# Investments 401 (k), IRA other Retirement Accounts the next Target



## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Just ran across this article which is a proposal to allow government regulators access to the goings on of your investment portfolio, Get Ready for Regulators to Peer Into Your Portfolio - MoneyBeat - WSJ

With Quantitative Easing causing the stock market to reach record highs, 17+Trillion of Debt, Record Tax Revenue, Record number of people wanting more free shit and public outcry for income redistribution...does anyone here think that the Feds are NOT coming after your retirement accounts?


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## Notsoyoung (Dec 2, 2013)

I remember hearing a democrat consultant stating something along the line of there being trillions of dollars in 401K plans and bemoaning the fact that they couldn't get their "hands on it". That part "getting their hands on it" shocked me. No pretense about safe guarding it for the individual. No pretense about improving the return on the individual's investments. Just complaining that they couldn't get their hands on it. He tried to justify it by saying that it wasn't fair because there are allot of people who either don't have access to a 401K plan or can't afford one. 

These people do NOT believe that it is YOUR money. They believe that it is theirs and get upset if they can't control someone's money. It upsets me because my 401K plan worked very well for me. When I retired from the Army I got a job working for a Cell Phone Company. After working for a few years I did one of the smartest things in my life. I was putting in allot of overtime bringing up new coverage areas so my wife could quit her job and go back to school to get her BS degree in Computer Science. She started making enough money that I could afford to max out my legal contributions to my 401K plan. After 15 years with my military retirement, my 401K, my wife's salary, and for years taking stock options in lieu of bonuses, when the company I was working for was bought out and I exercised my stock options I was able to retire at the age of 56. A big reason I was able to was because of my 401K plan, and I don't think it would have happened if the government had been controlling my 401K plan.


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## tango (Apr 12, 2013)

Back when POS Pelosi was Speaker and the crash was in full swing, she said, on camera, 'there are billions of dollars out there in IRA's, it's our money. We will just go get it" Paraphrasing---
This has been their plan for awhile.
Protect yourself


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## Notsoyoung (Dec 2, 2013)

What is troubling is that they speak as though there is something criminal or immoral about people who are using 401K plans, so it is only "Just" that the government controls them. We all know that the first thing they would do is move all of the investments into Government bonds, or as I like to call them "Government I.O.U.'s". Can't beat that 1% returns on that investment can we?


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

The Feds will not stop until they gain control. Maybe not next year or in the next 5 years but slowly overtime more regulatory control will occur until your money is not your money anymore.


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## Casie (Feb 26, 2014)

This *is* coming down the line. Laws are already being put on the books, laying the ground work for it. This is what the MyRA is all about. After all, anyone can open an IRA and buy T-Bills (though I have no idea why anyone would). But by pretending the government is looking out for the little guys by offering a "brand new MyRA" product, it has given them an excuse to start building the framework they will need to manage *all* retirement plans. In actuality MyRA is a nasty, evil piece of work, as it targets "first time investors", which means the working poor and young people. It's sick!

According to President Obama, the 'MyRA' account would "guarantee a decent return with no risk of losing what you put it." 
Sounds too good to be true? That's because it is. Unless you think it's possible to retire comfortably on a 3k return for your 20+ years of participation.

Here's the plan:
Step 1: Create the MyRA, which is just like an IRA, but can only be invested in Treasury securities.

Step 2: Make it mandatory that 15% (or more) of all Roth, IRA and 401k plans be invested in Treasury securities, (MyRA-ish).

Step 3: Forcibly convert every Roth, IRA and 401K to a MyRA.

It wouldn't be the first time it's ever happened. It was just last September that Poland announced quietly that it would transfer to the state (confiscate) the bulk of assets owned by the country's private pension funds.

And another fun fact you may have missed, in December China suddenly offloaded $48 billion in US Treasury holdings! This was the second largest dump by China in history. So why didn't this make front page news? Why didn't anyone talk about it? Because out of the clear blue sky, someone came to the US rescue and purchased all $48 billion.

Guess who it was.

Belgium! Belgium, which as you know is simply another name for... Europe. It's the EU's headquarters, and the home of NATO. One wonders what favors are being exchanged behind the scenes in order to preserve the semblance that "all is well" in the US? Is it to hard to imagine that this is why the US is pushing for a hot war in the Ukraine to force Ukrainians into the EU? We sure seem to be committed to making sure this war happens!

And do not forget, it was NATO (EU/US) that told the deeply devided Ukraine they must choose a side. NATO demanded an ethnically divided Ukraine choose EU/US assistance OR Russian assistance. Putin, on the other hand did not make such demands, and offered his 5 billion in assistance to the Ukraine without hesitation or stipulations. He said, "Why should they have to choose?" (He then promised 15 billion more)

The EU's offer was mere millions and came with all the oppressive measures that Greece is now burdened with. It is any surprise that Ukraine voted to not join the EU and instead looked to Russia? And does it make sense that the US is happy to promote a war that will keep the EU buying our T-bills... until of course they are ready to force American's to fill their retirement accounts with them.

My apologies for the rant.


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## AquaHull (Jun 10, 2012)

Michigan starting taxing IRA W/D's at 20% a couple years ago. 70 something was the grandfather clause where they wouldn't nab ya,but all the young folks will get hit.


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## Casie (Feb 26, 2014)

Oh! I almost forgot. Don't forget the sick irony that you are still forced to pay into SS every single check.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Obama has a plan in place to take all retirement accounts and share them . You did not not earn that money.
He tried to start the move but was held back ,the idea is still there.


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

You all understand that the retirement funds are the only location where enough money resides to secure as collateral so that the debt is not considered junk. A debt that is owed by a person or entity that is unsecured and known that the person or entity has no ability to pay the debt is considered "junk". So if you resist the government securing those funds you are encouraging the demise of the us fiat currency. As the debt is unsecured with very little collateral. You should be willing to allow the government to secure these funds their by securing the future of the currency and the liquidity of the government under which you reside so that you will be secure in your personal retirement.


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## Notsoyoung (Dec 2, 2013)

alterego said:


> You all understand that the retirement funds are the only location where enough money resides to secure as collateral so that the debt is not considered junk. A debt that is owed by a person or entity that is unsecured and known that the person or entity has no ability to pay the debt is considered "junk". So if you resist the government securing those funds you are encouraging the demise of the us fiat currency. As the debt is unsecured with very little collateral. You should be willing to allow the government to secure these funds their by securing the future of the currency and the liquidity of the government under which you reside so that you will be secure in your personal retirement.


Bull! Politicians spend money that that the government doesn't have and take out loans for which it has no security, and the answer to their little problem is to take control of individuals PRIVATE retirement funds? And just how long will it be before that is squandered? Using this logic there are all of this private property and businesses in the country. To help "secure" government loans, why not just have the government take ownership of EVERYTHING? After all, wouldn't that benefit everybody and the Country? Yeah, history tells us how well that works out.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

A spin on that commercial - "It's _my_ money, and _they_ want it _NOW_!"

There is nothing of ours that our rogue government doesn't want to take.

Besides, why do we need a retirement account? Due to the Affordable Healthcare rules for geriatric care, we will be delivered a bottle of tequila and 30 hydrocodone tablets with instructions to take tablets with the tequila. If you want to be really patriotic, you can crawl into the nearest dumpster, first.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

alterego said:


> You all understand that the retirement funds are the only location where enough money resides to secure as collateral so that the debt is not considered junk. A debt that is owed by a person or entity that is unsecured and known that the person or entity has no ability to pay the debt is considered "junk". So if you resist the government securing those funds you are encouraging the demise of the us fiat currency. As the debt is unsecured with very little collateral. You should be willing to allow the government to secure these funds their by securing the future of the currency and the liquidity of the government under which you reside so that you will be secure in your personal retirement.


Alterego,
Not trying to be a smart ass but please expound on this a bit further, I am not following you on this one. Simple English for those simple folk not in Ionia County! 
Thanks


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Correct. Except she's not an advisor or consultant she's on the obama regimes economic policies group and fairly high ranking - if I knew her name I'd post it. He thesis, or some paper she wrote, came up during her confirmation hearings and she defended them - yet still passed the senate (of course). In her doc she proposed that every 10 years there by a "taking" of 10% of everyone's IRA, 401k, and 403b (and other) accounts. Her proposal I believe was to use the last digit of your social security number as "your" year. Mine is "x" so in 201x I'd owe up 10% of my IRA. Now that would be a problem for me since my IRA is self directed and who decides what the value of my real estate holdings in it - really is. My personal issues aside I'm not opposed to a wealth tax in place of an income tax. In fact I think our society would be best served by a fair tax (1), income tax (2) and wealth tax (3). This way all of them could be smaller and a broader group of taxpayers would contribute to balancing our budget.



Notsoyoung said:


> I remember hearing a democrat consultant stating something along the line of there being trillions of dollars in 401K plans and bemoaning the fact that they couldn't get their "hands on it". That part "getting their hands on it" shocked me. No pretense about safe guarding it for the individual. No pretense about improving the return on the individual's investments. Just complaining that they couldn't get their hands on it. He tried to justify it by saying that it wasn't fair because there are allot of people who either don't have access to a 401K plan or can't afford one.
> 
> These people do NOT believe that it is YOUR money. They believe that it is theirs and get upset if they can't control someone's money. It upsets me because my 401K plan worked very well for me. When I retired from the Army I got a job working for a Cell Phone Company. After working for a few years I did one of the smartest things in my life. I was putting in allot of overtime bringing up new coverage areas so my wife could quit her job and go back to school to get her BS degree in Computer Science. She started making enough money that I could afford to max out my legal contributions to my 401K plan. After 15 years with my military retirement, my 401K, my wife's salary, and for years taking stock options in lieu of bonuses, when the company I was working for was bought out and I exercised my stock options I was able to retire at the age of 56. A big reason I was able to was because of my 401K plan, and I don't think it would have happened if the government had been controlling my 401K plan.


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## StarPD45 (Nov 13, 2012)

The only problem with the "Fair Tax" or a "Wealth Tax" is as long as Congress has the final say, they will just keep going up. And of course, we will never dump the income tax as long as we have the 16th Amendment.
.
.
From Retirement savings, investment & income plans from Dennis Miller Feb 20,2014
The Three Stooges Debunk myRA
A little skit ran through my head the other day&#8230;
The house lights dimmed and the bright American flag glistened in the background. The crowd hushed as a tall man in a strange costume strode confidently on to the stage. 
Curly turned to Larry and Moe and exclaimed, "Oh my, that's our favorite- Uncle Sam, our boyhood hero." Moe put his finger to his lips as if to say "Shhh!"
Uncle Sam rapped the microphone with his fingernail and the sound echoed throughout the hall. He then bellowed out, "Hello my fellow Americans!" and the crowd cheered wildly.
He continued, "Today I want to announce the deal of a lifetime. We all know that IRAs and 401(k)s are tools greedy rich people use to save for retirement. I'm here to announce a new retirement program for everyday, ordinary people. Everyone should have the right to retire safely and with dignity, and that is what we are going to do for you."
Uncle Sam paused until the applause died down.
"Today we have introduced a new retirement program called myRA. It's pretty simple. Your employer can withdraw as little as $5 from your paycheck, and it will be invested in a new government bond that will earn the same variable rate interest as those available through the government Thrift Saving Plan Government Securities Investment Fund (G fund). If you change jobs it is totally portable. You can take it with you.
"While the final details are still being worked out, you can invest your money into safe, interest-bearing bonds and let it grow tax free. And the best part is: when you take your distribution out, you don't have to pay taxes on it either. 
"So, there you have it! You can have money taken out of your paycheck in small amounts. It will be invested in variable interest government bonds paying a good return, and it will be there for your retirement along with Social Security, TAX FREE! Don't ever say your Uncle Sam isn't looking out for you. 
"I know everyone is anxious to get started, but I will answer some questions now. Please raise your hand."
Curly raised his hand and Uncle Sam pointed in his direction. "You, baldy, what's your question?"
Curly cleared his throat and asked, "It looks to me like the government is acting like an insurance company. We give you our money and you look after it for our retirement. Is that correct?" 
"Exactly right," Uncle Sam responded. "Who else can keep money as safe as the US government?"
Curly, Larry and Moe looked at each other quizzically. 
Moe raised his hand. Uncle Sam spotted him and said, "You, mop head, what is your question?"
Moe says, "The National Debt Clock shows the government already has over $127 trillion in unfunded promises to others. How will our money be invested? Will it be used to make good on promises already made to other people?"
Uncle Sam paused for a moment and said, "Those details will be worked out. While that may happen, younger people will take part in this program too, so they will help pay for your retirement when the time comes."
Moe could barely contain himself, "Isn't that a Ponzi scheme? I thought they were illegal?"
Uncle Sam paused and said, "Ponzi schemes are illegal, unless they are run by the government. What's your problem? I mean, come on! Doesn't everyone trust the government?"
51% of the audience cheered wildly while the other 49% remained silent.
Larry, not wanting to be outdone by his friends, raised his hand.
"You, half-bald mop-head, what's on your mind?"
Larry replied, "I have a two part question. Why not use a Roth IRA instead? Aren't they available to everyone? Also, can't all self-directed retirement plans invest in government bonds now if they want to?"
Uncle Sam's face grew red as he responded, "Obviously, you don't get it. Nothing is safer than a retirement program totally invested with the government. You earn a decent yield without any worry."
Larry shouted, "Wait a minute! The government has already made over $127 trillion in promises it cannot keep. Now you want us to invest our money with you, at an interest rate that you control? What's the catch?"
Uncle Sam's face grew bright red as he exclaimed, "Everyone knows the government can do a better job of looking after your money than you can. You guys are just a bunch of stooges. This program is so good, but you dummies are too stupid to see that!"
Curly turned to Larry and Moe and said, "When Uncle Sam calls it a myRA he is right. "My" means it is his. We may be dumb, but we are not that stupid. This is a terrible idea. They are just trying to grab our money so they can keep buying votes in the next election. I am not touching it."
"I heard that!" Uncle Sam screamed. "You are the kind of people who have torn America apart-greedy, selfish and without compassion for the little guy. Audience, you heard them. Don't you agree?"
51% jumped to their feet screaming wildly while the other 49% sat silent. Once the noise died down, Larry uttered through the microphone, "It sounds to me like another money grab. We might be better off just leaving the country."
Uncle Sam realized this was an argument he had to win. "Look you un-American radicals! We don't want your kind in this country. Those values have no place in a modern society. Go ahead! Get the hell out of here! Just leave your money behind. Audience, don't you agree it is time to tell those greedy buggers to hit the road? If they don't want to share, let them go elsewhere. I am sick of their selfish ways."
Again, 51% jumped to their feet screaming wildly, glaring at Larry, Curly and Moe. The screaming would not stop. 49% quietly headed to the exits with the three stooges leading the way. Moe, speaking in almost a whisper, commented, "It seems the real stooges are the ones who fall for the scheme." The 49% nodded their heads in silent agreement. &#8230;
Personally, I am a registered independent and have been for over 50 years. Both political parties have pushed the government to make $130 trillion dollars worth of promises-with our money-that it cannot afford to pay. What a terrible burden to place on future generations!
Our national debt clock shows government liabilities of $1.1 million per taxpayer. They spend our money to buy votes to stay in power. The system is beyond repair.
Humor is a good outlet to help work through issues that might otherwise drive my blood pressure-and yours-to an all-time high. Here's the scary part we cannot laugh away: myRAs are real. I recommend reviewing a few of the details from MarketWatch.
My advice: Just say no to myRA and open up a Roth IRA instead. You receive the same tax benefits but more options to invest your money ahead of inflation so you can actually enjoy retirement. Snake Oil is Snake Oil, no matter how you try to package it.
As a person who has spent the last several years trying to help people understand investing so they may retire comfortably, I become more frustrated with the government every day. No one needs a myRA when they can invest in a Roth IRA with the same benefits but greater flexibility.


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

Until the pain at the tax door impacts all people, and pays for all the wants, it is doubtful we can reduce the wants at all. Why not want more when you constantly get 15% extra at no cost.



StarPD45 said:


> The only problem with the "Fair Tax" or a "Wealth Tax" is as long as Congress has the final say, they will just keep going up. And of course, we will never dump the income tax as long as we have the 16th Amendment.
> .
> .
> From Retirement savings, investment & income plans from Dennis Miller Feb 20,2014
> ...


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

Sorry all. My post above is my attempt at a liberal minded NPR interview of a fair and balanced take on the government taking your money to secure the bad debt spending to distribute wealth.

Apology if you got any on you.


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