# What would you recommend for a beginner woman?



## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

I see there have been a lot of previous threads on this subject but wanting to get some fresh ideas and perspectives. Obviously it would be a good idea for me to take some kind of self defense class but I've heard so many suggestions I don't know where to start. Would love to hear some informative and helpful responses.

I'm a woman and I've had no self defense experience of any type. I also am not into crowds, I tend to panic (not like scream when zombies are attacking panic but more of blush, stammer and can't talk panic) in groups so a one on one type of training or class would be ideal but I'm sure they probably don't have those...

Anyway what do you recommend and most importantly _why_.


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## pheniox17 (Dec 12, 2013)

Aikido..

Why?? Lazy art use their own force against them

Firearms... No brainer


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## Zed (Aug 14, 2014)

Bullet in head is the best martial art..
Other than that...Krav-maga is good..if not possible go for Filipino bladed martial arts - Kali
If even that is not possible i will recommend basic knife fighting techniques and using it on your Chicken, Turkey, Lamb, Beef for practice!! 
Google "karambit", a extremely dangerous and stealthy knife..and learn how to use it.
Unarmed combat martial arts are fantasized by Hollywood movies..They are practically useless..
But just for CQC fights with 1 on 1..Judo, Aikido is very good..It will make you physically strong and you would be able to take some physical stress...and throw someone down easily
Martial arts having punches and kicks are not very useful except boxing e.g. karate, taekwondo etc

I'm personally trained in Karate, Judo and Maharashtrian traditional fighting..//Maharashtra is a state in India. My state//




But still "Gun"-Fu is best!! :lol:


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

I take aikido-arnis right now. While it's good...I don't recommend it for beginners. A more structured traditional martial art should be used first to form a foundation or basis for more experience to build from. I know I started with Karate. After Karate I went to kick-boxing (Mui Thai), Ju-jitsu, and Krav Maga...now Aikido-Arnis. Off all of these I find myself always reverting back to the stable stances and power production of karate. What am I really saying? 

For a WOMAN starting out, I would begin with a woman's self-defense class. That will teach situational awareness, how to punch, block, and kick (at least to basic levels) which will be an effective starting point. After a foundation is started and the woman is motivated to continue with training...a good sparring art like Karate or Tae Kwon Do will give you the opportunity to spar. Sparring is crucial in martial arts as it teaches you how YOU react in a fight...where your bad habits are and how to correct them. And while I love aikido...the sparring (rondori) is too rehearsed to be effective in a "street fight" at first. Now once at black belt (Shihan) level...you're probably able to use it more comfortably. I also consider aikido a very advanced art that focus' on spiritualism and calming your mind on top of learning very advanced throws and grapples. But there is no striking taught. I consider striking a key piece of training...you're not going to win a fight by throwing a guy or tickling him. 

That's my opinion.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Firearm training.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Thanks all! Smokin that's the kind of well thought out detailed answer I've learned to expect from you. And Slippy you know I'm already working on that!


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## Arklatex (May 24, 2014)

Another suggestion for Krav Maga. It is no nonsense and very effective. I also like the suggestion of taking a woman's self defense class.


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## vtwhelen (Jan 14, 2014)

Be careful with unarmed martial arts. I trained with a girl in BJJ and she was attacked/assalted and still missing. It has been over 10 years. Firearms are best. You need to train to have a " warrior mind set" . Smashing in someones face, stabing/ shooting someone are all very unnatural to the common person. I reconmend any writing by Massad Ayoob. It was a real eye opener for me. If I were you I would learn to throw a good punch learn basic grappling/wrestling and watch some videos on biteing and fishhooking.


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

I trained several years in martial arts. My favorite was ju jitsu. Consider this. Martial arts training takes you several years. You will learn many techniques that work so well with compliant students in a controlled dojo. Things can go bad when you are under stress and tangling with a person who will not "take the fall" like training. Like what was stated above, consider a women's self defence courses. Raking your shoe down a guys shin and stomping down on the instep of his foot will get his attention. One of the easiest things you can do is always always always walk to your car with the key between your middle two fingers in a fist. If you punch that key into an eye or throat of a bad guy he will let go long enough to get away and draw your gun. Oh yeah, have a gun, train with it, and most importantly have the mind set that you will use it.


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## K2CPO (Oct 15, 2014)

Firearms are the great "equalizer."


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

I do have a firearm and I'm learning how to use but wanted some kind of defensive training until I get my conceal and carry. Even then I won't be able to carry at work so I need some basic defense training. I think the women's self defense class sounds like the right place to start.


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

FWIW...a lot of assaults happen on the way to the car at night after everyone is gone. Consider buying a stun gun, or bear spray for the trip to the car where your gun is waiting. That hsould be able to hold off/subdue the attacker long enough to reach your gun.


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## DoubleA (Nov 9, 2012)

Perhaps also consider a small REALLY bright flashlight for use at night? Something 300+ lumens. I normally carry a Fenix PD32, and I just picked up a 600 lumen Streamlight for less than $70. Most good quality tac lights also come with a strobe function which is extremely disorienting.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

DoubleA said:


> Perhaps also consider a small REALLY bright flashlight for use at night? Something 300+ lumens. I normally carry a Fenix PD32, and I just picked up a 600 lumen Streamlight for less than $70. Most good quality tac lights also come with a strobe function which is extremely disorienting.


Great idea, thank you!


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Zed said:


> Maharashtrian traditional fighting..//Maharashtra is a state in India. My state//
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ZED, I love this, this is beautiful. I watch a lot of similar videos for ideas  I'm learning something similar but using two curved blades.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

TorontoGal said:


> ZED, I love this, this is beautiful. I watch a lot of similar videos for ideas  I'm learning something similar but using two curved blades.


Beautiful but definitely not for a beginner.


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## 7515 (Aug 31, 2014)

Its 2014 for God's sake.
Why fight with your hands or sticks. Firearms training and a CWP are all you need. imho of course


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Box of frogs said:


> Its 2014 for God's sake.
> Why fight with your hands or sticks. Firearms training and a CWP are all you need. imho of course


Because of this...



Kahlan said:


> I do have a firearm and I'm learning how to use but wanted some kind of defensive training until I get my conceal and carry. Even then I won't be able to carry at work so I need some basic defense training. I think the women's self defense class sounds like the right place to start.


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## 7515 (Aug 31, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> * Even then I won't be able to carry at work so I need some basic defense training*. I think the women's self defense class sounds like the right place to start.


Are you concerned about being assaulted on the job? I am not being a smart a##. I just don't understand what your saying
I can't bring my weapon into the building at work either but i keep it in the car.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

I wouldn't rule it out. Or the walk to and from my car. Self defense seemed like one of those things you can't have too much of. I don't want to put my safety into relying only on a gun.


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## jro1 (Mar 3, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> I see there have been a lot of previous threads on this subject but wanting to get some fresh ideas and perspectives. Obviously it would be a good idea for me to take some kind of self defense class but I've heard so many suggestions I don't know where to start. Would love to hear some informative and helpful responses.
> 
> I'm a woman and I've had no self defense experience of any type. I also am not into crowds, I tend to panic (not like scream when zombies are attacking panic but more of blush, stammer and can't talk panic) in groups so a one on one type of training or class would be ideal but I'm sure they probably don't have those...
> 
> Anyway what do you recommend and most importantly _why_.


Kick to the balls, kick to the balls! You-*Bam*-will-*Crack*-Never-*Thud*-Do-*Bash*-That-*Crunch*-Again!


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## 7515 (Aug 31, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> I wouldn't rule it out. Or the walk to and from my car. Self defense seemed like one of those things you can't have too much of.* I don't want to put my safety into relying only on a gun.*


I can agree with layers of protection and I agree having some sort of back up is a good plan.
I am not sure about hand to hand combat for women though. Don't take this the wrong way, but you look pretty small in your avatar, I am guessing you are not much more than 110# that is a huge weight disadvantage to give up to an average sized man at 190#


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## Sockpuppet (Sep 6, 2014)

I would recommend that you first introduce yourself to the NRA Refuse To Be A Victim Program. The first tactic to self defense, is to mitigate your vulnerabilities.






Topics covered: 

Home Security
Personal Security
Automobile Security
Workplace Security
Technological Security


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

<Kick to the balls, kick to the balls! You-Bam-will-Crack-Never-Thud-Do-Bash-That-Crunch-Again!>>

Actually, women are taught a multi-strike complete take down. Kicking in the balls is very dangerous and already planned for.
Once they fight, if they lose, males....but, yes, any soldier or instructor will say "a kick in the balls might kill you?"

I believe the better ones for females are throat, arm break, thigh break, knee crush combos so that they have a chance to get loose and get away.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Box of frogs said:


> I can agree with layers of protection and I agree having some sort of back up is a good plan.
> I am not sure about hand to hand combat for women though. Don't take this the wrong way, but you look pretty small in your avatar, I am guessing you are not much more than 110# that is a huge weight disadvantage to give up to an average sized man at 190#


No offense taken. The truth is the truth. Women are built differently than men.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

oddapple said:


> <Kick to the balls, kick to the balls! You-Bam-will-Crack-Never-Thud-Do-Bash-That-Crunch-Again!>>
> 
> Actually, women are taught a multi-strike complete take down. Kicking in the balls is very dangerous and already planned for.
> Once they fight, if they lose, males....but, yes, any soldier or instructor will say "a kick in the balls might kill you?"
> ...


This is why I need a class.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Sockpuppet said:


> I would recommend that you first introduce yourself to the NRA Refuse To Be A Victim Program. The first tactic to self defense, is to mitigate your vulnerabilities.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is great Sockpuppet, thank you!


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

In case that doesn't happen?

At this time, women need to know that it is Aok to kill a male attacker with and any way they can.
Don't think in terms of hitting to hurt. Think in terms of hitting every vital target as hard and as fast as you can, throat, eyes and groin are good starts. 
My brother was a nuclear cop years ago and he just pointed out "if she can kick a hole in a wall, she can break through the pubis bone" that would be directly above the equipment and done right that actually might be a one hit wonder if you can break through and kill him.
Not to kick him, but to kick through him. "In your mind" you mean that foot to come out the back.
The trachea is very vulnerable and women could kill that way too. Trachea/pubis/and kicking those knees down to the ground sounds like it has promise.

While many now are selling women great classes, one good 'ol us soldier you know is just as good as kung fu master for what you need and typically, those guys are just thrilled you asked?

Best wishes in grabbing a little more confidence. You sure can.
Also? Some guys can handle pepper spray? But those steam shooting cans of wasp spray in the eyes require medical help fast - no toughing through.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

I love the titles of some threads.... this one is the best though

"What would you recommend for a beginner woman?"

I think a good beginner woman would have a dad that owns a bar and a mom that owns a restaurant... think about it -if she was your beginner woman it would set the bar high for all other women you date... Heck you could go from girlfriend to wife upgrade pretty easy...and talk about saving money


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

The superficial peroneal nerve is in the shin just above the ankle. A kick there hurts like a mofo and makes it hard to stand. A snap kick to the knee can hyper extend it and end a fight. You can fight through a kick to the balls but not having your eyes raked. Remember what I told you about your car key. Held between your fingers in a fist its two inches of steel to gouge an eye with. Small cans of pepper spray are a good idea for you to consider too. I have been pepper sprayed and tazed. With the tazer, it's over in five seconds and I could fight again if the probes were out and you couldnt hit me again. Pepper spray is god awefull shit. I couldnt open my eyes, coughed and gagged for several minutes. The effects last about a half hour. Pulling you into an alley would be the last thing on my mind after being pepper sprayed.


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Ok the last few posts especially are great examples of why I need a class. You can tell me all day long that I need to hit a guy in his trachea and I may _know_ that's what I need to do. But like I said, beginner here. If I have never actually taken a class and practiced and prepared what are the chances of me freezing up, freaking out or panicking? In a class setting I would have the opportunity to practice and run through different scenarios. I assume anyway.

Keith I do do that with my keys. I also don't carry a purse. I'm not on my phone while walking to and from my car and I try to walk quickly with purpose and be aware of my surroundings. I'd like to think I don't look like an easy target to somebody. I still think it's a good idea to be prepared though. I guess my biggest fear are the ones who seem to get stupider and braver when they have their buddies egging them on. Little groups of 2 or 3.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Ok - do get a guy. Class or soldier buddy but do - I was only trying to offer ideas if somehow you can't. That's all.

I pray and think that if you don't gain that confidence before something happens, your mind will remember and do it for you. Girls have "cavegirl" stuff left. Instincts work for them too.


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> Ok the last few posts especially are great examples of why I need a class. You can tell me all day long that I need to hit a guy in his trachea and I may _know_ that's what I need to do. But like I said, beginner here. If I have never actually taken a class and practiced and prepared what are the chances of me freezing up, freaking out or panicking? In a class setting I would have the opportunity to practice and run through different scenarios. I assume anyway.
> 
> Keith I do do that with my keys. I also don't carry a purse. I'm not on my phone while walking to and from my car and I try to walk quickly with purpose and be aware of my surroundings. I'd like to think I don't look like an easy target to somebody. I still think it's a good idea to be prepared though. I guess my biggest fear are the ones who seem to get stupider and braver when they have their buddies egging them on. Little groups of 2 or 3.


Im a man and I still make it a point to give groups of dumbass thugs a wide birth if I can help it. I go out of my way to be the un-noticed guy.


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## Foxfire (Nov 9, 2012)

A handgun you know how to use and pepper spray (from a police supply store).
If you can't carry one you will have the other. 
Full lethal is not always the best choice. 
I believe the #1 thing you need to protect yourself is be ready to full-on, pissed off, Wolverine fight and make it show. 

Edward


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

I hate to bring back a dead thread and maybe I missed it in one of the responses but I'm having trouble finding a woman's self defense class anywhere withing 50 miles of me. When I do a search all I am finding are martial arts classes. I'd really like to start with the basic beginners self defense/awareness class. Is there a resource in a small town I could call who might know? The police station perhaps??


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## tks (Oct 22, 2014)

I've said it before on another thread but ill mention it again here. As a woman who has had to defend herself on more than one occasion from men twice my size, imo, you can't do any better than krav maga. The point of krav maga is using everything you can to survive (from your glasses, to your environment, to hand weapons, to firearms). Try looking for classes at a Jewish community center. They usually don't advertise them, you have to call and they cost slightly more if your not Jewish. The classes I take are taught by an retired idf instructor. Those women's self defense classes are a joke. I've been to a few of them over the years and it was always too many students with too few instructors. Outside of the classroom, much of the information I was given, I didn't think, was very real scenario practical. I'll admit, it may have just been who taught them sucked at their jobs but they left me feeling no better than before I went in.


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## Meangreen (Dec 6, 2012)

Another option is the cardio boxing classes that are offered in many gyms. They are not really considered self defense classes but the training and repetition are spot on for learning form and striking. Another advantage is the physical fitness gained that you really need in a fight. A CCW is great but remember to look into insurance to cover legal fees if you are forced to use it. Even in the best case scenario, it will cost you upwards of $30,000 in legal fees for your defense in a criminal/civil case. Secondary weapons like a baton, pepper spray, or tazer are a must but you must be properly trained in their use.

here is a book I highly recommend:

Amazon.com: FTW SELF DEFENSE eBook: C. R. JAHN: Books


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

tks said:


> I've said it before on another thread but ill mention it again here. As a woman who has had to defend herself on more than one occasion from men twice my size, imo, you can't do any better than krav maga. The point of krav maga is using everything you can to survive (from your glasses, to your environment, to hand weapons, to firearms). Try looking for classes at a Jewish community center. They usually don't advertise them, you have to call and they cost slightly more if your not Jewish. The classes I take are taught by an retired idf instructor. Those women's self defense classes are a joke. I've been to a few of them over the years and it was always too many students with too few instructors. Outside of the classroom, much of the information I was given, I didn't think, was very real scenario practical. I'll admit, it may have just been who taught them sucked at their jobs but they left me feeling no better than before I went in.


That is disheartening. I'll look into krav maga. Thanks Tks


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Meangreen said:


> Another option is the cardio boxing classes that are offered in many gyms. They are not really considered self defense classes but the training and repetition are spot on for learning form and striking. Another advantage is the physical fitness gained that you really need in a fight. A CCW is great but remember to look into insurance to cover legal fees if you are forced to use it. Even in the best case scenario, it will cost you upwards of $30,000 in legal fees for your defense in a criminal/civil case. Secondary weapons like a baton, pepper spray, or tazer are a must but you must be properly trained in their use.
> 
> here is a book I highly recommend:
> 
> Amazon.com: FTW SELF DEFENSE eBook: C. R. JAHN: Books


Thanks!


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

If a "womans self defense" class is not available, I would recommend starting with a standard Karate class. Don't get me wrong, Krav maga is good stuff...but as a beginner it can be an un-natural feeling to use some of their techniques. IMO karate is a well rounded versatile (and easy on the newb's) style...and usually the cheapest self defense to pay for.


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## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

The best defense is to learn to have situational awareness and avoid all confrontations.

Hand to hand fighting is for chumps. Carry a gun. If you can't (or don't want to) carry a gun, carry a blade.

I'm a male, 6', 200 pounds, have trained in at least 4 kinds of martial arts, and would run like a fluffy bunny before even thinking about getting into a fist fight. Been there, done that dear, all it takes is one lucky shot and it's game over. You can't lose a fight you're not in... period.

Studying any martial art to the point that you can use it well is not something you can do easily or quickly. It takes years of hard work and, even then, there are no guarantees. In Fact, it's all too easy to get a false sense of security that ends up getting you in more trouble. Best bet... learn to recognize danger and avoid it. Second best... have a gun and know how and when to use it. Third best.... carry a blade and slice and dice as a last option.


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## Sockpuppet (Sep 6, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> I hate to bring back a dead thread and maybe I missed it in one of the responses but I'm having trouble finding a woman's self defense class anywhere withing 50 miles of me. When I do a search all I am finding are martial arts classes. I'd really like to start with the basic beginners self defense/awareness class. Is there a resource in a small town I could call who might know? The police station perhaps??


 The General Federation of Women's Clubs.org - Home

The General Federation of Women's Clubs of South Carolina Public Issues Community Service Program

Self Defense Instruction & Equipment in & near Chester, South Carolina - YP.com

http://www.yellowpages.com/chester-sc/self-defense-classes


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## Gman303 (Jul 9, 2012)

Krav maga and firearms!!


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Sockpuppet said:


> The General Federation of Women's Clubs.org - Home
> 
> The General Federation of Women's Clubs of South Carolina Public Issues Community Service Program
> 
> ...


Sockpuppet those yellow page links only pull up karate and martial arts etc. I was originally looking for just a basic self defense course but guess I'm going to have to go the martial arts route instead. Thanks.


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## pheniox17 (Dec 12, 2013)

Kahlan...

Your looking into defending yourself, the mental picture I have of you is a light woman... So even tho self defense classes are suggested, give them a good go, they are a short term measure to give you one extra steep to those without training...

But you have to have a good think about the local demographic, and that martial arts are a popular sport, even more so with the MMA cage fighting crap...

So you have to have a good look at the clubs, you should get a free lesson to see what its like, just ask around in the club if they are cage fighters/competition or traditional...

And make your mind up, the more traditional means more time needed to be good, but your training will be one up from the cage fighters (when your training for the cage, you have protective equipment, as well as set clothing etc, there is more) 

If your seriously looking into martial arts, a traditional aikido class or jujutsu class would be the first to throw yourself into, of you enjoy it, your looking at years of investment.... If your caught in a fighting situation against any of the guys here, after the years of investment I would give you a real fighting chance

If self defense classes is the only way to go for you (these are short term classes) then if they have a Taekwondo background, (amongst others) you should learn a lot, one of the key things you have to get out of a self defense class is escape the situation*before its a situation, that includes threat assessment and using words before going toe to toe

Everyone has different opinions on defense training but when you do take that leap, it has to suit your build/body type, and you have to really enjoy the sport, as the argument x is better than y but x is great for smaller builds where y is great for larger builds... 

My extended advice, take it... Or don't, as when its needed I can't say I told you so... But if you don't enjoy it... Its simply not worth doing (and with thousands of different combinations of different styles you have the option to find what suits you)


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

pheniox17 said:


> Kahlan...
> 
> Your looking into defending yourself, the mental picture I have of you is a light woman... So even tho self defense classes are suggested, give them a good go, they are a short term measure to give you one extra steep to those without training...
> 
> ...


I'm going to be honest, I don't think martial arts of any kind is something I would enjoy. If I felt I _had_ to take the classes as my only means of protecting myself then I would. Now if I could get a one on one training or class, I would be all over that. But I don't want to do the classroom setting with a room full of students/teachers. Just a little quirk of mine... I was thinking the basic self defense course might be smaller, shorter and easier for me to manage in that kind of setting. I think I'm just going to end up having to pay somebody to teach me something one on one.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Recommend for a beginner woman.
1. Avoid stupid men no madder how much fun they seem to be
2. Get your CC learn how you use all that ninja won't help much.


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

^ what he said!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

The first is my wife preferred form of Personal defense if I am not there. The second one is my daughters. They both know how to use them effectively and quickly.
I did not mean to be a smart axx in number 2 just a reminder that often the great threat a women faces may be very close.
And stupid men are a total waste of time.


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

Yep. Learn to use a hand gun and NEVER put yourself in a place where you are not in control. I have two daughters. I bought both of them a hand gun and taught them how to use them when they moved out on thier own.


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## thepeartree (Aug 25, 2014)

I don't know what to say. I agree with the rest of the guys. On the other hand, lessons you won't take to are worthless. Maybe the only way in the door is to suggest Tai Chi. Most times you can find a class which is not being taught as a martial art. The difference is speed and purpose. Tai Chi as exercise is far slower and non-violent. However, you will be learning much of the same moves. What it might do for you is condition your reflexes and it certainly provides mind calming, which is a big plus in any bad situation. More people have been killed essentially by panic than bullets. 

THEN you should have your cc permit


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

Fist of all, being a woman has not a damn thing to do with what you should choose for your self defense training. Period. No excuses.

These are the concepts to consider when selecting a self defense system.
1. What is proven effective every time in every situation. 
2. What plays to your own personal strengths and weaknesses
3. What is available to you.

Considering these things, I would advise only 2 defense systems, Krav Maga and Systema. They are nearly identical, time and combat proven effective. They operate on the basic concept that in a fight you WILL lose your fine motor function (ie. the ability to execute grips, locks, etc.) and concentrates on large muscle group movements. 

One other reason I advise against other "traditional" martial arts is the structure. Fights aren't structured. No one says "GO," no one says "Stop," there are no points, no off limits striking zones, but all these things are in traditional martial arts. Krav Maga and Systema both ENCOURAGE striking "soft points" (groin, eyes, etc.) They teach incapacitating your enemy(s) as fast as possible with no flair and no bullshit. 

Best of all for you, they both offer small group and one on one instruction.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

What ever method of defense you decide on, you need to practice it. If you don't practice, you won't be able to respond without thinking about what you must do. If you have to think about it, you loose. Response must be automatic, whether is is a firearm, martial art, kick to the groin, etc. 
The last time I took my wife out shooting, I tried something new. After about ten minutes I put up a new "bad guy" full size target on the trolley and sent it out to 30 feet. I pressed the recall button so it came rolling in about the speed of a fast walk. Told her, "Quick, he's attacking you, shoot him." Even though she is an excellent shot, not one hole in the target out of a dozen rounds. Half an hour later she was reacting the way you should, no panic. I plan on doing this exercise every time we go out without warning her about the attack. 

Another major thing is situational awareness. Learn to pay attention to what's going on around you. Who's nearby, etc. I see so many people (men and women) blithely walking along, talking/texting on their phone while totally oblivious to who's right behind them, right in front of them, etc. Remember the video of the woman waling into the fountain pond at the mall.


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## turbo6 (Jun 27, 2014)

Two words: Multiple assailants. 

Get firearm training. 

Take some basic self defense classes geared for women. Learn about using back up weapons, knives pepper spray etc 

Maybe, just maybe, if she's interested enough learning a martial art wouldn't hurt.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Ka: These folks are all giving you some very good ideas. One I haven't seen mentioned is a collapsible baton ASP P 12 Compact Clip On Expandable Baton at Galls . At just under 6" collapsed, with the proper training it would give you a very unobtrusive defensive weapon that even small stature folks can give a good account of themselves. Don't just buy the baton. Take the class and check if in your state it falls under the CCW statute. In VA some do


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

SARGE7402 said:


> Ka: These folks are all giving you some very good ideas. One I haven't seen mentioned is a collapsible baton ASP P 12 Compact Clip On Expandable Baton at Galls . At just under 6" collapsed, with the proper training it would give you a very unobtrusive defensive weapon that even small stature folks can give a good account of themselves. Don't just buy the baton. Take the class and check if in your state it falls under the CCW statute. In VA some do


In another life I was the defensive tactics instructor for a police department. The asp baton was one of the best tools I worked with short of lethal force. I used it many times in the field. If you can get a strike across the calf muscle its over. You will not be able to stand after that hit.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

keith9365 said:


> In another life I was the defensive tactics instructor for a police department. The asp baton was one of the best tools I worked with short of lethal force. I used it many times in the field. If you can get a strike across the calf muscle its over. You will not be able to stand after that hit.


Except for really big guys, and people who are intoxicated, determined, experiencing an adrenaline rush, fighters, etc. 
My point here is that you cannot rely on any one thing to defend yourself. One good hit may take down one person, but not others. One well placed shot can take someone out, but it may take many to take out others. Whatever the situation, NEVER stop attacking until you are POSITIVE you are out of danger.


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## keith9365 (Apr 23, 2014)

Jakthesoldier said:


> Except for really big guys, and people who are intoxicated, determined, experiencing an adrenaline rush, fighters, etc.
> My point here is that you cannot rely on any one thing to defend yourself. One good hit may take down one person, but not others. One well placed shot can take someone out, but it may take many to take out others. Whatever the situation, NEVER stop attacking until you are POSITIVE you are out of danger.


True. But I could use that baton like Zoro!


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 25, 2014)

If you are a beginner with firearms, and looking for a defensive firearm, avoid the whiz-bang guns. All those levers and safeties and cocking things are just going to cause you confusion in a situation.

Go with a simple revolver. It's the same thing I recommend to any newbie; man, woman, or child. Don't get a Glock or a 1911 like the homies. Just get a solid S&W or maybe a Taurus. 2-4" barrel (whatever is on sale-new or used) I advocate revolvers for beginners because of their simplicity. Six shots for sure, no llevers, no stuff to screw with and above all---a very long trigger pull, reducing accidental discharges. Glocks are half cocked when they are in your holster, not a gun for amateurs. The 1911 is fully cocked, and has shot off more than it's share of fingers, toes, and kneecaps. 

A revolver is not sexy by modern standards, but guns aint for showing. A 38 with bobbed hammer and magsafe defenders will serve you well while you advance up to more technical weapons. If you get a 357, you can carry either the mighty 357 magnum or the easier-shooting 38spcl. 

Look for a good 22 as well, for training. You can do a lotta inexpensive learning with a 22. Some places rent guns so you can try a few before buying.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 25, 2014)

Many people will tell you that a 38spcl is a poor defensive choice (myself included) but the round can be serioously boosted with the use of frangible rounds. Magsafe and Glaser both make excellent safety ammo that performs so well that Sanow & Marshall actually gave it it's own performance category in their awesome book 'Handgun stopping power'. They create this meaty hole about the size of a fist. In the strausberg tests they performed as well as the best hollowpoints, but in half the time.

So although these frangibles are all loaded to +P+ pressures, they are shooting a fairly light projectile. In the 38spcl the bullet is roughly half the weight of a normal 38 cal projectile, so the felt recoil is actually less than a normal target round (but the blast is terrific in the dark.) 

So Magsafe and Glaser will turn a 38spcl into a 357 without all the felt recoil. Also, these bullets are safer in apartments and houses because the projectiles begin breaking up as soon as they strike the drywall. If you get hit by an overpenetration it will likely be small fragments, not a whole projectile. These rounds are pricey, but then so is your ass.


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## Will2 (Mar 20, 2013)

Anyone is a potential threat.

What is in your area?
Campus clubs, close to where you live etc...

I chose krav maga but I don't depend on it alone, it is supplemental.


Don't limit your options.


I am a pretty big guy this doesn't mean small people arnt threats.

All the sexism and size stuff is used to victimize big people in court. Everyone is a threat.

Jiujitsu/ninjitsu is recommended if it is locally available.


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

Zed said:


> Bullet in head is the best martial art..
> Other than that...Krav-maga is good..if not possible go for Filipino bladed martial arts - Kali
> If even that is not possible i will recommend basic knife fighting techniques and using it on your Chicken, Turkey, Lamb, Beef for practice!!
> Google "karambit", a extremely dangerous and stealthy knife..and learn how to use it.
> ...


I will agree Aikido is good for learning how to approach multiple attackers but whatever was in the video you posted is pretty weak. I saw a bunch of drum majorettes twirling a baton. I could easily see when they had to reset and would attack then. Not sure what the guy with the "yo-yo" spear was doing but I could take in within a minute. Those things on the video look impressive when they are in kata but have zero practical use. At best they might get lucky and catch someone upside the head. Most likely they would be taken down and taken out in combat.


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## TacticalCanuck (Aug 5, 2014)

Neat vid. But I see myself being one with Indiana Jones if I saw that....


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## MisterMills357 (Apr 15, 2015)

*What would you recommend for a beginner woman?*



Kahlan said:


> I see there have been a lot of previous threads on this subject but wanting to get some fresh ideas and perspectives. Obviously it would be a good idea for me to take some kind of self defense class but I've heard so many suggestions I don't know where to start. Would love to hear some informative and helpful responses.
> 
> I'm a woman and I've had no self defense experience of any type. I also am not into crowds, I tend to panic (not like scream when zombies are attacking panic but more of blush, stammer and can't talk panic) in groups so a one on one type of training or class would be ideal but I'm sure they probably don't have those...
> 
> Anyway what do you recommend and most importantly _why_.


I don't recommend any hand-to-hand--Tae Kwon Do, Judo, etc. I have taken some Tae Kwon Do and wrestling, and they are effective, but too slow.
You won't be able to take on multiple attackers, without a weapon. Take classes on armed combat, learn to use gun and knife and stick. 
You can carry a stick, just about anywhere, and it can make a deadly weapon. And if you want to train in a school, look at Kendo, Japanese stick fighting.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

my advise- other than a simple form of self defense and a firearm that you are comfortable with is........
get some running shoes and practice long distance running cause if you don't shoot the SOB and just kick him in the nutz he will want revenge 
KON-FUSIA SAY man with baggy pants have trouble running.
other than that learn situation and environmental awareness


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

another thing learn what every day things you carry now can be used as an improvised weapon- eye pencil, hair spray, keys(or get one of those black cat thingy's) even your lipstick.
if you are seeking a professional school to teach you self defense tell them exactly what you want and why you want it ,one art most peeps do not look at is escrima most instructors in this will customize a plan and technique for you specifically.


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## slewfoot (Nov 6, 2013)

Their are people out there that offer one on one training in about anything you want to train in, It's just a matter of cost. I know a martial arts expert that has his own business of training in groups but also does individuals as well. Try calling around and see what you find.


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## just mike (Jun 25, 2014)

My daughter started taking Karate when she was 11 and took classes for 3 years. The big thing I wanted her to learn is how to slip a punch or block and turn a punch. After she got that down pat then I taught her how to fight dirty--if your not in a ring with a ref there are NO rules.You have to have the right mindset-I will not be defeated!!!! When she turned 21 she got her first 9mm, when she started working night at the hospital I bought her a nice little derringer for her front pocket for those nighttime walks to her vehicle..

Take some basic classes but remember that situational awareness is something you have to cultivate within yourself, too many people just go around with their head in the clouds and do not pay attention to their surroundings.


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Is Kahlan still around?


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## James m (Mar 11, 2014)

Nope. Last I heard she got a gun, then a little dog.


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

I initially suggest an experienced man as she was an inexperienced woman..... maybe she did that!


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## triem (Jun 18, 2015)

first, secure at least $5000 and 200 hours of your time over the next year. Don't bother with classes of more than 4 students at a time, cause all you'll learn will be bad habits. Such small classes are going to cost you $20 per hour, if they instructor is any good, and it takes time for your body to grow into the demands that martial arts will place upon it. YOu have to give it 3-4 hours per week, ideally split as 2 days of training, a day off, then 2 more days of training then the weekend, during which your body will recover. You'll need to add more protein and creatine to your diet, and probably other supplements, too, like vitamin D, B complex. To be of any real value, especially if you are petite, this stuff has to be VERY strenuous, right up to the point of being brutal. Read THE FOUR HOUR BODY, by Tim Ferris


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

triem said:


> first, secure at least $5000 and 200 hours of your time over the next year. Don't bother with classes of more than 4 students at a time, cause all you'll learn will be bad habits. Such small classes are going to cost you $20 per hour, if they instructor is any good, and it takes time for your body to grow into the demands that martial arts will place upon it. YOu have to give it 3-4 hours per week, ideally split as 2 days of training, a day off, then 2 more days of training then the weekend, during which your body will recover. You'll need to add more protein and creatine to your diet, and probably other supplements, too, like vitamin D, B complex. To be of any real value, especially if you are petite, this stuff has to be VERY strenuous, right up to the point of being brutal. Read THE FOUR HOUR BODY, by Tim Ferris


Grow upon a farm. Fight animals and villians with your own hands. Fight with your friends, kindly, doing sports in the back yard. The farm and the sports will keep you in shape. Do 2000 bales by hand when it is 90 oF, the women I worked with would kick most city boys butts. You will also lean hunting, fishing, and trapping.

And it won't cost you a cent. A good farmer will kick most peoples ass, and they scare the hell out of city people. And they eat well without ANY suppilments, DON'T EAT CRAP! Eat real food.

Besides that, they shoot pistoles, shotguns, and rifles VERY well.

Have been instructed by several masters, the best taught me Jeet and several other styles. I was stronger than most but much inexperienced. It is not how big/strong, but your skill.


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## triem (Jun 18, 2015)

BS Bs, and more BS. Most of my family are farmers, in ILL and none of them knows jack about hand to hand, or pistols, and very little about longarms. The lady aint askiing how to waste 20 years of her life. She's asking how to fix a weakness, right now. it takes TREMENDOUS levels of skill and speed to overcome the handicap of being petite and female. i suggest that you ccw a pistol, in addition to your hand to hand training.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

triem said:


> BS Bs, and more BS. Most of my family are farmers, in ILL and none of them knows jack about hand to hand, or pistols, and very little about longarms. The lady aint askiing how to waste 20 years of her life. She's asking how to fix a weakness, right now. it takes TREMENDOUS levels of skill and speed to overcome the handicap of being petite and female. i suggest that you ccw a pistol, in addition to your hand to hand training.


I am sorry your family did not teach you well. Mine did. I guess the ILL people don't have much use for guns, besides the THUGGS in CHICAGO, ask Barry Sotero, you elected him.

Besides what else I have learned was mechanics, welding, forging, timberframing, arborculture, horticulture.........went to school and got a BS MS and pH D. I still like the farm best. Who fixes your farm equipment? I still do my own work.

So to you I will say start with a BB gun/air rifle, then a 22 LR. I got my 22 at 6. Then a shotgun then high powered rifles, before I left junior high school.

My grandmother and mother hunted and trapped and could shoot as well as "Granny Clampett". Want to eat some possum , or crow?


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

First, realize that you cannot defeat a 180 plus lb man, not to mention one bent on the attack.
Take defense courses. Get whatever training you can.
Get a gun that you can use correctly and PRACTICE!
Be aware, always.


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## triem (Jun 18, 2015)

i"d bet a year's pay that grandpappy couldn't shoot worth a hoot and quite a bit that you can't, either, except perhaps from benchrest. I deal in SPEED, and it takes godawful amount of work to be fast and hit. 20-30x as much as it takes to be slow and hit.

For instance, can you toss up a couple of soda cans with your non firing hand, rifle butt on hip, a fighting rifle now, finger out of the guard and safety engaged, and hit both cans in midair? Can you do the same with the pistol, with the pistol concealed and your hand on it?  any little kid can hit, slowfire. that's nothing.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

triem said:


> i"d bet a year's pay that grandpappy couldn't shoot worth a hoot and quite a bit that you can't, either, except perhaps from benchrest. I deal in SPEED, and it takes godawful amount of work to be fast and hit. 20-30x as much as it takes to be slow and hit.
> 
> For instance, can you toss up a couple of soda cans with your non firing hand, rifle butt on hip, a fighting rifle now, finger out of the guard and safety engaged, and hit both cans in midair? Can you do the same with the pistol, with the pistol concealed and your hand on it?  any little kid can hit, slowfire. that's nothing.


What you talk of, is like you, Annie Oakley.

Well I've deered at 100 yds offhand with a 12 ga shotgun unrifled many times. I have jumped many more closer, and shot faster than you imagine, based on your infantile response, you would die in the woods.

That was young shotgun years. Rifle? Many off hand and hunting. Wood chucks , coyotes, squirrels, bear, deer, ........

What you talk of is much more BS, than me.

AS far as speed, M1A I will do an inch off a rest, 2-3 offhand 100 yds , the whole magazine. And I hunt wood chucks with a M29, they flip at 75yds.

So shoot fast and miss, I don't


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## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

boys put your guns away! The lady asking the question cannot carry concealed - she lives in Canada. There are some specific classes that teach hard core women's self defense for attacks that are common to women. She is not asking how to defend herself from a gang of bad guys. So quit comparing the length and girth of your sticks and provide answers or stay quiet.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

there are equalizers such as brass knuckles or a roll of nickels and there are companies out there such as the one that makes that black cat key chain thing for punching that do make defensive devices such as a monkey fist(get a little training with it before you use this thing) there are alternatives besides fighting like recognizing intent , body language ect. and knowing when to run. 
I am sorry there is no definite answer for a solution to your specific question.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Mad Trapper said:


> What you talk of, is like you, Annie Oakley.
> 
> Well I've deered at 100 yds offhand with a 12 ga shotgun unrifled many times. I have jumped many more closer, and shot faster than you imagine, based on your infantile response, you would die in the woods.
> 
> ...


I Forgot, FAST SHOT, how are you on Woodcock, and Grouse? Ducks, Geese? Rabbits in deep snow and cover?

Think 20-30 shots will help? With those or a criminal. 1st shot counts

P.S. sorry for being angry, IT was starting to iritate me too.

Thank you mods:stick:


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## Ashton (Aug 6, 2016)

I would recommend woman's self-defense classes or Krav Maga. One that I wouldn't recommend for sure is judo, especially if you are tiny (in judo it is possible to use the strenght of an opponent but to some extend). 

I was having Krav Maga lessons and there were some women in the group - I can say most of them was really satisfied with the results. 

My younger sister was attending women's self-defense classes in her university and he managed to protect herself when somebody attacked her in the park at night - her height is only 155cm


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

time to say it again first priority. Stay away for worthless men. The rest comes easy.


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## bgreed (Feb 26, 2014)

Here's my take. Firearms training is a must, but it has to be realistic training not just can you put your shots into a pretty little group.

As far as empty hand Russian Systema it is a survival art developed over a thousand years of personal combat. It is what is taught to special units of Spetznaz and KGB. No dances to learn no stiff stances.

Now this comes from someone who has nearly thirty years experience in the martial arts with advanced black belts in Okinawan Shorin Ryu and Aikido.

Neither of which teach you how to breathe, stay relaxed, have good posture and move freely or how to take a strike recover and continue to fight.






You can check out YouTube videos by Vladimir Vasiliev, Martin Wheeler, The Zettler twins to name a few.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


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## Targetshooter (Dec 4, 2015)

Slippy said:


> Firearm training.


This is the best advice you can have . "one shot = one kill " .


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## Kevin (Oct 11, 2016)

This is a really old post, but I thought it would be important to leave my input as no one else mentioned Wing Chun. Wing Chun is all about efficiency and simplicity. It is prefect for a women's self defense style because it doesn't rely on momentum strikes like many forms do.

These guys ham it up a lot, but don't let that fool you. Wing chun done right is very effective. 





It can be used very effectively for self-defense for women and men.





Situational awareness, preventative measures, and firearms training are all absolutely necessary as well, but anybody who tells you hand to hand is useless has never got the drop on themselves before.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk


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## Economic Survivalist (Dec 21, 2016)

Kahlan said:


> I see there have been a lot of previous threads on this subject but wanting to get some fresh ideas and perspectives. Obviously it would be a good idea for me to take some kind of self defense class but I've heard so many suggestions I don't know where to start. Would love to hear some informative and helpful responses.
> 
> I'm a woman and I've had no self defense experience of any type. I also am not into crowds, I tend to panic (not like scream when zombies are attacking panic but more of blush, stammer and can't talk panic) in groups so a one on one type of training or class would be ideal but I'm sure they probably don't have those...
> 
> Anyway what do you recommend and most importantly _why_.


Have you heard of Damsel in Defense? My wife is a realtor and she has bought several products from this company. A tazer and a cu-baton. I am a frearm guy but I am also a responsible owner and would never recommend a firearm unless you have the proper training and understand the laws in your state. The tazer is great because it doubles as a flashlight for when she is showing houses. The cu-baton is her favorite cause it is very simple and little training is required but very effective. Its a piece of steal around 4" long that you can attach to your keys. Its formed to fit your hand and comes to a blunt point. 
If you want to learn more about fireams I would suggest specialty courses geared towards women. My local shooting range puts on classes called guns and laces and it is taught by women.


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## 7515 (Aug 31, 2014)

Kahlan was a lot of fun. I wish she'd come back


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

Front sight focus, trigger squeeze


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## AnotherSOFSurvivor (Sep 7, 2016)

Holy Necroposts!

sent from a paper cup and string via quantum wierdness


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## jdbushcraft (Mar 26, 2015)

How new are you at being a woman? 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Grinch2 (Sep 12, 2016)

Hi Kahlan, my fiance is a very petite woman she's 5'1 and maybe 80lbs, now granted she has a temper on her that is something fierce, she went to a community orientated self defense class, she really liked it. Now granted you're not going to be getting the hands on you might be seeking, she also saw our local sheriff who got her involved in a police style self defense course. I think if you ask enough they'll be willing to help out, glad to read you're getting involved more into the firearms aspect of self defense. But what I thought was nice with the police classes she took was there were actual police officers showing techniques and it did not just cover hand to hand, it showed some knife work and basic awareness. They demonstrated how to use pepper spray and even a rolled up magazine. 

My fiance works at a hospital so she is not even allowed to carry a firearm in her vehicle, now in my mind a firearm is best but not always plausible for people, maybe if work somewhere where you can keep one in your vehicle you should focus on how to properly equip yourself to get to your vehicle. But I would ask a few local L.E.O's they seemed to help my fiance out a lot and were more than happy to help, plus the training she got was free ( they do ask for a donation ) but I mean for the donation price her and I both agree it is worth it. What I especially cared for was they focused on not always being the biggest/strongest person in the fight and defending yourself with " set-backs ".


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Stick with what I said back when this thread started. Avoid stupid men. The rest of it you can work around.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

For a starter women - pretty much anything but a red head < answering the OP


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Hey now red headed folks are nice.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Did I ever tell ya guys about Kandice?


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

Go visit self defense / martial arts classes near you . Ask to watch and talk with some other students. You get a good feeling about instructors and other students , fits your budget and schedule , close enough to work and where you live. Give it a try for 6 months to a year or as long as you like it then figure out if you want to try anther style . I know guys who studied several as they took what they could where they could as they were stationed on various US army bases around the world . 

My wife studied tae kwon-do while in South Korea , 2 years, and again much later in Panama for 3 years . The level of instruction was considered to be better in Korea, lifelong student / instructor whose full time job was teaching for 30 plus years. But she had more fun and learned more in Panama from a part time instructor who only had 3 years experience teaching. A large part of that was her fellow students. 

I was able to join her for the class in Panama for about a year. While the rest of the class worked on pretty forms I usually spent most of my time sparring. We had some protective gear and I really was not aware of how hard we were going at it till we took out a wall. We were all big, in shape and young.

The key is to practice and keep practicing regardless of style . The blocks you need to do without thinking and you can only do that through lots of practice. It is very good exercise and in the right group has social and prepping benefits.


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Do you realize this thread is over 1 year old?
The op is long gone.


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

More like 2


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Urinal Cake said:


> Do you realize this thread is over 1 year old?
> The op is long gone.


I am not gone lol. I just lurk more now. And as far as the original post I just went with firearm and awareness.


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Kahlan said:


> I am not gone lol. I just lurk more now. And as far as the original post I just went with firearm and awareness.


Welcome back, stay a while


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Kahlan said:


> I am not gone lol. I just lurk more now. And as far as the original post I just went with firearm and awareness.


Well well well...
And I thought you were a hit and run girl!
I hope you've learned a greater command of prepping as opposed to your OP 

Is this you?


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

I'm assuming TG = Toronto Gal? If so it's good to see you back. I come and go. And in my defense Urinal Cake I honestly didn't mean the double entendre in my original post's title...


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## Kahlan (Sep 16, 2014)

Urinal Cake said:


> Well well well...
> And I thought you were a hit and run girl!
> I hope you've learned a greater command of prepping as opposed to your OP
> 
> ...


Of course. I'm an old pro by now!


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Kahlan said:


> I'm assuming TG = Toronto Gal? If so it's good to see you back. I come and go. And in my defense Urinal Cake I honestly didn't mean the double entendre in my original post's title...


I'm sure, but I couldn't resist messin' with you...

I'm assuming TG = Toronto Gal? Never mention this again! KGB is everywhere! 







We buried Toronto Girl Deep, Deep, Deep undercover!


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Перестань :vs_laugh:


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Действительно ли Вы готовы подчиниться?

I sure hope this translates correctly....


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## Urinal Cake (Oct 19, 2013)

Kahlan said:


> Of course. I'm an old pro by now!


Good, what do you recommend for an beginner man?


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## ecotecenergy (Jun 9, 2017)

fgedrf


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