . . too old to be doing a lot of trucking with full load out._

And there's nothing wrong with this.

Even if an attacker has more fire-power than you do, he still would have to stumble around unfamiliar territory. Even if the aggressor had a handgun (which few people really know how to use), a sharp knife and 21 feet of distance is all you need to terminate this attack.

I think there are too many detective shows on TV. The hero always has a really slick firearm and he's a crack shot. Most of my friends have snub-nosed .38 SPL handguns and I would hate to meet them in a corridor or back alley. A small revolver and a speed loader offers 10 rounds. At social distances this is more than enough to end the fray.

There is one thing I have always found odd, that being the 'knife' itself. For some reason an aggressor will see a firearm and he probably will continue his attack. However, if you show him the glitter of a very sharp knife edge, I believe the attacker is imagining what that edge is going to do to him on his slightest mistake.

In the old gun magazines they reported that when hit by the rounds of handgun you still have cognitive attributes in 55% of the time. This translates to 90 seconds or 2 minutes to initiate your own attack.

The trick is to keep a very "cool head." You're hurt, but you probably won't be dying.


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## AquaHull

I'm a Lone Wolf at the moment. I'm sure others will be asking my advice soon. It will probably be the silver haired folks I talk to on my morning walks.


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## Piratesailor

Prepared One said:


> I have food, water, and enough supplies to last me 2 years or more. Enough ammo and guns to get the job done certainly. But, I m an army of one, and a 61 year old at that. Not going to run although that is part of my contingency planing. No, I think I will oblige you to come and get it. I am an old pissed off man with nothing more to lose so take your best shot. That's not bravado or Rambo talk, that's just the way it will be.
> 
> I will attempt to team up with like minded here in my neighborhood of course, and lay low as much as possible. I am on the outskirts of a major city so that helps, I am not in the thick of it. I have scouted my area well and know all avenues of egress and ingress. I am prepared for fire with pumps and plenty of extinguishers. Plenty of barbed wire and razor wire, some surprises for the unaware, and a plan to defend the house and my shit. It will take a team to survive I know, but I am prepared in my mind to go it alone if I have too. It's not ideal to be sure, but it's what I got.


Now hold your damn horses there... 61 is NOT old...

Yeah.. I'm 61.


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## Piratesailor

Interesting thoughts and conversations. 

For me.. right now we are 2 but should this apocalypse come, we’d be 12+ at my house. Have enough food, etc to keep going for awhile. The extra 10 would be the kids/grandkids. Could be more depending on their situation.

I’m semi-rural. 45 miles from a big city (houston) but in an area that is farm, cattle and residential houses on acreages. Lots of cattle, horses, chickens, gardens and small farms. Dead end street and I know all the neighbors; we are of like minds. Easy to block off a road. Access via fields and on foot is another matter. Key is we all would work together for defense. 

Key question is if it would be the apocalypse where we would have to act like the VC or be insurgents or fight insurgents. I’m not so sure of that. Yeah, hope for the best and plan for the worst. 

As I mentioned to my wife this morning when talking about current state and our kids, it will take one news cycle to create an irrational panic and run on stores. TP is a good example. That alone will stress supply lines and cause all kinds off issues. Throw in the election, constitutional crisis, SCOTUS, BLM/Antifa, etc and you have mix that spells turmoil. Apocalypse... maybe not. 

Now with that said, my biggest concern is protecting investment with a market crash. 

And lastly, I’ve said it before and will again.. Balkanization will be the end result. What it looks like I can’t imagine but i feel it will happen.


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## Annie

> Do you have fire extinguishers? Yes, plural!


Hubs has been going fire extinguisher crazy of late. Every week he comes home with another one. I think all this blm burning down of cities has him thinking its the next thing to disappear from the shelves. He said he's gonna take a one or two of the old ones and give everybody a lesson in using them. I told him to use them on those ravager deer our neighbors feed. :devil: now that'd be fun.


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## rice paddy daddy

jimcosta said:


> For instance, just this morning someone sent me an article on Skunk Spray used by Israel to stop protests. I did a search and found a product one might put near the front entrance when shooting is heard in the neighborhood. Just another option for defenders. See: Link


There's absolutely nothing wrong with that advice, but I got a chuckle out of "when shooting is heard".
Out here, shooting is heard every day, moreso on weekends. Because it is legal in Florida to shoot on your property, and a lot of people do rather than travelling 50 miles to a range and pay fees.
Right now there's some guy about 1/2 mile away firing what sounds like an AR. And he's practicing "spray and pray". He's already fired $50 worth of ammo. :vs_laugh:


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## Smitty901

Gun fire in many direction is common here. What is different now is how often you hear it.


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## Elvis

Same here. Used to be someone firing at least a few shells every day but the last 6-8 months the level of shooting is about half what it use to be.


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## Piratesailor

Yeah. In my area not to hear gun fire is strange. Few folk around here have their own outdoor ranges set and they are used frequently.


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## Smitty901

Take lesson from this man. Speed surprise and violence of action.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1309521908405284864


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## rice paddy daddy

Piratesailor said:


> Now hold your damn horses there... 61 is NOT old...
> 
> Yeah.. I'm 61.


61? 
Young whippersnapper.

(Spellcheck did not like that)


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## keith9365

stowlin said:


> Been taught, told, and read that no position is impenetrable and if enemies are sufficient it will be over run. It's just my wife and I so nearly impossible to cover every access direction though our little farm makes one way in and out most likely. Fortunately we can trek away the opposite direction and it puts me in a path to my boat. Guess you could say we are runners not fighters. That doesn't mean I wouldn't strive to remove a bad apple from the basket given a clean shot.


There are expanses of beach in Normandy, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, and Guam that were thought to be impregnable by their defenders. Keep that in mind.


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## Michael_Js

Annie said:


> Hubs has been going fire extinguisher crazy of late. Every week he comes home with another one. I think all this blm burning down of cities has him thinking its the next thing to disappear from the shelves. He said he's gonna take a one or two of the old ones and give everybody a lesson in using them. I told him to use them on those ravager deer our neighbors feed. :devil: now that'd be fun.


I just got the last large one at Costco - now every shed has one, the garage, 2 in the house, and 1 in each car. We also have a fire blanket - just in case 

These have nothing to do with the current situation. We have a coop with lights, a fan, and in the winter, a water heater. Each of the other 2 sheds have gasoline, diesel, and machinery in them. We want to be prepared! 

Peace out,
Michael J.


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## NewRiverGeorge

I plan to blend in...to disappear


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## Elvis

Michael_Js said:


> I just got the last large one at Costco - now every shed has one, the garage, 2 in the house, and 1 in each car. We also have a fire blanket - just in case
> 
> These have nothing to do with the current situation. We have a coop with lights, a fan, and in the winter, a water heater. Each of the other 2 sheds have gasoline, diesel, and machinery in them. We want to be prepared!
> 
> Peace out,
> Michael J.


I also went heavy on fire extinguishers. Both shops have two 10 lb with another in the walkway between. The house has another 4 and the garage has 2 more. All fuel is in separate storage boxes away from the buildings. All reloading powders are in a metal building with a concrete floor. All roofs are metal and we just pulled the wood siding off the house and replaced it with Hardi-plank for additional fire protection. Each building has a outdoor freeze proof water faucet and I keep the grass cut short close to the house during dry weather. The 2 shops are surrounded by gravel at least 12' out which should help keep a grass fire from getting the buildings.

We are basically surrounded by fields out for several hundred yards and I could see the potential for a grass fire in a dry wind ripping through.


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## Elvis

Fire extinguishers are expensive and not super effective but... a lot cheaper than letting a fire get out of control. 
And as a prep very important. Imagine if you had a lot of your food stores go up in flames.


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## Denton

Elvis said:


> Fire extinguishers are expensive and not super effective but... a lot cheaper than letting a fire get out of control.
> And as a prep very important. Imagine if you had a lot of your food stores go up in flames.


Fire extinguishers are effective depending on how fast it is caught.


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## Kauboy

While indulging myself in some post-election riot fantasy fear porn on Youtube, I came across a video about precautions to take to prepare for the next week or two.
Nothing the lot of us haven't already planned for, but for the general public, might be good knowledge.

Get your prescriptions filled
Fill your gas tanks
Have fire extinguishers
Charge up all devices
Food and water for a week or more
Test your generator
Have alternative light sources if the power goes out
General first aid supplies
etc...

That wasn't the real gem, at least not in my opinion...
I've been promoting the "have multiple fire extinguishers" since the start of these riots since we know fire is the number one weapon hooligans employ.
But a comment under the aforementioned video was like a lightbulb.
The poster suggested getting a y-splitter for a garden hose, and hooking it up to your washing machine's water supply. It should be the exact same threads as your exterior spigots.
One side continues to feed the washing machine while the other side has a garden hose and sprayer nozzle attached and always at the ready. With the flip of a valve, you have full water pressure inside your home!

Genius, I tell you!
Well I of course went right out and gathered the necessary materials. Picked up a brass y-splitter, a "fireman's hose" nozzle for a nice wide spray, and a "Zero-G 25-ft Premium-Duty Kink Free Woven Gray Hose" from Lowes. I also picked up some thread wrap to ensure a leak-free installation.
After assembly, I have no leaks and the woven hose coils nicely into a small bucket next to the washing machine and completely out of the way.
Your own preferences may vary on the length of hose you choose, but this option sounds like it will work a treat to handle a large area with a large volume of water from an indoor source. No worry with running outside to gather up the rubber hose and risk whatever may be out there, or having it running through a door or window that would need to be held open to avoid pinching it.
Having it inside is much preferred.

If you'll be defending your home from rioters, this might be another tool in your kit to prevent a total property loss due to fire, and of course, might save your life.


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## Chiefster23

I did the fire hose thing two days ago. I carefully drained one hose and hooked it up inside an unheated gargage. This hose can be easily charged and used all around the outside of the house. Then I prehooked up another in the basement that is long enough to reach anywhere inside the home. I also have multiple fire extinguishers stashed all over the house and basement. I like the hose idea. I think the inside basement hose is going to be a permanent thing at our house going forward.


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## Chiefster23

Just an FYI for anyone considering the hose thing for your home. I tapped into my existing water pipes and ran an extension into my garage for the additional hook-up mentioned above. I used pex pipe and shark bite fittings. This system is very easy and anyone can do water lines with these fittings. I purchased a hose bib valve that is billed as a ‘washing machine’ water shut off valve. Caution!! This valve is a ball valve with a very small hole in the valve ball. It severely restricts the water flow to the hose. This isn’t something you want if you are trying to control a fire. So be forewarned if you are considering installing new plumbing for a hose. Make sure your shut off valve isn’t overly restrictive to your water flow. I will be going to Lowes today for a more suitable replacement.


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## Prepared One

I did have the forethought of checking hoses and fittings so I am covered. I have splitters and plenty of hose to get the job done if called for.


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## Maine-Marine

I am sure I will see it coming long before it reaches me.. and I will load my food and other items in my truck and go. Where? TBD based on events... My house in Maine, friends in PA, friends in Maine


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## Eyeball

I live on the 3rd floor of an inner-city apartment block so if rioting breaks out all around me I'll have to hunker down and name the place 'Fort Apache'.
If they try to burn me out I've got a couple of extinguishers, but if they don't do their job i'll have to go to Plan B and use this rope which I keep in the corner.
I'll tie one end to a table leg and sling the rest out the window to climb down, hopefully without hanging myself..


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## Eyeball

AquaHull said:


> I'm old, with little family and I'm all out of f's to give.
> Bring it on.


Me too, I'm 72 and our kool "don't give a damn" philosophy is a great mindset to have..


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## Eyeball

AquaHull said:


> I'm a Lone Wolf at the moment. I'm sure others will be asking my advice soon. It will probably be the silver haired folks I talk to on my morning walks.


I'm a LW too with no family, so it should be easier for us in a SHTF situation with just our own ass to worry about..
Mind you, i'll help friends and neighbours if I can, but we need to always keep in mind that the more mouths that need feeding, the less there'll be for ourselves, as this pic below dramatically illustrates-
On the left is our food stock, but if we have just one extra mouth to feed it's halved (right)-


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