# Gold Hoarding For When SHTF



## Squadus

I think it is important to keep a stock of gold for any kind of disaster, not just economic. In troubled times, people are usually desperate and irrational. Gold is a resource that takes advantage of this fact by being such a highly coveted resource. It would be simple to trade gold for assets like weapons, real estate, vehicles, and others (with an emotional advantage), and it works in all countries around the globe. :glasses:

What to buy:

Gold Bars
Gold Bullion
Gold Coins
CombiBars

How To Get It:

Pawn Shops
Jewelry Stores
Online Retailers
Retirement Portfolio


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## Denton

Gold is for international traders. I'm a simple man. Silver for me. Who the heck are you?


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## dwight55

Denton said:


> Gold is for international traders. I'm a simple man. Silver for me. Who the heck are you?


Gold salesman is my guess, boss...........

I ain't no expert, . . . but the last time I looked at my wife's little 24 k gold necklace I bought her in Vietnam, . . . I decided I'd rather eat a Hershey bar than eat it.

May God bless,
Dwight


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## Chipper

When it gets to the point you need to trade for weapons shiny objects will be worthless.


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## A Watchman

Many of us here store some silver. Some of us a little and some of us a lot. I haven'y checked the market in a while, but at $1200 - $1500 an ounce the cost of gold limits the acerage preoared person's access. One more time for all of you rookies and wineheads .... Storing gold and silver is a hedge against a fiat US dollar in the event of an economic collapse. It is not an investment vehicle.


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## SDF880

My preps are my gold and will allow me to take care of family during that time!
I agree with Denton and have some silver but who knows how it will be used then?


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## paraquack

The precious metal I prefer is copper plated lead, and lots of it.


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## Smitty901

Lead and brass trumps Gold. Try to use your gold post SHTF. You will turn your gold over to someone else and like see your last day on earth until the second coming.


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## Back Pack Hack

I've seen this, and it looks promising.


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## rice paddy daddy

I sure am glad I was too poor to afford to buy gold at $1800 per ounce when the gold peddlers were screaming "Buy gold NOW!!! It will be $3,000 per ounce soon!!!!"
:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## Maine-Marine

I believing in covering all bases or at least being prepared for many things...

however, I no longer stock gold. I sold my gold years ago. Now we only stock silver. We (wife and I) have bullion and U.S. and Canadian coins. 

For me, Silver is now and in the future will be easier to use.


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## Crunch

SDF880 said:


> My preps are my gold and will allow me to take care of family during that time!
> I agree with Denton and have some silver but who knows how it will be used then?


Agreed on that. The only correct answer on the "gold or silver?" question is "Both" in my opinion.

Consider: At $900 median weekly wages for the average US worker (per the BLS for Q3 2019), having just 90 days of savings in silver would be about 45 pounds for the average American, compared to only 0.5 pounds of gold. Gold is also nearly twice the density of silver, so gold coins are roughly half the size of silver ones for the same weight, making them easier to carry or hide. So for even a relatively small amount of savings, bugging out on foot, in an INCH bag, or for hiding in your "prison wallet", gold makes more sense.

But gold is too expensive for use in small trades so silver is better for those. Not everyone will be willing or able to make change for gold coins used for small purchases.


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## rice paddy daddy

dwight55 said:


> Gold salesman is my guess, boss...........
> 
> I ain't no expert, . . . but the last time I looked at my wife's little 24 k gold necklace I bought her in Vietnam, . . . I decided I'd rather eat a Hershey bar than eat it.
> 
> May God bless,
> Dwight


Agreed.
People who think that they can trade gold for goods after a (very improbable) collapse of the American financial system may be in for a rude awakening.

"Yes sir, mister, I want to give you this tiny piece of shiny metal for a can of beans. It's REAL GOLD!!" :vs_laugh:

Instead, if you are really serious about a real collapse, put your hard earned cash into a few acres of land outside a small town. Learn how to hobby farm, grow your own food, keep chickens for their egg laying.
If you work in a city, just commute. I did, for almost 20 years - 48 miles one way, 5 days a week.

Just the vastly reduced stress that comes from quiet country living is truly worth its proverbial "weight in gold." :tango_face_smile:


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## Maine-Marine

Crunch said:


> Agreed on that. The only correct answer on the "gold or silver?" question is "Both" in my opinion.
> 
> Consider: At $900 median weekly wages for the average US worker (per the BLS for Q3 2019), having just 90 days of savings in silver would be about 45 pounds for the average American, compared to only 0.5 pounds of gold. Gold is also nearly twice the density of silver, so gold coins are roughly half the size of silver ones for the same weight, making them easier to carry or hide. So for even a relatively small amount of savings, bugging out on foot, in an INCH bag, or for hiding in your "prison wallet", gold makes more sense.
> 
> But gold is too expensive for use in small trades so silver is better for those. Not everyone will be willing or able to make change for gold coins used for small purchases.


if things are so bad I even CONSIDER sticking gold coins up my arse....said gold coins will not be of any use!!!!!!! Seriously, even if the AntiChrist came to town riding on a comet followed by george soros and the UN fully armed declaring martial law - I am still not putting gold up my backside

I could not carry all my silver on my person. I also could not carry all my food or ammo... if SHTF so bad it comes down to bugging out... there will be lots of things buried or left behind


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## The Tourist

I'm glad you started this thread, because I get to be "The Devil's Advocate." In truth, I never understood the concept of 'gold' in an TEOTWAWKI scenario. Here's my point.

You, your spouse and your kids are have just rolled into "Bartertown" and all you have with you is six bucks, two worn out revolvers and 17 rounds of ammunition. Would you barter for a gold doubloon or a pork chop?

I believe that when it all falls apart, you will be judged on your talents, not your wallet. For example, back several years ago I was reading about people running off to the hinterlands and setting up survivalist condos. My wife asked me if we were the types of people who would be included. I told her, "_Why, certainly, you're a teacher and I can cast perfect linotype bullets..._"

In this dystopian scenario, what you were in the past would not guaranty you anything in the future. In fact, if gunpowder runs out, I can switch over to polishing knives. After all, it's going to be a blood bath in the "_Mad Max Century..._"


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## rice paddy daddy

People who think silver American coins will be good for barter are overlooking something.

So, you've got a pre-1964 silver quarter that's worth $15 bucks, TO YOU.
You want to use it to barter for goods. The guy you are trying to barter with does not see $15 worth of silver, he sees A QUARTER. 25 cents!


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## Slippy

rice paddy daddy said:


> Agreed.
> People who think that they can trade gold for goods after a (very improbable) collapse of the American financial system may be in for a rude awakening.
> 
> "Yes sir, mister, I want to give you this tiny piece of shiny metal for a can of beans. It's REAL GOLD!!" :vs_laugh:
> 
> Instead, if you are really serious about a real collapse, put your hard earned cash into a few acres of land outside a small town. Learn how to hobby farm, grow your own food, keep chickens for their egg laying.
> If you work in a city, just commute. I did, for almost 20 years - 48 miles one way, 5 days a week.
> 
> Just the vastly reduced stress that comes from quiet country living is truly worth its proverbial "weight in gold." :tango_face_smile:


I cannot agree more to what RPD wrote above that I highlighted in red.

Sure, diversifiction of assets/investments is great, I agree. But to think that silver and gold will feed you in a total collapse grid down or WROL, well I'd place my bets on other tangible goods


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## Chiefster23

In my humble opinion, gold is good for two things. First, it is easily hidden and thus the government doesn’t know you have it. They can’t tax it or confiscate it.
Second, as long as some form of government exists they are gonna want to tax your property. Gold can be sold off or bartered to pay your property taxes.


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## Maine-Marine

rice paddy daddy said:


> People who think silver American coins will be good for barter are overlooking something.
> 
> So, you've got a pre-1964 silver quarter that's worth $15 bucks, TO YOU.
> You want to use it to barter for goods. The guy you are trying to barter with does not see $15 worth of silver, he sees A QUARTER. 25 cents!


you are assuming that the guy you are dealing with does not know what SILVER is!!! and I have to think that people who have things worth buying will know the value of silver


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## paulag1955

In a post-apocalyptic setting, I think it would be years before silver and gold had real world value. If I could only afford to have gold/silver or trade goods, I'd lean heavily towards trade goods.


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## Maine-Marine

paulag1955 said:


> In a post-apocalyptic setting, I think it would be years before silver and gold had real world value. If I could only afford to have gold/silver or trade goods, I'd lean heavily towards trade goods.


here is the problem with trade goods.

you need a widget, the guy that has a widget needs a whatchagot, you do not have a whatchagot... the widget guy does not need food, or water, or anything you have

so you need a place holder... today we use dollars.. because we know that X dollars represent x amount

the only thing that might be used successfully as a place holder will be bullets or meds JHMO


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## paulag1955

Maine-Marine said:


> here is the problem with trade goods.
> 
> you need a widget, the guy that has a widget needs a whatchagot, you do not have a whatchagot... the widget guy does not need food, or water, or anything you have
> 
> so you need a place holder... today we use dollars.. because we know that X dollars represent x amount
> 
> the only thing that might be used successfully as a place holder will be bullets or meds JHMO


Bullets, meds, feminine hygiene products and alcohol, IMO. Also salt and maybe coffee. Disposable diapers probably for sure, but they're too bulky to store.


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## Back Pack Hack

paulag1955 said:


> Bullets, meds, feminine hygiene products and alcohol, IMO. Also salt and maybe coffee. Disposable diapers probably for sure, but they're too bulky to store.


Condoms. Coffin Nails as well.


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## Verba Bellum

People who are relying on their precious metal stash during SHTF


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## paulag1955

Back Pack Hack said:


> Condoms. Coffin Nails as well.


I hadn't thought of condoms. Great idea, but can you believe I'm too embarrassed to buy them? I can imagine the looks I'd get at my age.


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## Denton

rice paddy daddy said:


> People who think silver American coins will be good for barter are overlooking something.
> 
> So, you've got a pre-1964 silver quarter that's worth $15 bucks, TO YOU.
> You want to use it to barter for goods. The guy you are trying to barter with does not see $15 worth of silver, he sees A QUARTER. 25 cents!


I sure am glad I live where I do. Seems the hobby farmers around here are a little more enlightened when it comes to the value of precious metals and the thousands of years of their status of being _money_ and not currency. They all made it known to me that they'll only take silver (preferably) or gold if there's ever a banking collapse. If someone has the right caliber of ammo, that'll be welcome, too.
I don't have the land to grow enough food to make a difference. On the other hand, I can fill ammo cans with silver.

Now, having said that, I believe I'll see the Rapture before I see the inevitable collapse of our currency.


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## MountainGirl

Chiefster23 said:


> In my humble opinion, gold is good for two things. First, it is easily hidden and thus the government doesn't know you have it. They can't tax it or confiscate it.
> Second, *as long as some form of government exists* they are gonna want to tax your property. Gold can be sold off or bartered to pay your property taxes.


Yeah ^^  but that's the thing. In a true SHTF, there wont be any 'government' of any size for a long time. It'll be WROL, and any local tribal ruling authority might want your gold/silver, but you'll lose it all in one take...along with everything else you've stashed. And if your homestead/set-up is beneficial to them? They'll take that too. Some here are ready to make a well armed and well defended stand, for a long time, but we too will eventually fall. AND I dont think any of us kid ourselves about that...because what matters in the end is the choices we make, like how to live and how to die, when faced with things not in our control. Our choice is to live as free as possible for as long as possible. After that - it's up to God.

Precious metals are a good hedge against financial hard times - as long as the existing underlying monetary system exists.
In SHTF, it wont be there.


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## bigwheel

Seem to recall Toronto Girl who actually survived the collapse of her society when the USSR fell apart..said gold was not high on the list of bartering goods. Tops were cigarettes..vodka and toilet paper. A chum just gave me 10lbs of free tobacco yesterday. Hes had it a while and its dried out needing a bit of rehydrating..but all us old boy scout cowboy hippies kinow how do do that. Sould make a bunch of smokes. 
https://www.martjet.com/cigarette-making-faq/roll-your-own-make-cigarettes-save-money


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## Annie

Chipper said:


> When it gets to the point you need to trade for weapons shiny objects will be worthless.


Bibles, rosaries, blest candles and holy water. If it gets really bad people will want these things more than silver. Not for barter, but given freely.


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## NotTooProudToHide

I don't think a scenario where money is worthless is very likely. While it could happen odds are far more favorable for temporary and or localized situations where things have gone wrong and in these situations currency will still hold value. Rather than buying gold you're far better off paying off debt, having cash on hand, having some sort of investment account, having as much money as you can in a savings/checking account, and finally having a piece of property that you hold the deed to clear and free.


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## Back Pack Hack

NotTooProudToHide said:


> I don't think a scenario where money is worthless is very likely. While it could happen odds are far more favorable for temporary and or localized situations where things have gone wrong and in these situations currency will still hold value. Rather than buying gold you're far better off paying off debt, having cash on hand, having some sort of investment account, having as much money as you can in a savings/checking account, and finally having a piece of property that you hold the deed to clear and free.


When the grid is down and the banks are all closed, what good is a bank balance?

Having the deed to your land is meaningless when you're outgunned.


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## Maine-Marine

Verba Bellum said:


> People who are relying on they're precious metal stash during SHTF
> View attachment 102095


I do not know of any prepper that relies on precious metals for SHTF... but part of being prepared is not being blind to the possible eventualities of the need for precious metals.

I think that anybody who does not have some put away should be forced to turn in their prepper membership card and banned from calling themselves a prepper


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## NotTooProudToHide

Back Pack Hack said:


> When the grid is down and the banks are all closed, what good is a bank balance?
> 
> Having the deed to your land is meaningless when you're outgunned.


The assumption here is that services are down and their not coming back, I don't believe that is realistic. It is far more likely most grid down situations are temporary and localized meaning that bank account is going to be there when services are restored or should you bug out to an area that's not affected. That deed is going to give you legal protections to your property so if someone tries to take it you can have law enforcement remove them when services are restored. Having a supply of cash on hand in addition to your preps (which absolutely should include home security/defense) will help you weather the storm.

There's more to prepping than being ready for that worst case scenario, its a lifestyle where you build resources to get you through lean times, and having financial independence/security goes a long way to ensure you can deal with whatever comes your way.


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## Verba Bellum

Maine-Marine said:


> I do not know of any prepper that relies on precious metals for SHTF... but part of being prepared is not being blind to the possible eventualities of the need for precious metals.
> 
> I think that anybody who does not have some put away should be forced to turn in their prepper membership card and banned from calling themselves a prepper


That's why I said people.. not "preppers"


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## Denton

Verba Bellum said:


> People who are relying on they're precious metal stash during SHTF
> View attachment 102095


Cute but inaccurate.
Are you going to rely on Federal Reserve notes? Unlike silver, they'll be worthless.
Figure on trading some things you need for some other things you need? You'll need those things. @paulag1955 thinks it'd take years to determine the value of silver and gold. That's an assumption. I'd be willing to assert that an ounce of silver would quickly be valued at around 20 "dollars."

Now, if you don't have room in your preps for some silver, that is your decision. Me? I prefer to add it to the things I think will be helpful. After all, it has been valuable for thousands of years, unlike the USD.


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## Maine-Marine

Verba Bellum said:


> That's why I said people.. not "preppers"


when i think about people that have metals for SHTF... non-prepper people do not come to mind

if i heard people talking about Silver and SHTF in the same sentence... I think PREPPERRRRRRRR


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## paulag1955

Denton said:


> @paulag1955 thinks it'd take years to determine the value of silver and gold. That's an assumption. I'd be willing to assert that an ounce of silver would quickly be valued at around 20 "dollars."


Aren't we all operating on assumptions about how things will be?


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## rice paddy daddy

I inherited many silver coins.
I sold them when the market was the highest, about 10 years ago.

:tango_face_smile::tango_face_grin:


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## Back Pack Hack

Anyone who claims to know 'how things will go' is lying.


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## Denton

paulag1955 said:


> Aren't we all operating on assumptions about how things will be?


To an extent, but people don't like uncertainty and will normalize and standardize things as quickly as possible. I use 20 "dollars" from a historical reference of our nation's past, before the Federal Reserve. The Devil in the details is that we have been under the rule of the Federal Reserve and its inflation and deflation for over a century. To the point that many think silver and gold are nothing. Still, it won't take long for it to be sorted. After all, ten ounces of silver is easier to carry than a wagon full of collards.


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## paulag1955

Denton said:


> To an extent, but people don't like uncertainty and will normalize and standardize things as quickly as possible. I use 20 "dollars" from a historical reference of our nation's past, before the Federal Reserve. The Devil in the details is that we have been under the rule of the Federal Reserve and its inflation and deflation for over a century. To the point that many think silver and gold are nothing. Still, it won't take long for it to be sorted. After all, ten ounces of silver is easier to carry than a wagon full of collards.


A wagon of collards would be worthless in Washington!


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## Denton

paulag1955 said:


> A wagon of collards would be worthless in Washington!


What?!? They don't eat greens in D.C.? It's worse than I thought.


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## paulag1955

Denton said:


> What?!? They don't eat greens in D.C.? It's worse than I thought.


Ohhhh, no. Washington state. At least we have a good half. and, no, greens aren't a big thing here unless you're talking kale salad.


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## Denton

paulag1955 said:


> Ohhhh, no. Washington state. At least we have a good half. and, no, greens aren't a big thing here unless you're talking kale salad.


I would surely starve there, too. What is life without collards? It is worthless.


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## paulag1955

Denton said:


> I would surely starve there, too. What is life without collards? It is worthless.


Our youngest went to college in Alabama and she assured me that collards are disgusting.


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## Denton

paulag1955 said:


> Our youngest went to college in Alabama and she assured me that collards are disgusting.


We paid her to lie to you. We don't want a run on collards to happen.


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## Demitri.14

Just do it, if the clerk looks funny at you, tell them they are to protect barrel of your rifle when its wet outside !


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## Deebo

"All I brung was lead"


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## The Tourist

I still have buckets of cast bullets in the gunroom, and it's a good thing the way my right hand will tremble a bit nowadays. I used to wait for a scalding hot summer day and cast bullets until the lead ingots ran out. There used to be plenty of places to shoot near me, but then, we were on the edge of 'civilization.' Now I'm in the same house, but smack in the middle of suburbia!


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## Prepared One

paulag1955 said:


> Ohhhh, no. Washington state. At least we have a good half. and, no, greens aren't a big thing here unless you're talking kale salad.


Not in my most delusional or drunken state of mind and body, would I ever, ever, discuss Kale salad. :tango_face_grin:


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## paulag1955

Denton said:


> We paid her to lie to you. We don't want a run on collards to happen.


I'll have to seriously consider that. Her salary is criminally low and I'm pretty sure she'd take money to tell that lie.


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## paulag1955

Prepared One said:


> Not in my most delusional or drunken state of mind and body, would I ever, ever, discuss Kale salad. :tango_face_grin:


Okay, but it's your loss.


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## paulag1955

Demitri.14 said:


> Just do it, if the clerk looks funny at you, tell them they are to protect barrel of your rifle when its wet outside !


That is hilarious, but I would be blushing so furiously that I don't think I could pull it off!


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## Camel923

Gold is valuable once the crosses passes and it’s time to rebuild. Silver is much better for barter as well as trad items that may become hard to obtain. Booze, tobacco, lighters, canned meat.


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## bigwheel

Annie said:


> Bibles, rosaries, blest candles and holy water. If it gets really bad people will want these things more than silver. Not for barter, but given freely.


Yep..yampum beads should be in high demand after the big War.


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## bigwheel

paulag1955 said:


> Aren't we all operating on assumptions about how things will be?


Yep. Prepper mentality is pretty easy to spot. They build scary imaginary future worlds in their heads and insist to move in and live there. The concept is not very heavily supported by the Bible. It seems like it says...there is enough evil for today than to spend much time worrying about tomorrow. lol. So we just fret about it a little. Too dang much training in Boy Scouts. lol.


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## rice paddy daddy

Denton said:


> I would surely starve there, too. What is life without collards? It is worthless.


Man can not live by collard greens alone!!
He must have mustard greens, and turnip greens too!!
With fat back added to the liquor. (I threw that in to see how many Southerners we have here)


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## Denton

rice paddy daddy said:


> Man can not live by collard greens alone!!
> He must have mustard greens, and turnip greens too!!
> With fat back added to the liquor. (I threw that in to see how many Southerners we have here)


Pot Likker, as Lewis Grizzard wrote it.


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## bigwheel

rice paddy daddy said:


> Man can not live by collard greens alone!!
> He must have mustard greens, and turnip greens too!!
> With fat back added to the liquor. (I threw that in to see how many Southerners we have here)


Well Collard greens..chicken wings..oxtails and chitterlings was considered soul food back in the Texas oil patch. We ate white folks food. lol. Will admit to loving turnip greens and mustard greens I have done died and went to heaven..cooked or in a salad raw. I have tried canned collards a few times. Always taste like their is a stink bug in it. Is that normal for collards? Thanks.


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## Deebo

Poke salad, collard greens, turnips, I put that hot pepper sauce on them and go to town. Havent had any a while. 
My dad used to make a damn good cabbage and ham mix. MMMM
And since were remembering, his pineapple upside down cake and dump cakes were BOMB


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## Old SF Guy

paraquack said:


> The precious metal I prefer is copper plated lead, and lots of it.


Agreed, If I'm going to get into trading metals with anyone....I'll bet on Copper plated, lead over gold every time....its more practical.


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## Verba Bellum

Denton said:


> Cute but inaccurate.
> Are you going to rely on Federal Reserve notes? Unlike silver, they'll be worthless.
> Figure on trading some things you need for some other things you need? You'll need those things.
> @paulag1955 thinks it'd take years to determine the value of silver and gold. That's an assumption. I'd be willing to assert that an ounce of silver would quickly be valued at around 20 "dollars."
> 
> Now, if you don't have room in your preps for some silver, that is your decision. Me? I prefer to add it to the things I think will be helpful. After all, it has been valuable for thousands of years, unlike the USD.


I never once suggested that we shouldn't set aside some gold or silver.. I'm just saying don't RELY on it. For many people, that's all they do, stash away precious metals.. and it's silly.


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## Denton

Verba Bellum said:


> I never once suggested that we shouldn't set aside some gold or silver.. I'm just saying don't RELY on it. For many people, that's all they do, stash away precious metals.. and it's silly.


Stocking up on just one thing isn't smart.


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## Crunch

Two almost universal constants when preppers discuss precious metals are that there's strong beliefs on both sides, and rarely is anyone's mind ever changed in the end.  That said, I decided gold made sense for us since it has value whether the SHTF or not, it's been used as money (or a store of value/medium of exchange) for thousands of years unlike anything else, and money is something we use every day so good to have some and kept under our own control. I know it's not always going to be the answer, just more often than not IMO.

A couple other things I rarely see discussed about money after the SHTF is for use in black markets and for bribes. Underground markets for things in demand but are not otherwise obtainable, and corruption, always seem to follow disaster. "Everything has a price" and "pay me or take your place at the back of the line" seems to generally apply. That probably deserves its own thread.

As a side note, about a year ago I did some math on the cost in gold for some items in 301 AD Rome, based on the Edict of Maximum Prices (some prices from it listed here: https://community.plu.edu/~315j06/doc/what-things.pdf) and using the gold price of about $1,300 per troy ounce or $42.50 per gram at the time. I was just curious how the prices of things compared when priced in gold from 1,700 years ago to today, to find whether gold really did hold it's value, or purchasing power, over that amount of time. The amount of gold in the Roman coins and the official exchange rate in Denarii Communes fluctuated a lot in a short number of years because Rome was going through it's own period of hyperinflation at the time (which is why the edict was needed in the first place), but a couple items:

A sextarius (1.1 pint) of beer would cost 80 cents worth of gold. If you consider it at the case or keg price today, that's pretty close.

The price for a libra (11 ounces) of meat, after averaging the prices of poultry, beef, pork, and fish together, came out to about $4 per pound when converted to gold. Again, pretty close.

A lawyer to plead your case in court would cost $450. That'd probably be a bargain for a lawyer today except maybe for something petty like a littering ticket.

I did have some numbers for wheat and loaves of bread but must have deleted them, IIRC bread today is about half the price as it was then. Haircuts were much cheaper in 300 AD Rome though, only 50 cents. I also tried finding the cost for a Roman soldier's sword or shield but couldn't, thought it would be interesting to compare those to the cost of a rifle or a bullet resistant vest today. Anyway, just something to consider if you're looking at gold as an investment. It might fluctuate in price in the short(er) term, but very constant in longer terms.


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## The Tourist

Crunch said:


> I also tried finding the cost for a Roman soldier's sword or shield but couldn't.


Well, I cannot tell how much it cost to make a gladius, but I'll bet I can come pretty close to how much it costs to sharpen one.

Roman soldiers died by the thousands fighting in the phalanx. Roman rulers were assassinated. But consider this, sword makers and polishers went to the British Isles because they were craftsmen. Sure, many Romans were killed and driven back to Rome. But let's be honest, sword polishers worked for anyone.


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## SOCOM42

I have $5,000.00 in cash stowed away, and not in the bank, mostly 1,5, 10 and 20's.

I consider, bullets and food more valuable than gold, silver or precious stones.

In a real drawn out post SHTF scenario those non edible items are useless.

Look what happened to the Jews in Europe, Their treasure was for the most part useless after 1939.

With the real possibility of a revolution in this country as thing are developing towards it,

those two items I mentioned are becoming more important.

Those bastard$ in power in Virginia are showing us what to expect from the socialist/communist left.

If the SHTF, all commerce transport will stop and you will go with what you got on hand.

Any and all stores will be death traps to avoid, store now!


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## Annie

bigwheel said:


> Yep..yampum beads should be in high demand after the big War.


Merry Christmas, Bigwheel.


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## Back Pack Hack

One barter item no one ever thinks of: _Clothing._

Can be purchased über-cheap any day of the week at any one of millions of thrift stores, garage/yard sales etc. Easy to store. Never expires. Always in need.

And if you buy it right, you'll have the 'perfect size' for yourself if you start losing weight after SHTF.


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## SOCOM42

Annie said:


> Merry Christmas, Bigwheel.
> 
> View attachment 102135


Hey! I got one of those (not the nun) in 45 ACP, have had it for 40 years now.

Also have about 50 mags for it, 10 are loaded in the safe, oh, it is full auto.


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## SOCOM42

Back Pack Hack said:


> One barter item no one ever thinks of: _Clothing._
> 
> Can be purchased über-cheap any day of the week at any one of millions of thrift stores, garage/yard sales etc. Easy to store. Never expires. Always in need.
> 
> And if you buy it right, you'll have the 'perfect size' for yourself if you start losing weight after SHTF.


I personally have thought of clothing for storage, have plenty,

including brand new USAF arctic parkas and pants, mickey mouse boots also.

I also have 9 sets of new woodland cammo shirts and pants, field jackets and liners,

plus a dozen used, that is the correct pattern for my location.

I use to be in the mil surplus business at one time, those comm shelters I have posted are from that time.

Some of those sets are exactly as you say reduced sizes for loss of weight.

One of the other great scores were a dozen mil arctic sleeping bags, brand new.

I have plenty of "civilian" clothing put aside also,

bought jeans from BJ's every other week along with shirts and just stashed them away.

I went a little crazy after getting a $250,000. inheritance.


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## Back Pack Hack

SOCOM42 said:


> I personally have thought of clothing for storage, have plenty,
> 
> including brand new USAF arctic parkas and pants, mickey mouse boots also.
> 
> I also have 9 sets of new woodland cammo shirts and pants, field jackets and liners,
> 
> plus a dozen used, that is the correct pattern for my location.
> 
> I use to be in the mil surplus business at one time, those comm shelters I have posted are from that time.
> 
> Some of those sets are exactly as you say reduced sizes for loss of weight.
> 
> One of the other great scores were a dozen mil arctic sleeping bags, brand new.
> 
> I have plenty of "civilian" clothing put aside also,
> 
> bought jeans from BJ's every other week along with shirts and just stashed them away.
> 
> I went a little crazy after getting a $250,000. inheritance.


Stockin' up on duds for yessef is one thing.

Stockin' up as a barter item is quite another.


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## SOCOM42

Back Pack Hack said:


> Stockin' up on duds for yessef is one thing.
> 
> Stockin' up as a barter item is quite another.


I plan no barter at all with any of my stored goods.

I have skill sets that I would use for barter, do it now, welding, machining, plumbing, electrical.


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

SOCOM42 said:


> I plan no barter at all with any of my stored goods.
> 
> I have skill sets that I would use for barter, do it now, welding, machining, plumbing, electrical.


But don't you think it would be prudent to have something you are willing use as barter material? Sometimes a few shiny bits will be what others really want.


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## SOCOM42

Honkerhunteronhoth said:


> But don't you think it would be prudent to have something you are willing use as barter material? Sometimes a few shiny bits will be what others really want.


I have 31 cases of 151 proof rum, 100 proof vodka, 190 proof grain alcohol, whiskey and gin in 750 ML bottles,

if I ever wanted to use it for such.

It all came from a friends package store when he died, I don't drink anything, never have, never will.

I have skill sets including professional gunsmithing that I can use to barter.

Have been a gunsmith full and part time for over 60 years, that is an important skill just on its own.

I can make parts if no replacements are available, how many can do that???

I made the tool room samples of the M16A1 at H&R in the 70's when we had a contract for them.

I have had AR-15's since they first came out in 1964, prefer 30 cal and not in an AR like you have.

I live in a rural area here, none of our group have any interest in barter at this time.

Having prepped for over 40 years there is not much I am without.


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

SOCOM42 said:


> I have 31 cases of 151 proof rum, 100 proof vodka, 190 proof grain alcohol, whiskey and gin in 750 ML bottles,
> 
> if I ever wanted to use it for such.
> 
> It all came from a friends package store when he died, I don't drink anything, never have, never will.
> 
> I have skill sets including professional gunsmithing that I can use to barter.
> 
> Have been a gunsmith full and part time for over 60 years, that is an important skill just on its own.
> 
> I can make parts if no replacements are available, how many can do that???
> 
> I made the tool room samples of the M16A1 at H&R in the 70's when we had a contract for them.
> 
> I have had AR-15's since they first came out in 1964, prefer 30 cal and not in an AR like you have.


So you do have things you will be willing to use as barter material besides your time and labor. The alcohol and the vodka in particular would be of great value. 
Having multiple things to offer, is not exactly a bad idea.


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## SOCOM42

Honkerhunteronhoth said:


> So you do have things you will be willing to use as barter material besides your time and labor. The alcohol and the vodka in particular would be of great value.
> Having multiple things to offer, is not exactly a bad idea.


The primary reason those cases are stored is for medical/antiseptic reasons, they were not intended for barter.

No food, guns, ammunition, fuel, med supplies or clothing would ever go out of here.


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

SOCOM42 said:


> The primary reason those cases are stored is for medical/antiseptic reasons, they were not intended for barter.
> 
> No food, guns, ammunition, fuel, med supplies or clothing would ever go out of here.


Sometimes one has to be flexible if somebody has something you really need. 
Which is why having "sacred cow's" can also be a hindrance to business.

But we each have our ways of doing things and they are neither right or wrong, just different.


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## Slippy

Honkerhunteronhoth said:


> So you do have things you will be willing to use as barter material besides your time and labor. The alcohol and the vodka in particular would be of great value.
> Having multiple things to offer, is not exactly a bad idea.


If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


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## SOCOM42

Slippy said:


> If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


You are right, that is my position at this point in my prep life.

I would only do something for someone I know for a fee, the hell with everyone else around here.


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

Slippy said:


> If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


Which is also a big "if". We try to be as prepared as possible but sometimes you won't have everything including information. At times you might have to buy goodwill or simply gift people things for their goodwill. Much like giving a gift to a landowner who lets you hunt on their property. A small token bottle of whisky and a few pounds of summer sausage goes a long way. But the small price paid up front might reap epic rewards in the end.


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## Back Pack Hack

Slippy said:


> If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


You might have to "barter" some lead to_ keep_ what you have. Jus' sayin'


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## The Tourist

That's the nice thing about being my age--in the long run. I bought all of this "survivor stuff" back when attics were assailed for their 'clutter.'

I also made sure I could polish anything with no electricity. I think I could build a very nice moat with all the boxes of noodles we have salted away...


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## Slippy

Back Pack Hack said:


> You might have to "barter" some lead to_ keep_ what you have. Jus' sayin'


Yes, and the Charitable and Giving Slippy is fully prepared to freely give of this lead!...at anywhere from 900 to 3600 Feet Per Second!


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## Smitty901

Back Pack Hack said:


> You might have to "barter" some lead to_ keep_ what you have. Jus' sayin'


 That could be read a couple ways. We are not leaving. SHTF this cold country will not be on many people list of places to go. We will ride it out here. Barter will not be a be issue we can grow more food they we will ever need. One thing that maybe in short supply will always be labor. But once SHTF you will have a lot more time on your hands . Most of it will be spent with some type of labor.
Our lead will be t keep others from taking what is ours. And to keep those we share with from getting any Ideas.


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## The Tourist

Well, Slip, if you can fire a projectile at 3600 FPS, it ain't lead, it must be linotype.

I was a caster, and I had trouble getting enough tin into a bullet to go beyond 2200 to 2400 FPS. I was too cheap to go any further...


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

Smitty901 said:


> That could be read a couple ways. We are not leaving. SHTF this cold country will not be on many people list of places to go. We will ride it out here. Barter will not be a be issue we can grow more food they we will ever need. One thing that maybe in short supply will always be labor. But once SHTF you will have a lot more time on your hands . Most of it will be spent with some type of labor.
> Our lead will be t keep others from taking what is ours. And to keep those we share with from getting any Ideas.


It will be the little luxury items in life that people will want. Smokes and Copenhagen, alcohol, seasonings, etc. That last packet of Chick Fil A sauce and bottle of Cholulu or Texas Pete might be worth it's weight in gold!


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## Smitty901

The Tourist said:


> Well, Slip, if you can fire a projectile at 3600 FPS, it ain't lead, it must be linotype.
> 
> I was a caster, and I had trouble getting enough tin into a bullet to go beyond 2200 to 2400 FPS. I was too cheap to go any further...


Tourist we shot accelerator rounds out of 308 at over 4,000 fps. They were really for punching holes in paper more than anything else and some times the bullet split or turned dust.


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## Elvis

paulag1955 said:


> Our youngest went to college in Alabama and she assured me that collards are disgusting.


Tell her to add some vinegar to the collards.


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## paulag1955

Elvis said:


> Tell her to add some vinegar to the collards.


I'm quite sure that wherever it was she had them, they were prepared and served properly. I'm certain she never cooked them herself. LOL


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## Elvis

Slippy said:


> If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


But there is always something your missed. Something as simple as work gloves or flea meds for your dog. Maybe you'd need an 10 amp diode for a solar panel or flints for your Zippo lighter.
Barter will happen eventually.

Low value sized PMs are a simpler way to make trade happen.


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## Elvis

Honkerhunteronhoth said:


> Which is also a big "if". We try to be as prepared as possible but sometimes you won't have everything including information. At times you might have to buy goodwill or simply gift people things for their goodwill. Much like giving a gift to a landowner who lets you hunt on their property. A small token bottle of whisky and a few pounds of summer sausage goes a long way. But the small price paid up front might reap epic rewards in the end.


While I'm a big believer in trade I've given up on trade for goodwill. 
Value for value.


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## Elvis

Honkerhunteronhoth said:


> It will be the little luxury items in life that people will want. Smokes and Copenhagen, alcohol, seasonings, etc. That last packet of Chick Fil A sauce and bottle of Cholulu or Texas Pete might be worth it's weight in gold!


Buy a few tobacco seeds and toss them in the freezer. Good for 5+ years.


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## paulag1955

Elvis said:


> Buy a few tobacco seeds and toss them in the freezer. Good for 5+ years.


Funny you should mention this because I was, literally, just thinking about this yesterday. Better than just tossing them in the freezer, plant a few each year and let them go to seed.


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## Crunch

paulag1955 said:


> Funny you should mention this because I was, literally, just thinking about this yesterday. Better than just tossing them in the freezer, plant a few each year and let them go to seed.


That's what I did, but with the intent to only grow a few plants every 2nd or 3rd year for new seeds.










I'm a little overdue... Each of the pods contains hundreds of seeds, thinking I may try starting these indoors in April to see if any are still viable, then transplant them after the risk of frost is gone if any do sprout.


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## Crunch

Slippy said:


> If you have everything you need, there is no reason to barter.


But what if what you need is an appendectomy? Hard to put one of those on the shelf


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## Honkerhunteronhoth

Elvis said:


> Buy a few tobacco seeds and toss them in the freezer. Good for 5+ years.


I don't have much of a growing season for much of anything. We just get a snowing season from October through May. Followed by hail. Rinse and repeat.


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## bigwheel

Smitty901 said:


> Tourist we shot accelerator rounds out of 308 at over 4,000 fps. They were really for punching holes in paper more than anything else and some times the bullet split or turned dust.


An old coyote hunting partner shot a lot of them in his naguht six. Recall he said the poi was different. Lower maybe? Never heard him bad mouthing the round too much but dont believe they sell em anymore. Gotta make your own maybe. 
https://eabco.com/remington-accelerator-sabots.html


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