# Match grade ammo, Questions



## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

First I want to thank you guys for helping me on Scopes, barrels, lowers, and triggers, I have bought my scope. and ordered the parts for the trigger. 

Now I need your input on ammo. I have a 1-7 twist barrel so I was going to start out with match grade ammo 77gn and 69gn and see where it leads me. That's one of my questions does that sound about where I should start with the bullet weight?

Match Ammo, I been looking at Winchester and Hornady. But there are so many brand names what's good? <What works for you?

Also I read somewhere that you got be careful because some company's use the word "match" more for the name of the ammo and not so
much as a description of the ammo. Is this true? Does it really need to say "Match grade" and not just match?


Note: someone should sell a 20 round box of match ammo with 4 different bullet weights 5 each of each for tuning in a rifle.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

budgetprepp-n said:


> First I want to thank you guys for helping me on Scopes, barrels, lowers, and triggers, I have bought my scope. and ordered the parts for the trigger.
> 
> Now I need your input on ammo. I have a 1-7 twist barrel so I was going to start out with match grade ammo 77gn and 69gn and see where it leads me. That's one of my questions does that sound about where I should start with the bullet weight?
> 
> ...


 Sounds like you have it figured out. You said earlier that 100 yards was you general range goals. 62-77 will serve you well with 77 likely being the cream of the crop. Match grade by the name brand will serve you well. In most cases however off the shelf 62 grain will do well out to 300-400 yards for most shooters.
If you really want to play with it you need to find a local reloader that understand the 5.56 and let that person load you up some. Different powers also make a difference. Sounds like your are in for a lot of fun.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

In my opinion, I think that you should shoot the 69 and 77grn ammo, but also buy and shoot 55grn and 62grn, 193 and 855 green tip as well. Learn how your rifle shoots a variety of ammo and then pick one or more that you stock and shoot.
Take a look at Hornady Black https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/category/hornady/ammunition.do and Steel Match ammo https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/hornady-steel-match-rifle-223-rem-bthp-75-grain-50-rounds?a=862801, in addition to Speer Gold Dot ammo...https://www.ammunitiondepot.com/145-speer-gold-dot-223-rem-64-grain-sp.html for quality, yet affordable ammo. 193 and 855 green tip is readily available as well.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

I've played around on the bench with a number of AR15 style rifles using a locking "sled" and 5.56 ammo. The difference in accuracy with various bullet grains and barrel twists at 100 yards is statistically insignificant. At least for me based upon my trials. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Slippy said:


> I've played around on the bench with a number of AR15 style rifles using a locking "sled" and 5.56 ammo. The difference in accuracy with various bullet grains and barrel twists at 100 yards is statistically insignificant. At least for me based upon my trials. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.


True on the insignificant accuracy at 100, but heavier gran ammo separates from others (55-62grn), is longer range. Heavier weight round carries more energy and is more accurate at longer range.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

What weight range will be stabilized by a 1 in 9 twist rate?
Will a 35 grain varmint round disintegrate in flight from a twist that fast?

I've got a Mini 14 that is mainly for barnyard defense against coyotes and dogs. I'm not worried about one MOA at 200 yards. 
Right now it is kept loaded with Winchester Super X 55 grain JSP.
I also have a box of Hornady V Max 45 grain polymer tip varmint rounds.


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

To evaluate a certain rounds compatibility with a rifle you really need to go with at least 50 rounds.

In this case, being new to the rifle, learn how to shoot it first,

using cheap M-193 or the little more expensive M-855 ammo.

At a point when you can from a bench generate 1-1/2 inch groups consistently,

you can then start looking at more accurate ammo.

One thing not pointed out here is that the barrel needs to be broken in first.

About one hundred rounds of M-193 is a good start for both of you.

You can use that break in time to learn about the rifle and yourself shooting it.

If the tube is good mechanically, the 855 will shoot under one inch or one MOA.

Have you shot sub MOA with any rifle? 

To be realistic, you have to be able to before you can get it out of any rifle.

I learned to shoot a long time ago, high power competition with an M1 and M14.

Today with either my M-25 or my bolt sniper I can still shoot 1/2-3/4 MOA mostly to the 3/4.

I had a customer for who I built a rifle for, bring it back saying it would not shoot under 6 inches @ 100 yds.

Took him and rifle out back and proceeded to put five rounds in the same hole at 100,

he shut his mouth and thanked me.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

budgetprepp-n said:


> ...............Note: someone should sell a 20 round box of match ammo with 4 different bullet weights 5 each of each for tuning in a rifle.


Do what I do...... get handfuls of different rounds from friends who are shooters. We do this all the time. Someone in our group buys a new boomstick, and we all donate 10 or 15 rounds of all the different ammo we have one hand and the proud new owner gets to go out and try a couple dozen different types of ammo to see what works and what doesn't work. Then when I come home with a new toy, I know I'm going to inherit bits of pieces of everyone else's stock so I can do the same thing.

It's an all-around win-win situation. Going to the range and sending 15 different rounds downrange really helps speed up the 'what works best' process after buying a new firearm.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

You need to start reloading if your going down this road, IMHO. A grain or 2 of powder with the same bullet will make a world of difference in accuracy. If you find a round that works make sure to buy a bunch with the same lot number. The question is the manufacture loading the ammo "EXACTLY" the same with each run. So your rifle will shoot and group the same shot after shot. If you reload "YOU" control what goes into a round, bullet depth, crimp, powder, COL etc to match what your rifle likes. Plus you will save money in the long run over buying "match" ammo. 

For example with my 270 I wanted a lighter bullet for varmints but would still work for deer. Found a Hornady 110 grain bullet and worked with it until I got it to shoot through my rifle. The center picture, orange dot, shows the group. Minute of coyote eye ball is close enough for me. Thing is nobody loads that bullet in a 270 that I can find. Yet the round is one of the most accurate, devastating rounds I've seen on game.


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## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

Smitty901 said:


> Sounds like you have it figured out. You said earlier that 100 yards was you general range goals. 62-77 will serve you well with 77 likely being the cream of the crop. Match grade by the name brand will serve you well. In most cases however off the shelf 62 grain will do well out to 300-400 yards for most shooters.
> If you really want to play with it you need to find a local reloader that understand the 5.56 and let that person load you up some. Different powers also make a difference. Sounds like your are in for a lot of fun.


Yes I am a 100 yard shooter. I'm hopping to move up from that to some longer distances.


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## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

RedLion said:


> In my opinion, I think that you should shoot the 69 and 77grn ammo, but also buy and shoot 55grn and 62grn, 193 and 855 green tip as well. Learn how your rifle shoots a variety of ammo and then pick one or more that you stock and shoot.
> Take a look at Hornady Black https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/category/hornady/ammunition.do and Steel Match ammo https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/hornady-steel-match-rifle-223-rem-bthp-75-grain-50-rounds?a=862801, in addition to Speer Gold Dot ammo...https://www.ammunitiondepot.com/145-speer-gold-dot-223-rem-64-grain-sp.html for quality, yet affordable ammo. 193 and 855 green tip is readily available as well.


Thanks for the links. I'm checking them all out


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## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

RedLion said:


> True on the insignificant accuracy at 100, but heavier gran ammo separates from others (55-62grn), is longer range. Heavier weight round carries more energy and is more accurate at longer range.


Yes I know you guys taught me that. That's why I got the 1-7 twist rate so the heaver ammo would feel a home.


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## LunaticFringeInc (Nov 20, 2012)

If it were me....but its not!



> Now I need your input on ammo. I have a 1-7 twist barrel so I was going to start out with match grade ammo 77gn and 69gn and see where it leads me.


That seems like a good place to start bullet weight wise if its all about accuracy given that twist rate on your gun. While you might be able to do better, I seriously doubt you can go too far wrong with that for a starting point.



> Match Ammo, I been looking at Winchester and Hornady. But there are so many brand names what's good? <What works for you?


Not to be a biased hater but I would likely default to Hornady first. I have used their commercially loaded ammo on many occasions and its almost always been one of the better choices. For commercial ammo...dont throw your nose up at Nosler, its usually been top shelf for me many times!!! It can be a little pricey at times and a bit on the scarce side on the store shelf, but usually performs very well. Even for my Handloads, they are usually sporting Hornady bullets except in rare cases. If you look at the bullets on my reloading bench, I am sure that probably 70% of whats on the shelf is Hornady. In fact in 7.62x39 thats the only selection on the shelf as I cant find anything that performs better in the 5 guns I have in that caliber of different makes and designs!



> Note: someone should sell a 20 round box of match ammo with 4 different bullet weights 5 each of each for tuning in a rifle.


On the surface that sounds like a good idea...but once you get into hand loading your own ammo and play around with all the myrad of changes that you can make to tweak a load, you'll discover that there are many other factors than just bullet weight or design, that can have a profound effect on accuracy. Its been said that its the little things that make or break you and seperate the average from the exceptional. You would be amazed at how much 1/10th of a grain in powder or a few thousandths of an inch on seating depth can make to a load in a particular rifle and thats just two aspects of a load!!!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

budgetprepp-n said:


> Yes I am a 100 yard shooter. I'm hopping to move up from that to some longer distances.


 You will get there. Just don't make the mistake of expecting more from a weapon than it is signed for.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

rice paddy daddy said:


> What weight range will be stabilized by a 1 in 9 twist rate?
> Will a 35 grain varmint round disintegrate in flight from a twist that fast?
> 
> I've got a Mini 14 that is mainly for barnyard defense against coyotes and dogs. I'm not worried about one MOA at 200 yards.
> ...


An AR with a 1:9 twist usually shoots the lighter to mid-weight rounds well and the heavier rounds not to well. 50-69 grn for a 1:9 twist.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

budgetprepp-n said:


> Thanks for the links. I'm checking them all out


A couple good sites to use to search for ammo. https://ammoseek.com/ & GunBot 17hmr rimfire ammo


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

rice paddy daddy said:


> What weight range will be stabilized by a 1 in 9 twist rate?
> Will a 35 grain varmint round disintegrate in flight from a twist that fast?
> 
> I've got a Mini 14 that is mainly for barnyard defense against coyotes and dogs. I'm not worried about one MOA at 200 yards.
> ...


 This is a generally correct guide . I say that because you can always fudge the numbers a little.


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## LunaticFringeInc (Nov 20, 2012)

I have a couple of 1-9 guns and they work generally well with 55 to 69 in my guns. Lighter than that or heavier and things start getting pretty iffy accuracy wise. Its not so much about the weight as it is the bullets profile design and length of the bullet.


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## Gunn (Jan 1, 2016)

Break the rifle in. Then take your brass and start reloading. Start with a light to mid weight bullet. Start at the minimum load for that weight of bullet load 10 bullets, move up 1/10 grain and do again until you reach max. Whichever starts to pattern best you start working around that load. If nothing works change powders and try again. That is what I do. Some people do not have the patients to do this. But I find it fun and relaxing.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Anytime any where, hand me any Ar15 with off the rack ammo 55gr to 77gr 1 in 7,8 or 9 iron sights and I will hit a man size target every time prone ,standing supported unsupported kneeing. And I can train anyone that can see 200 yards to do the same.
Can do it at even father ranges but would bet the weapon on it at 200 yards and take it home with me.


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

Mine are 1-7 and 1-9 for the most part, I don't load anymore.

I do have a ton of M193 and M855 stored for SHTF, both will do the job needed of them.


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## NewRiverGeorge (Jan 2, 2018)

Sierra Match Kings have always performed exceptionally for me. I love to load them over 24g of Varget. My Colt 6920 (1:7) absolutely loves them.


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## KUSA (Apr 21, 2016)

Here you go.

https://www.targetsportsusa.com/fed...to-77-grain-open-tip-match-fc262-p-58827.aspx


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## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

KUSA said:


> Here you go.
> 
> https://www.targetsportsusa.com/fed...to-77-grain-open-tip-match-fc262-p-58827.aspx


would this be like a match grade? I need to find out for sure what my rifle likes. ( you only get one free turret


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

Black hills 77gr mk 262, Federal MK318 Mod 0 . Proven and tested t8 be pretty darn accurate


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## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

Slippy said:


> I've played around on the bench with a number of AR15 style rifles using a locking "sled" and 5.56 ammo. The difference in accuracy with various bullet grains and barrel twists at 100 yards is statistically insignificant. At least for me based upon my trials. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.


Yes I agree I would like to take 3 different Grains of match ammo and tune it in at about 400 yards. I got to admit I'm not much of a long distance shooter
so I might take a good friend that's really good and let him shoot it and let me do the adjustments to get hang of the scope.

I'm inexperienced at this kid of shooting but I must admit I'm having a blast. Man with this weather I will probably wait till spring and take a full day.
I am amazed at what is involved in sending a little piece of lead to the same spot at the distances that they do.
I had a guy that is a reloaded was tell me about different powders for different burn time for different length barrels and I found it fascinating. I can see a guy can get hooked on shooting as a sport or hobby.


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## KUSA (Apr 21, 2016)

budgetprepp-n said:


> would this be like a match grade? I need to find out for sure what my rifle likes. ( you only get one free turret


It's match grade military ammo. The bullet is a 77 grain Sierra Match King. If your rifle won't shoot this well then it's your rifle. You may find something else that your rifle likes a bit better but this is quality ammo that you should consider.


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