# Government to shut down ?



## NotableDeath

I have heard rumors about stating of a potential government shutdown on October 1'st. Has anyone else heard of this or have any news stories on it ?

UPDATE - Just kind of a update on what i have learned. There is a POTENTIAL Government Shutdown to happen on October 1st over Big Brother throwing a temper tantrum on Republicans not wanting to pass Obama care. And that Republicans are demanding that the demo's hold off on Obama care until it is revised to reduce the spending planned in it. As of now no side has showed signs of backing down. And that a government shut down just means it cuts off all but necessary public services (I.E Police, Firemen, Medic's, etc. etc.) While this may not effect most, for families with active duty military and Contractors, they will be temporarily laid off until the dispute is settled. If this is true or not i cannot say, simply stating what I have been hearing a increasing amount of. Regardless, get ready people, Scenario 1 is on our doorstep. Let's just pray it stays there and doesn't advance.


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## PrepConsultant

They are talking about it but I just don't see them actually allowing a shutdown to happen!!


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## Nathan Jefferson

Scare tactics. nothing more.

They have already been at the 'debt limit' for months and have been playing games. They COULD continue to play them but they might shutdown the important things while leaving the unimportant to keep on running, just to scare people...


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## Prepadoodle

If they cause a government shutdown, the politicians won't get paid either. Not gonna happen.


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## wesley762

My answer to that question is Yes Please.....


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## PrepConsultant

wesley762 said:


> My answer to that question is Yes Please.....


I'm with ya but don't see it happenin... Just a scare tactic.. All they will do is just give it another extention and blame each other for not coming to an agreement.. Just a bunch of douchebags at work!!


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## Ripon

Smoke and mirrors. Even if things "shut down" for a few days it will be back up and running with back pay for the poor bureaucrats that missed out in no time.


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## BigCheeseStick

Happened when Clinton was in office. I was overseas in the military and remember very clearly nobody getting paid for a while.

Am I right in thinking this is supposed to hit on October 1rst? Press doesn't seem to be talking much about a date.

Ever been in a walmart at midnight? I was once and asked the cashier what the heck was going on because the place was PACKED at 11:45 with people shopping for food. At 12:01 EVERY person in that store rushed to the checkout. The cashier told me the food stamp money gets deposited in their accounts at EXACTLY 12:00. _And they all know it._

Sooooo, what happens when they all hit the checkouts nation wide at midnight and their free money isn't there???????


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## Fuzzee

It is nothing but scare tactics. Their simply looking to stir the fear so people overlook what they do again. Either way, I could care less if the government shuts down. I'll adapt and continue on.


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## Fuzzee

BigCheeseStick said:


> Happened when Clinton was in office. I was overseas in the military and remember very clearly nobody getting paid for a while.
> 
> Am I right in thinking this is supposed to hit on October 1rst? Press doesn't seem to be talking much about a date.
> 
> Ever been in a walmart at midnight? I was once and asked the cashier what the heck was going on because the place was PACKED at 11:45 with people shopping for food. At 12:01 EVERY person in that store rushed to the checkout. The cashier told me the food stamp money gets deposited in their accounts at EXACTLY 12:00. _And they all know it._
> 
> Sooooo, what happens when they all hit the checkouts nation wide at midnight and their free money isn't there???????


Hmmmm.


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## BigCheeseStick

Sooooo, their confident only Region III is going to be a problem? Or confident only Region III is worth saving?  

They seriously have "vegetarian" MRE's?!? BLEAGH! I personally like the "beef" stew with the teeny bottle of hot sauce, and freeze dried ice cream! 

Make no mistake though. If those people don't get their free food money, things WILL HTF!! CRIME SPREES!!!


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## Fuzzee

BigCheeseStick said:


> Sooooo, their confident only Region III is going to be a problem? Or confident only Region III is worth saving?
> 
> They seriously have "vegetarian" MRE's?!? BLEAGH! I personally like the "beef" stew with the teeny bottle of hot sauce, and freeze dried ice cream!
> 
> Make no mistake though. If those people don't get their free food money, things WILL HTF!! CRIME SPREES!!!


If something big enough happens, it will be chaos. I can still put my bullets where I want them. I guess maybe I'll get some moving target trigger time in coming up. Personally, I still love Chili Mac Mre's. :mrgreen:


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## Inor

Fuzzee said:


> If something big enough happens, it will be chaos. I can still put my bullets where I want them. I guess maybe I'll get some moving target trigger time in coming up. Personally, I still love Chili Mac Mre's. :mrgreen:


I was in the process of coming up with something equally pithy but you beat me to it.


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## Deebo

If the poor, poor govt shuts down, will my company continue to tax my payroll?


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## bigdogbuc

As long as the assholes don't open back up, I'm all for it. ::clapping::


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## Inor

bigdogbuc said:


> As long as the assholes don't open back up, I'm all for it. ::clapping::


You''re on a roll tonight boy-o!


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## Prepadoodle

It will be interesting to see if our government shills keep posting here when they aren't getting paid to do it.


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## Nathan Jefferson

Prepadoodle said:


> It will be interesting to see if our government shills keep posting here when they aren't getting paid to do it.


Yes, because only the things people will actually miss will be furloughed. All the things we can do without(or would love to be stopped) will continue to be bankrolled. It is how they drive fear into people!


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## Rigged for Quiet

Nathan Jefferson said:


> Yes, because only the things people will actually miss will be furloughed. All the things we can do without(or would love to be stopped) will continue to be bankrolled. It is how they drive fear into people!


If Obama owned a diner that was losing money he'd lay off the cooks and hire more wait staff.

We should cut Cogress and Seante work weeks to 29 hours.


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## 9UC

Thanks for the heads up, I wasn't aware that we actually had a functioning government!


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## Meangreen

This has been going every six months since Obama took office. They threaten to furlough and at the 11th hour they pas another continuing resolution.


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## bigdogbuc

Inor said:


> You''re on a roll tonight boy-o!


It's three weeks back at school. I spend 11 weeks every summer forgetting how stupid teenagers really are. Then their parents remind me why they're all ****ed up in the first place. :shock:

Toss in a new administrator who thinks they can "save them all, no child left behind" bullshit and you stand there shaking your head asking "Why do I even bother?" But hey what do I know? They don't even take into account I'm a cop on the very reservation that many of the kids we have issues with, come from. Apparently it's because I lack one of them cool pieces of cotton that tells everyone I'm a smart fella'....

So yeah, I'm a little blunt at the moment. I'll get over it and I still love ya' Inor!!!


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## jimb1972

BigCheeseStick said:


> Happened when Clinton was in office. I was overseas in the military and remember very clearly nobody getting paid for a while.
> 
> Am I right in thinking this is supposed to hit on October 1rst? Press doesn't seem to be talking much about a date.
> 
> Ever been in a walmart at midnight? I was once and asked the cashier what the heck was going on because the place was PACKED at 11:45 with people shopping for food. At 12:01 EVERY person in that store rushed to the checkout. The cashier told me the food stamp money gets deposited in their accounts at EXACTLY 12:00. _And they all know it._
> 
> Sooooo, what happens when they all hit the checkouts nation wide at midnight and their free money isn't there???????


It will be there, Obama will make sure his supporters get their money. I get laid off from work seasonally, my unemployment has been cut 9.2% for sequestration but all the government money for those who never work still goes out at the full rate, congress and Obama still get their full checks too.


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## Fuzzee

Inor said:


> I was in the process of coming up with something equally pithy but you beat me to it.


Gotta be fast on the draw too. Those moving targets can run. :mrgreen:


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## Desert Marine

I figure let the Government shut down. At least they won't be spending some of my tax money.


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## Inor

It should be interesting. I have to fly off to Toronto this afternoon. I am wondering if I am going to be able to get back through customs on Friday. The government website says that customs will remain open but will have a reduced staff. That does not concern me a whole lot since I have a Global Entry card, I usually do not have to talk to a U.S. Customs agent when I come back. But I expect in the interest of making things as difficult as possible, they may shut down the Global Entry machines and make me do it the old-fashioned way. That is what happened for the first couple weeks of the sequester.

But I figure standing in line for a while is a small price to pay if we can get rid of, or at least delay Obamacare. And if they do end up shutting down the border, I guess I'll just have to re-enter the country illegally. - It's not like that is difficult to do even when the government is operating at their full efficiency.


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## BigCheeseStick

If it's shut down long enough for the food stamp crowd to notice a lack of funds.... Ewwww boy! :shock: Lock the doors and baton down the hatches!!!


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## PrepperLite

I doubt it will be chaos. The military's still getting paid so... Egypt here we come! ( I cant seem the fox news article of them passing as well that if the shutdown happened the military still would get paid.)


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## Nathan Jefferson

My favorite is how they are already reporting that IF there is a shutdown that the .gov employees will get back pay for the days they DON'T work. I don't care who you are or what your beliefs are but getting free - non-vacation pay for days you don't work is BS. 

You want back pay? Show up and do your job.


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## BigCheeseStick

Been trying to prepare for this by finding a Detroit city live web cam I can watch at midnight...  Their all already "out of service"  Probably sitting in a pawn shop.


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## Alpha-17

Nathan Jefferson said:


> My favorite is how they are already reporting that IF there is a shutdown that the .gov employees will get back pay for the days they DON'T work. I don't care who you are or what your beliefs are but getting free - non-vacation pay for days you don't work is BS.
> 
> You want back pay? Show up and do your job.


Source? Not sure where you're getting that one. The back pay will be for the military, and civilian employees that have to work. Everything I've read says that workers furloughed will not receive back pay.

I've also not seen anything that says the military funding bill actually made it past both the House and the Senate. I had heard one it had made it though one, but that was it. Anybody got a source that says it did make it past both?


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## Smitty901

Memory serves me right ,this has happened before and they paid everyone.
Obama grinning ear to ear he can't wait to cut of Va disability payments.


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## Nathan Jefferson

Alpha-17 said:


> Source? Not sure where you're getting that one. The back pay will be for the military, and civilian employees that have to work. Everything I've read says that workers furloughed will not receive back pay.
> 
> I've also not seen anything that says the military funding bill actually made it past both the House and the Senate. I had heard one it had made it though one, but that was it. Anybody got a source that says it did make it past both?


Randoms talking heads and news articles, nothing definitive but seems like that is what has happened in the past, and then people already saying they will sue for it...

Unions Will Demand Back Pay if Government Shuts Down


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## Seneca

I have no problem with them shutting it down until they have a workable solution. Seems everyone with some political clout has cut a sweet deal on not so affordable healthcare. 

Yes Virginia...everyone has caught a break except the tax paying public, so why not shut it down for a while? I'm prepared to be alone in the big scary world with out a progressive nanny there to hold my hand.


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## Meangreen

Nathan Jefferson said:


> Randoms talking heads and news articles, nothing definitive but seems like that is what has happened in the past, and then people already saying they will sue for it...
> 
> Unions Will Demand Back Pay if Government Shuts Down


You are absolutely right only the working employees will get back pay and furloughed employees do not. I went through this during the Clinton administration. That was the longest furlough in US history at just over a month and a half. It's tough to go to work when you're not getting paid but my credit union gave me no interest loans until I was finally paid and could pay them back.


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## Smitty901

Meangreen that can not be I just 30 minutes ago listen to Obama say this will be the first time it has ever happened.
He said it several times the first.


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## BigCheeseStick

View attachment 2777
.....


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## Hawaii Volcano Squad

According to my calculations the Monday night football game ends about the time the government shutdown begins. Maybe I can work that and a Kona, Hawaiian beers review into a Youtube rant. Hmm I sense another rant posting coming on at my Youtube page.

::rambo::


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## Smitty901

Ok so news is reporting the shut it down. Next question how long?
Of course you don't need the link you will see it first thing in the morning anyway.
By the way this is not SHTF yet. Free be money still flowing everything in fine


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## PrepperLite

Alpha-17 said:


> Source? Not sure where you're getting that one. The back pay will be for the military, and civilian employees that have to work. Everything I've read says that workers furloughed will not receive back pay.
> 
> I've also not seen anything that says the military funding bill actually made it past both the House and the Senate. I had heard one it had made it though one, but that was it. Anybody got a source that says it did make it past both?


Obama signs bill guaranteeing active duty military pay in event of shutdown | Fox News


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## Meangreen

Smitty901 said:


> Meangreen that can not be I just 30 minutes ago listen to Obama say this will be the first time it has ever happened.
> He said it several times the first.


He is lying as usual, google it, 1996 under clinton. If you were in the military at the time, the military avoided not paying the troops by taking really high interest loans from the railroads.


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## PrepperLite

I believe the govt has shut down 17 times before? Last one under Clinton yes. Longest one being for 27 days?

I assume Smitty is being sarcastic -_-


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## Meangreen

KillSwitch said:


> I believe the govt has shut down 17 times before? Last one under Clinton yes. Longest one being for 27 days?
> 
> I assume Smitty is being sarcastic -_-


Under Clinton it was a month and a half. But I guess they don't count weekends. Not to worry even though I'm not getting paid, fear not I will still be heading down to the border and do my best to protect it


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## Alpha-17

KillSwitch said:


> Obama signs bill guaranteeing active duty military pay in event of shutdown | Fox News


Saw that this morning. Good to know that I'll actually be getting paid for being stuck in Africa, and so will everybody else in Afghanistan, Korea, etc. :-?

Well, now that the shutdown is officially on, the question is, how long, and who will blink first? Hopefully the Republicans can spin this so that the blame calls on the Democrats/Obama, and it doesn't hurt them in the next elections. With the phrasing the media is using, I doubt it though.


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## Hawaii Volcano Squad

WHAT WOULD Franklin Delano Roosevelt have done? Answer:

Okay here is my govt. Shutdown Monday night football BEER review ! Have fun!

Includes "Come On Man!" Half time report!


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## pharmer14

The government couldn't have shut down... we're nearly 7 hours in... surely there would be food lines with Republicans serving dog food to grandmas and kids by now... and I haven't seen 1 riot in the streets yet either...


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## BigCheeseStick

As one of the polititians said last night. "What exactly does it take to shut the government down? A snow storm. This kind of thing happens all the time and nobody really notices." 

It HAS happened 17 times before since 1976. The bama is just using the press to make a circus out of it this time.


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## Smitty901

Working people don't riot.
The trouble would come if the hand out crowd checks and debt cards stop coming then it will hit the fan.
Working people just keep doing the right thing they don't have time to riot .
Yes they robbed the rail rails roads and much of it never got paid back.


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## Inor

pharmer14 said:


> The government couldn't have shut down... we're nearly 7 hours in... surely there would be food lines with Republicans serving dog food to grandmas and kids by now... and I haven't seen 1 riot in the streets yet either...


I think Dick Cheney is putting the finishing touches on his Death Squads to go out and take food away from grandmas and kids. I also heard this opens the way for Sarah Palin to open her new "Bag-A-Homey Travel Adventures" where evil conservatives will be able to pay exorbitant fees to fly to Chicago and shoot poor people with a rifle from a helicopter.


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## Fuzzee

Inor said:


> I think Dick Cheney is putting the finishing touches on his Death Squads to go out and take food away from grandmas and kids. I also heard this opens the way for Sarah Palin to open her new "Bag-A-Homey Travel Adventures" where evil conservatives will be able to pay exorbitant fees to fly to Chicago and shoot poor people with a rifle from a helicopter.


Now that's not fair. I'd pay good money to fly over Chicago hunting homeys, but you got to make it affordable. :-|


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## Meangreen

Hawaii Volcano Squad said:


> WHAT WOULD Franklin Delano Roosevelt have done? Answer:
> 
> Okay here is my govt. Shutdown Monday night football BEER review ! Have fun!
> 
> Includes "Come On Man!" Half time report!


Beer and Spam! I'm going to have to report you cause you're building an illegal therm-nuclear weapon in your gut!


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## Hawaii Volcano Squad

Meangreen said:


> Beer and Spam! I'm going to have to report you cause you're building an illegal therm-nuclear weapon in your gut!


DON"T forget the final critical ingredient: Nachos!


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## Smitty901

Did the world end yet? has anyone really noticed?


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## BigCheeseStick

If the bama's approval ratings don't fall like a rock after the speech he's making right now it only proves this country has dumbed down to the point we all_ need_ to be controlled like mindless fools.


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## Meangreen

Smitty901 said:


> Did the world end yet? has anyone really noticed?


I bet you somewhere there is hippy freaking out right now because they can't get into a National Forrest.


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## Meangreen

Hawaii Volcano Squad said:


> DON"T forget the final critical ingredient: Nachos!


OH NO! Think about the children!!!!!


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## pharmer14

rickfromillinois said:


> Just what was in the House Bill that was so terrible? 1) On his own authority Obama decided to grant 1,500 corporations, banks, and unions a 1 year extension before they had to start paying into Obamacare. No where in the law does it grant him this authority. The House Bill would give the same extension to small businesses and individuals, in other words, US. 2) On his own authority Obama granting tax payer subsidies to cover 75% of the payments for Congress, The White House, the Supreme Court, and their staff. No where is the Obamacare act is he granted this authority. Under the House Bill this taxpayer subsidy would be removed......Those terrible right wing facist Tea Party Republicans in the House are trying to do these terrible things to the American people (sarcasm).


The element you're missing is that the bill was a Republican idea so therefore it's inherently wrong. And the Dems are treating Obamacare like Dad's sports car. You so much as look at it the wrong way and you may as well have taken a sledge hammer to the hood and defecated on the leather seats...


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## retired guard

Meangreen sorry they didn't include you in on those who get paid. Before I retired from state government I got the furlough treatment. Then after getting to listen to all the folks scream about how we did nothing for our checks, I got to hear them scream for us to get a pay cut because they didn't want the wait for service staffing shortages caused. I guess what it comes down to is they are another breed of welfare cat that wants something for nothing.


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## Rigged for Quiet

Smitty901 said:


> Did the world end yet? has anyone really noticed?


It seems I must still mow my yard.


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## Meangreen

retired guard said:


> Meangreen sorry they didn't include you in on those who get paid. Before I retired from state government I got the furlough treatment. Then after getting to listen to all the folks scream about how we did nothing for our checks, I got to hear them scream for us to get a pay cut because they didn't want the wait for service staffing shortages caused. I guess what it comes down to is they are another breed of welfare cat that wants something for nothing.


It's no problem and I'm in the prefect place right now camping out in the Boot Heel of New Mexico. I, as well as every other federal employee got a real thoughtful letter from Obama this morning. I would love to share it with everyone but I can't save it, cut and paste, or attach it. It's probably for the better. With the magic of technology I'm still able to talk with everyone here on preppers and I'm listening to FOX waiting to hear what comes of this shutdown. I included a photo from the, "view from my office"


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## Inor

Meangreen said:


> It's no problem and I'm in the prefect place right now camping out in the Boot Heel of New Mexico. I, as well as every other federal employee got a real thoughtful letter from Obama this morning. I would love to share it with everyone but I can't save it, cut and paste, or attach it. It's probably for the better. With the magic of technology I'm still able to talk with everyone here on preppers and I'm listening to FOX waiting to hear what comes of this shutdown. I included a photo from the, "view from my office"
> 
> View attachment 2784


Was this the letter you are referring to?



> To the dedicated and hard-working employees of the United States Government:
> The Federal Government is America's largest employer, with more than 2 million civilian workers and 1.4 million active duty military who serve in all 50 States and around the world.
> But Congress has failed to meet its responsibility to pass a budget before the fiscal year begins today. And that means much of our Government must shut down effective today.
> Today, I wanted to take a moment to tell you what you mean to me - and to the country.
> That begins by saying thank you for the work you do every day - work that is vitally important to our national security and to American families' economic security. You defend our country overseas and ensure that our troops receive the benefits they deserve when they come home. You guard our borders nad protect our civil rights. You help small business expand and gain new footholds in overseas markets. You guide hundreds of thousands of people each day through the glory of America's national parks and monuments, from Yosemite to the State of Liberty. And much more.
> You do all this in a political climate that, too often in recent years, has treated you like a punching bag. You have endured three years of a Federal pay freeze, harmful sequester cuts, and now, a shutdown of our Government. And yet, you persevere, continuing to serve the American people with passion, professionalism, and skill.
> None of this is fair to you. And should it continue, it will make it more difficult to keep attracting the kind of driven, patriotic, idealistic Americans to public service that our citizens deserve and that our system of self-government demands.
> Public service is noble. Public service is important. And by choosing public service, you carry on a proud tradition at the heart of osme of this country's greatest and most lasting achievements. In fact, more than 50 current or former Federal employees have received the Nobel Prize for their efforts. It was grants from the Department of Energy that helped businesses unlock new sources of renewable energy, and from the National Science Foundation that helped entrepreneurs like the founders of Google change the world. It is your efforts hat will help this country meet the great challenge of our time - rebuilding an economy where all who work hard can get ahead.
> So while the budget fights in Washington are too often partisan, your service to the countyry must never be. As on eof my predecessors, President George H.W. Bush, once said, "There is nothing more fulfilling than to serve your country and your fellow citizens and to do it well. And that is what our system of self-government depends on."
> This shutdown was completely preventable. It should not have happened. And the House of Representatives can end it as soon as it follows the Senate's lead, and funds your work in the United States Government without trying to attach highly controversial and partisan measures in the process.
> Hopefully, we will resolve this quickly. In the meantime, I want you to know - whether you are a young person who just joined public service because you want to make a difference, or a career employee who has dedicated your life to that pursuit - you and your families remain at the front of my mind. Your agency leaders and I will continue to defend your wrk at a time when that work has rarely been more important. We will continue to work with your agencies to kep you and your familiies apprised and informed of what is happening. And I will continue to do everything in my power to get the House of Representatives to allow our Government to repoen as quickly as possible, and make sure you receive the pay that you have earned.
> Thank you, again, for your service, your sacrifice, and everything you do every day for this country we love so much.


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## Meangreen

Inor said:


> Was this the letter you are referring to?


Pretty darn close. Mine is geared more to the law enforcement end but a lot of the same lines. Did you get one to?


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## PaulS

"...This country we love so much..." What country is he referring to, exactly?
It's a known fact he doesn't even like the USA so I have to ask.....


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## Rigged for Quiet

Meangreen said:


> It's no problem and I'm in the prefect place right now camping out in the Boot Heel of New Mexico. I, as well as every other federal employee got a real thoughtful letter from Obama this morning. I would love to share it with everyone but I can't save it, cut and paste, or attach it. It's probably for the better. With the magic of technology I'm still able to talk with everyone here on preppers and I'm listening to FOX waiting to hear what comes of this shutdown. I included a photo from the, "view from my office"
> 
> View attachment 2784


Perfect terrain for my Model 70 270 with 3x9.


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## Meangreen

Rigged for Quiet said:


> Perfect terrain for my Model 70 270 with 3x9.


I agree and a .22-250 or .243 would be great because the coyotes are thick down here. A shotgun for the dove and quail would pass the time.


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## Smitty901

Meangreen while you are out there Look around I hear Holder lost a bunch of nice weapons around there.


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## Inor

Meangreen said:


> Pretty darn close. Mine is geared more to the law enforcement end but a lot of the same lines. Did you get one to?


No, I got it from Drudge or Breitbart. I have been happily unemployed (read that to mean self-employed) since '97.


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## BigCheeseStick

Obama, I'm afraid your games have reach an end. Government shuts down after you and your liberal press have been warning us for weeks how _scary_ such a thing would be... And stocks GO UP! Stock Market Data - Dow Jones, Nasdaq, S&P 500 - CNNMoney Could it be the public isn't falling for your lies & scare tactics anymore?!?

NOW WHAT?!?

Better tell big daddy George Soros it's time to try something new!


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## alterego

just a note;

I got up at the same time, went to work and returned home
My wife went to work and returned home
My daughter went to work and her college classes should be done a few minutes ago and she will be on her way home soon,
My little girl is in bed on time
we feed the cows, spoke to the neighbors, the one boy missed a deer with his bow tonight.

I have lived through 17 government shut downs to my knowledge, I have never been affected by it.

**** them shut it down, it is a temporary reprieve from a group of fools running our society into the ground.

I hope it stays shut down permanently, and free rides for all are never more.


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## lancestar2

Most people here consider me the "liberal" of the group... and well in case you were wondering what I though about the government shut down well...

CLICK HERE! (it should start at 32 sec in FYI)

Go in with the mindset of complete repeal of Obama care and settle for AT LEAST removal of the mandate!!!!! If they are successful I would sure lean more republican going forward! I don't think the republicans have a backbone to win a game of chicken as saddly I am confident they will give in a week or two. None the less if they do give in then they just wasted everybody's time and I would have even LESS respect for them for going throw the "motions"

They should bring up the talking points on how unless 100% of the people AGREE there should not be a mandate! I am pissed because now I will be forced to pay into this stupid system 100 bucks a month for healthcare! Because right now I am not covered I don't have money laying around to afford this BS and according to the gov my STUDENT LOANS that I have to pay back count as INCOME! WTF! ...

I sure hope the republicans stay the course! But my instance tell me they will cave within the first 30 days if sooner! Republicans tend to always let the people down... :evil:


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## exmilitary

It looks like they did shut down. :wink:
It looks.like it might be a temp shut down to save some money.
So lets get through the fat.
I know some of the services like this social services or ems personnel are still working. 
We bust our asses to work hard for our money and this is the outcome. 
It just goes to show how well the government handles our hard earned money.
Just my thoughts


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## BigCheeseStick

And this whole steaming pile of shutdown was for absolutely NOTHING! John Boehner announced that he "would NOT let this country default on it's debt. Even if that means giving in.". So they'll continue the game until the 16th. And then it's status quoe. Kick the debt can on down the road. Spineless [email protected]#s!!!:evil:

The bama's dancing in the white house this morning!


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## Meangreen

Smitty901 said:


> Meangreen while you are out there Look around I hear Holder lost a bunch of nice weapons around there.


We are not far from where Brian Terry and Nicolas Ivie were killed. Actually there have been more agents killed here in this little slice of heaven between Arizona/New Mexico than any other part of the country.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/10/0...1-killed-near-major-drug-cooridor-in-arizona/

Another story that sums it up: http://gma.yahoo.com/shutdown-squeeze-agent-loses-financial-security-while-working-090420919.html


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## lancestar2

Need a good laugh at the stupidity of the shutdown then CLICK CLICK 

Insane Tourists Blatantly Defying The U.S. Government's Demands

I couldn't help but laugh my butt off hahahah :lol:


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## Rigged for Quiet

lancestar2 said:


> Need a good laugh at the stupidity of the shutdown then CLICK CLICK
> 
> Insane Tourists Blatantly Defying The U.S. Government's Demands
> 
> I couldn't help but laugh my butt off hahahah :lol:


Well played, sir.


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## BigCheeseStick

lancestar2 said:


> Most people here consider me the "liberal" of the group... and well in case you were wondering what I though about the government shut down well...
> 
> CLICK HERE! (it should start at 32 sec in FYI)
> 
> Go in with the mindset of complete repeal of Obama care and settle for AT LEAST removal of the mandate!!!!! If they are successful I would sure lean more republican going forward! I don't think the republicans have a backbone to win a game of chicken as sadly I am confident they will give in a week or two. None the less if they do give in then they just wasted everybody's time and I would have even LESS respect for them for going throw the "motions"
> 
> They should bring up the talking points on how unless 100% of the people AGREE there should not be a mandate! I am pissed because now I will be forced to pay into this stupid system 100 bucks a month for healthcare! Because right now I am not covered I don't have money laying around to afford this BS and according to the gov my STUDENT LOANS that I have to pay back count as INCOME! WTF! ...
> 
> I sure hope the republicans stay the course! But my instance tell me they will cave within the first 30 days if sooner! Republicans tend to always let the people down... :evil:


Obama's handlers aren't _nearly_ stupid enough to think that if you remove the mandate this entire plan wouldn't _*IMMEDIATELY*_ become a completely forgotten issue, and in 10 years press would be checking back to see if the law even still existed. NOBODY wants this. Other than the people that bought Obama's seat in office. AND people that go along with it blindly because "It's what Obama wants, so it's what I want!". MAKE ME PUKE!

Obama couldn't give two squirts of pee over Obamacare! He's pushing it because he's told to by his owners. Nobody seems to notice he can't even explain what it really is.

MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL: Nobody notices how he's NEVER spent two seconds trying to tell us how HE thought any of it up or why. He makes generic, broad statements about it helping "the people". Why has he NEVER explained what gave him the idea. Why it means so much to him personally. HOW it's going to make all our lives better having mandates forced upon us... Because his owners never explained all that to him. "*WE OWN YOU!!!* HERE IT IS. MAKE IT HAPPEN!" is all he's been told. 

Along with. "We CAN arrange a hunting trip with you and Dick Cheney you know... It's been done before..."   
View attachment 2882


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## Piratesailor

The republican rino's bit the dust. All hail the king and the ruling democrat politburo. Yup, spend spend spend... And how are the insurance rates and deductibles working for everyone? And where will you be when the money runs out? All rhetorical questions btw.


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## Smitty901

We are trying but this beast Government is hard to shut off it has a life of it's own.


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## lancestar2

BigCheeseStick said:


> Obama's handlers aren't _nearly_ stupid enough to think that if you remove the mandate this entire plan wouldn't _*IMMEDIATELY*_ become a completely forgotten issue, and in 10 years press would be checking back to see if the law even still existed. NOBODY wants this. Other than the people that bought Obama's seat in office. AND people that go along with it blindly because "It's what Obama wants, so it's what I want!". MAKE ME PUKE!
> 
> Obama couldn't give two squirts of pee over Obamacare! He's pushing it because he's told to by his owners. Nobody seems to notice he can't even explain what it really is.
> 
> MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL: Nobody notices how he's NEVER spent two seconds trying to tell us how HE thought any of it up or why. He makes generic, broad statements about it helping "the people". Why has he NEVER explained what gave him the idea. Why it means so much to him personally. HOW it's going to make all our lives better having mandates forced upon us... Because his owners never explained all that to him. "*WE OWN YOU!!!* HERE IT IS. MAKE IT HAPPEN!" is all he's been told.
> 
> Along with. "We CAN arrange a hunting trip with you and Dick Cheney you know... It's been done before..."
> View attachment 2882


hmmm... I do think some people want this. I don't think Health care should be a unregulated for profit business that mandates customers to purchase there items! What is worse than socialism? Socialism mixed with business in a way that creates a disgusting monster!

There will be no incentive to lower prices as a free market would allow (customers MUST purchase services!) and there is no incentive to supply customers with better health services as again your customers are forced to purchases. Compared to Canada's healthcare system I would take that any day of the week!!!!! I don't belive in a for profit healthcare system because thats how the entire mess started 80 dollars for a fricking bandaid from the ER and 30,000 dollars for a normal birth of a child!!! My god who can afford this crap! NOBODY! I understand that concept does conflict with my Libertarian views however I think a general practice "socialism medicine" for a lot of the minor things would be ideal, while having a lot of the preventive practices remain a for profit industry.

Sure I don't have my opinions set in stone, yet the idea of doctors making more money just because I decide to take more tests seems wrong. Which is partly why Health Care is so expensive so many people take unnecessary tests which greatly increase there costs which they pass onward to others! Also at the same time I think Health Care Insurance is BS!!!!! From my parents they paid in 1200 a year and there employer payed into 1200 a year for dental and they only got 2400 a year in money to use for dental work! eh... WTF is that!!! That's like buying a 2,400 gift card to Itunes each year when you know that your pretty much only buy a few songs here and there. There is INCENTIVE to spend extra and to waste money!

I think another better style of payment could be your PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE meaning each month your employer takes out 40 bucks maybe they match it or match 50% and that money is set aside for your healthcare meaning in 20 years you have 14,400 dollars towards any healthcare service you want!!!!

I'm sorry but I have recently been eating healthier, losing weight, and taking better care of my self because I have too without insurance!! But at the same time I shouldn't have to fear if fall and break my leg I will become 100,000 dollars in debt not able to work for a year or so and completely ****ed for the rest of my life!!!!!!!

I don't have the answers but had we skipped invading Iraq, Afghanistan, and bombing Pakistan we sure would have alot more funds to help ourselves at home! Sure it's nice were bombing others across the world *eye roll* I know many of you like the idea of a holy war but PLEASE not with my paycheck! Fund it yourself! 

*EDIT*

it's always nice to end on a high note...


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## PrepConsultant

lancestar2 said:


> hmmm... I do think some people want this. I don't think Health care should be a unregulated for profit business that mandates customers to purchase there items! What is worse than socialism? Socialism mixed with business in a way that creates a disgusting monster!
> 
> There will be no incentive to lower prices as a free market would allow (customers MUST purchase services!) and there is no incentive to supply customers with better health services as again your customers are forced to purchases. Compared to Canada's healthcare system I would take that any day of the week!!!!! I don't belive in a for profit healthcare system because thats how the entire mess started 80 dollars for a fricking bandaid from the ER and 30,000 dollars for a normal birth of a child!!! My god who can afford this crap! NOBODY! I understand that concept does conflict with my Libertarian views however I think a general practice "socialism medicine" for a lot of the minor things would be ideal, while having a lot of the preventive practices remain a for profit industry.
> 
> Sure I don't have my opinions set in stone, yet the idea of doctors making more money just because I decide to take more tests seems wrong. Which is partly why Health Care is so expensive so many people take unnecessary tests which greatly increase there costs which they pass onward to others! Also at the same time I think Health Care Insurance is BS!!!!! From my parents they paid in 1200 a year and there employer payed into 1200 a year for dental and they only got 2400 a year in money to use for dental work! eh... WTF is that!!! That's like buying a 2,400 gift card to Itunes each year when you know that your pretty much only buy a few songs here and there. There is INCENTIVE to spend extra and to waste money!
> 
> I think another better style of payment could be your PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE meaning each month your employer takes out 40 bucks maybe they match it or match 50% and that money is set aside for your healthcare meaning in 20 years you have 14,400 dollars towards any healthcare service you want!!!!
> 
> I'm sorry but I have recently been eating healthier, losing weight, and taking better care of my self because I have too without insurance!! But at the same time I shouldn't have to fear if fall and break my leg I will become 100,000 dollars in debt not able to work for a year or so and completely ****ed for the rest of my life!!!!!!!
> 
> I don't have the answers but had we skipped invading Iraq, Afghanistan, and bombing Pakistan we sure would have alot more funds to help ourselves at home! Sure it's nice were bombing others across the world *eye roll* I know many of you like the idea of a holy war but PLEASE not with my paycheck! Fund it yourself!
> 
> *EDIT*
> 
> it's always nice to end on a high note...


I can assure you. If we hadn't invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. There would not be all this extra cash sitting around in a bank just for your future use..


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## Themajorprepper

They won't shut down :lol: 

Are they not theeee..... Government?


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## Arizona Infidel

lancestar2 said:


> hmmm... I do think some people want this. I don't think Health care should be a unregulated for profit business that mandates customers to purchase there items! What is worse than socialism? Socialism mixed with business in a way that creates a disgusting monster!
> 
> There will be no incentive to lower prices as a free market would allow (customers MUST purchase services!) and there is no incentive to supply customers with better health services as again your customers are forced to purchases. Compared to Canada's healthcare system I would take that any day of the week!!!!! I don't belive in a for profit healthcare system because thats how the entire mess started 80 dollars for a fricking bandaid from the ER and 30,000 dollars for a normal birth of a child!!! My god who can afford this crap! NOBODY! I understand that concept does conflict with my Libertarian views however I think a general practice "socialism medicine" for a lot of the minor things would be ideal, while having a lot of the preventive practices remain a for profit industry.
> 
> Sure I don't have my opinions set in stone, yet the idea of doctors making more money just because I decide to take more tests seems wrong. Which is partly why Health Care is so expensive so many people take unnecessary tests which greatly increase there costs which they pass onward to others! Also at the same time I think Health Care Insurance is BS!!!!! From my parents they paid in 1200 a year and there employer payed into 1200 a year for dental and they only got 2400 a year in money to use for dental work! eh... WTF is that!!! That's like buying a 2,400 gift card to Itunes each year when you know that your pretty much only buy a few songs here and there. There is INCENTIVE to spend extra and to waste money!
> 
> I think another better style of payment could be your PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE meaning each month your employer takes out 40 bucks maybe they match it or match 50% and that money is set aside for your healthcare meaning in 20 years you have 14,400 dollars towards any healthcare service you want!!!!
> 
> I'm sorry but I have recently been eating healthier, losing weight, and taking better care of my self because I have too without insurance!! But at the same time I shouldn't have to fear if fall and break my leg I will become 100,000 dollars in debt not able to work for a year or so and completely ****ed for the rest of my life!!!!!!!
> 
> I don't have the answers but had we skipped invading Iraq, Afghanistan, and bombing Pakistan we sure would have alot more funds to help ourselves at home! Sure it's nice were bombing others across the world *eye roll* I know many of you like the idea of a holy war but PLEASE not with my paycheck! Fund it yourself!
> 
> *EDIT*
> 
> it's always nice to end on a high note...


thank you for posting that. It just further proves to me that a theory I've been developing about hardcore Libertarians is indeed correct. 


> Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. -John Adams


 so as atheism and libertarianism seem to go hand in hand it is no surprise to me how often libertarians will depart from the Constitution and the idea of a limited govt. And veer into socialism and don't have any problem with authority as long as it is enforcing their ideals. 
I'm curious as to how you think " healthcare" was handled before the govt. Got involved and mucked things up?
I remember how we did things when I was young. We didn't equate health insurance to healthcare. Back when Medicare had only been instituted for about 10 years or so, and the govt. Hadn't screwed up the system. If we were hurt or badly sick we'd go to the hospital and if you had insurance you would pay your part and the insurance would pay theirs. If you didn't have insurance you would pay for it. If you couldn't you would make arrangements to pay it. If you needed to go see the doctor you would, and you would PAY him. Then the govt. Got more involved and they screwed the entire system up. Now prices are out of control and half the population doesn't think they should pay their own freight. This leaves the other half to pay it for them. And you think the answer to this is to have a dysfunctional govt. That screwed it up in the first place to take over the entire thing instead of getting it completely out of it? Makes perfect sense. :shock:
It is also interesting how you want me to stay out of your paycheck when it comes to the country fighting a war, but you want to control my paycheck to finance healthcare for people who don't want to pay for their own. I don't think anyone has ever tried to make the claim a libertarian was consistent. I guess that's the problem when you don't have a belief system that supports natural law and have to depend on mans law. Mans law changes with the whims of man.


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## Inor

Lance - 

If you think healthcare is expensive now, just wait until it is free.


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## PrepConsultant

I am reading now that EBT food stamp cards aren't working in several states. The government said it is a glitch but they just might be testing the waters.. Could you imagine if people couldn't collect their almighty food stamps for several weeks? They just might have to actually get a job.. Granted, there are some that NEED them but the vast majority are lazy ****s that want to suck off of the government titty for as long as they can!


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## roy

Inor said:


> Lance -
> 
> If you think healthcare is expensive now, just wait until it is free.


Really! The rest of the industrial world is paying about half as much including such backward spots as Switzerland.


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## Inor

roy said:


> Really! The rest of the industrial world is paying about half as much including such backward spots as Switzerland.


Yeah - they are sure off to a great start with their Obamacare rollout aren't they? They are saving us boatloads of money. I sure want more of that. - NOT!


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## Meangreen

roy said:


> Really! The rest of the industrial world is paying about half as much including such backward spots as Switzerland.


Most of those countries including Switzerland have the population of one of our states.


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## PalmettoTree

We will shortly be back to a system where if you can pay a doctor you will get treated. If not you will be put in the cemetery queue.


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## Nathan Jefferson

roy said:


> Really! The rest of the industrial world is paying about half as much including such backward spots as Switzerland.


That is because we pay for the development of pretty much every advancement in drugs and equipment - sell it to other countries at a rate low enough to prevent them from breaking patents and then make it illegal to re-import stuff. That is why it is cheaper to buy meds in Canada or other countries, and it is illegal to buy them from their.

We also cost shift and prevent market pricing from happening. What other line of business is it legal to raise your price to help cover the lack of payment from someone else (yes, you build in a small reserve for non-payment but in the med industry its a cost shifting scheme of a different nature) or to charge them for a problem you cause? If you get a staph infection from a dirty hospital room - they charge you for it. If your home repair buy busts a window when fixing something - he pays for it...

Fix those things and a few others and we would be on our way to a real medical system with real prices.


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## roy

Meangreen said:


> Most of those countries including Switzerland have the population of one of our states.


So. Does the population of your state affect the cost of healthcare? Incidently, healthcare in Switzerland although manditory, is completely private.


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## Inor

PalmettoTree said:


> We will shortly be back to a system where if you can pay a doctor you will get treated. If not you will be put in the cemetery queue.


Well yes, I hope so. What is a better motivator for being productive than survival?

That is the thing you "healthcare is a right" guys refuse to accept. The only other option is to effectively enslave all of the folks working in the healthcare industry. If you nationalize the medical industry, you put a ceiling on the salary they can make. Most of the medical folks I have ever met could put their skills to use in many other endeavors. So, even if you offer someone a $300K government salary to be a heart surgeon, why would somebody that smart take the heart surgeon path when they have an unlimited potential doing software or electrical engineering? If they have the smarts to become a medical doctor, they obviously have the skills to become something that does not put the onus of government regulation on their ass.


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## kevincali

PrepConsultant said:


> I am reading now that EBT food stamp cards aren't working in several states. The government said it is a glitch but they just might be testing the waters.. Could you imagine if people couldn't collect their almighty food stamps for several weeks? They just might have to actually get a job.. Granted, there are some that NEED them but the vast majority are lazy ****s that want to suck off of the government titty for as long as they can!


Pic was taken at a circle K in the next town over from me. I think they're testing waters personally


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## Meangreen

roy said:


> So. Does the population of your state affect the cost of healthcare? Incidently, healthcare in Switzerland although manditory, is completely private.


Think about the size of this country and the amount of people on welfare and reformation in this country, it's a huge undertaking unlike a country the size of Denmark, Sweden, Switzerland,etc.


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## PalmettoTree

Inor said:


> That is the thing you "healthcare is a right" guys refuse to accept...


You have never seen me imply that.


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## Inor

PalmettoTree said:


> You have never seen me imply that.


My apologies if I inferred incorrectly from your post. What other option is there?


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## Arizona Infidel

roy said:


> Really! The rest of the industrial world is paying about half as much including such backward spots as Switzerland.


Tell me about Switzerlands welfare state.


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## lancestar2

PrepConsultant said:


> I can assure you. If we hadn't invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. There would not be all this extra cash sitting around in a bank just for your future use..


Of course not! instead of being 15 trillion debt we may only be 12 trillion in debt. Of course the more debt we become the less a trillion dollar seems :lol: We STILL wouldn't be able to fund any additional programs we just be less in debt that's all which is a good thing because were eventually have to pay that 15 trillion plus interest back.... well that or default and start selling off a few states LOL won't that be a shocker to all the republicans here you complain about socialism now? Wait until Texas is turned over to China! haha... mostly kidding but of course there is no way were gonna pay that back so I wonder what will eventually happen (which is reason enough we do need a strong military once the debt collectors like china come with there warships demanding payment.



Arizona Infidel said:


> thank you for posting that. It just further proves to me that a theory I've been developing about hardcore Libertarians is indeed correct.
> so as atheism and libertarianism seem to go hand in hand it is no surprise to me how often libertarians will depart from the Constitution and the idea of a limited govt. And veer into socialism and don't have any problem with authority as long as it is enforcing their ideals.
> I'm curious as to how you think " healthcare" was handled before the govt. Got involved and mucked things up?
> I remember how we did things when I was young. We didn't equate health insurance to healthcare. Back when Medicare had only been instituted for about 10 years or so, and the govt. Hadn't screwed up the system. If we were hurt or badly sick we'd go to the hospital and if you had insurance you would pay your part and the insurance would pay theirs. If you didn't have insurance you would pay for it. If you couldn't you would make arrangements to pay it. If you needed to go see the doctor you would, and you would PAY him. Then the govt. Got more involved and they screwed the entire system up. Now prices are out of control and half the population doesn't think they should pay their own freight. This leaves the other half to pay it for them. And you think the answer to this is to have a dysfunctional govt. That screwed it up in the first place to take over the entire thing instead of getting it completely out of it? Makes perfect sense. :shock:
> It is also interesting how you want me to stay out of your paycheck when it comes to the country fighting a war, but you want to control my paycheck to finance healthcare for people who don't want to pay for their own. I don't think anyone has ever tried to make the claim a libertarian was consistent. I guess that's the problem when you don't have a belief system that supports natural law and have to depend on mans law. Mans law changes with the whims of man.


We I'm not a "true" Atheist I identify as agnostic which means there is not enough proof to prove god exists. I explained it in detail before but I do defer to christian teachings and do use them as inportant texts that helps develop morals and guildlines to the way I live my life. I don't claim to know completely what is the best solution for a healthcare system I do think personal responsibility is best. However when sombody is suffer in pain because they broke there leg as a community we just can't let them wait until they die because they don't have a credit card to pay it with or insurance. I do think Canada has a better system then we do I am not saying everything should be all lumped together as all testing screening and speciality things should be a different grade of healthcare that is NOT free!

I think the worst thing that we could do is what Obama is doing forcing everyone to purchase health insurace into a corrupt industry. Imagine be at your local hardware store and they suddenly start forcing you to purchase a policy regardless of if you ever shopped there before! The surpeme court considers it a "tax" yet your buying private company insurance?

Socialism healthcare would be a step up from this BS they are proposing being forced into a for profit market disrupts the supply/demand rule. Because the demand will be constant they can increase the price all they want without decreasing the demand! This concept of what they are building is the worst thing ever possible!

$30,000 dollars is what it cost to have a normal deliver of your child obviously the free market with help of government is not working. It either needs to be free market 100% or Socialism not a mixture of them.

In regards to my belief system your right in a way being that I am able to think for myself I am able to judge and perceive what is right and wrong and my opinions can always change and adapt. Where as you following religious teaching you are unable to think, or judge your beliefs so your opinions are more solid and unchanging. In regards to depending on mans law I don't think you have that very correct of course I want to obey the laws of society of course! I make my judgement based on my "commandments" Which mainly boils down to treat others the way you want to be treated and do no harm and to live a "godly" aka good life meaning be a good person do good acts towards others and try to enjoy life too.

I do that without fear of being punished by a revengeful god or being forced to live in an after life full of pain and suffering. I consider my style of belief system more honorable because I do so out of my own free will. As a child I was raised roman catholic and did things out of fear of punishment from a very demanding and angry god. I do think there is some truth to the bible and are full of inspiring stories but people who take the literal view of the bible only proves there unable to think for themselves and blindly follow there religious leaders through there human priests and the bible which was written by man too! The biggest thing I dislike about religion is the demonetization of knowledge and education. As Adam and Eve ate from the tree of knowledge and were are paying for there sins! If you want to control a population you keep them dumb down and don't let them think for themselves.

I understand how you may think I am more corrupt for my morals being more on "un-solid ground" however I would make the same point that your more at risk of being controlled through your church and political leaders. I have had long debates with family that are deeply religious and I have also came to a few conclusions myself but were getting a bit off topic lol...


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## Meangreen

Free healthcare is never free.


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## Meangreen

Arizona Infidel said:


> Tell me about Switzerlands welfare state.


Three per cent of the Swiss population live on welfare payments, according to a survey published by the Federal Statistics Office.


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## Meangreen

The government isn't paying for the healthcare, the people that work and have health insurance does. Why do you think health insurance is so expensive? Just like auto insurance, you're paying for everyone else that doesn't have insurance.


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## BigCheeseStick

Meangreen said:


> The government isn't paying for the healthcare, the people that work and have health insurance does. Why do you think health insurance is so expensive? Just like auto insurance, you're paying for everyone else that doesn't have insurance.
> 
> View attachment 2896


Imagine wearing that on the back of a T-shirt and walking through a crowded mall. The hateful things people would be saying... 

Truth is rarely a popular opinion.


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## Meangreen

BigCheeseStick said:


> Imagine wearing that on the back of a T-shirt and walking through a crowded mall. The hateful things people would be saying...
> 
> Truth is rarely a popular opinion.


I have that as a bumper sticker on my car.


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## Meangreen

Here is my latest T-shirt.


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## Arizona Infidel

Explain to me how the system got corrupted? I got some bad news for ya. If you break your leg, and you go to the hospital, the hospital will set your leg. Even if you don't have insurance or a credit card. If you can't pay for it, the hospital will set up a payment plan for you.


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## Piratesailor

Meangreen said:


> Here is my latest T-shirt.
> 
> View attachment 2898


Love it!


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## Nathan Jefferson

kevincali said:


> Pic was taken at a circle K in the next town over from me. I think they're testing waters personally


I wish they were testing the waters - if it really was anything other than a glitch it wouldn't be testing the waters, it would be stirring up the 'voter base'.



Arizona Infidel said:


> Explain to me how the system got corrupted? I got some bad news for ya. If you break your leg, and you go to the hospital, the hospital will set your leg. Even if you don't have insurance or a credit card. If you can't pay for it, the hospital will set up a payment plan for you.


EMTALA back in the 80's is where it really started going down the ****er. at least for those who walk into the ER and get free care - before that they had to go to charity clinics and what not, now if you can't pay just wait until its bad enough you have to goto the ER and the cost will be 10x - but you don't have to pay it! WOO HOO!


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## Nathan Jefferson

I saw today on 'the teevee' that this shutdown is costing the economy like $25 million a minute and $1.6 Billion a day! OH MY WE BETTER GO SPEND MORE MONEY WE DON"T HAVE!

I almost threw up in my mouth a little when they showed that... No spin at all....


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## PaulS

If the government had truly "shut down" it would cost less than when they are running things.

The "government" shut down is political speak for "shut down as much of the things people enjoy to make them hurt.


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## Arizona Infidel

PaulS said:


> If the government had truly "shut down" it would cost less than when they are running things.
> 
> The "government" shut down is political speak for "shut down as much of the things people enjoy to make them hurt.


Ya. It really is just to make political points.


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## BigCheeseStick




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## lancestar2

Just like I predicted the Republicans cave

At 11th hour, U.S. edges away from brink of debt crisis | Reuters

They do nothing but political posturing wasted our time, efforts, and scared the public into spending less (which might be a good thing lol) and has pressured China and UK and other countries to decrease there investments in the USD and there debt!!!

The republicans kicked the can down the road which will make it even harder for them to defund obamacare because in 2014 IT STARTS GIVE OUT BENEFITS!!!!! Republicans basically gave up when we needed them to stay strong yup I knew it they don't give a shit about doing what is right! They do what they want, and what will get them re-elected. The sad part is when they go back home to talk to there districts they can claim they stood against Obamacare but end of the day they CAVED!

Welcome everyone your now FORCED to pay into a for-profit insurance system that will profit from your health, no incentive to keep prices down with forced purchases!

The republicans have proved to be scum and have no backbone nor principle when big business (there masters who fund there campaigns!) tell them to back of they listen! They should of passed the defunded obamacare bill and left town! Let the senate pass or fail it and it would have been on THEM!!! So stupid the republicans completely messed up and completely lost everything!!


----------

