# I have been working on my communications plan.



## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

I have been working on my communications plan. During this process I did a lot of searching for information. Throughout this thread I will upload a good deal of information. What prompted this was because a while back I was able to test my Family Radio Service (FRS)/General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS) radios for distance away from my house. I was disappointed. I did not get as far as I wanted. We are relatively flat but very wooded in this area. My house sits in the woods away from the road. So I am guessing trees cut the distance.

The house I moved from last year sat in the open on an elevation. I don't want to call it a hill compared to military standards but basically a smaller hill. The surrounding terrain was open to semi woods to woods and the terrain was rolling. My reception was almost good with the rolling terrain as I drove down the road at my current location.

If you don't know with GMRS you are supposed to have a license from the FCC but the majority of society does not deal with it. I am part of that majority. The license does cover you and your family. GMRS is great for around the retreat or homestead but probably will not cut it for patrols depending on your terrain.

FRS runs at 2 watts of power and GMRS runs at 5 watts of power but note you can buy GMRS only radios that have much higher wattage. Midland MXT 400 GMRS radio is the highest that I have seen so far at 40 watts.

I don't want to deal with Ham. While amateur radio is for some, it's not for me. I don't want to have to be required to have a license and get on another government list. I don't want to pay fees and the equipment generally costs more. Plus the fact that I don't really care about talking to someone that I do not know across the country or around the world. Eventually I do plan on getting a radio, something inexpensive. Basically I want it for emergency information and monitoring purposes.

Besides all that beautiful range with a Ham radio will end with an EMP/Solar Flare taking out the repeaters. Really it will not just be repeaters taking a hit but almost all electronics being took out with an EMP. If you do not have extra radios in a Faraday cage you will loose all comms. I say extra radios because who will get their electronics out every time they need to use it and then put it back?

People talk about triangulation and finding out where you live because of radio traffic. Try that in a SHTF turn WROL. One, if you have the gas to drive around you just made your self a target. Two if you are trying that in my area and you are not a neighbor or local your F'd. Our hasty road block will inspect your vehicle, credentials and if you are not local you just lost your vehicle, equipment and you are now a prisoner or taking a dirt nap. Now with saying all that you have to maintain proper communication protocols.

This paragraph is what COMSEC is all about. Keep your mouth shut on the radio unless its important. When you do talk make it very short and to the point. Use codes, a key phrase that means something or anything cryptic. A military style Brevity Matrix and CB 10 codes are a good example of that. You can create anything that you want that would help your group. Plus you will want to make it hard for anyone listening to understand your communication. Remember to do what the military does and change their information and codes every 24 hours. We civilians do not have the military luxury of having radios that have cryptographic security. In other words we do not have radios that do the security for us. As close we can get to secure radios is using sub channels on the GMRS/FRS. Garmin Rino radios have a scramble option. Using codes and a Brevity Matrix is a kicker. A self made non standard cryptic code that is random and is changed every 24 hours will be a real pain to decipher. So you need to take a look around and evaluate what your communication plan needs. What do you want your radios for, options? The distance you plan on communicating at? Your budget? For me the budget is always the deciding factor. Very seldom do I buy premium or at least in the beginning I will almost always buy budget till I get my feet wet. Even then when I do buy premium equipment I will probably buy it used unless I need to have the warranty.

View attachment 1 Alternative Commo and Security.pdf


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

I have decided to go with CB radios along with the GMRS/FRS radios. Its a happy medium between Ham and GMRS/FRS. CB radios have 40 channels in the 27 Mhz 11 meter band.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_band_radio 
I have been slowly acquiring the equipment from eBay, Craigslist and an auction that I used to frequent. After a couple of cheap purchases that were duds from the auction(online but you go and pick it up) I got the stuff to test so I wasn't wasting my money even if it was 5 or 7 dollars.

So in the beginning get your most needed equipment to test future radios. This is what I did for CB radios. You want a power cord. A known working hand mike/microphone, antenna and a SWR meter. Note: YOU ALWAYS NEED TO HAVE AN ANTENNA CONNECTED TO THE CB BEFORE YOU KEY THE MIKE, IT WILL BURN OUT YOUR RADIO. An SWR meter with a power meter function is ideal and not much more $. You hook the antenna wire to the SWR meter and then a jumper cable from the SWR meter to the CB radio. You then follow directions and adjust your antenna until you reach an allowable range. I would try to describe SWR (Standing Wave Ratio) but wiki does a good job. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standing_wave_ratio

The power cord for the CB is different depending on manufacturers. The 3 pin connector power cord is common. On the back of the CB there is a 3 pin power connection and the cable has a matching connector and then a male cigarette lighter connector on the other end of the wire.

Some CB radios have a built in power cord. It will have a cut off end so that you can hard wire into the vehicle or a cigarette lighter end connector. I made a cable with the male cigarette lighter end and then on the other end I installed rubber covered alligator clips. Now when I want to test a radio with bare cut off wires I can now clip onto the wires and then plug it in. A quick simple temporary fix.

Something that I did is add an inline fuse to the positive on the power cords with a 2amp fuse. Just CYA. Fuses like to pop. I had one wiring harness blow the fuse in the cigarette lighter male end and no store carried the fuse. It is one of those older style long tube fuses. Now the stores have several lengths and diameters. That's when I said screw it and bought the popular inline fuse assembly with the common flat fuses. For the blown fuse I put aluminum foil around it and reassembled it so that the circuit would be complete. Note: ALWAYS HAVE A FUSE IN YOUR POWER CORD! If you do the aluminum foil trick and if you do not have a fuse you will fry your radio.

Now with a power cord, hand mike, antenna and preferably a Power/SWR meter you can check out and test your possible used radio purchase before you lay down the cash. If you are doing a Craigslist ad then let the buyer know ahead of time you want to test the equipment. If they are not willing to let you test then move on. If you are buying on eBay then look for a return policy. If there is no returns allowed then look for a statement of "tested", "works great", or other similar statement. You are looking for a way to guarantee its in working condition so that eBay/Pay Pal will protect you from a Dead on Arrival situation and you can get your money back. If there is a statement of "No Returns AS IS Where Is" then steer clear of these listings unless you are looking for parts.

I chose to have a couple different radios. Using different channels like the local auction, Craigslist and eBay I got a few different radios at a steep discount. They are normal radios with the exception of two. They have the option which is good to have and that is the National Weather Service and a scanning mode. That way if it is WROL and you have a team in the field conducting a patrol you or they can scan for any radio traffic and if the weather service is still operating then you can get weather updates. I have hand held CB's also and one option that I wish I have is a headphone plug. Without having head phones you are broadcasting to the forest your radio traffic. In the woods noise travels.

Note, antennas are different shapes sizes and performance. You have vehicle antennas that are "Ground Plane" because of the large metal surface. You have "No Ground Plane" for vehicles and houses that have very little metal like motor homes, boats, cars made out of fiberglass(vettes). You have different antenna types or styles. Most common is the vertical antenna and the horizontal called a dipole. I am using these two styles. There are several other styles that I am not familiar with. The vertical has 360 degree coverage The dipole is straight forward and backwards, no left or right coverage. This type of antenna transmits a very long ways away using skip. There are other antenna styles. I will upload several books on antennas.

A quick note about CB radios. They operate on the AM band. There is another type of CB called Single Side Band (SSB).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-sideband_modulation

SSB is still AM and still uses the same frequencies but it has an option of turning on the SSB and then it operates at a higher wattage which in turn allows you to transmit further. From my understanding if you are on a normal CB and you try to listen to a SSB transmission it is garbled. When the opportunity arises I do plan on getting a SSB radio for my communications center.

View attachment SSB.pdf


I want to make a quick mention of towers such as residential TV or radio towers. I bought my 40' tower for $50.00 at an auction. Some where's down the line the previous owners had a tower near my house. The cement pad and steel mounts sticking out of the cement are the only thing left. I am going to figure out a way to create a mount to align up with the cemented mount so I can erect my tower. With a tower you get height and the higher an antenna is the further distance you gain.

Here are some files to do with the science behind transceiver radios.

View attachment Radiowave propagation.pdf


View attachment SolarMax.pdf


View attachment Iono.pdf


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here are some basic options that you can buy for your system.









SO-239 female to female coupler adapter for PL-259 connector. This is for joining antenna wire sections together to make a longer wire.









This adapter is the male PL-259 to SO-239 female right angle connector. This is basically for mounting your antenna on the back of the CB at a right angle.









SO-239 female 4 holes Square Panel TO SO-239 PL259 RF connector adapter. This is for when you have to bring an antenna into a vehicle, house or some other hard structure or container.









Here is a SO-239 female to BNC Male antenna adapter. What I used this adapter for is to replace the rubber ducky antenna on a handheld CB radio while in the field. The rubber ducky antenna sucks. It is a close range antenna period. It does not matter if it is a base station CB, mobile CB (car) or a handheld CB. All CB's are regulated at 4 watts transmitting power. This adapter allows you to hook up the antenna wire and no ground plane antenna for long range transmission. You will probably have to attach the antenna to a very long stick or throw a rope over a high tree branch and lift the antenna up. The higher the antenna is the better transmitting and receiving.









Here is pretty handy adapter a PL-259 to SO-239 T splitter. This adapter allows you to hook up two different antennas to your radio. For example I have a vertical intermediate range and a longer range dipole. The vertical antenna transmission could be used for your local traffic and with the dipole aimed at your patrol location(s) like South of base camp.

If any of this has been an interest then start your research. This thread wasn't so much to teach you but inform you of options. I am not an expert, just learning as I go and this is what I learned so far. There are a lot of different sources and one that I did not mention is truck stops. Many larger truck stops have CB shops and can help you out. I had a couple antennas and CB radio eBay stores provided a little time and a lot of information. Remember ask questions, check for a return policy and test your equipment.

I will be uploading a lot of commo books and files to supplement this thread. Have patience for the upload.

Eventually I will be creating a thread on a portable power source that I am building. Almost all of the components have been received from China so the building will come soon. Besides casual use the purpose of this is to be used in the field on a patrol to power the CB radio and recharge the GMRS. Maybe even help neighbors charge any items they need.

The power source will contain a set of cigarette power plug, USB plug and volts meter. I will have an additional USB plug and cigarette plug. Inside will have a 10 fuse block and a grounding bar. A battery kill switch. I will also have a solar charge controller and a volts, watts, amps power meter for overall power monitoring. Right now I have a 12v 15amp deep cycle battery(small sized) but I am thinking of adding another one. Keep in mind weight and size is critical. This power supply will be carried in a rucksack.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

We will start with some communication security. Remember everything can be altered so they have different meanings. You don't have to have military grade scrambling devices when you can make A mean Q and change it every 24 hours so Q means G and then it continues. If you keep changing it then it will be hard to decipher it but were talking SHTF and really WROL and at that point were not dealing with a Rogue government but Joe in the town next over or further away. Simple cyphers will jack him up.

View attachment (SOI) Signal Operation Instructions.pdf


View attachment VADF_SOI_07_updated_1-2008.pdf


View attachment fm3-54-10.pdf


View attachment MCRP 2-25A Reconaissance Reports Guide.pdf


View attachment MCRP 3-40.3B Radio Operators Handbook.pdf


View attachment 10codesCB.PDF


View attachment Police tencodea.pdf


Few more files in the next post.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here's more of the security files.

View attachment Police tencodeg.pdf


View attachment 10 Codes.pdf


View attachment cblingo.pdf


Remember change everything. 10-4 which means Ok can be changed to "Start attack". Just remember however you do it make it so that your codes can be changed every 24 hours and you have a months worth of codes at all times and make some kind of discreet mark or label so you can differentiate which code is which.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

This post should of been before the previous one.

This post is about a communications log. You should have a full time operator like at a police desk waiting for any complaints or emergencies. This desk will also be your full time communications operator. He/She will be operating whatever radio equipment your group decides to have. This post can be operated by an older person or elderly person. A person that has a medical problem such as a broken bone. Basically I am saying this is one of those positions that can free up an able bodied person to work in the garden or a security detail and let a less mobile person monitor the radio. Keep in mind this person has to have the ability to move to mark positions or key things on a map i.e. a push pin or? You have to keep up to date intel on your local map. Either a county map or a topographical map.









View attachment Business Communication Log Template.pdf


View attachment Communication Log.pdf


View attachment EMRG-501_ICS-309_Communications_Log.pdf


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Antennas, an important subject and I am still ignorant on the subject. Read as I am and once I am done posting all of these damn books ask questions or offer your opinions.

Here is info on using a meter to tune your antenna to get better performance.

View attachment CB-SWR.pdf


View attachment swr-plot.pdf


View attachment 2011_July_W9IPR.pdf


View attachment ant1936.pdf


View attachment ARRL HANDBOOK - Antenna Project.pdf


View attachment Here is Dipole.pdf


View attachment practical antenna handbook fourth edition.pdf


prepperforums chain of command take note you that you have a low document memory requirement. Increase it so that files can be uploaded.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

This short posting will be about frequencies. CB radio and GMRS/FRS radio,

View attachment CB Frequency Chart.pdf


View attachment FRS-GMRS-Frequencies.pdf


View attachment hGMRS_FRS_Frequencies.pdf


View attachment MissionSpec-GMRS-FRS-CheatSheet02.pdf


View attachment NEW ARRL HAM-BAND COLOR CHART.PDF


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Time zones, important to keep updates.









View attachment standard_time_zones_of_the_world.pdf


View attachment timezones_ref01.pdf


View attachment timezones4.pdf


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## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Sounds like you have a plan, that's good. That was a lot of work. 
I usually just tell folks to download this book. Ham Radio for Dummies. 
Go here and scroll down to the "H" section and look for it. Free download in pdf format. 

www dot n5dux dot com/ham/files/pdf 

There's tons of info on this guy's page. 

This direct link may or may not work for you. 

www dot n5dux.com/ham/files/pdf/Ham%20Radio%20for%20Dummies dot pdf

An excellent book that even the totally radio clueless can understand. You can find paper copies cheap on e-bay and a-mazon.


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Great Job MG!
I've been looking forward to your report!


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here are more antenna related files. At this point in the thread, I could feel the beer I had been drinking and forgot to post more of the antenna books.

View attachment antenna book.pdf


View attachment CB antennas.pdf


View attachment CB Wip Ham J.pdf


View attachment Practical Antennas.pdf


View attachment StealthAntennas_Sample.pdf


Here are a couple figures of antenna tower mounting and grounding.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here are some military radio files. The GTA's are really great for newer inexperienced radio operators.

View attachment Radio GTA11-1-6.pdf


View attachment Radio GTA11-1-7.pdf


View attachment FM 24-19 24-May-91 Scribd.pdf


View attachment fm24-18.pdf


View attachment ta 312 TM_11-5805-201-12.pdf


I have a TA-312 maintenance book but it will not upload for some reason. I really like the TA-312 field phone. They are awesome for a LP/OP but they are stupid expensive. I am slowly working on using an old time dial phone for use as a field phone. I bought a crap load of the phones at an auction for like $15.00 and have bought some of the stuff needed for the test/build but I just have to get the time to finish doing the research and the experimentation and then the build. It will be a winter project for when my wife runs out of crap to keep me busy and she wont want to go out into the cold. So a dial up phone conversion to a field phone thread will be coming up.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here is a file on the antenna cable and the different styles.

View attachment Coax-Basics.pdf


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

The following files are mostly in general educating books.

View attachment collinsaetext04thrdm10.pdf


View attachment General_-_Shortwave_Radio_101.pdf


View attachment General_-_Shortwave_Radio_Handbook.pdf


View attachment Radio-Handbook.pdf


View attachment Radio-Monitoring-a-How-to-Guide.pdf


View attachment The Beginner's Handbook of Amateur Radio.pdf


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Check out this project for a small radio using an ammo can. My idea and future project of having a portable power source came from watching this YouTube video and PDF.

DIY How To Build A Solar Powered Ham-O-Can Radio Go Box » TinHatRanch

View attachment GMRS-Ham-O-Can-Rev-1.0.pdf


Here are a couple other links for useful or neat information that is commo related in one way or another.

https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/calculator-sizing-a-battery-to-a-load.html

Small 12V Battery Solar Power Charging Rig for a Caravan or Camper: 17 Steps


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here is a file on some alternative communication methods and some other stuff.

View attachment 1 Alternative Commo and Security.pdf


Well I think this is last post. Any suggestions or recommendations? Like I mentioned right at this moment in time I have zero interest in Ham radio but if you have something interesting then post it or upload it because another individual may be interested in it.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Boss Dog said:


> Sounds like you have a plan, that's good. That was a lot of work.
> I usually just tell folks to download this book. Ham Radio for Dummies.
> Go here and scroll down to the "H" section and look for it. Free download in pdf format.
> N5DUX Ham Radio PDFs There's tons of info on this guy's page.
> ...


Those links are bad juju I just tried opening up the link for that book and it started downloading a virus.


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## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

Sorry bud, I checked it and downloaded it this morning to make sure it worked and had no problems. Maybe your antivirus is just wound too tight?
Links disabled.


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## ddp (Oct 14, 2017)

I understand anyone's reluctance to obtain a ham radio license who is not actually interested in pursuing the hobby. But don't rule out ham radio equipment! You do not need a license to purchase ham radios. You don't even need a license to transmit if life or property is at risk and there is no other means of communication available.

Most ham radio equipment has transmit restricted to the ham frequencies. In most radios you can eliminate this restriction by simply removing a diode. All of my VHF/UHF ham radio gear has been modified this way. That means I can transmit and receive on ham frequencies, marine frequencies, FRS and GMRS frequencies, MURS (unlicensed) frequencies and even some commercial and public service frequencies. Also, these radios transmit up to 5 watts for handheld models and 50 watts for base or mobile models.

My HF radios have also been modified (one diode removed) to enable both transmit and receive from 1.6 MHz to 30 MHz. That covers CB, ham, short wave, government, military, marine and many other frequencies.

All of my ham radio equipment is well made and has the ability to scan either ranges of frequencies or memorized channels. This can really help if regular news broadcasters are off the air. Software is available that will allow you to decode weather satellite images and other digital broadcast protocols giving you a back up source for situational awareness.

In a SHTF situation licenses will probably not matter but the ability to monitor and communicate on a broad range of frequencies with a decent amount of power will certainly matter.

One last thought. If you have a ham radio club in your area you should check it out. You do not need to be a licensed ham to be welcome. You do not need to disclose that you are a prepper and you will not be asked to produce identification. Hams have informative programs at their meetings that can help you with antenna design and construction, equipment selection and modification and interfacing radios to computers to decode digital transmissions. If you don't have a nearby club search YouTube for ham information.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

ddp said:


> I understand anyone's reluctance to obtain a ham radio license who is not actually interested in pursuing the hobby. But don't rule out ham radio equipment! You do not need a license to purchase ham radios. You don't even need a license to transmit if life or property is at risk and there is no other means of communication available.
> 
> Most ham radio equipment has transmit restricted to the ham frequencies. In most radios you can eliminate this restriction by simply removing a diode. All of my VHF/UHF ham radio gear has been modified this way. That means I can transmit and receive on ham frequencies, marine frequencies, FRS and GMRS frequencies, MURS (unlicensed) frequencies and even some commercial and public service frequencies. Also, these radios transmit up to 5 watts for handheld models and 50 watts for base or mobile models.
> 
> ...


If I could get modified equipment like you have then I would probably be more interested, LOL. Cost would be a turn off though. I did check out my local county Ham club. They have a website but you have to use snail mail to get ahold of them. No email or phone number listed. I laughed at that one.

$ Cost + Being on another government list + having to have a license to talk = I don't think so.

I do plan on getting a Ham radio at some point. Its not very high on my list but I do want one. Mainly to play and get a grasp of use and how it works and have it for whenever needed.

I know Ham operators have to have call signs. In my opinion anyone could observe and listen to radio traffic and learn how operators talk to each other. What is to say someone doesn't just learn the ropes. Make up a call sign and start talking to everyone? I'm being serious. I could really see how easy it would be to someone that know radio procedures like active or veteran status military. Anyone in Specialist E-4 and higher knows how to talk on a radio.


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## Brettny (Apr 26, 2017)

Being on another gov list and needing to have a license is all the same stuff to properly use a GMRS radio. Why go with the lesser of the two radio types?

A ham license is $15. You dont have to buy any study material. If you dont feel like studying and taking a test you can just say so.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Brettny said:


> Being on another gov list and needing to have a license is all the same stuff to properly use a GMRS radio. Why go with the lesser of the two radio types?
> 
> A ham license is $15. You dont have to buy any study material. If you dont feel like studying and taking a test you can just say so.


Well, I don't really care to take the test let a lone study for one. I did hear the Ham license is cheaper than the GMRS. The GMRS is around $89.00 or something. But I am not going to do the GMRS license either. Does it make me a criminal? don't really care. Especially when most of the rest of society doesn't care. If the powers to be want to try catching me using GMRS then let them. Right now they are sitting in a faraday cage. That could be a long wait.

It may seem like I am being cocky in my answer but really I am not. I am more against big government and all the stupid laws they make. I don't feel a citizen should have to be on a list and pay to talk. Yeah there should be rules so that people are not walking all over each other but I don't want the gov in my business. That is why I don't do Ham.

I also don't do Ham because I don't need to talk across the country or further away. I have a receiver for monitoring purposes. I only need to talk up to 20+/- miles away for patrol purposes to see what threats are out there in the community. In WROL if you do not see what is out there it will be on your doorstep and then your F'd. Around the homestead/retreat the GMRS radios will be used for LP/OP and command and control. Patrols will use CB radios. They will have the range to talk to the base radio operator.

any questions?


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

All this chatter about various forms of communications make me think of..............................






Sorry, I couldn't help my self. I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.


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## TGus (Sep 18, 2017)

Regarding HAM, how do you guys protect your sets against an EMP? Do you keep a spare radio in a Faraday cage, or something else?

How will you deal with the shorted repeaters to get any distance?

If the repeaters are out, wouldn't HAM traffic reveal that there is an organized group in the "local" area?

Most non-localized martial law situations I know of prohibited any radio communications between the public. In that case, how will you circumvent getting arrested?

These are the main questions I've had about personally using short wave after an SHTF situation.


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## TGus (Sep 18, 2017)

Back Pack Hack said:


> All this chatter about various forms of communications make me think of..............................
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I remember watching this skit when it was first aired on TV. Thanks!


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## Old SF Guy (Dec 15, 2013)

MaterielGeneral said:


> Here are some basic options that you can buy for your system.
> 
> View attachment 56929
> 
> ...


Just remember this. roughly 1 dB of loss from every connector. after 3 dB of loss your power out is half of what yu thought it was. example 37dBm is 5 watts. 3db of loss equals 34dBm or 2.5 watts of power. and your transmit distance is cut in half at every 6 dB of loss on the receive side.

Simple rule...the higher the frequency the greater the loss from ground and vegetation absorption.


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## azrancher (Dec 14, 2014)

TGus said:


> Regarding HAM, how do you guys protect your sets against an EMP? Do you keep a spare radio in a Faraday cage, or something else?
> How will you deal with the shorted repeaters to get any distance?
> If the repeaters are out, wouldn't HAM traffic reveal that there is an organized group in the "local" area?
> Most non-localized martial law situations I know of prohibited any radio communications between the public. In that case, how will you circumvent getting arrested?
> These are the main questions I've had about personally using short wave after an SHTF situation.


Yes real preppers keep a duplicate of the ham gear they normally use, we also unplug and disconnect from the antenna.
You don't need repeaters to get distance, that's why we are Ham Radio operators.
Yes, and so would smoke, lights, people moving around, and if there was traffic that was received nearby it probably wouldn't be by the real bad guys.
Huh?
Get licensed and find out.

*Rancher*


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Old SF Guy said:


> Just remember this. roughly 1 dB of loss from every connector. after 3 dB of loss your power out is half of what yu thought it was. example 37dBm is 5 watts. 3db of loss equals 34dBm or 2.5 watts of power. and your transmit distance is cut in half at every 6 dB of loss on the receive side.
> 
> Simple rule...the higher the frequency the greater the loss from ground and vegetation absorption.


Great tip, I was going to mention something about that and forgot.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

azrancher said:


> Yes real preppers keep a duplicate of the ham gear they normally use, we also unplug and disconnect from the antenna.
> You don't need repeaters to get distance, that's why we are Ham Radio operators.
> Yes, and so would smoke, lights, people moving around, and if there was traffic that was received nearby it probably wouldn't be by the real bad guys.
> Huh?
> ...


If you do not need repeaters then why do they exist?

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

MaterielGeneral said:


> If you do not need repeaters then why do they exist?
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


For hand-held and mobile units.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

TGus said:


> Regarding HAM, how do you guys protect your sets against an EMP? Do you keep a spare radio in a Faraday cage, or something else?
> 
> How will you deal with the shorted repeaters to get any distance?
> 
> ...


.

All really good questions.


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## ddp (Oct 14, 2017)

I keep back-up radios in a double Faraday cage. The radio is in a box wrapped with four layers of aluminum foil, that is in a steel garbage can lined with cardboard. Repeaters are for local (30-40 mile range) traffic between stations that have poor antennas like hand held or mobile. If you have a decent base station antenna 25 or more feet up you can get good range with it. Repeaters are for VHF/UHF bands which operate line of sight. HF radios bounce signals off the ionosphere and can reach distant stations without a repeater. You will always be able to contact somebody somewhere. If you want to contact a specific station thousands of miles away that takes knowledge of radio propagation and antenna construction which comes from many months to several years of experience and/or study.

EMP protection is one of the trickiest things in the prepper's world. You could experience an EMP, then break out your protected equipment only to have a second or third EMP take it out too. I have radios (HF/VHF/UHF) in use all the time and also have backups stored away in a Faraday cage. I will not transmit at the beginning of a SHTF situation but will scan a number of bands for news, information and other situational awareness. Listening circumvents the "getting arrested" problem. I will also monitor police and other public service frequencies. If an EMP takes out these "listening" radios then I'm deaf. 

I have no intention to transmit while martial law is imposed. I intend to wait several months before I unpack the protected radios and attempt to contact anyone. That contact will be to determine who is left and what kind of new society they are forming.


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## azrancher (Dec 14, 2014)

MaterielGeneral said:


> If you do not need repeaters then why do they exist?





Back Pack Hack said:


> For hand-held and mobile units.





ddp said:


> Repeaters are for local (30-40 mile range) traffic between stations that have poor antennas like hand held or mobile. If you have a decent base station antenna 25 or more feet up you can get good range with it. Repeaters are for VHF/UHF bands which operate line of sight. HF radios bounce signals off the ionosphere and can reach distant stations without a repeater. You will always be able to contact somebody somewhere. If you want to contact a specific station thousands of miles away that takes knowledge of radio propagation and antenna construction which comes from many months to several years of experience and/or study.


Thanks BPK and ddp, I was going to say for the same reason CB radios exist, ddp that was a very concise answer and straight to the point, Thanks![/COLOR][/COLOR]



ddp said:


> I have no intention to transmit while martial law is imposed. I intend to wait several months before I unpack the protected radios and attempt to contact anyone. That contact will be to determine who is left and what kind of new society they are forming.


However I think if martial law is imposed then there will be no need to get out the back up radios, if you did have to, then how did you hear about martial law? I keep backups to find out how deep the "S" is, and I will be assuming that all electricity (Grid) is down, and all AM/FM stations are off the air, and probably all receivers that were not protected.

Give me your thoughts on that, am I off-base, or not?

*Rancher*


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

azrancher said:


> ..........However I think if martial law is imposed then there will be no need to get out the back up radios, ..........


Martial Law doesn't mean sit at home on your hands and STFU. Radios can still be used. Security, hunting, even communicating where a resource is located..........


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## azrancher (Dec 14, 2014)

Back Pack Hack said:


> Martial Law doesn't mean sit at home on your hands and STFU. Radios can still be used. Security, hunting, even communicating where a resource is located..........


What I meant by that comment is, that if you know that martial law has been imposed, then there probably hasn't been an EMP event since the probably the only way they can get the word out that the country is under martial law is via current communications, radio/TV/phones? So no need to drag out the backup comm.

*Rancher*


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## Lightning6Actual (Sep 28, 2017)

Don't want to be another list huh? Well lets see now.....Drivers License? Bank Account? Vehicle? Tags? Insurance? CCW? 401(k)? Veteran? VA? Mortgage? And you are worried about being on a list? You paid what $85-$90 for a GMRS license thru another Govt agency namely the FCC. And it is a lesser radio with little to no range. A HAM license is only $15 but you have to study for it. As far as CB is concerned it has turned into a free for all for anyone who has a hand and a mouth. HAM is at least a little more disciplined. MG you have laid out some damn good articles here and they really makes one think.
But, with ham you can actually do more, believe it or not you can remove the stops on most HF radios and listen to military traffic. Might come in handy one day. Think about it before you beat up HAM radio.......


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Lightning6Actual said:


> Don't want to be another list huh? Well lets see now.....Drivers License? Bank Account? Vehicle? Tags? Insurance? CCW? 401(k)? Veteran? VA? Mortgage? And you are worried about being on a list? You paid what $85-$90 for a GMRS license thru another Govt agency namely the FCC. And it is a lesser radio with little to no range. A HAM license is only $15 but you have to study for it. As far as CB is concerned it has turned into a free for all for anyone who has a hand and a mouth. HAM is at least a little more disciplined. MG you have laid out some damn good articles here and they really makes one think.
> But, with ham you can actually do more, believe it or not you can remove the stops on most HF radios and listen to military traffic. Might come in handy one day. Think about it before you beat up HAM radio.......


Nice list of lists. The point is I want less to do with the government. That fee you say I paid for the MGRS never happened and never will. I only use the FRS portion of that radio. That is my official statement. The studying for the Ham is another downer that isn't going to happen. With my wifes honey do list I'll never have time and never give Ham a priority.

The radio modification so you can listen to unsecure traffic would be really cool. I would like to get that when I get a ham radio. Is it legal(I don't really care you just have to keep your mouth shut)? Is it hard to do?

This statement I want to talk about it for a minute 
"Think about it before you beat up HAM radio". Now this is to all, in this thread have I beat up or degraded/disrespected Ham radio? Maybe write a little more firm.

I like Ham radio. I like many features about it. But because of the many reasons I already mentioned and the expenses of Ham from being legal, education to the purchase of radios themselves antennas and the accessories the prices suck.

Why would I want an expensive radio to talk to a person across the country to across the planet when I do not want to. If you do then go for it. Its not me.

Like I stated I want radios for my homestead/retreat and radios for patrol purposes. For both vehicular patrol and by foot.

I only need to talk up to 20+/- miles. The CB can provide most of my needs. It is very cheap. A good thing with CB is that it is not widely used so there will be less people monitoring and with using codes those that do monitor will not know what you are talking about.

So I want a Ham. It is very low on my list unless someone wants to give me one. Eventually when I do get it. I will familiarize my self with it and probably talk on it just because I can and then put it in a faraday cage for storage. My priority is with the FRS/MGRS radios for base camp security and operations. CB radio for patrol purposes for making sure a threat will not be on our doorstop unexpected. They fit my requirement.

Any future posts from anyone trying to convince me Ham is the way to go and I am just going to agree and then stop posting. This thread should be about choices and making a decision that will fit your requirements. Finances and features should be part of those requirements.

People should be giving pro and cons to everything radio related. Ham, CB, FRS/GMRS, MURS what else is there? Its just CB and FRS/GMRS is what I got familiar with and hence this is how this thread became about.


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## Lightning6Actual (Sep 28, 2017)

Well then, all that money I wasted getting into HAM. I generally use 2 meter simplex. that is for 0-20 or so miles. HF can always go further depending on antenna configuration, time of day or night and time of year and atmospheric conditions. That goes for all radio unless you are within a rocks throw. It is nice to listen to HF, sometimes it can give you a heads up for something that might be coming down the pike that you might can have more time to prepare.
On 2 meter you can use repeaters if they are still up and working during a SHTF. And you can use repeaters on GMRS as well but you are limited in power. At least I can swap my antennas and power up right now to 75w to get my message out if need be.
All it boils down to is what suits your specific needs. Me I need something better than bubble pack radios from Walmart and MURS.
That's my opinion whether anyone likes it or not, oh well........


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Lightning6Actual said:


> Well then, all that money I wasted getting into HAM. I generally use 2 meter simplex. that is for 0-20 or so miles. HF can always go further depending on antenna configuration, time of day or night and time of year and atmospheric conditions. That goes for all radio unless you are within a rocks throw. It is nice to listen to HF, sometimes it can give you a heads up for something that might be coming down the pike that you might can have more time to prepare.
> On 2 meter you can use repeaters if they are still up and working during a SHTF. And you can use repeaters on GMRS as well but you are limited in power. At least I can swap my antennas and power up right now to 75w to get my message out if need be.
> All it boils down to is what suits your specific needs. Me I need something better than bubble pack radios from Walmart and MURS.
> That's my opinion whether anyone likes it or not, oh well........


OK, you are right. You won me over. I'm going to look online right now and buy a radio and study guide.


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## edprof (Aug 13, 2016)

Some of the information in the early posts is well-meaning but a little under-studied. Most hams know how to work around those problems whether or not it hits the fan.

I have ham, CB, and GMRS/FRS. I ended up at ham after weighing the other communication alternatives and finding them wanting. I'd rather have ham and have to watch my Ps and Qs than not have it. If nothing else, I can be an intelligent listener.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

edprof said:


> Some of the information in the early posts is well-meaning but a little under-studied. Most hams know how to work around those problems whether or not it hits the fan.
> 
> I have ham, CB, and GMRS/FRS. I ended up at ham after weighing the other communication alternatives and finding them wanting. I'd rather have ham and have to watch my Ps and Qs than not have it. If nothing else, I can be an intelligent listener.


Ok, thank you.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Here are some brevity matrix samples. I don't know if the spreadsheet will upload but if not then the pdf samples should work. The beauty is that you can change them constantly. At a minimum ever 24 hours. You should have several editions so that if a patrol is compromised they will not have the same data as local security or local patrols. Your base radio operator will have multiple matrix for different locations or missions.

View attachment Brevity matrix.pdf


View attachment Matrix 2.pdf


View attachment Matrix 3.pdf


Edit: Some more info.

View attachment Brevity Matrix Contents.pdf


View attachment IsogramMatrix_2017-11-13-2.pdf


Here are some files on the Brevity Matrix. My wife helped me create a spreadsheet that I put the basic info on and then created a Word doc that has the subject titles and the information that could be used to fill the blanks with. Doubt the spreadsheet will load though.

You do not want to have the same information in the same spot every page. To do so your matrix will quickly be deciphered. Make it random, change the content as often as you can. Change the Matrix every 24 hours to throw off any enemy you may have.

You don't have to just use what I provided. You can uses your own. You can use the CB 10 codes that I provided also. The point is to make it random and switch it up constantly.

In a without rule of law SHTF this will work really good against any type of enemy force up to a military force. Your ally there will be silence and very, very brief coded messages. The more you talk the more your location will be found and the more data they can collect to decipher.

Any suggestions on information to add to the matrix contents list? For SHTF regardless of the cause do you have a way of sending encrypted radio traffic?


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

The spreadsheet would not load but you should get the gist of it.


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## OSC (Oct 21, 2017)

edprof said:


> Some of the information in the early posts is well-meaning but a little under-studied. Most hams know how to work around those problems whether or not it hits the fan.
> 
> I have ham, CB, and GMRS/FRS. I ended up at ham after weighing the other communication alternatives and finding them wanting. I'd rather have ham and have to watch my Ps and Qs than not have it. If nothing else, I can be an intelligent listener.


Hey there....quick question.

I am a blithering novice in the Ham environment. My C Crane radio is going to be upgraded soon. I am considering buying one where I can listen to the "2 meter HAM band" in addition to AM/FM and NOAA. What sort of stuff would I hear on the 2M band?


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

OSC said:


> Hey there....quick question.
> 
> I am a blithering novice in the Ham environment. My C Crane radio is going to be upgraded soon. I am considering buying one where I can listen to the "2 meter HAM band" in addition to AM/FM and NOAA. What sort of stuff would I hear on the 2M band?


You may want to check on YouTube with leading Ham channels. Some people like to spout off but not come back to answer questions. I am Ham ignorant but slowly learning.


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