# Poorman's SHTF Loadout?



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

This is a gear layout that I have made myself, might work for some, especially when on a budget. The principals/purpose of this gear is to give you basic protection and combat (if necessary) efficiency while being under 500 dollars. Most of the items are from cheaper than dirt, however most items can be found elsewhere. I have a couple variations for cheapest,cheap, and budget. I am not the best prepper, not the most skilled, so I would love some CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM
So that I could revise this some I could help myself, and perhaps others.

_Cheapest layout:_
Type 53 mosin nagant -120.00 avg.
Flektarn camo Flak vest 40.00 avg.
Steel Helmet (m71 swiss, m40 russian, m1 American, etc) 30.00-45.00 avg
440 round can of surplus 7.62x54r- 120.00 avg.
*320.00 avg Total*
_Cheap layout:_
M91/30 mosin nagant 120.00-150.00 avg
Flektarn camo Flak vest 40.00 avg.
Steel Helmet (m71 swiss, m40 russian, m1 American, etc) 30.00-45.00 avg
440 round can of surplus 7.62x54r- 120.00 avg.
10 Stripper Clips- 15.00 avg
Sks sever pocket chest rig- 10.00 avg.
*335.00 avg total*
_Budget Layout:_
M44 mosin nagant 150.00 avg.
Flektarn camo Flak vest 40.00 avg.
Steel Helmet (m71 swiss, m40 russian, m1 American, etc) 30.00-45.00 avg
440 round can of surplus 7.62x54r- 120.00 avg.
10 Stripper Clips- 15.00 avg
Sks sever pocket chest rig- 10.00 avg.
AR500 steel plate 10x12 65.00 avg.
*400.00 avg total*


----------



## HuntingHawk (Dec 16, 2012)

Not really sure that was thought out well. Flak vest for what? Having incoming motor or artillery rounds?


----------



## nechaev (Nov 10, 2012)

Good start. Throw in a handgun, holster, etc, and some food and first aid stuff, along with water, and knife, a back pack and a few other essentials. This represents a good start.


----------



## Rigged for Quiet (Mar 3, 2013)

I like the approach if you are really on a tight budget. It's easy to say just save your money until you can afford better equipment but I know people who would have to make real sacrifices to come up with 400 - 500 bucks so having something that works is much better than not having at all.

If the list were mine I would reconsider the helmet and the flak jacket. Any rifle round is likely to defeat them, and if you have ever worn a kevlar helmet you will shudder at the thought of having to wear steel. I'd drop them from your "Cheap" list and get it down to around $240 then add something like an surplus Argus 9mm (time to break out the flame retardant underwear, lol) and you are still under $500.

Of course, security is a moot point without shalter, water, and food but I believe your inventory in trained hands will stand up against most of the untrained population so long as you aren't facing numbers. It's a damn shame the days of the $100 SKS is a thing of the past.


----------



## Fuzzee (Nov 20, 2012)

Poorman's shtf loadout I'd say is a 10/22, a couple of bricks and a serviceable pair of shoes to run from anyone who's better armed.


----------



## retired guard (Mar 7, 2013)

Another vote against flak jacket and helmet. If you already have them they can be useful as conditioning tools. However in a firefight a bullet through the zipper means you will die wearing the jacket. If you perceive a need for it snaps only.


----------



## dwight55 (Nov 9, 2012)

Since I'm not bugging out, . . . my loadout is my main battle rifle, . . . 30 to 60 rounds of ammo, . . . my super softee quiet shoes, . . . camo shirt, britches, hat, . . . and enough dirt on my face and hands that I can't be seen.

We are talking of a scouting trip around the outside perimeter of my AO. Would love to have a kevlar skid lid and some serious body armor, . . . but there are a whole bunch of other things I think that have a more important role in my home defense plan.

But if you gotta go, . . . the OP list might get him through, . . . but he needs a 1911 in there some where.

May God bless,
Dwight


----------



## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

Whats wrong with wearing your kit its like everything else wear it enough and it becomes a second skin.


----------



## roy (May 25, 2013)

ApexPredator said:


> Whats wrong with wearing your kit its like everything else wear it enough and it becomes a second skin.


You might notice that special ops don't wear any of that crap unless they are assaulting a target. Do you plan on attacking someone?


----------



## Fuzzee (Nov 20, 2012)

Holding down the homefront or BOL is one thing. You're there, you can wear what you want when you want if you've got it. Bugging out, cover distance, is a whole other thing. Weight, freedom of movement, staying cool, and making your supplies last. Not a chance in hell am I wearing my bullet proof vest to bug out in. I sweat a couple gallon wearing it without a pack and other gear. I can see myself, 5 miles down the road, a walking wet towel soaked to the bone in sweat, canteen and bladder run dry, looking for more water, cursing the world, looking to shoot someone to take it out on. To hell with a flak jacket and helmet unless your in a controlled situation where you can take it off later and not be leaving it on the side of a tree.


----------



## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

On the question of full body armor - like the black "assault" teams wear for a home entry - how much protection does all that gear provide (from a 3006 say) and what whould you have to add for better protection?

More curiosity than any particular interest....


----------



## Fuzzee (Nov 20, 2012)

PaulS said:


> On the question of full body armor - like the black "assault" teams wear for a home entry - how much protection does all that gear provide (from a 3006 say) and what whould you have to add for better protection?
> 
> More curiosity than any particular interest....


Soft body armor which norm is Level III these days I'd say won't do anything against .30-06 or any other rifle round. It's meant to stop pistol rounds and may not stop all of them. You'll got you use ballistic plates rated for the heavier rifle rounds and they add a good amount of weight. Not many people who know better would want to bug out on foot with either. The plates commonly only cover your front center mass and back so all those open areas around the edges and sides are open hit zones. Someone smart wanting to kill someone in it would wait for the shot to get around the armor or a head shot.

Body Armor | Concealable Body Armor | Tactical Body Armor - SAFARILAND®


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed responses! as for the flak vest and helmet, I could see not wearing them too much, but lets say the us gets invaded or even worse, obama decides to go commie, and theres bombing, etc. I think the flak vest and helmet would do good. See, i live in southern california and we got azuza canyon pretty near us and its a good canyone goin many miles deep into wilderness. I would most likely make a camp real deep into it, and patrol it. of course i wouldnt wear flak vest and helmet doin that haha maybe the vest though. But a question to the more experienced preppers, could a ar500 plate fit into a flak vest? Ive heard many say it could, but i dont know how it would.


----------



## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

Fuzzee said:


> Soft body armor which norm is Level III these days I'd say won't do anything against .30-06 or any other rifle round. It's meant to stop pistol rounds and may not stop all of them. You'll got you use ballistic plates rated for the heavier rifle rounds and they add a good amount of weight. Not many people who know better would want to bug out on foot with either. The plates commonly only cover your front center mass and back so all those open areas around the edges and sides are open hit zones. Someone smart wanting to kill someone in it would wait for the shot to get around the armor or a head shot.
> 
> Body Armor | Concealable Body Armor | Tactical Body Armor - SAFARILAND®


I know a little about the common "body armor" but the swat and other teams use a full body suit with helmet and face shield. What kind of protection does that provide?


----------



## roy (May 25, 2013)

Against something like .308 or 30.06, even 5.56 . . . none. Does make 'em look kool, though.


----------



## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

All I can say is this... if I see someone in body armor, I'm aiming for the face or knees.


----------



## Rigged for Quiet (Mar 3, 2013)

Prepadoodle said:


> All I can say is this... if I see someone in body armor, I'm aiming for the face or knees.


Not necessary. Any center mass hit with a rifle will put them down. It takes a lot of adrenaline to overcome a blow to the chest with that much kinetic energy. Then it's time to break contact.


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

Ive heard of people also getting 2 flak vests and doubling the kevlar inserts. is this good for perhaps larger caliber pistols? or just impractical.


----------



## roy (May 25, 2013)

Aim for the crotch!


----------



## Gunner's Mate (Aug 13, 2013)

decide on a plan that best suits your physical and mental abilities, personally I believe that most of the average joes that are planning on hiking out of the major metro areas are going to be Targets of Opprotunity, to 1. exhaustion the crap that most people think they are going to carry ask any ground pounder in here about ruckin up 2. the police, mercs, or any other highly trained paramilitary organization just like in New Orleans during katrina, 3. roving indiv or gangs of people that want your stuff. Lets say defending from home is not an option then why and can that be overcome if not then how far is your BOL, can you drive to BOL if you can so can someone else , does your BOL have some sort of natural shelter like a cave or mineshaft or an old abandoned structure like a barn or house, is your BOL on private property that you dont own, national forest, or state public land, does your BOL have a source of water, does your BOL have any fish or game, does your BOL have any signs of human activity at or nearby, is your BOL unsecure because of weather like flashflood or brushfire is your BOL on highground easier to defend but harder to hide, does your BOL, have an escape route. if I had a choice and felt very secure Id cache supplies at more than one location near my BOL, whats your timeline for survival in wilderness setting 1 wk, 1 month, 1 year, try to leave as little sign as possible going to your BOL use different routes to BOL, ditch non essential stuff helmets and flak jacket Id rather have water and MRE's, tools for survival like traps and fishing equip tools for building shelter are you mentally and physically prepared for wilderness survival. Shelter Water food security. Hiking into a canyon with no plan is a bad idea. scout your BOL know it like the back of your hand have a backup, conceal secure evade and defend silently when at all possible. hope this helps. your thinking for low buck is good but Plan, Organize and Equip for your enviroment terrain geography and weather. 
I used this list in an excel format and added comment boxes to each item its probably not perfect but you can use it in excel and start adding things you think you may need for your particular situation
Shelter
Water 
Food 
Cooking
Kitchen 
Hygene / Bathing 
Clothing 
Fuels
Lierature
Tools
BOB 
BOL 
BOV
Weapons 
Reloading 
Medical
Gardening / Farming
Livestock 
Security
Refrig
Heat 
Light
Refrig


----------



## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

lol Roy check out SF operators they do in fact wear them they may not even like it. I dont mind it all but command forces us to do it all the same. I can vouch for this personally and whats more they do wear them on long movements you may check the EIB ruck standards if you dont believe me. Some SOF snipers will argue very well that armor interferes with their accuracy but modern plate carriers do not greatly affect it in my opinion. As for attacking someone all plates are a defensive option, if I was on the offensive I would count on surprise or a prepared position to give me protection. If you say CQB I would say doesnt matter some form of call out would happen if it was me. Plates will force a Sniper to try and make a head shot or pelvic if they are smart. I am not a sniper but I do know how to shoot and know several snipers. Head shots are hard at any range throw in wind humidity moving target etc and your chances go down and down and down a good way to increase those chances of a hit is to aim center mass plates negate the initial round which is usually the most accurate then you gotta deal with a target scrambling for cover after you knocked him to the ground. Also worthy of consideration is survival after the fact even civil war doctors could often save a arm or leg wound but chest/abdominal shots were almost always fatal. Sorry the Spec ops comment struck a little nerve you should at least read someones profile page.


----------



## roy (May 25, 2013)

What do EIB standard have to do with it? I was on a LRRP/LRS team for 15 years. If the government comes after you it doesn't matter what kind of defenses you have. Ever see a D6 Cat go out the back of a C5?


----------



## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

Not sure where the GOVT came into but yes obviously someone in the possession of nuclear weapons is prolly gonna be able to take out your house. I think we are talking about other people not organizations any organization can over come a well fortified individual. EIB 12 mile road march in kit plus your ruck (45lbs dry) kinda says something about not being able to carry it for long distances I think. So what does a D6 have to do with it. I really am curious about that I would also like to hear your comments on the plates AR500 steel plates only weigh 6-7 lbs and only cost about 65-80 dollars pair it with a cheap and I mean cheap plate carrier at 20-40 or a surplus one at about the same price and while not as cheap as flak jackets I could see them being a cheap alternative that provides the level of protection this guy is seeking.


----------



## HuntingHawk (Dec 16, 2012)

Rather then spending what I think would be a waste of money on a helmet & flak vest, you might consider a canteen & knife or chopping tool. Poncho can come in handy also.


----------



## StarPD45 (Nov 13, 2012)

Rigged for Quiet said:


> I like the approach if you are really on a tight budget. It's easy to say just save your money until you can afford better equipment but I know people who would have to make real sacrifices to come up with 400 - 500 bucks so having something that works is much better than not having at all.
> 
> If the list were mine I would reconsider the helmet and the flak jacket. Any rifle round is likely to defeat them, and if you have ever worn a kevlar helmet you will shudder at the thought of having to wear steel. I'd drop them from your "Cheap" list and get it down to around $240 then add something like an surplus Argus 9mm (time to break out the flame retardant underwear, lol) and you are still under $500.
> 
> Of course, security is a moot point without shalter, water, and food but I believe your inventory in trained hands will stand up against most of the untrained population so long as you aren't facing numbers. It's a damn shame the days of the $100 SKS is a thing of the past.


$100.00 SKS's? I remember when you could buy them for $40-50.00. Yeah, I'm that old.


----------



## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

StarPD45 said:


> $100.00 SKS's? I remember when you could buy them for $40-50.00. Yeah, I'm that old.


I bought two rifles and a case of ammo for under $100 when I got mine. I figured it would be a fun 22 LR replacement - cheap ammo was throw away but it turned out my 22's were more accurate.


----------



## Prepadoodle (May 28, 2013)

I would be tempted to forget the flak jacket and just go with a cheap plate carrier and an AR500 plate in the front, but would probably forget the body armor, get some inexpensive optics, and plan on longer range sniping from a network of prepared, concealed positions that would cover likely routes of advance. If you spent $50 on sandbags, you could have the protection without having to lug it around.


----------



## jadm (Aug 9, 2013)

_If the list were mine I would reconsider the helmet and the flak jacket._

I thought this once, until one of my corrected me by saying that the first round that the vest absorbed would be worth the price of the vest


----------



## jimb1972 (Nov 12, 2012)

A steel helmet won't stop a bullet anyway, unless you expect to be exposed to a lot of shrapnel it isn't going to do you much good. Kevlar helmet might stop one, but unless you are willing to train with it on and wear it very frequently it is probably going to be more hindrance than help. Flak jacket falls into about the same category as the helmet, good for shrapnel but probably not going to stop a bullet from a rifle. I would worry more about water, shelter and food than tactical accessories


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

a steel helmet could stop a bullet. of course i would hesitate to puta NIJ rating on it because its not made for it, but lookey this [video=youtube;Zo7RL4B2r28]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmME-JKLgiE[/url] and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo7R...s well, and it'll have to be a small caliber.


----------



## jimb1972 (Nov 12, 2012)

TweakerTeeth said:


> a steel helmet could stop a bullet. of course i would hesitate to puta NIJ rating on it because its not made for it, but lookey this [video=youtube;Zo7RL4B2r28]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmME-JKLgiE[/url] and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo7R... going to knock it off your head most likely.


----------



## Scotty12 (Jan 5, 2013)

I gotta agree about the flak vest and helmet. That is a lot of weight. You may really need your strength. The only thing a flak vest is good for is just that...flak


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

it'll stop .22s and in my research it seems alot of people would be using em when it comes to shtf so i think it would e good. and extra weight would be around 10 pounds only, not that much to me


----------



## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

The biggest problem with any kind of body armor is that your feet, hands and head are exposed. We have been training lately with our pistols to go for head shots on the run. It's not as hard as I thought it was going to be - even though I don't run very far at 63, I can still hit more times than I miss, and that is with only three months of casual practice.


----------



## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

Hum seems to contradict everything Ive ever heard there have been reports of LEOs firing 15-30 rounds at point blank range and missing completely. Ive got to ask what is the range what is your approximate speed what is the stress level are you firing while moving left to right in relation to the target or advancing on it or retreating. Whats your acquisition time grouping size etc.


----------



## Nathan Jefferson (May 11, 2013)

TweakerTeeth said:


> a steel helmet could stop a bullet. of course i would hesitate to puta NIJ rating on it because its not made for it, but lookey this [video=youtube;Zo7RL4B2r28]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmME-JKLgiE[/url] and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo7R... even a .22lr. Hot and sweaty, no go for me.


----------



## Nathan Jefferson (May 11, 2013)

ApexPredator said:


> Hum seems to contradict everything Ive ever heard there have been reports of LEOs firing 15-30 rounds at point blank range and missing completely. Ive got to ask what is the range what is your approximate speed what is the stress level are you firing while moving left to right in relation to the target or advancing on it or retreating. Whats your acquisition time grouping size etc.


Most police probably don't even 'casually practice' like Puals said he does. but yes, adrenaline and moving while firing at a moving target are very complicating items. Either way, practice/train for the eventuality and you will be much better off than if you hadn't.


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

as far as the helmets id be pretty sure that it would be dependent on the quality of the individual helmet, since in the video i posted showes some round penetrating that in another video, i saw were stopped. CTD has plenty helmets to choose from like the m1-style m71 swiss or a m40 russian helmet. or if your a man with alot of cash you could always go for pasgt.


----------



## TweakerTeeth (Sep 9, 2013)

also, its harder to aim when your being shot at, so I wouldnt abandon at least some lightweight protection because of the possiblity of being shot in the face/head


----------



## jadm (Aug 9, 2013)

the new Body armor ( ar500 with anti-spalling) would be the way to go. it's not as expensive as a Kevlar vest and it stops rifle rounds
but again weight is a problem, so is heat. try to wear a Kevlar vest in 100 degree heat and see how long it takes to get uncomfortable
then think of another 50-60lbs and a forced march!!! :shock:


----------



## flyhoovers (Oct 25, 2013)

...So any form of body armor was quite a ways down my priority list, and like other posts here I believe it really depends on what specifically you want to prep for. When I got to it on my list, I did My research and got AR500 plates($80) and a Condor MOPC ($70). My logic was the old "better to have and not need than need..." You know the rest. Something else to consider....if the S really HTF, what you have is all you may ever get. Plates (as opposed to ceramic) can absorb multiple rounds and don't necessarily need to be tossed after an impact. More bang for the buck (pun intended.). Just my 2 cents....LOTS of other stuff to secure before a purchase like this.


----------



## Arizona Infidel (Oct 5, 2013)

Don't think I like the idea of bugging out. If I'm buggin I don't want to see anyone. Cover and concealment. I want to go as light as I can.


----------



## MikeyPrepper (Nov 29, 2012)

Nice start I like it


----------



## Doomsday (Jun 25, 2013)

I try to put my assets in items that help me avoid situations where I would not be shot at. And help me survive going to and at my bug out location. My bug out plan is based on a location where I would be less likely to be seen or shot at. If you fill that you need body armor to accomplish your bug out plan. Then I would consider another plain. 

I can’t carry everything! I have to evaluate each item for its usefulness. Body armor only protects you if you are shot at and hit in the areas that it protects! If I’m hit in the leg or arm can I still achieve my bug out mission? Can my family take care of me or carry me the rest of the way? Can I survive the trip? Probably not, this is why avoidance is more important. IMO body armor is offensive item and not practical for escape and avoidance. If your bug out plan involves hunkering down and/or taking the world head on when you bug out then yes add body armor.


----------



## MikeyPrepper (Nov 29, 2012)

Essentials only


----------



## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

(Caution, the following is for the purpose of humor only.)
I want to be the first nuclear power on my block. I have 2 neighbors that fail to collect the dog $hit from the big a$$ dogs.


----------



## jimb1972 (Nov 12, 2012)

paraquack said:


> (Caution, the following is for the purpose of humor only.)
> I want to be the first nuclear power on my block. I have 2 neighbors that fail to collect the dog $hit from the big a$$ dogs.


find yourself a brown paper bag, a bic lighter, and make a hot delivery to their doorstep.


----------



## MikeyPrepper (Nov 29, 2012)

Lolol


----------



## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

The problem with neighborhood nukes is that it takes out the whole danged neighborhood. You end up part of your own collateral damage.


----------



## ScPrep (Nov 30, 2013)

No survival gear at all? Leave the helmet and flak jacket off and get some gear you'll need more than that. It's not a war haha just my .02 cents


----------



## XMTG (Jan 28, 2014)

I agree, ditch the helmet and flak jacket. They will only stop shrapnel, not projectiles.


----------



## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

i got pasg dirt cheap. helet about 100 vest 65 steel plate abot 22 ea.


----------



## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

ApexPredator said:


> Not sure where the GOVT came into but yes obviously someone in the possession of nuclear weapons is prolly gonna be able to take out your house. I think we are talking about other people not organizations any organization can over come a well fortified individual. EIB 12 mile road march in kit plus your ruck (45lbs dry) kinda says something about not being able to carry it for long distances I think. So what does a D6 have to do with it. I really am curious about that I would also like to hear your comments on the plates AR500 steel plates only weigh 6-7 lbs and only cost about 65-80 dollars pair it with a cheap and I mean cheap plate carrier at 20-40 or a surplus one at about the same price and while not as cheap as flak jackets I could see them being a cheap alternative that provides the level of protection this guy is seeking.


 the steel plates come pretty cheap, folks with throw away money are goin with ceramic. im buggin in till things quiet down, will probably get shot in the face as i protect the 2nd floor widows anyway, but something is always better than nothin.it gives you peace of mind.


----------



## Seneca (Nov 16, 2012)

If you've ever worn some of this stuff plates, body armor helmets etc. After a while you'll either make a truce (adjustments) with your gear or you'll come to hate it. I see such things as body armor, plates and helmets as being useful (maybe) as bug in gear. If for no other reason than I want all the protection I can get because more than likely I'm having to make a stand.

If I'm out and moving about as in bugged out I want to blend in and be as mobile as I can possibly be. In or out? each should be dealt with as being uniquely different situations.


----------



## Maxxdad (Feb 5, 2014)

Right. One more no on the Flack Vest. A standard 9mm ball WILL zip through the front and out the back. Trust me on this. Kevlar Helmet ? Nope. Unless as others have said your Dinning in. Then it'snot really an issue.
I do like your start and thought process. Keep thinking and sharing. You can add a pistol. But unless you have the time and $$ to practice, perhaps a revolver might fit the bill. I've tagged quite few rabbits and squirrels with a 22 pistol and if you went 38 or better you could get dedicated "Shot" rounds for small game. Just a thought.


----------



## LordRamon.FloresIII (6 mo ago)

HuntingHawk said:


> Not really sure that was thought out well. Flak vest for what? Having incoming motor or artillery rounds?


I am thinking *TweakerTeeth was intending to keep grenades (hand thrown or mk19 or Palmay) off him. Still I think it is good.*


----------

