# Second amendment sneak attack



## Texas (Nov 27, 2018)

I have seen two articles on this. Anybody notice that more states are approving medical and recreational use of marajuana? I’m sure everyone reading this has filled out a 4473, so you all know they ask you about marijuana use on the form. Some people that are getting these marijuana cards are getting turned away at the gun shop. I’m not saying that that’s a bad thing about not letting users buy guns, but what is bad is that we are being lead to think that it’s ok to use marijuana and that in turn is making more and more people who may not have bad intentions not able to buy a gun. Just thought I would throw that out there because I see it as a way for the government to decrease the amount of people who are able to exercise their second amendment rights discreetly.


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## Lunatic Wrench (May 13, 2018)

They don't seem to know that stoned people tend to be very mellow, unlike drunks, methheads, crackheads, cokeheads, etc. potheads are far less inclined to commit a crime with a gun.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Use weed no guns. Weed is still illegal and disqualifies you for firearms purchase. It's a federal law doesn't matter what the states say.


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## SGT E (Feb 25, 2015)

Funny thing is if you get oxycodone for a hemorrhoid operation...cancer...Hydrocodone for major dental work...or any other class 1 narcotic nobody is calling for shit to happen for your guns?...Whats worse...an Oxy or a joint?


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Yes its all a commie plot. I aint never seen a dope headed hippy that killed anybody either in a car wreck or a shooting. Maybe they are different up North. If democrats get on PCP they can continue to fight with half of their brain and heart shot out. That stuff aint normal. It should be illegal.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

Some things are worse than others. At some point the Dems and RINOs will change the federal laws for pot. I find it funny after raping tobacco companies via huge lawsuits and high taxes to get people to quit smoking, government is promoting the left handed cigarettes. Ironic.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

During the first year of the Obama administration, Senator Feinstein wanted to bar any veteran with PTSD from owning firearms. I paid close attention.
It going to be added to a defense bill.
Senator John McCain shot it down.


Now they are getting sneakier. Starting a year or so ago, all of a sudden there's a big push for the VA to prescribe marijuana for PTSD. 
Coincidence? Or another attempt to disarm veterans?

Because of our lovely government, I never filed a claim with the VA for PTSD. I just didn't trust them. Still don't. And I damn sure wouldn't try to get a pot card.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Camel923 said:


> Some things are worse than others. At some point the Dems and RINOs will change the federal laws for pot. I find it funny after raping tobacco companies via huge lawsuits and high taxes to get people to quit smoking, government is promoting the left handed cigarettes. Ironic.


Has any agency done a long term study on pot use and if it leads to harder drugs in time? just asking.....


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## StratMaster (Dec 26, 2017)

ekim said:


> Has any agency done a long term study on pot use and if it leads to harder drugs in time? just asking.....


https://prohbtd.com/35-years-ago-this-cannabis-report-made-nixon-furious


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Doesn't bother me!


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

ekim said:


> Has any agency done a long term study on pot use and if it leads to harder drugs in time? just asking.....


While not every pot smoker will go on to harder drugs, I don't think you'll find one heroin addict that just decided one day to stick a needle in his arm for the heck of it.
Just the same as not every alcohol drinker will go on to become a real alcoholic.

Studies HAVE shown, however, that regular pot use by teenagers retards mental development. Which would explain a lot about the current generation of young 'uns.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

I've dealt with stoners and drunks. I'd much rather deal with a stoner. I'd really prefer neither drive. or handle firearms while under the influence, and that is the thing. My CCL is void if I am under the influence of alcohol. Pot should be handled in the same way.


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## Gunn (Jan 1, 2016)

We are finding that people who smoke pot are just as libel to have problems with COPD and cancer. They looked down on cigarettes for this, how long until pot is looked down on?


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Gunn said:


> We are finding that people who smoke pot are just as libel to have problems with COPD and cancer. They looked down on cigarettes for this, how long until pot is looked down on?


They might be just as liable to have COPD and cancer as cigarette smokers but that has nothing to do with the 2nd Amendment.


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## StratMaster (Dec 26, 2017)

rice paddy daddy said:


> While not every pot smoker will go on to harder drugs, I don't think you'll find one heroin addict that just decided one day to stick a needle in his arm for the heck of it.
> Just the same as not every alcohol drinker will go on to become a real alcoholic.
> 
> Studies HAVE shown, however, that regular pot use by teenagers retards mental development. Which would explain a lot about the current generation of young 'uns.


I worked with The HRC for a few years, and knew lots of heroin addicts who couldn't stand pot. There's certainly crossover, but they're really two different crowds with different drug agendas. Ditto meth. Fact is, the biggest gateway drug on the planet is alcohol, not pot, yet no one likes it pointed out. If you get high on alcohol, you are WAY more likely to smoke or use other drugs. And BEER is THE gateway drug to hard liquor... a dangerous, highly addictive, mind altering and impairing drug responsible for WAY WAY WAY more violence and driving homicides. I tried it a few times myself in the 70's and didn't like it... but I do like bourbon. Having used both, I can say with certainty that alcohol is as strong, addictive, and dangerous as most schedule II drugs... whereas pot is not. We have weed stores on every corner here in Oregon, and the sky didn't fall... business as usual. Ditto liquor stores. A lot of to-do and fuss for decades about nothing after all.


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

This country is OVER medicated and people are addicted to legal prescription drugs, yet the government is worried about pot? Legalizing weed is just another form of control and the pot smokers don't even realize it.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Gunn said:


> We are finding that people who smoke pot are just as libel to have problems with COPD and cancer. They looked down on cigarettes for this, how long until pot is looked down on?


Do you have any idea what this thread is about or are you smoking pot?


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

ekim said:


> Do you have any idea what this thread is about or are you smoking pot?


Good thing skimming is not indicative of smoking pot. If so, @Cricket would demand that I went in for a company urinalysis test. :vs_laugh:


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Lunatic Wrench said:


> They don't seem to know that stoned people tend to be very mellow, unlike drunks, methheads, crackheads, cokeheads, etc. potheads are far less inclined to commit a crime with a gun.


 Stoned people do stupid stuff. They do not show good judgement . If you want to live a stoner life then leave the car and the guns to others. Yes I been around users most of my life so the it's good shit won't work on me.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

rice paddy daddy said:


> During the first year of the Obama administration, Senator Feinstein wanted to bar any veteran with PTSD from owning firearms. I paid close attention.
> It going to be added to a defense bill.
> Senator John McCain shot it down.
> 
> ...


I have known some veterans that were put on the prohibited list for having a payee. I do not know about the VA in your area, but the VA in Minneasota is very clear in not supporting and not providing medical cannabis for any condition. It is fairly common for veterans to come to the VA Medical Center in Minneapolis looking for VA prescribed cannabis since MN allows medical cannabis, and are always disappointed.
I do not have a problem with cannabis being legalized, but I do think that there should be some "body" overseeing the quality, safety and potency of the product. I also do not think that using cannabis should make a person a prohibited person in buying a gun, ever. Of course I am also a person that thinks anyone safe enough to be in the community and pay taxes should be able to exercise their 2nd amendment rights.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Denton said:


> I've dealt with stoners and drunks. I'd much rather deal with a stoner. I'd really prefer neither drive. or handle firearms while under the influence, and that is the thing. My CCL is void if I am under the influence of alcohol. Pot should be handled in the same way.


 In a prefect world , people would get drunk or stoned and lock their guns up and give away the car keys before they start. But that don't happen they get stoned and decide to go for a ride. Stones like drunks will risk what they must to get their high.
You see it all of the time condition of release sty sober no pot . But they will risk going back to jail to get their high. Also they are almost never revoke anyway. Pot is not harmless to others.


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## Denver (Nov 16, 2012)

I found I had lung cancer in 2015. (in remission) My oncologist said if I wanted to go to New Mexico I automatically qualified for a pot card. I thought about it then thought about the 4473 form. Turns out I never got sick from the chemo so didn't need the weed. Glad I didn't sign up for it.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Smitty901 said:


> In a prefect world , people would get drunk or stoned and lock their guns up and give away the car keys before they start. But that don't happen they get stoned and decide to go for a ride. Stones like drunks will risk what they must to get their high.
> You see it all of the time condition of release sty sober no pot . But they will risk going back to jail to get their high. Also they are almost never revoke anyway. Pot is not harmless to others.


So, do you want to further change the regs? Want to add another block on the 4473, asking if you drink alcoholic beverages?


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Denton said:


> So, do you want to further change the regs? Want to add another block on the 4473, asking if you drink alcoholic beverages?


 I don't want people smoking POT driving ever, I don't want them operating equipment of work sights. I don't want to have firearms or smoking that carp around others . But people want their high and they will stay stoned at any cost. I have no use for drunks either.
I have seen the results of harmless pot smoking on job sights and it is not harmless. And no the dude that get stone tonight is not fine on the job tomorrow they are a serious danger.


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

It is generating a lot fo discussion. 

I think the form needs to be changed to not ask about medical or recreational use of marijuana . Does it ask about alcohol? Legal is legal. Tring to think did I ever fill one out and not sure I ever have, Perhaps when I bought a Berretta 9 mm back in 1988. Every other weapon I have purchased/ given to me has been private sale in my state you only fill out the background check form buying from a licensed gun dealer.

I do think every gun sale/ gift/ transfer should require a background check - I don't think marijuana use should disqualify you . 

For now it is a non-issue in that they do not know what you have . Just make sure to get your guns prior to getting your marijuana medical card. 


I notice the Government of Canada has advised its citizens to purchase legal marijuana in Canada paying with cash as using a debt card leaves a trail. They don't want thier citizens getting hassled trying to cross into the US or flying thru. Seems the US customs has info that some Canadians bought legal Marijuana and are attempting to prevent them from crossing citing that reason. 

Not right in my opinion.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

Smitty901 said:


> I don't want people smoking POT driving ever, I don't want them operating equipment of work sights. I don't want to have firearms or smoking that carp around others . But people want their high and they will stay stoned at any cost. I have no use for drunks either.
> I have seen the results of harmless pot smoking on job sights and it is not harmless. And no the dude that get stone tonight is not fine on the job tomorrow they are a serious danger.


People who got three sheets to the wind are very dangerous the next day.

You skirted the question. Do you want people who consume alcoholic beverages banned from purchasing firearms?


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## RJAMES (Dec 23, 2016)

Camel923 said:


> Some things are worse than others. At some point the Dems and RINOs will change the federal laws for pot. I find it funny after raping tobacco companies via huge lawsuits and high taxes to get people to quit smoking, government is promoting the left handed cigarettes. Ironic.


Most of the people that I know who use medical marijuana eat a couple pieces of "candy " a day. Others use a couple drops of oil on thier tung . They do not smoke. Edibles that way you do not smell like smoke .


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

RJAMES said:


> It is generating a lot fo discussion.
> 
> I think the form needs to be changed to not ask about medical or recreational use of marijuana . Does it ask about alcohol? Legal is legal. Tring to think did I ever fill one out and not sure I ever have, Perhaps when I bought a Berretta 9 mm back in 1988. Every other weapon I have purchased/ given to me has been private sale in my state you only fill out the background check form buying from a licensed gun dealer.
> 
> ...


So, you want the government involved in private transactions and I want the government totally out of the firearms.


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## Texas (Nov 27, 2018)

I’m seeing some good points on here, but I am also seeing the point of the post be lost with some of you. The purpose of this post is to keep your gaurd up with some of your life choices because they could in turn cost you one or more of your rights. I agree that marijuana will bring down your situational awareness, motor skills, and regards to safety in many activities. The point is, YOUR RIGHTS ARE BEING TAKEN DISCREETLY WITH THINGS THAT ARE DEEMED “LEGAL”. Marijuana is not legal on a federal level. Some states say it’s ok, but that doesn’t mean it won’t cost you when it comes to your rights. Please spread the message far and wide so people can understand this better. Show them where this is stated on the 4473 under number 11 if they don’t believe you.


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## Texas (Nov 27, 2018)

Here it is. 11e.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Denton said:


> So, do you want to further change the regs? Want to add another block on the 4473, asking if you drink alcoholic beverages?


Question "E" on form 4473 does ask the person if he/she is "addicted to"....."any depressant," thus it really does already include alcohol. If NICS ever started including HIPPA data like treatments, then a whole lot of people could be determined to be prohibited. Food for thought if nothing else.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Denton said:


> People who got three sheets to the wind are very dangerous the next day.
> 
> You skirted the question. Do you want people who consume alcoholic beverages banned from purchasing firearms?


 If they have shown they have problems with it yes. Next question would I like to see it banned yes but wll never happen people will not give up their drugs.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

RJAMES said:


> Most of the people that I know who use medical marijuana eat a couple pieces of "candy " a day. Others use a couple drops of oil on thier tung . They do not smoke. Edibles that way you do not smell like smoke .


 Ok now how about the real world. Just an excuse to get high. One thing they want from pot a high and that is it.


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## Lunatic Wrench (May 13, 2018)

Smitty901 said:


> Stoned people do stupid stuff. They do not show good judgement . If you want to live a stoner life then leave the car and the guns to others. Yes I been around users most of my life so the it's good shit won't work on me.


Can't argue with that. 
I spent a fair part of my youth as one of them, been a few decades since I gave it up. Out of all the stoners I knew and was around (my mom and her friends were pot smoking hippies) I don't recall anyone getting the idea to hold up a 7-11 for a bag of Funions, a burrito and a slurpee or to get money to buy more weed. Even the stoner thieves I knew of were more crimes of opportunity and no weapons involved, shoplifting, car prowling and the like. 
Now on the dealer, smuggler, supplier side, that's a different story.

There are always exceptions, but I've had so many more negative dealings with drunks than stoners it doesn't even compare, and believe me, I know more than majority population about dealing with drunks and alcoholics.

As for me I always had a job to pay for a place to live a vehicle and my weed.

Not justifying anything here, just stating my point.


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## Lunatic Wrench (May 13, 2018)

Texas said:


> Here it is. 11e.


I have never seen anything that proves pot as addictive, not like oxy, antidepressants etc. When I gave it up I just stopped, no withdrawls, just changed how I lived my life.


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## StratMaster (Dec 26, 2017)

Smitty901 said:


> Ok now how about the real world. Just an excuse to get high. One thing they want from pot a high and that is it.


Just like alcohol.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Lunatic Wrench said:


> I have never seen anything that proves pot as addictive, not like oxy, antidepressants etc. When I gave it up I just stopped, no withdrawls, just changed how I lived my life.


 You are not looking then


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Deep thoughts from Slippy!

In a FREE Society, there is no Form 4473

In a FREE Society, there is no discussion about legalizing or criminalizing a plant that can be grown and harvested on your property

I suspect that if Mrs S were to die should SHTF and my osteoarthritis were to continue on its quest to cripple me, I may give it a shot and utilize my green thumbery skills to cultivate me some Acapulco Gold or Maui Wowie for medicinal purposes. But until then, I'll pass.

Just sayin...


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Slippy said:


> Deep thoughts from Slippy!
> 
> In a FREE Society, there is no Form 4473
> 
> ...


If you rely on it to get by daily from the pain is it not the same as being addicted? Just sayin....


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## Texas (Nov 27, 2018)

Doesn’t really matter if it’s addictive or not. If you get the card you lose the right to defend yourself legally in any state! Someone brought up a good point about the HIPPA laws being exposed to the ATF or FBI in regards to the 4473. It’s things like that we need to look for as pro 2A Americans. This marijuana thing is just something I have researched after seeing those articles. I’m sure there are more things relevant to this that we are completely missing because we are talking about what is addictive or what should be on the form. What we really need to be doing is looking into what else may be affecting our second amendment right and discuss how we can make these discreet attacks known to the population. I urge any of you that have a YouTube channel or social media account to put this out there. We need to get the message out there and possibly get some feedback about other things like this that we may not know about. Knowledge about these things could make a difference in people’s choices that may restrict any of their rights.


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## Real Old Man (Aug 17, 2015)

Texas said:


> I have seen two articles on this. Anybody notice that more states are approving medical and recreational use of marajuana? I'm sure everyone reading this has filled out a 4473, so you all know they ask you about marijuana use on the form. Some people that are getting these marijuana cards are getting turned away at the gun shop. I'm not saying that that's a bad thing about not letting users buy guns, but what is bad is that we are being lead to think that it's ok to use marijuana and that in turn is making more and more people who may not have bad intentions not able to buy a gun. Just thought I would throw that out there because I see it as a way for the government to decrease the amount of people who are able to exercise their second amendment rights discreetly.


Perhaps reading the form would be in order. Unlawful use or addicted are the terms used on the actual form. If prescribed by a MD and it's legal in your state its legal.

How about getting ones panties in a wad over something serious. Like the lack of Choco ice cream during a SHTF event.

Merry Christmas to all


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Slippy said:


> Deep thoughts from Slippy!
> 
> In a FREE Society, there is no Form 4473
> 
> ...





ekim said:


> If you rely on it to get by daily from the pain is it not the same as being addicted? Just sayin....


I hear you Mike,

What I was referring to was and Over-Reaching government.

My pain management can and should be up to me especially if I can make it naturally and am not hurting anyone else by doing it.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Slippy said:


> I hear you Mike,
> 
> What I was referring to was and Over-Reaching government.
> 
> My pain management can and should be up to me especially if I can make it naturally and am not hurting anyone else by doing it.


I agree it's the government that is the problem.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

ekim said:


> Has any agency done a long term study on pot use and if it leads to harder drugs in time? just asking.....


Not sure of any definitive studies on the topic but as an old wore out Kiddy cop and DARE Lady I got exposed to quite a bit of real life scenarios. I would have to say yes that some of the kids do want stronger drugs so thats when some of them venture over into da hood to try out some heroine. Which at the huge high scoool were I sometimes hung out usually killed a few kids per year...not to mention a few dying from prespcrition meds. The biggest gateway drug for the pot smokers seems to be cigarettes. A kid normally has to learn to like those things before they can start huffing on reefer. At the risk of redundancy always follow money. Seagrams and Bud invested multi milions to pay off sleazy politicans to keep it illegal for way too long. Now they are interested in marketing their own THC infused beverages..so now the money will swing back to them who want to do some kinda rational legalizaton. Pot is the most valuable cash crop in the world. The guvment wants a cut. lol


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## Texas (Nov 27, 2018)

Real Old Man said:


> Texas said:
> 
> 
> > I have seen two articles on this. Anybody notice that more states are approving medical and recreational use of marajuana? I'm sure everyone reading this has filled out a 4473, so you all know they ask you about marijuana use on the form. Some people that are getting these marijuana cards are getting turned away at the gun shop. I'm not saying that that's a bad thing about not letting users buy guns, but what is bad is that we are being lead to think that it's ok to use marijuana and that in turn is making more and more people who may not have bad intentions not able to buy a gun. Just thought I would throw that out there because I see it as a way for the government to decrease the amount of people who are able to exercise their second amendment rights discreetly.
> ...


Maybe you missed my post on this thread where I included a picture of the question on the form. Along with what you said it does state that marijuana is NOT legal on a federal level. So even if it's legal in your state and a doctor prescribes it to you, you can be prohibited from buying a firearm. Here it is again.


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

ekim said:


> I agree it's the government that is the problem.


When has the government not been the problem? That is the question.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Prepared One said:


> When has the government not been the problem? That is the question.


Probably around 1783 give or take a year. Sense then it's been all down hill. Especially when they found out they could give themselves more money and pass laws on the common people and answer to no one for it.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

ekim said:


> Probably around 1783 give or take a year. Sense then it's been all down hill. Especially when they found out they could give themselves more money and pass laws on the common people and answer to no one for it.


Actually, before then. Before the thought of a government.


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