# What if?



## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

First off all I have to mention that I would not like to start a political topic I just want to have your opinions

Generally we talk about shtf like a world without rules but what would you do if goverment , police and laws still exists but it is against you , this means you can use weapons to protect you because there is still law , you can not call police because they are against you , you will not be judged fairly because it is controlled by goverment but 10-20 goverment supporters can easily attack you with a knife or bats because they are sure that police is behind hem. Yes you are right I'm talking about Turkey right now.....

If this turns to a civil war I know what I have to do but for now I can not think better than increasing my food stocks,ammo,etc.

So what would you do?









Goverment supporter working with police

































Great Summary






at this video tens of thousand people are asking for more pepper sprey from police and cheering "pepper gas oley" (Biber Gazı Oley )


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## Inor (Mar 22, 2013)

You do whatever you have to do to protect yourself and your family. If it come to that, make sure you hide the bodies well. My prayers go to you brother.


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

at about 32ish i sprayed pepper spray in my mouth to show my little brother, he's 7 years younger, that it only stops pussies, it wasn't so bad


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## Silverback (Jan 20, 2014)

I have told my girl the same thing Murph when she told me that was her chosen defense. There is quite a bit of misconception to what will stop a motivated assailant. I too have been sprayed, I'd say the last 100 meters of a 4 minute mile was much worse.


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## Silverback (Jan 20, 2014)

I should add hero, I noticed your location. Stay Safe.


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## Beach Kowboy (Feb 13, 2014)

Inor said:


> You do whatever you have to do to protect yourself and your family. If it come to that, make sure you hide the bodies well. My prayers go to you brother.


That's right. Some people aren't willing to do certain things.. You do WHATEVER it takes to keep yourself,your family and friends safe. Whatever it takes... A friend will help you move. A true friend will help you move dead bodies!!


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## Charles Martel (Mar 10, 2014)

Keep your head down, man. Avoid the authorities at just about any cost. Stay safe.


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## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

thanks for the comments and wishes but I should surely add that these pepper spreys is not like the ones which civil people can buy , they are very strong and today one police is dead too because of gas even he was in armored vehicle with protection.

Yes I shoud keep my head down and stay safe but when I do this I feel very bad cause I'm leaving my people alone outside and also this does not mean that they will not come for you one day because they are tracking all internet and they keep records from facebook and twitter posts to know who are against them also I'm sure that this posts are followed too thats why I can not clearly mention my real feelings.


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## Beach Kowboy (Feb 13, 2014)

herofb said:


> thanks for the comments and wishes but I should surely add that these pepper spreys is not like the ones which civil people can buy , they are very strong and today one police is dead too because of gas even he was in armored vehicle with protection.
> 
> Yes I shoud keep my head down and stay safe but when I do this I feel very bad cause I'm leaving my people alone outside and also this does not mean that they will not come for you one day because they are tracking all internet and they keep records from facebook and twitter posts to know who are against them also I'm sure that this posts are followed too thats why I can not clearly mention my real feelings.


Trust me, the pepper spray they are using is not some kind of "super" spray...If someone died it was because of an allergy or there was something else involved.. As for social media. Expect them to read EVERYTHING.. I know I write some crazy shit sometimes and I always assume they are reading it.. I have never came out and made a threat though. Sure, I might say I wish for something to happen but that's it.. I never say I am going to do something myself.. That would be illegal and we can't have that!!!


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

Silverback said:


> I have told my girl the same thing Murph when she told me that was her chosen defense. There is quite a bit of misconception to what will stop a motivated assailant. I too have been sprayed, I'd say the last 100 meters of a 4 minute mile was much worse.


I agree...watch






A K9, baton, my striking surfaces, or a gun. Best way of defending.


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## SAR-1L (Mar 13, 2013)

I don't know how long your situation will last but I would say the following for your advice.

#1 Do you have to stay? Do you have relatives outside of town? If you can get out of Instanbul let things blow over, and if they don't then at least you aren't at the epicenter.
#2 If you must stay, have a proactive plan with you and your family members, know safe routes and backup locations to regroup should you need to leave your home.
#3 Keep in contact with friends, to ensure you know the status of any stores or places where you may need to get supplies, any unnecessary or wasted travel is always extra danger.

#4 Make your home defensible, consider furniture to block door ways, designate a safe room or secondary exit.
#5 Stay away from large groups, mobs etc, stay out of the streets, remember government officials will be focused on active groups in the effected area.
#6 Use contacts to keep tabs of where flash points are building, rioter's will bring looters, and set fires to buildings, police will be arresting, and shooting ( hopefully non lethal rounds ) 
detaining citizens, and moving them to another location dependent on circumstances.

#7 be prepared for a looter or small group of looters who may try to force entry into your home if you are on the first floor, baseball bats, piping, and other bludgeon like objects can be used for defense.
#8 If you need to fight off a home invader, use fortified choke points and blind spots, for instance a coffee table blocking the door that they must crawl over or under, so you can hit them or help keep space between you and them
where a bat or bludgeon would have range advantage against a shank or knife.
#9 if you suspect they have guns, fortify the walls of a single room closest to the point of entry, Bathrooms with tile, make sure your family is taking shelter in a bathtub if it isn't the cheap plastic type. Use the blind spots
aim for the wrist of the weapon, force them to have to come around the corner and scan the room to find you, giving you a first strike advantage, try to break their arm/wrist, focus on disarming their firearm.

#10 Don't be afraid to run, Don't be afraid to fight, Being afraid is ok, but you can't stand still, you can't afford to do nothing.

I hope this helps, keep us up to date, depending on your situation hopefully I can offer more and better advice based on your situation.


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## Silverback (Jan 20, 2014)

Perfect example video Smokin


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## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

I'm sorry I think I am not mentioning the correct name of the gas because we generally say pepper sprey to the gases police use but believe me it is not something you know because they are not used in your countries cause they are against international laws and not allowed to use against people because of human rights.

also the most of the problem is they are using gas cannisters as bullets and directly aiming to the people even it has to be thrown with a 45 degree 

in Turkey now people are swearing politicians from twitter like this : dear Sir please kindly be informed that people are calling you ..... so you are not swearing your are just informing


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## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

I just saw SAR-1L sorry , thanks for your great advices , I will try to keep them


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

herofb said:


> thanks for the comments and wishes but I should surely add that these pepper spreys is not like the ones which civil people can buy , they are very strong and today one police is dead too because of gas even he was in armored vehicle with protection.
> 
> Yes I shoud keep my head down and stay safe but when I do this I feel very bad cause I'm leaving my people alone outside and also this does not mean that they will not come for you one day because they are tracking all internet and they keep records from facebook and twitter posts to know who are against them also I'm sure that this posts are followed too thats why I can not clearly mention my real feelings.


 your probably right but ive sucked up cn, cs and most of the shit the u.s army has and if you are strong or crazy it aint shit


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Not so many crazy and strong as you...


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

herofb said:


> I'm sorry I think I am not mentioning the correct name of the gas because we generally say pepper sprey to the gases police use but believe me it is not something you know because they are not used in your countries cause they are against international laws and not allowed to use against people because of human rights.
> 
> also the most of the problem is they are using gas cannisters as bullets and directly aiming to the people even it has to be thrown with a 45 degree
> 
> in Turkey now people are swearing politicians from twitter like this : dear Sir please kindly be informed that people are calling you ..... so you are not swearing your are just informing


 Im sorry sir, not cuttin you down or sayin i'm a tough guy, tell you the truth i dont know what i'm sayin, good luck god bless you, tough times, your gonna need it


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## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

thanks for your support but I have to say main point is not gas used by police maybe even it is nomt %1 of the issue , my main point is to be prepared for the worst days and defending my family from looter groups supported by goverment without using a pistol or a shotgun


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## Silverback (Jan 20, 2014)

oddapple said:


> Not so many crazy and strong as you...


Strength is borne of experience of what to expect.

Pain is only a perception of a feeling, if you know what to expect and keep your head level you can focus to remain functional. The video Smokin shared was a direct example of the Military training soldiers or what to expect and how to remain functional.

In the course of three month (the average Track, swimming or cross country season) you watch kids personal records drop 2-3 sometimes surprising large amounts depending on the events they do. In 3 months, that is not a lot of time to have a body physically change to allow this. What you are actually witnessing is the perception and expectations the athlete has change and the ability to cope with the situation to push harder also harden. I am missing the correct word for this.... Can anyone point it out? The closest I can stay is steel is forged. The mind can be forged faster than the body.


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

smokin good to see you back my pal


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

oddapple said:


> Not so many crazy and strong as you...


 your right i was a a$$hole for writin it


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

Those big cans of wasp spray that shoot a power stream 12 feet? I you hit them with that, they have to have medical help to get out of it. Maybe someone could tough through it? But they would keep getting worse and worse until they got treatment. Don't tell osamabama...

My advice is go camping far, far away from people. They pull these kills and hopefully, you can avoid them altogether until they settle back down.


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## oddapple (Dec 9, 2013)

oldmurph58 said:


> your right i was a a$$hole for writin it


Ahaha! I did not mean to implyt that! I was just having fun. You are completely right because people that have been there have seen people do some amazing things, but it take a powerful will or rage to walk through that and most won't, but that one that will, kill the whole house.
If you aren't in the ass kicking business, be careful in the ass kicking business ahaha!

What I saw in venezuela videos (for comparison) was viscious thugs with intent and resolve. Like here, they have hired gobs of guys no one would hire for copsunless they were doing exactly what they are.


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## oldmurph58 (Feb 8, 2014)

i think the word you want is balls silverback


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## Silverback (Jan 20, 2014)

oldmurph58 said:


> i think the word you want is balls silverback


Close Enough


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

Pepper spray is the least of your worries


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

oldmurph58 said:


> smokin good to see you back my pal


Never left...just TDY right now. Learning to do some cool shit in Va.


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## ATRPrepping (Mar 9, 2014)

Gather some friends, and like minded friends btw. Stay safe out there


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

Beach Kowboy said:


> Trust me, the pepper spray they are using is not some kind of "super" spray...If someone died it was because of an allergy or there was something else involved.. As for social media. Expect them to read EVERYTHING.. I know I write some crazy shit sometimes and I always assume they are reading it.. I have never came out and made a threat though. Sure, I might say I wish for something to happen but that's it.. I never say I am going to do something myself.. That would be illegal and we can't have that!!!


Too high of a concentration will kill also so if someone popped a canister in the APC that could very well be what killed him. This is what I suspect probably actually did him in although I have no idea what they are actually using. I'm not sure if it's still in use in other countries but the pre runner to CN which I believe was called DM (someone correct me if that's not right) was known to cause death. I don't believe it's still in use in this country but may be in others.

herofb, my suggestion would be to gather up those that are important to you and get the hell out of Dodge if it's at all possible. I'm not sure I'd be able to hunker down in that situation, I was raised to fight for what I believe in so I might find myself getting my family to safety and then joining the resistance movement. This would probably leave my boys without a father and my wife without a husband but at least they would know that I went out fighting so they could have a better life. If you decide to hole up with your family I think this is a perfectly acceptable decision since their safety should be paramount for you and I would advise you to find a defensible position and dig in until it's over. Whatever you decide I wish you good luck and hope you stay safe.

-Infidel


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## herofb (Feb 4, 2014)

I'm too sorry for the late reply and post for a very old topic but i had to say at least thank you to the guys who posted here , i was traveling since long time and had no time for the forum


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## Leon (Jan 30, 2012)

you know he makes a very good point. If SHTF here stateside you just know there will be pro-authority idiots backing anyone trying to cling to power.


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## Doc Holliday (Dec 22, 2012)

Leon said:


> you know he makes a very good point. If SHTF here stateside you just know there will be pro-authority idiots backing anyone trying to cling to power.


Yup, All those liberals you know, work with, are neighbors with... They will be the ones to watch because they want the gooberment to take your guns away so everyone can be safe.... They will be the ones to turn you in

Before Obama got into office there was a divide in this country between Conservatives and Liberals but nothing we couldnt work at... After he got into office stating he was for bi-partisanship but then he turned around after getting elected and has spent the last 6 years blaming EVERYTHING on the republicans, He has worked this country into a bigger frenzy then we had before the civil war... Civil war II is coming and I think its their plan. What better way to disarm America then to declare Martial Law which will suspend our constitution and give them the power to take what they want and start a civil war so they get a 2fer (they take our guns and population control)


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## Casie (Feb 26, 2014)

Doc that reply is 5x5.

And it isn't something coming down the road. It is a real a present danger. 

How stupid were the 24 BLM agents that got themselves cut off and surrounded at Bundy's ranch, with only a couple of standard vehicles as cover. No seasoned veteran or well trained soldier would look at that position and say, "Sure, lets set up here boxed-in under this bridge that we don't hold. That will rock!". 

Did you see their faces? They were scared shitless. They were so afraid they were cowering in the wheel-wells the entire time, and even screamed like little girls when the Fox News crew approached them.

Those BLM jerks got used like borrowed tools. They were sent there to be gunned down by crazy right-wingers. They were meant to bleed in the dirt for the nine o'clock news. Harry Reid and his boy demanded it and the BLM was sent.

But right wingers are also Christians and they remained calm and resolute. It also helped that Dingy Harry did not think to send in his own gun-toting psychopath wearing a brand new tea party t-shirt.

Next time he won't be so careless.


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## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

Id take those odds theres more conservative minded people than there are liberals by definition we are not as vocal until directly challenged. Who do you thinks fights the wars for this country or defends its borders I dislike police but even most of them taken out of their role are decent people. Alienate your enforcement base how are you gonna enforce things.


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## PaulS (Mar 11, 2013)

Just so you don't forget; The constitution doesn't provide our rights - we are born with them. If martial law is invoked we still have the right to defend ourselves. All our rights are still in effect even though the politicians may declare them suspended. I don't plan on giving mine up as long as I'm alive. The rest of you can do as you see fit - that is also your right.


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## microprepper (Nov 21, 2013)

Beach Kowboy said:


> That's right. Some people aren't willing to do certain things.. You do WHATEVER it takes to keep yourself,your family and friends safe. Whatever it takes... A friend will help you move. A true friend will help you move dead bodies!!


A Texas sheriff responded to critics of his promotion of weapon-ownership along the border: "Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six."

BTW, that original post describes reality today, not some future. In my city the police department is openly controlled by drug gangs. The present chief was brought in from Dallas when they ran the old chief out of town. The new chief was on the local radio right away announcing his support of the "don't call 911 policy" to the extent that evictions are forced on landlords by the police department if they have tenants who call. His excuse was that the police department is overstretched. When gangbangers urinated on a person's door not long after he arrived, the dispatcher told the person to open the door to get a good look at the person urinating and the department forced an eviction because that tenant "didn't belong in that neighborhood."

Under this new chief's direction (directed by the Democrats above him in city hall) the over-stretched police department has taken charge of animal control and building inspection, so that, organizationally, they can now mix the authorities of police with the civil authorities of those divisions in order to more efficiently harass, intimidate and even incarcerate citizens who do not co-operate with the gangs.

This city is not the only one. The border down here is really perforated. Yet, in some ways it is in fact safer because once you know the map of gang-turf, you can let the gangs know you are not a threat to them and have nothing they want. Mexican gangs this close to the border tend to be disciplined enough to respect that. The white gangs are the dangerous ones. They are crazy over-privileged, overgrown children on drugs with liberal social support and they are the ones who rob people for pennies, urinate on doors, harass pedestrians and kill for thrills. They are the ones who insist that their world includes their neighbors and they'll harass any who try to steer clear of them.

A good website to check out, in order to find the weaknesses in your own city structure and organizational chart (to see how far the professional gangs have taken police control) is municode.com. Look up any city and see how they have decimated or deconstructed traditional local government structures so that essentially there is no real government outside of the police department, and that department has been disconnected from citizen oversight in most cases.


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