# Bugging Out, is it realistic?



## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Okay, this is a long one, and has probably already been hashed out before. But I’m here less than a year, and others have joined after me. You guys with thousands of posts can skip over, or contribute if you care to. Thanks.

After studying this board for the past 7 months, and having more detailed private conversations with some of the members, I believe I’ve found a flaw (sic) in the ointment of Bugging Out. For this post, assume there is a national emergency such as civil disturbance, EMP attack, virulent epidemic, etc in play.

Some members believe they can bug out to remote locations by driving. Some expect to drive some 10’s of miles, some even 100’s of miles. They believe they must travel to their BOL to be safer, or are ready to do so if they are forced to by circumstances. But in my experience, the first thing that happens in reaction to such an emergency is that the authorities forbid all non-essential travel. Unless you are a doctor, nurse, police officer, utility worker, etc you will be non-essential. One can assume that in a dire national emergency, the police, army and/or National Guard will have traffic check points on all major highways and intersections.

Some members have very capable 4-wheel drive BOVs, but even they cannot travel that far off-road. Nor can young children, or many grown men for that matter, expect to walk that far through farmer’s fields or whatever, if their vehicles are stopped by the authorities.

Yes, yes, some plan to bug out BEFORE the SHTF. And that’s the best that could happen. But some emergencies are not predictable. And people, being how they are, will delay departure hoping that the situation will turn around, and be caught by the S Hitting TF.

I’m lucky. I have relatives who live close by who will shelter me. I realize not everyone does. But bugging out long-distance doesn’t seem to be viable. To members who have BOVs and a BOL, am I missing something?


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## AquaHull (Jun 10, 2012)

sideKahr said:


> Okay, this is a long one, and has probably already been hashed out before. But I'm here less than a year, and others have joined after me. You guys with thousands of posts can skip over, or contribute if you care to. Thanks.
> 
> After studying this board for the past 7 months, and having more detailed private conversations with some of the members, I believe I've found a flaw (sic) in the ointment of Bugging Out. For this post, assume there is a national emergency such as civil disturbance, EMP attack, virulent epidemic, etc in play.
> 
> ...


I'm not going anywhere nor is there anywhere for me to go


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Do to health, walking anywhere isn't going to happen if it's more than 10-15 miles. I do not have a BOL of my own but a friend says I would be too valuable to let disappear. Driving would be the only way to bug out for me. That leaves too options. Watch for trigger points that would tell it's time to get out of Dodge before the masses figure it out. OR bog in until things seem to settle down enough to allow an orderly retreat. My basic plan is to bug in.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Me and some others are just to old and ornery to BO. We have put our lives into building a home, property, relationships with neighbors etc, to survive. The idea of trying to live on the road in a strange area is about the dumbest plan I've heard. Sure I understand some have no choice for whatever reason and that's to bad. I'll die on top of a pile of brass at home.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

I would say no, you got it right. If you are located near a major population center and it is raining Pooh, your chances are slim and none of getting away from it. To try and put this into a bit of perspective, the last time I did a red eye into NYC, the planned pickup of passengers was in Midtown at 9:00pm on a Saturday night. I was 7 miles away. It took almost 3 hours. More reality, very few people in the big cities own cars, cost too much to park it, too time consuming just to go to the store get gas and run a few errands. bicycle or Taxi if raining/snowing too hot/cold. Depending upon the event, my best bet, living on the edge of a forested township is to shelter in place where all my stuff is located. Leaving would be a last resort, an absolute no other option except a certain death if I stayed. As soon as you get out of your dwelling, you are now a target of opportunity in desparate times. Those who can afford a BOL, you still may get picked off in an ambush trying to relocate.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

well you say your lucky cause you got relatives close by that can shelter you -they might for a couple weeks and who says they have to at all? I know they are family they wouldn't do that.

the thing is those of us that have a place to go is just that it is ours. most have extensive back up to our back up to our back up we have plan a all the way to zz just to get there, for the most pat it would have to be really crappy I mean just about everything's gone completely to keep some of us from getting there.
also some plan on bugging in. They are not going anywhere , they have chosen were they live carefully and made sacrifices(or not) or maybe they actually like the country/farm life it makes no difference they are already there.


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## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

Yeah, bugging out wouldn't be easy in situations like that.

In a scenario involving a mass exodus from major population centers, I would expect all bridges, tunnels, and other choke points to be blocked and guarded. No small town could afford to let itself be overwhelmed by refugees, and you can almost guarantee that they would take measures to protect themselves from mobs of displaced outsiders.

It has been reported that all of the bridges and tunnels out of NYC were blocked within 30 minutes of the 9/11 attack.

The area I live in can't support the number of people living here, at least not long term. We have too many people and not enough farmland. And yes, it's really just that simple.

My plan is to hunker down for a few months and gather my forces, then strike out once my supplies are nearing depletion. This will allow things to settle down some and a larger group will be able to cope with any small bands of marauders.

As far as bugging out and "living off the land" forever... well, see this thread for my views on that: The Bushcrafter Fantasy


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## trips-man (Apr 26, 2015)

sideKahr said:


> Okay, this is a long one, and has probably already been hashed out before. But I'm here less than a year, and others have joined after me. You guys with thousands of posts can skip over, or contribute if you care to. Thanks.
> 
> After studying this board for the past 7 months, and having more detailed private conversations with some of the members, I believe I've found a flaw (sic) in the ointment of Bugging Out. For this post, assume there is a national emergency such as civil disturbance, EMP attack, virulent epidemic, etc in play.
> 
> ...


I've got family on the same street and I'm on top of a big ass hill. I also know my home, but outside of that would be unknown if SHTF. I would most likely stay.


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## PCH5150 (Jun 15, 2015)

My wife and I have family on the same street. Not far from suburban area at all, but they have about 40 acres with multiple family homes on it and horses and a good sized stream running through it. This will be the retreat for all of us in a SHTF situation. All of us have multiple firearms and in the family group we have experienced hunters, a doctor, two nurses, a few that are mechanically inclined, and a military veteran (myself). There are 6 horses on the property and of course dogs. Not a perfect set up (close to a city) but better than I could afford to set up on my own.


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## Seneca (Nov 16, 2012)

For me bugging out is a plan B or C or perhaps a plan D, it is way down the list in the scheme of things. 

I keep an open mind about prepping. And if for no other reason than to keep my perspective rounded out and balanced, bugging out gets it's due consideration. While I'd prefer not to become a well equipped refugee, I miss the mark by saying it couldn't happen.


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## whoppo (Nov 9, 2012)

We have a few little acres of land scattered around New England... While they all offer reasonable resources should we choose to bug out to any of them, we have them primarily as nice places to go with the motorhome for short get-aways. We're pondering which is our favorite, with plans of building a sustainable retirement place. The only reason I could see for pulling up stakes and heading to one of these locations before retirement would be to escape some kind of natural disaster that would render our current home uninhabitable. Should the area be overrun by zombies, werewolves or liberals, we're better off sandbagging and defending the homestead.... I think.


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## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

The idea of waiting until your stores run low is not a good idea. The longer you wait after an event occurs the less freedom you will have to travel. The longer you wait the more organized any counter culture will be. Small towns and those who own large plots of land will have already been exposed to raiders, moochers and desperate people. They will have established the necessary people needed to make the community work and none of them will be happy to see more strangers.

If you have no place to go then you are likely to be listed as part of the statistics - not fair, not good but that is the sad reality. If you are living at your BOL and you are set up with renewable food and water then you have your work ahead. Growing your food, protecting your resources and family will be two full time jobs but you have a better chance at living through it than most. If you live in an agro/ranching community where there are large numbers of farms and no urban population to speak of then you are very well off as long as you can help your neighbors and they all get along. If factions start to form - even in an agro community then trouble will be as bad as it is in the city.

If you are near a large population then you must have a place to go where you can be self sufficient. If that place is not already set up then you will need a years supply of food (at least) to get you to your first harvest. Bugging out must be done EARLY or not at all. At the first sign of trouble get out! if it turns out to be a false alarm then you got to spend a week away from the city. If it gets worse then you don't have to fight traffic jams, road blocks, road pirates or the military to get to your BOL. If you have no place to go where you can be self sufficient then you have no good options. The best option open to you is to form or join a group that is working toward self sufficiency. You will have to fight the raiders that will take from others to survive. People are going t6o die in the cities - both good and bad - and it will be horrible. If you can live through that and remain true to yourself then you are a very special person and I wil want to meet you when things return to "normal".


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## Orang Pendek (Jun 19, 2015)

I already live at a bug out farm, but my extended family would have a difficult time getting here unless they have prior warning. Even so, there is a chance I might be forced to leave my farm and retreat even farther into the woods. I have prepared for that. Though I'm over the hill I can still carry a 50 pound pack, rifle, etc, all day long. Age isn't really a problem until you're talking about 70 or over. Even some men near 80 can out walk a lot of young men. You will not be running any five minute miles but there is no reason a 65-year-old can't carry a pack all day long. It's a matter of being in shape. Of course some can't do that at 20, because of health problems or disabilities. But baring that most 60 something men should be able to walk. Working on a farm and camping, hiking, hunting, fishing, and all the other stuff country folks do keeps you in shape. Remember, "Country folks can survive."


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## Swedishsocialist (Jan 16, 2015)

Bugging out at a SHTF moment will make you a target and a refugee. You must also assume that the Bug out location might be gone, plunderd ore inhabited by hostiles. If you depend on a car to get there, welll, not gonna happen, roads will full of cars that dont move. 

Still, trying/planning might be better then staing, depending on location and what goes down. Sometimes staing will be impossible, think forestfire as example. 

For me personally, Im in a sweet spot in many regards, and keep my mind, body and relations in shape. I will stay were I live and from that I plan. IF I have to leave for any reason, to were and how I must choose from what is at hand at that moment, hard to plan, but an open mind & healty body and a positive attitude will be helpful. Whiners will be shot.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

sideKahr said:


> But in my experience, the first thing that happens in reaction to such an emergency is that the authorities forbid all non-essential travel.


try this calculate the number of police / National Guard .. now divide the number of cross roads, back roads, sides roads, and other roads by that number and unless you are real unlucky.. chances are you can get to your location by driving of peddling if you have those options

remember early on the regular military will not be involved.. it will take some time to get them in place

they (the powers that be) will have to focus on small areas IE large cities.... there are not enough armed government folks to control all the towns and or roads


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## pheniox17 (Dec 12, 2013)

Is a bol a asset to a prepared person.... YES

Is the concept floored.... Well YES

Same as those that plan to become refugees and head to the mountains.... That's more floored

Everyone should have redundancy plans (one is none) and through forums like this have a idea on the lead up to a major event....

Yes distance affects your chances... 

But its a odds game... Everything we do is a gamble that if we stuff up... We die....


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Depending on the SHTF event, military, police, etc. may never be deployed, or should I say they may never report for duty. Remember the PD at New Orleans.


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

For some , it is, for others it is not.


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## OctopusPrime (Dec 2, 2014)

I fled the southern border already...my bug out already happened. My parents live by and I will drive to them to help them and drag my girlfriend and sister with me. I think if something happens it is a good idea to make a educated guess on what to do and don't flip flop on your plan. Plan a route and a time. Most people are lazy so like 1 am is good time to get moving imo...at that time almost no one is on the road, I know it will be different in shtf...another thing is many will stay at their homes panicking or run to the grocery store in a panic and then they will seek gov help. When they wait/panic make your move. Take the longest route possible ...others will take the shortest. That is my plan.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

you know when I was a kid my parents had to( they cold have said no) buy a sticker called a city sticker it was cheap a couple dollars or so but if a disaster happened like a tornado or something if you didn't have that sticker on your vehicle and were out side the city limits you were not getting in. the city PD and FPD had check points at every road going in and would turn you away no matter what address was on your DL.
in some ways I thought this was a good idea.


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## Lastminprepper (May 24, 2015)

My opinion, just a thought. When I grew up, we new all our neighbors and helped them if they needed help. These days, people soon run over or walk over you. Thats to bad, the ones hat have been prepping for years should be the teachers. I would try to be prepared for any situation, the gov has plenty of executive orders that say they can take your food, water, protection and your family (yes your family members, look it up). When anything happens, don't run walk. Grab everyone everyone and get out of dodge. The closer you are to a major city, the more dangerous it will be...


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## Disturbed12404 (Apr 23, 2015)

I've been asking myself the question of whether or not BO is a good idea. It'll be a dangerous journey, 450+ miles to the BOL. If warning is given I would most definitely be leaving right away, if im trapped on this side of the river I feel as though death would be most imminent. No where to BO to in Jersey, would have to dig in. Which would only be safe in the very beginning, until those from Camden, Trenton, Florence, Ocean county... get hungry and wild


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## MisterMills357 (Apr 15, 2015)

*Bugging Out is going to be an iffy thing.*

Bugging Out is going to be an iffy thing. I foresee a lot of people who will have to fight it out, right where they live. The NG, cops & medical personnel will be in the same boat, just better supplied, and with freedom to travel.
Everyone will be protecting their turf, and trespassers will be shot, so there is another problem, you can be killed for trespassing.
My thinking is that you can be killed for anything and everything, by cops or civilians. I would hunker my fat old self down, and keep my .45 in my pocket, and stay close to home.
If I even suspected that someone was about to open fire or home invade, I would shoot first.:armata_PDT_15:



sideKahr said:


> Okay, this is a long one, and has probably already been hashed out before. But I'm here less than a year, and others have joined after me. You guys with thousands of posts can skip over, or contribute if you care to. Thanks.
> 
> After studying this board for the past 7 months, and having more detailed private conversations with some of the members, I believe I've found a flaw (sic) in the ointment of Bugging Out. For this post, assume there is a national emergency such as civil disturbance, EMP attack, virulent epidemic, etc in play.
> 
> ...


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## RNprepper (Apr 5, 2014)

We have a great little off grid cabin in the mountains. That is our theoretical BOL, but in reality, getting there in a crisis could be difficult, mainly because of road blockages. If it was the right time of year for seasonal water to be available, we could attempt to pack out overland with the mules, but who is to say the BOL would be secure once we got there? The way I see it, if we are here in southern AZ when SHTF, we are prepared to stay put. If we are at the cabin, then we stay there. Both are equipped and stocked with supplies. Even at the cabin there has to be an evacuation plan in case of an emergency like a forest fire. In that case, we bug out back to Tucson. The key is flexibility and the ability to stay or leave from either location. The most effective bug out scenario requires some kind of advance warning, which is not always going to happen. I figure to be prepared no matter which location I happen to be residing at the time.


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

I plan on going nowhere, everything is here and I have enough of everything to last at least four years.
Have food, guns, ammunition, three heat sources, water in the form of a river behind shop and several means to make it potable.
Have x-cut saws, axes, mauls, wedges for when the gas runs out.
Have six acres of which three are plantable, have seed stores in freezer.
The only bugout plan I would have is if thing got so bad here I needed to leave.
I would have to destroy 30 years of prepping.
My way to a friends location in Wyoming would be for me to "liberate" a twin engine airplane from the local airport. 
Yes, I do know how to fly and navigate, 2,000 + hours.
That would be a last ditch option, at the point it would be needed the planes would be probably be junk and no fuel.
So, back to square one, stay here and suck up.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

While my basic plan is to bug in, in the face of a crisis that would force me to bug out would be dependent on many things. But the biggest one would be the idea of early warning or paying attention to trigger points. In a way, I'm lucky being retired. If a trigger point (say a pandemic moving my way) occurred that told me I had no choice but to bug out, I wouldn't have to worry about calling in sick or taking vacation days just in case it's a false alarm. I can't help but feel some preppers who don't have this freedom might unconsciously ignore a trigger point because of their job, especially new preppers.


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

Thanks, everyone, for your thoughtful and interesting responses. I've learned a few things. Most people are realistic in their planning, trying to stay flexible, minimize travel during the peak of danger, and watching the news. 

To the few that say the N.G. can not block every intersection of every road, I urge caution. They won't block every road, but they will patrol. You do not want to be apprehended breaking curfew and be confined in a country jail or federal internment camp while the S Hits TF.


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## Charles Martel (Mar 10, 2014)

Ideally, we'll have bugged out long before S truly HTF, but, we're also prepared to bug-in long term as well. 

Bugging-in is the most practical plan for most preppers/survivalists. Bugging out under ideal circumstances can be tricky...bugging out with children, or with elderly/infirm adults during SHTF isn't a very good idea, and should only be considered as a last resort. You're just making yourself refugees unless you have someplace to go that is stocked with all the essentials for long term survival.


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## TacticalCanuck (Aug 5, 2014)

I agree. Bugging out is more of this romantic notion or pipe dream than a feasible reality. Being ready to.get the hell out of an area and survive for a few days to a week or so is feasible. But the reality of it is that if you have to go so does everyone else. The mass exodus will cause all sorts of issues known and unknown the least of which is space to move. It will drive all wildlife out of the area so hunting isnt an option. There will be people killing people for the simplist of goods like a pot of rice to live another day. Bugging out of a city isnt going to work. Your best bet is to hunker in as long as possible. Prepare to move out and take the opportune moment to do so. But understand you will have nothing to go home to. Everything you leave behind will be gone. Squatters could take up residence. Your block could burn. Or flood. You wont be there to stop it or help or salvage what you can. Bugging out is a romantic fools notion that makes for some really great stories. If you have to go as there is no other option i hope you make it to a safe place. Anyone else near by will be forced out just the same as you were.


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## tinkerhell (Oct 8, 2014)

The reason why we can't all agree on the value of the Bug out plan is:
 not all disasters lead to SHTF,end of days, total anarchy outcomes
we all have the freedom to define BO as we please. For me, I include short term get away plans in response to chemical spills, flooding, train derailment, mud slide, etc.


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## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

If your abode is threatened by a natural or man-made disaster then bugging out is mandatory to your survival.
For local, short term, disasters, you might only need three days before you can return. for other events that cause permanent damage you might be looking at moving to a new location.


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## Jakthesoldier (Feb 1, 2015)

I think one premise of this thread that leaves out half the people bugging out. Just because you bug out does not mean you have a final destination. Wanderers will fare better and worse than everyone else.


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## Will2 (Mar 20, 2013)

For good reason most people in the US would not need to bug out.. however the whole idea of a bug out is to get out of dodge when things are expected to get worse if you stay.

A good bugout will have a bugout location that can be gotten to. 

A good bugout location will be one that is prepared in advance such as a retreat, cottage, summer home, camp, etc...

For a bunch of people they don't have a second property so use alternate locations.

In warmer areas this may very well work as long as food and water is there.

Here are some examples of when to bugout (evacuate):

plauge- very fast spreading disease - people close to you get it, highly contageous deadly etc.. if you stay there is a good chance you will die and not even get a spot in the morgue. 

extreme organized violence against people like you (invasion, gang wars, political crackdown etc..)

Natural disaster - (services are cut off locally, there are fires, looting, riots, radiation, biochem attack, etc..)

Its not that bugout doesn't have its place, but essentially, it is for when you no longer feel safe where you are because the problem is now coming to your Bug in Location. Unless you know your bug in can withstand the problem you now need to question, is it safer to stay or to go.

Different types of scenarios may have different response plans.

The bug out definatelyhas a place but a good bugin should cover you in many circumstances -but what if your bugin is destroyed now what?

It is a bit like moving to higher ground in a flood.


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