# Inverter generator, survive EMP?



## Swrock (Dec 14, 2018)

I have a 2000 watt generator. Plan on getting a second one with parallel cord to run my small camper. That would give me a backup generator also. Keep 75 gallons of non ethanol gas in the boat, can use the gas to run the generators if needed.
Do yall think an EMP would disable these generators?


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Swrock said:


> I have a 2000 watt generator. Plan on getting a second one with parallel cord to run my small camper. That would give me a backup generator also. Keep 75 gallons of non ethanol gas in the boat, can use the gas to run the generators if needed.
> Do yall think an EMP would disable these generators?


Reply hazy, try again...

(Slippy shakes his Magic 8 Ball and awaits the next question...:vs_smile


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## Chiefster23 (Feb 5, 2016)

Inverters work by using semiconductors and electronics. The EMP gurus all say that this stuff will fry. Who knows? You could store your Honda genny inside a faraday cage or even under some of the ‘emp cloth’ that Dr. Bradley sells.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Swrock said:


> I have a 2000 watt generator. Plan on getting a second one with parallel cord to run my small camper. That would give me a backup generator also. Keep 75 gallons of non ethanol gas in the boat, can use the gas to run the generators if needed.
> Do yall think an EMP would disable these generators?


According to the experts, nope.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Swrock said:


> ..........Do yall think an EMP would disable these generators?


The definitive answer is.... 100% maybe.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Why take a chance? Build yourself a Faraday Cage for the spare. If it's 2000W, it can't be all that big. Would it fit in a garbage can by itself?
Dr. A Bradley PhD, sells an EMP resistnt cloth at http://disasterpreparer.com/?product=emp-cloth
I find his videos and books somewhat credible, but maybe expensive.


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## Elvis (Jun 22, 2018)

If there is no power cord plugged in it may survive, or maybe not, it depends on how strong and what wavelengths the pulse is.

Adding plugging in a cord acts like an antenna drawing in more of the pulse.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

In short, anything with an IC chip has the potential to be fried with ~50kV per meter, or 6.6MW per meter.

For those recommending a Faraday cage, you need to be SUPER specific. A room lined with chicken wire will NOT stop an E1 pulse.
Any container designed to protect against the E1 will need to be fully conductive on the outer shell with no gaps greater than .1mm. The blanketing material mentioned above could potentially work, but I've not seen testing done with it, so I'm not willing to stake a claim on it just yet. Blocking normal radios waves is not the same as blocking the E1 pulse.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

According to everything I've read, the E1 pulse is an electromagnet pulse. Since radio waves are electromagnetic waves, 
I've never seen any discussion that there is a difference except for strength and frequency. What have you seen?


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

paraquack said:


> According to everything I've read, the E1 pulse is an electromagnet pulse. Since radio waves are electromagnetic waves,
> I've never seen any discussion that there is a difference except for strength and frequency. What have you seen?


Nuclear EMP - E1,E2,E3 - Futurescience.com


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## modfan (Feb 18, 2016)

@Kauboy Dr. Bradley lost me with this statement "Also, it has low surface conductivity, meaning that it can be grounded very easily - usually by just allowing it to drape onto the ground or concrete floor"


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

modfan said:


> @Kauboy Dr. Bradley lost me with this statement "Also, it has low surface conductivity, meaning that it can be grounded very easily - usually by just allowing it to drape onto the ground or concrete floor"


Yeah, that threw me too. So many questions started popping into my head, questioning my own understanding of what I've read about on EMP, and my understanding of electrical theory in general. Either he's wrong, or I've got more learning to do. I would not be surprised by the latter.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Kauboy said:


> Yeah, that threw me too. So many questions started popping into my head, questioning my own understanding of what I've read about on EMP, and my understanding of electrical theory in general. Either he's wrong, or I've got more learning to do. I would not be surprised by the latter.


I think what he's saying is a flexible cover (like a blanket or tarp) acting as a faraday cage will 'seal' the bottom edge as long as it's in contact with a concrete surface or the soil itself.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Back Pack Hack said:


> I think what he's saying is a flexible cover (like a blanket or tarp) acting as a faraday cage will 'seal' the bottom edge as long as it's in contact with a concrete surface or the soil itself.


And I would tend to agree with that, right up until he demonstrates this covering and you can see numerous folds in the material on the ground creating cavities large enough to put your arm through.
Perhaps this is why he states the material has a low surface conductivity. Any charge traveling along the material would not follow the surface to the underside?
I just don't know. It baffles me at the moment.


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## Chiefster23 (Feb 5, 2016)

I do know for a fact that a Honda 2000 inverter/generator will fit inside a large metal garbage can. Ya gotta do a little bending here and there, but it will fit.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Kauboy said:


> And I would tend to agree with that, right up until he demonstrates this covering and you can see numerous folds in the material on the ground creating cavities large enough to put your arm through.
> Perhaps this is why he states the material has a low surface conductivity. Any charge traveling along the material would not follow the surface to the underside?
> I just don't know. It baffles me at the moment.


Then all you need to do is set something large enough and heavy enough on the edges to flatten it out.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

I've read everything by J. Emanuelson B.S.E.E. and read Dr Bradley books and watched his videosley. Emanuelson says to use 
aluminum foil, in 3 layers with insulation between the foil layers. He even thinks a 1/2" aluminum mesh might protect solar panels. 
I've tried the same "experiments" as Dr Bradley, using aluminum foil instead of his "best bags". One layer of aluminum foil stopped 
my ham radio's electromagnetic wave from reaching my other ham radio on 462 Mhz at 4 watts of RF power at about one foot range. 
This "appears" to be better protection than the Dr's "best bags" (he sells on his website) used one inside the other, inside the 
other when tested witha FRS/GMRS radio operated at around 462 Mhz at a max of 2 watts of RF power. Obviously, since no one
seems to have actual test results with an EMP, it's all best guess by the "experts" but I'll follow Mr. Emanuelson's recommendations.

BTW, the famous cell phone test is a misunderstanding of how a cell phone works. I've sucessfully blocked the phone's signal to the
cell tower with 2 "Cheetos" bags to the point where the tower lost track of the phone and thinks the phone is OFF or out of range and 
instead of routing the call to the phone, sends the call to voice mail. I'll be happy to send you the video for those you believe the cell
phone test is real.

Don't forget to seal the garbage can with foil tape. Wish you luck.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Back Pack Hack said:


> Then all you need to do is set something large enough and heavy enough on the edges to flatten it out.


Yeah, that could solve it, but might be difficult when talking about car-sized objects. Also, he fails to mention any such additional effort.

Short of building a solid-shell room to drive a car into, I don't have a better idea than this blanket. It would just need to be done differently than the good Dr. describes.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Maybe that part got edited out. Or forgotten to be included. Or assumed the viewer would know that much. We're all human, we all makes mistakes.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

When he's promoting a product to save devices that cost thousands, such mistakes could be quite costly.


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## modfan (Feb 18, 2016)

At work, I had to build a Faraday room for testing remote controls. I realize this is a different wave length and not apples for apples. This being said, completely sealing this room was extremely difficult. It didn't require much of a hole to allow the RF to travel inside of the room. I really struggle to believe that throwing a blanket over anything would protect it.

If someone were to try to build a Faraday room. Mc Master Carr has bulk copper wire cloth in different hole sizes.

FYI, the engineers specified no grounding of the Faraday room.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Anybody know how the military gennies are prepared for this? Do the acoustic kits help at all? Seems something must have been addressed quite a while ago........

Been looking at 3kW and 5kW for a while now........

One other thought, how about a shipping container, grounded well w/doors sealed up? Lots of stuff could go in one of those........


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Anything electrically conductive, regardless of size, can be a faraday cage. It just depends on how much time and money you wanna spend on it.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Back Pack Hack said:


> Anything electrically conductive, regardless of size, can be a faraday cage. It just depends on how much time and money you wanna spend on it.


So what is a big used shipping container going for? Add some copper mesh around the doors and good to go? Put in a tractor, chainsaws, gennies, radios, batteries, 55-gal -drums of fuel/water. Could make a partition and do a root cellar, but would have to deal with venting.

Might be useful for SHTF regardless as they are pretty easy to lock up. Maybe even bury one into a hillside, put some brush around the doors......


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Mad Trapper said:


> So what is a big used shipping container going for? Add some copper mesh around the doors and good to go?.......


It's not just the doors. _Every seam _needs attention. *Any* opening or gap has the potential to make the entire setup fail to perform.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Mad Trapper said:


> So what is a big used shipping container going for? Add some copper mesh around the doors and good to go? Put in a tractor, chainsaws, gennies, radios, batteries, 55-gal -drums of fuel/water. Could make a partition and do a root cellar, but would have to deal with venting.
> 
> Might be useful for SHTF regardless as they are pretty easy to lock up. Maybe even bury one into a hillside, put some brush around the doors......


It's going a bit off topic, but you would not want to bury a shipping container without reinforcing it first. They are designed to carry a lot of weight on the corners, but not on the long panels that make up the sides and top.
Sealing one up would prove challenging if you still wanted to retain access to the interior. Hinges and seams would be problematic. Not impossible, but problematic.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

Kauboy said:


> It's going a bit off topic, but you would not want to bury a shipping container without reinforcing it first. They are designed to carry a lot of weight on the corners, but not on the long panels that make up the sides and top.
> Sealing one up would prove challenging if you still wanted to retain access to the interior. Hinges and seams would be problematic. Not impossible, but problematic.


At that scale, I think it would actually be easier and more practical to just build a cage inside a container from scratch as opposed to using a magnifying glass all around the container. On the plus side, you would have a cage the size you want and store things that aren't affected by the E waves outside of it. Like water, ammo, medical supplies etc.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

I see using 6 X 8" hardwood beams over the top with 4' of dirt on that. Doors to downhill slope. Some wire mesh on those, then closing it in with brush. I'd get the lincoln out and weld up any gaps first. Put in some vents/woodstove too. Have covers/camo for them. Maybe a manhole cover on top for quick access. If feasable a shallow well nearby with a hand pump inside, crude sink/crapper/septic going down the hill.

How does EMP do with several feet of dirt? For that matter, anybody have access to caves or old mines?


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Back Pack Hack said:


> At that scale, I think it would actually be easier and more practical to just build a cage inside a container from scratch as opposed to using a magnifying glass all around the container. On the plus side, you would have a cage the size you want and store things that aren't affected by the E waves outside of it. Like water, ammo, medical supplies etc.


Agreed. Trying to work with an old, and possibly rusted, shipping container is going to be a nightmare to seal up.


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## modfan (Feb 18, 2016)

Just a thought on shipping containers. Put a Schrader valve on it, Mig weld every hole you can find, Pressurize it with the Schrader valve, and monitor the pressure for 24 to 48hrs. If the pressure bleeds off. Go back repressurize it and listen for air hissing. Weld that spot. After SHTF and your comfortable nothing else is coming. Cut the doors open with a Sawzall. abrasive saw, or torch.

This would work with just about any size steel container.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Kauboy said:


> Agreed. Trying to work with an old, and possibly rusted, shipping container is going to be a nightmare to seal up.


Ever worked on a 1965 Dodge that has been in the northeast all it's life?

You guys, just have to seal up the border, that's easy!


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

So back to the other question, is an EMP going to go much underground? We don't have lots of old mines here but some. Make good root cellars, if you keep the critters and bats out.

People in coal country, or (silver/gold) out west should be able to find some.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

deleted double post


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## Swrock (Dec 14, 2018)

Thanks for all the info guys. I got alot more to learn.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Please stay with info from reliable sources. People with the fancy initials after their name shows, they might just know something about what they speak of. There is tons
of info on prepper websites that appear to be erroneous at best. and so much seems to be copy and pasted throughout the internet, perpetuating the BS.


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