# Open Carriers



## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

not protesters mind you, just random people open carrying in convenience stores at 10pm. I encountered one last evening, I truly had the urge to remove his weapon and shove it up his ass and tell him no one should or needs to know he is carrying. It was a cheap gun in a bikini type holster with no retention. Really bad tactical form to do so. And the carrier was a doofus, oblivious to surroundings, sunglasses on at 10pm etc. I know lighten up Francis.

I also sort of liken it to this, same doofus walks into the same store wearing a banana hammock, nothing else. Everyone can see he is wearing a banana hammock but we really do not need to know.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

Our laws in Tennessee are becoming more relaxed regarding weapons carry. Anyone who can pass a background check can now carry a loaded gun in their vehicle. I'm fine with that. Open carry is certainly not for me. I have to carry openly in plain clothes/business casual on duty but I don't like people knowing I am armed. All too often people carry a gun on their hip as social plumage. "Look at me, I am a badass." Out in the woods or on a farm is one thing, but at the grocery store? I'm not a fan.

It's your right, I will not say a word to you. I don't think you are helping the cause though. You will also be the first person to get shot in a robbery so I will thank you in advance for drawing the suspect's fire and dying so I can engage and neutralize the threat......hopefully.


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## 7515 (Aug 31, 2014)

I don't see this issue. If they guy wants to open carry as opposed to concealed why is it even your business? I see your point regarding the holster not being secure, but did you mention that to him?


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

My common dress for work is usually jeans and a button down casual or dress shirt tucked in. Between or after my work meetings, I'll usually strap on my full size .45 in a Blackhawk Serpa Holster. In the summertime in the South, how do I conceal? Yes, I could go with an "inside the waistband holster and a compact, which I sometimes do but it is NOT comfortable at all and I am not practiced at making the draw, it has never been comfortable to me . If I have to stop for gas or the store, I have no choice and will open carry. 

Believe me, I do not flaunt it and do not do this for people to think I'm a badass. Its just the result of the situation.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Box of frogs said:


> I don't see this issue. If they guy wants to open carry as opposed to concealed why is it even your business? I see your point regarding the holster not being secure, but did you mention that to him?


There was no need to even make contact with this person. I just sort of had a heightened observation, due to my surroundings and location. I had no idea if the guy was waiting for the store to clear out so he could rob it? Or if he was just intent on showing off for his girlfriend? Since I was still on the clock working and not carrying concealed, if this person's intent was to rob the place while I was still there, all I had was a Kershaw Blur. So I got my food as quick as I could and moved on. I hate to pass judgment on anyone, but educating this person would probably been an exercise in futility.

In PA where this happened, there is no law concerning OC making it defacto legal. Concealed? Need a permit. I'm betting that is why he was OC, no permit. Now do this in a larger city, you will most likely have contact with LE and in some places be cited for disturbing the peace or disorderly conduct. You used the Officers time to investigate your carry practice, now you need to spend money to defend the citation. I'm not going to research this 2A infringement, but that is the way it goes in the larger cities. Therefore I CC. I'm not going to give up my tactical advantage just to feel good about myself.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Box of frogs said:


> I don't see this issue. If they guy wants to open carry as opposed to concealed why is it even your business? I see your point regarding the holster not being secure, but did you mention that to him?


First impressions are lasting ones. Within 10 seconds of encountering this person, my immediate thoughts/first impressions were to look around and see who was filming as this looked just like a scenario I would later see on youtube OC. I reviewed my original post and see I gave no description. 20 y/o, 6'+ 150, sunglasses on at 10pm, cheap gun cheaper holster, girlfriend with him. Looked very similar to those that appear in the vids. This store is very close to a PSP station.

edit: I should read my own postings closer, I gave a brief description.


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## GTGallop (Nov 11, 2012)

I like to take the same stance with people who open carry in public (in town, not rural) that I take with homosexuals. As long as they aren't trying to F-me, I really couldn't care less.

Note, I'm not calling OC gay or comparing the two. I'm saying I approach these two different topics with the same mindset. As long as it doesn't involve me, I don't care. Their life, their business, their freedom - my participation and/or judgement is not required. Point that gun (either one) at me, then I'll have an issue and it will be resolved quickly. ;-)


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

GasholeWillie said:


> First impressions are lasting ones. Within 10 seconds of encountering this person, my immediate thoughts/first impressions were to look around and see who was filming as this looked just like a scenario I would later see on youtube OC. I reviewed my original post and see I gave no description. 20 y/o, 6'+ 150, sunglasses on at 10pm, cheap gun cheaper holster, girlfriend with him. Looked very similar to those that appear in the vids. This store is very close to a PSP station.
> 
> edit: I should read my own postings closer, I gave a brief description.


Thanks and I understand better now. In my case, early 50's mostly gray headed yet strikingly handsome for a "husky" man, and usually in a rural setting...sends a different message I would hope!


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Gasholewillie, do you have the same reaction when you see a cop open carry, they're both legal! The cop even wears a uniform to flaunt his authority/position of power and a badge to prove he is somebody. Which one is more likely to have a confrontation with you? Just wondering.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

GTGallop said:


> I like to take the same stance with people who open carry in public (in town, not rural) that I take with homosexuals. As long as they aren't trying to F-me, I really couldn't care less.
> 
> Note, I'm not calling OC gay or comparing the two. I'm saying I approach these two different topics with the same mindset. As long as it doesn't involve me, I don't care. Their life, their business, their freedom - my participation and/or judgement is not required. Point that gun (either one) at me, then I'll have an issue and it will be resolved quickly. ;-)


Which is kinda why I stayed behind him the whole time he was within my view. I did not want it to involve me. It was just that brief thought that this was one of those youtube OCer video things. I wanted to watch his actions while I waited to get my food and if that right hand went for the gun, well then all bets are off.

One of my co workers was robbed at gunpoint last year, while checking into a hotel, she walked into a robbery. I cannot, by company policy, CC while I'm on the company dime. Unless I don't want to work there any longer, then I can carry until they find out and fire me. Right now that seems kinda not smart to do. If I am working by myself, I "might" CC if I think the work scenario could put me at a higher risk which would be being in a convenience store at night or a hotel parking lot, check in solo.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

ekim said:


> Gasholewillie, do you have the same reaction when you see a cop open carry, they're both legal! The cop even wears a uniform to flaunt his authority/position of power and a badge to prove he is somebody. Which one is more likely to have a confrontation with you? Just wondering.


Ehh I should have snapped a pic, then you might understand the way it unfolded better, picture worth a 1000 words I guess? But see the post below yours, perhaps that sheds some light on it. No, I don't agree with your comment that a cop wears a uniform to "flaunt" anything. They are there to enforce law and the gun is there to protect themselves. And the badge just proves he is a member of stated jurisdiction.


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## jeff70 (Jan 29, 2014)

A pic would be good, but I don't see a issue with open carry in general, It is the morons that walk around with ARs and AKs that make me wonder.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

I don't think the open carry was the issue, I think Mr. Gashole had more of a problem with the fact the boozer was wearing a cheap set up that looked as if it was engineered in Africa. All to impress a lady at the expense of everyone else's brain cells. 
Gashole is just being an honest fashion police officer. Or is he? I bet you got that "oh damn, sum tin ain't right about this hear", feeling! that is hard to explain to those who have never felt it or noticed they felt it before, didn't yah? Sorry about the ******* hillbilly text type thingy did not mean to offend anyone it is just how it plays out in my head when I get it.


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## dwight55 (Nov 9, 2012)

On or around July 4th, . . . mounted in by best cowboy duds, . . . I open carry my Beretta Stampede .45LC, . . . in a custom made black leather holster and belt.

Other than that day, . . . about the only other open carry, . . . is to the right of Old Glory with my M14, . . . during the parade, . . . or at a fellow veteran's funeral with a Garand.

Otherwise, . . . it's called concealed carry for a reason.

May God bless,
Dwight


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## ApexPredator (Aug 17, 2013)

GasholeWillie said:


> not protesters mind you, just random people open carrying in convenience stores at 10pm. I encountered one last evening, I truly had the urge to remove his weapon and shove it up his ass and tell him no one should or needs to know he is carrying. It was a cheap gun in a bikini type holster with no retention. Really bad tactical form to do so. And the carrier was a doofus, oblivious to surroundings, sunglasses on at 10pm etc. I know lighten up Francis.
> 
> I also sort of liken it to this, same doofus walks into the same store wearing a banana hammock, nothing else. Everyone can see he is wearing a banana hammock but we really do not need to know.


AARG I have and would open carry again if it were legal where I live. Your not giving up any "tactical" advantage Ill beat you in any draw OC vs CC. If your not aware of your surroundings hiding your gun aint gonna help you. Listen man I could argue with you all night but why your obviously biased towards it, but if no one open carries then who is showing the public that guns are part of normal everyday life certainly not you with your hidden carry, and yes I understand wackos who abuse this right. So the next time you see it don't be a coward, approach the guy and say hey why do you open carry and see if you can influence him to be more conformist like yourself if it bothers you so.


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## paraquack (Mar 1, 2013)

Everybody to their own, I guess. Sorry, but if it's legal, and the guy isn't be some 
kind of yohoo (holster not included), so what. Down here I see lots of open carry. 
It's a way of life.


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## slewfoot (Nov 6, 2013)

ekim said:


> Gasholewillie, do you have the same reaction when you see a cop open carry, they're both legal! The cop even wears a uniform to flaunt his authority/position of power and a badge to prove he is somebody. Which one is more likely to have a confrontation with you? Just wondering.


A lot of ignorance showing. The question is even dumber.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

slewfoot said:


> A lot of ignorance showing. The question is even dumber.


You seem to prove your own post, but I've come to expect it from you, please continue.


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## Ian (Dec 12, 2014)

ApexPredator said:


> AARG I have and would open carry again if it were legal where I live. Your not giving up any "tactical" advantage Ill beat you in any draw OC vs CC.


I think the tactical advantage he was referring to was that if some tries to rob a store and sees someone oc-ing their going to shoot them first, if someone is cc-ing they will have the "element of surprise". Also it seems like the person that gasholewillie was talking about was open carrying to impress his girlfriend and seem "macho" or intimidating. imho open carrying is not something i will ever do, but to each their own.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Ian said:


> I think the tactical advantage he was referring to was that if some tries to rob a store and sees someone oc-ing their going to shoot them first, if someone is cc-ing they will have the "element of surprise". Also it seems like the person that gasholewillie was talking about was open carrying to impress his girlfriend and seem "macho" or intimidating. imho open carrying is not something i will ever do, but to each their own.


Having worked in a position for a long time where I needed to catalog a persons actions, demeanor, and basically profile a person to determine if they were threat or not, that experience apparently in my case, has not gone away. Something felt sketchy right away, rights be damned, and self was asking me why is this person OC? My alarm was raised as this person could be a danger to me. Took me about 1 minute to finally feel the guy was just OCing to impress his GF. But until I got to that point, I kept him in front of me.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Medic33 said:


> I don't think the open carry was the issue, I think Mr. Gashole had more of a problem with the fact the boozer was wearing a cheap set up that looked as if it was engineered in Africa. All to impress a lady at the expense of everyone else's brain cells.
> Gashole is just being an honest fashion police officer. Or is he? I bet you got that "oh damn, sum tin ain't right about this hear", feeling! that is hard to explain to those who have never felt it or noticed they felt it before, didn't yah? Sorry about the ******* hillbilly text type thingy did not mean to offend anyone it is just how it plays out in my head when I get it.


I have never saw a holster like it, possibly kydex or polymer, had a tensioner screw on it but holes drilled all thru it. Sort of like a Glock Combat Sport holster with a screw retension. The pistol sort of looked like a Beretta 92, but was not. A knock off of some sort.


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

Box of frogs said:


> I don't see this issue. If they guy wants to open carry as opposed to concealed why is it even your business? I see your point regarding the holster not being secure, but did you mention that to him?


I like this response. It really is none of our business. It's just not for me.


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## CourtSwagger (Jan 3, 2013)

I live in a state where open carry is legal. I choose not to do so. I really have nothing against it, and if I encounter someone carrying openly, I have no issues with it. I do understand GWs concern. When we are all jealously protecting our 2nd Amendment rights, advocating gun safety, and attempting to reintegrate guns into everyday society, encountering a jackhole who is representing us poorly is concerning. Inevitably our opposition will use that idiot as an example as to why guns are evil and normal people shouldn't be trusted with them. Just like when a tornado destroys a town, the newscasters will seek out the dumbest toothless hillbilly to interview. One bad apple...


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

Interesting converation here so I thought I should add to it...

To open carry or to conceal? What an interesting question. Let's break it down. You're evaluating one scenario with one person being the topic. That makes this easier. So this guy was OC'ing in a gas station during night time hours with his GF in tow. Me personally, I have ZERO issue with this for a few reasons. Here are some of them...

1) Maybe the guy can't afford a CC permit. They can be expensive (at least an significant additional expense and period of waiting)...and your mention of the cheap weapon and rig make me think exactly that. So he's carrying in the only way financially feasible for him. 
2) As a prior cop, I can tell you that statiscally speaking, people who are visibly carrying are FAR LESS LIKELY to be robbed or have other crimes committed against them because criminals will avoid the potential threat to their lives presented by visibly armed citizens.
3) If it's legal to do so in your state...why the hell not? Given the choice between conceal carry or open carry, I prefer to OPEN carry when possible. Why you ask? See reason #2. (Not to mention, when questioned by police for any reason, it makes them far less nervous. Ask me how I know.)
4) The GF has little to do with the conversation other than her being present. But for the sake of conversation, maybe she was robbed (or worse) at a gas station (or other public place) at some point in her life...maybe her man is trying everything in his power to make her feel safe in society again, in what ever way he can. Either way, more power to him.
5) One less layer of clothing between you and a successful draw of your firearm. (Easier access) Do you think if I was being car jacked that a concealed pistol on my waistband or in a glove box would help me versus my setup? See pic below...








The advantages to concealed carry? 
1) People (and criminals) DON'T KNOW you're armed. (Caveat: crimes are MORE likely to happen to/around you that otherwise would not, if your firearm was visible.)
2) You are far less likely to make gun wary citizens nervous because they can't SEE that you're armed.
3) It makes police less likely to "investigate" you during routine interactions. (Caveat: CCP's require extensive checks that remove all potential for subject to be a criminal or felon.)
4) It allows the CCP holder the advantage against an unsuspecting criminal, because the criminal doesn't think the person they're about to rob is armed. (Similar to point #1)

Now, with all that being said, there are also disadvantages to BOTH situations (open vs concealed) in which I'm curious to hear the OP's opinion on.


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## ekim (Dec 28, 2012)

Smokin04 said:


> Interesting converation here so I thought I should add to it...
> 
> To open carry or to conceal? What an interesting question. Let's break it down. You're evaluating one scenario with one person being the topic. That makes this easier. So this guy was OC'ing in a gas station during night time hours with his GF in tow. Me personally, I have ZERO issue with this for a few reasons. Here are some of them...
> 
> ...


Best response I've seen about OC'ing, and it makes sense.


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## Diver (Nov 22, 2014)

GasholeWillie said:


> not protesters mind you, just random people open carrying in convenience stores at 10pm. I encountered one last evening, I truly had the urge to remove his weapon and shove it up his ass and tell him no one should or needs to know he is carrying. It was a cheap gun in a bikini type holster with no retention. Really bad tactical form to do so. And the carrier was a doofus, oblivious to surroundings, sunglasses on at 10pm etc. I know lighten up Francis.
> 
> I also sort of liken it to this, same doofus walks into the same store wearing a banana hammock, nothing else. Everyone can see he is wearing a banana hammock but we really do not need to know.


If it is legal in that location, you have no reason to complain or react. Unless of course you are part of the Bloomberg crowd, then have at it.


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Smokin04 said:


> Interesting converation here so I thought I should add to it...
> 
> To open carry or to conceal? What an interesting question. Let's break it down. You're evaluating one scenario with one person being the topic. That makes this easier. So this guy was OC'ing in a gas station during night time hours with his GF in tow. Me personally, I have ZERO issue with this for a few reasons. Here are some of them...
> 
> ...


I'll try on the negative side, point by point.

1) Permit cost $25 for a 5 year term. no training or additional expenses required by law.
2) If I'm wrong then I am, but I would think (in this scenario I encountered) if the store was going to get robbed at gun point, you have a gun and don't react or do react late, this could truly be problematic. Speculation as to what could happen is worthless. I wish I had a picture because this guy, in my estimation belonged on a bad youtube video.
3) Legal to OC. But the manner in which it was done? You want to do it, PLEASE do it with regard to being responsible as in having a holster with retention. And also being aware of surroundings. IME, clearly this guy was not. And as I'm sure you are aware it takes life experience and some training to hone that awareness. Along with rights comes responsibilities and my opinion means little, but what I was witnessing raised my awareness meter a few pegs.
4) The GF was the guy's focus, that sort of created the inattention. Perhaps when she is not the focus of his attention, he is as responsible as the next OCer. Again speculation and no way for me to determine.
5) If I'm getting car jacked, I'll give the car away, why I have insurance. Anyway I drive with a seat belt on, I'm right handed and both of my cars have high center consols. Regardless if I had to draw from a seated driver position, I'm struggling to do that. Let's not stray from the subject at hand.

I live sort of outside of the suburbs, there are State Game Lands nearby. Everyone around me owns guns. I have encountered 3 scenerios in the past year where I saw someone OC that drew my attention. 2 of those situations raised my awareness, last evening and another time where I was at a Hunt and Fish store and a guy came out of the store with a pistol strapped to his hip that was flippin' and floppin' about like a large busted woman w/o a bra. I fully expected the pistol to eject at any moment and the carrier was oblivious to what I was seeing. The 3rd, I'm not sure if OC or his cover had failed, but it did not concern me one bit. PA is like that, some places OC is fully expected/accepted where other locations will gain you plenty of attention and possibly a citation for disturbing the peace or DC, regardless of what your rights are.

Forgot to mention, I have a permit, carry one of three possible guns, and do not want the attention I anticipate comes with OC. I did not create the mess we currently have, but I live within it's framework. My guns are to protect me from deadly threats.


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## Smokin04 (Jan 29, 2014)

GasholeWillie said:


> I'll try on the negative side, point by point.
> 
> 1) Permit cost $25 for a 5 year term. no training or additional expenses required by law.
> 2) If I'm wrong then I am, but I would think (in this scenario I encountered) if the store was going to get robbed at gun point, you have a gun and don't react or do react late, this could truly be problematic. Speculation as to what could happen is worthless. I wish I had a picture because this guy, in my estimation belonged on a bad youtube video.
> ...


Interesting reply...so I'll respond to your points:

1) If it's truly only $25, then yes it would behove citizens to pursue acquiring one. However, I personally would only conceal when the situation I was potentially being exposed to warranted a CC load out. Few and far between for me. For the guy in question...I don't know what his state of mind is/was and also, maybe he has applied for one, and he's still waiting for it. I don't know of a single state that hands out CC permits without a waiting period.

2) Legally you are NOT OBLIGATED to "keep the peace" or "stop a crime" just because you are carrying a weapon. You are not a police officer. Even if concealed, when interviewed by police following a crime, it will be known that you are a CC permit holder when they run your ID through NCIS. Carrying for defense means just what it says...if YOUR LIFE is put in jeopardy, you can react to defend yourself. I can't see a single cop being upset that you didn't react or "draw down" on a robbery. By drawing down, you may have turned just a robbery into a bloody shoot-out. Hell, anytime bullets are kept from flying, it's a win in LE's eyes.

3) WHo cares about retention? I don't. Then again, I'm trained in weapons retention...where as most are not. Retention holsters can get you killed, ESPECIALLY if/when concealed. Think about it...why would anyone reach for YOUR gun? You're not a uniformed police officer. You're not going hands on with criminals. Yes, cops have to worry about retention when arresting criminals...but IMO any retention device that slows my draw down even 1 millisecond is risking my life. I have had/used double/triple retention holsters in the past...but none of them made me feel more comfortable. My situational awareness is what keeps retention on my weapon, not some holster gimmick. They were more of a hinderance to me. Different strokes I suppose.

4) Speculation aside...nobody knows his intent or capability. My martial arts experince says never underestimate your opponent...so I can translate that into he could be a freakin beast with it...but you won't know until you "try him." Bad juju either way.

5) You could look at purchasing a vehicle that gives you the upper hand in most situations. Not a subject change...just another way to plan to have the tactical advantage in as many situations as possible.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

fill out the application and pay $25. It takes about a week for the local sheriff here to run a back ground check, You then have to show up for a picture on your permit. Issued on the spot and your ready to go. GW you just have to trust your gut sometimes. If someone is giving you the creeps, get away. If your right and something goes down there will be no good coming from it. I have a CC permit too, it is rare for me to open carry but i have done it. Some people are irresponsible in public or at the range. Steer clear.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

The standard use to be open carry in teh USA... everybody had a gun on their hip... even the 15 year old gangly farm boy 

I like to see people carry a gun and have never had the reaction of trying to take it off them... they fact you had that reaction speaks volumes about you...


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## GasholeWillie (Jul 4, 2014)

Camel923 said:


> fill out the application and pay $25. It takes about a week for the local sheriff here to run a back ground check, You then have to show up for a picture on your permit. Issued on the spot and your ready to go. GW you just have to trust your gut sometimes. If someone is giving you the creeps, get away. If your right and something goes down there will be no good coming from it. I have a CC permit too, it is rare for me to open carry but i have done it. Some people are irresponsible in public or at the range. Steer clear.


All I can do is be responsible for myself and my actions. Like I said, it tweaked my personal danger meter for a few minutes. Time of day, location, type of biz. Don't care how close to the PSP barracks it was, the interstate is 1/2 mile away. Anyone doubting my reaction, all I can say is you were not there and I was. Last 2 times my danger meter was tweaked was while I was working, my company just gave me an award for averting a serious accident and the time before that I discovered that an accident had happened based upon what I was witnessing. (someone backing a heavy truck up to an earthen pit that had the potential of collapsing)


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## redhawk (May 7, 2014)

I have a CWP and carry always, that being said, at times I will open carry. I do not like OC but that is just me, if someone feels comfortable carrying openly then more power to them...they are just exercising their second amendment right. I like the idea of no one knowing that I am carrying, basically the only person that knows I carry is my wife and she is not telling anyone...JM2C


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

csi-tech said:


> You will also be the first person to get shot in a robbery so I will thank you in advance for drawing the suspect's fire and dying so I can engage and neutralize the threat......hopefully.


Any cases that you could point us to that shows this?


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

well if 5 people oh never mind it's a what if thingy -sheesh never freaking mind


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Ian said:


> I think the tactical advantage he was referring to was that if some tries to rob a store and sees someone oc-ing their going to shoot them first


Any news articles you can link to that shows this trend?


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## csi-tech (Apr 13, 2013)

Could open carry prevent a robbery? Sure it could. The only point I am trying to impart is purely opinion. I have never heard of it happening at all. It seems that if one were to walk in to a bank or convenience store during the commission of an armed robbery with a visible gun there is a possibility that the offender will immediately recognize the threat and move to negate you as a threat. Just like a big 'ol black and white patrol car. The Cops usually draw fire or otherwise impact a situation just from being there. The cars stand out with this intent in mind. 

The more likely scenario is you are at your Doctor's Office listening to the girl from Ipanima in the lobby when the receptionists jealous husband walks in and starts arguing with her, pulls a gun and murders her right in front of you. I would rather he remained focus on the task at hand rather than dealing with me first. Like I said, just not for me. I think that in most settings open carry makes you stand out and gives the anti-gunners grist for the mill. I have no problem if you choose to do it. I just like the peace of mind going concealed gives me. I can respond if I have to, I have the element of surprise in my corner or I can do nothing and be a good witness. The choice is mine. Not always the case if I have an exposed weapon. IMO.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Throwing around "what if" scenarios is for roleplaying and ego stroking.

If there is no statistical evidence to show that carrying openly makes a person the first target, then I don't consider it in my decision making.
Once that is removed as an issue, the next point my mind goes to is which method of carry offers me the best reaction time.
There is only one good answer.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

I'm with Kauboy in this...but the "Girl from Ipanima" is a darn catchy tune...


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