# Nonverbal Communication and Survival



## Xerographica (Feb 14, 2017)

Howdy folks,

My first post! Maybe I should start off by mentioning that I'm not a _traditional_ prepper. But I did spend 3 years in the infantry down in Panama and a year in Afghanistan. So I do have a few survival skills... but I'm sure that they are pretty rusty. Of course I hope I never get the chance to see just how rusty they are. But I also have a very green thumb!

I definitely enjoy watching fictional disaster shows. The Walking Dead is pretty great. Some non-fiction survivor shows are pretty enjoyable as well. A while back I had a prepper friend who was very excited to watch a new reality survival show. But when we watched the first episode we both agreed that it was painfully and disappointingly bad. I can't remember the name of the show but in the first episode a group of people were arguing about what items to grab from a big box.

My favorite area of study is economics. There's a lot of overlap between economics and survival. A friend and I have been debating the best economic system for a group of people stranded on an island.

Ok...so... nonverbal communication. Like giving somebody the middle finger... or a thumbs up. Smiling or frowning. Is there a connection between nonverbal communication and survival?

You'd figure that if there were two different groups of primates&#8230; whichever group was better at understanding each other would have a greater advantage. Voila! Humans engage in a lot more nonverbal communication than any other primate. Our bodies are also the best at allocating resources. This difference provides another pretty significant survival advantage.

Having arms and hands is like having a built in bug out bag... and walking upright means being able to carry a variety of survival items over greater distances. But you can imagine all the nonverbal communication involved with considering other people's carrying decisions... "You *really* shouldn't carry that!" :vs_mad: There's a limit to how much we can carry so the economic concept of opportunity cost is _very_ relevant to survival.

If you accept the relationship between nonverbal communication and survival... then what? Well... then it's important to appreciate that one of the most important forms of nonverbal communication is spending/sacrificing. In the beginning of the Bible, God judged Cain and Abel on the basis of their willingness to sacrifice (nonverbal communication). Later on God judged Isaac on the same basis. In the New Testament... God willingly sacrificed his only son to save the world. The message of God's love was powerful and clear. Consider the democratic alternative... "For God so loved the world that he voted for it." The democratic form of nonverbal communication really would not have sent the same message.

Markets are all about putting your money where your mouth is. Consumers use nonverbal communication (spending) to _prove_ how much they want something. Proof is necessary because talk is cheap.

Yet, forums are all about talk! Clearly verbal communication is necessary... but can you imagine if this forum also facilitated the most important form of nonverbal communication? Members of this community would understand each other far better.

Here are a couple ways that this forum could use spending to facilitate mutual understanding...

*Method 1*: Pragmatarian market

Each month each member would pay $1 dollar, but they would have the *option* to choose which threads they spend their pennies on. If you didn't choose this option, then your dollar would stay in the owner's digital wallet. If you did choose this option, but you spent your fees on your own threads, then that money would also stay in the owner's wallet. If you decided to spend your money on other people's threads... then your money would be transferred to their wallet.

*Method 2*: Donors choose

Whenever somebody made a donation, they would have the option to use their donation to communicate how much they love their favorite threads. The owner would keep track of this info on a Google sheet which could be embedded in its own webpage. The threads on this page would be sorted by their value to donors. You could check out this page... if you were interested in seeing which threads on this forum were worth the greatest sacrifices.

With the current system... let's say that I wanted to put together a bug out bag. I'm sure that you folks would be able to recommend some good threads. But it wouldn't be quite the same thing as spending your money to communicate just how important those threads are to you. The more money that you're willing to spend on those threads, the more important they are to you... and the more important it would be for me to determine how important they are to me.

One of my favorite ideas from the Bible is to not hide your light under a bushel. Sorting threads chronologically is definitely useful... but it logically results in a lot of buried treasure. Since people's time is limited like space in a bug out bag... it seems pretty beneficial for everybody to use their own money to help create a list of the most valuable threads. Then every new member could quickly find and read the most important/valuable threads. Admittedly, "sticking" threads to the top of the category kinda serves the same purpose. But even if everybody voted (democratic definition of love) for which threads to sticky... it really wouldn't be the same thing as everybody reaching into their own pockets and deciding how much a thread is truly worth to them (economic definition of love).

In the beginning I said that I'm not a _traditional_ prepper. Perhaps I can be considered a _meta_ prepper. My survival strategy is to minimize risk of disaster by strengthening systems. If this forum facilitated spending, then more people would understand the importance of individual sacrifice as a very important form of communication. As a result, people would gain the freedom to choose where their taxes go. This freedom would minimize the chance/impact of disasters.

When I was humping the hills in Panama... we didn't all look in the same direction. We all scanned different sectors. This provided greater coverage and protection for the group. Disasters can come from all sorts of different directions. And since humans are all different, it's only natural for us to look in very different directions and be concerned about very different things. This means that preventing people from choosing where their taxes go is the single greatest threat to our existence. If we did have the freedom to choose where our taxes go, then we'd be able to use our taxes to protect each other's backs. You'd protect my back by spending your taxes on space colonization (in case of asteroid) and I'd protect your back by spending my taxes on virology research (in case of zombie outbreak). Because of human diversity, individual freedom means far greater protection for humanity.

God helps them who help themselves. Our current system prevents us from using our taxes to help ourselves. As a result, we're all incredibly vulnerable.


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## Coastie dad (Jan 2, 2016)

Booze and two dances.

You know....
Whiskey
Tango
Foxtrot


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Welcome!


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## jim-henscheli (May 4, 2015)

Hell of a first post. P.s, I mimed that first but it did not get the point across.
P.p.s welcome from little New England.


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## AnotherSOFSurvivor (Sep 7, 2016)

Interesting first post. 

Welcome from CBus OH

sent from a paper cup and string via quantum wierdness


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Welcome from Wisconsin


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## Xerographica (Feb 14, 2017)

Thanks for the welcomes! 

jim-henscheli, we need more emoticons :/


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

Welcome to the fray.

Sent from a Galaxy S5 far far away.


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Welcome!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Nonverbal Communication and deceptive verbal communication skills are a major tool of survival. Long before radios and long after. Flags were used along with hand and arm signals , Horns ,Whistles ,bagpipes, lights.
Some time just the look on your face, or not saying a word sent a clear message to those that should understand it.


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Smitty901 said:


> Nonverbal
> Some time just the look on your face, or not saying a word sent a clear message to those that should understand it.


This works equally well on children and my husband.


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## Coastie dad (Jan 2, 2016)

TG said:


> This works equally well on children and my husband.


Oooohhhh....the "mom face"....


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## Xerographica (Feb 14, 2017)

Yesterday my friend and I were on the phone discussing this topic. I defined "communication" as the transmission of information. We tried to guess whether more information is transmitted verbally or nonverbally. On the one hand, there are lots of books and forums and people talking with each other. But on the other hand... there are so many ways that information is transmitted nonverbally.


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## TG (Jul 28, 2014)

Coastie dad said:


> Oooohhhh....the "mom face"....


This is why I never yell at my kids and never had to spank them. One look and they're back to marching like soldiers


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Insightful or thought provoking? Perhaps, or perhaps not.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

At one time I could get 150 soldiers a message will quick with out a word. Latter the would explain it to the officers.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Xerographica said:


> Howdy folks,
> 
> My first post! Maybe I should start off by mentioning that I'm not a _traditional_ prepper. But I did spend 3 years in the infantry down in Panama and a year in Afghanistan. So I do have a few survival skills... but I'm sure that they are pretty rusty. Of course I hope I never get the chance to see just how rusty they are. But I also have a very green thumb!
> 
> ...


Goofy liberals should refrain from misquoting the Bible.

https://www.kent.ac.uk/careers/tests/spatialtest.htm


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Xerographica said:


> Howdy folks,
> 
> My first post! Maybe I should start off by mentioning that I'm not a _traditional_ prepper. But I did spend 3 years in the infantry down in Panama and a year in Afghanistan. So I do have a few survival skills... but I'm sure that they are pretty rusty. Of course I hope I never get the chance to see just how rusty they are. But I also have a very green thumb!
> 
> ...


Were you an officer?


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Nonverbal Communication and deceptive verbal communication skills are a major tool of survival. Long before radios and long after. Flags were used along with hand and arm signals , Horns ,Whistles ,bagpipes, lights.
> Some time just the look on your face, or not saying a word sent a clear message to those that should understand it.


I was in the same line of thinking. I would add smoke grenades and flares.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

You can get non military smoke grenades that are pretty decent. Sport Smoke | smoke grenades, tactical smoke grenade, paintball smoke grenades, airsoft smoke grenades, tsg, battlefield smoke grenades, pb200, sportsman, smoke bombs, smoke grenades for sale I have some from this company and they work pretty good. There are other sources out there, you just have to search.


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## Go2ndAmend (Apr 5, 2013)

Racking the slide on my 870 has always proven to be a most excellent form of non-verbal communication for me.


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## AnotherSOFSurvivor (Sep 7, 2016)

Smitty901 said:


> At one time I could get 150 soldiers a message will quick with out a word. Latter the would explain it to the officers.


The good ole days huh, Top? And as an addition that - words dont need to be spoken among men who understand each other.



MaterielGeneral said:


> Were you an officer?


My thoughts exactly.

Too well written and over the top for a sand pounder.

sent from a paper cup and string via quantum wierdness


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## Xerographica (Feb 14, 2017)

AnotherSOFSurvivor said:


> The good ole days huh, Top? And as an addition that - words dont need to be spoken among men who understand each other.
> 
> My thoughts exactly.
> 
> ...


I wasn't an officer, but when I got out I sure took advantage of the GI Bill.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Xerographica said:


> I wasn't an officer, but when I got out I sure took advantage of the GI Bill.


 Smart move , Often counseled soldier on making use of it. Even while still on active duty. The program has changed over the years but still outstanding for those that put it to use. Even in the infantry today education out side your MOS is a big plus in advancement. To advance beyond E-7 is becoming rare without it. The days of only officers having degrees are long sense over.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Smitty901 said:


> Smart move , Often counseled soldier on making use of it. Even while still on active duty. The program has changed over the years but still outstanding for those that put it to use. Even in the infantry today education out side your MOS is a big plus in advancement. To advance beyond E-7 is becoming rare without it. The days of only officers having degrees are long sense over.


When I was active duty they would preach for people to take classes but when soldiers would, different individual basis when soldiers needed to be at class they would bitch they had to take the soldier to class and defiantly let the soldier know they were an inconvenience. Not to many soldiers tried to take classes anymore cause they didn't want to deal with the BS. They liked to keep us in the field with a lot of BS field problems.

I waited until I got back to Michigan and then started College. I did take a Gunsmithing Correspondence course which was a really good primer on basic firearms repair and retail sales.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

MaterielGeneral said:


> When I was active duty they would preach for people to take classes but when soldiers would, different individual basis when soldiers needed to be at class they would bitch they had to take the soldier to class and defiantly let the soldier know they were an inconvenience. Not to many soldiers tried to take classes anymore cause they didn't want to deal with the BS. They liked to keep us in the field with a lot of BS field problems.
> 
> I waited until I got back to Michigan and then started College. I did take a Gunsmithing Correspondence course which was a really good primer on basic firearms repair and retail sales.


 The right course is not always the easy one. When you serve duty comes first. I know many the made it work. The other problem was the schools, they had a requirement to work with the soldiers. However in many cases once they started getting their cash they did not care. For many years , and it still happens even big name school made a killing ripping of soldiers on the GI bill.


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## MaterielGeneral (Jan 27, 2015)

Yes you are right, when you serve duty came first but it was just the way they handled things. I did have a platoon sergeant that was a jerk though. He would swear at us as a whole platoon, talk down to us a lot, not individually but just a general jerk. We were actually the better platoon out of the battery (Air Defense). When it came time to ETS, he was the deciding factor for me to get out. I did not want to deal with people like that. I don't have the temperament for it.

After a while I did miss the comrade of it and joined the guard. Did normal guard and then active duty guard. Leadership is more accountable in the guard. They have to answer to the immediate chain of command then the National Guard Bureau and to the governor of the state. Besides if you decided to be a dirt bag you could just go AWOL and they would kick you out. My unit we changed things up, when we pushed for and got the warrant we would then go pick the individual up and place them under military arrest. We had a local cop come with us to do the pick up. When I went AGR, I started working in supply in a signal unit south of Detroit and they had a crazy AWOL rate. I got the commander to implement the same program. After I arrested a few people they straightened up.

Sorry for the ramble, the memories start flowing.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Go2ndAmend said:


> Racking the slide on my 870 has always proven to be a most excellent form of non-verbal communication for me.


Ya know I always thought that sound was sorta deafening myself. Now some of these old military codger sniper types say that just let the bad guy know something is amiss. We cant all be right huh?


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

With in our home I can with out you knowing it, in several ways let everyone know. Something is not right, to stand by, to kill that person or other options . It helps having sons and wife that served or still are.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

Thanks for all yalls Service to the Country. It usually just the little bride and I around here and she dont do the stuff I tell her so doubt she is going to respond to much non verbal stuff. Now the Shitzu guard dog is more highly attuned. He knows when I put on my hat and coat..secure my pepper spray on the wrist and grab the golf club walking stick..we is fiixing to got for a walk. Now a burglar come in the house while we are sleeping he will never wake up. He does let us know when the cat wants in.


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## Xerographica (Feb 14, 2017)

MaterielGeneral said:


> Sorry for the ramble, the memories start flowing.


Huuaah! Is that how you spell that? That word was so great... I really miss it. Depending on how you said it, it could mean anything from "F YOU" to "awesome"! You could say "huuuah!" (F YOU) to an officer and they'd know exactly what you were saying but it's not like they could (directly) do anything about it.


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## admin (Apr 28, 2016)

Xerographica said:


> Thanks for the welcomes!
> 
> jim-henscheli, we need more emoticons :/


We have 270 of them.

If that isn't enough, I doubt I am gonna be able to find the ones you think ya need. :vs_laugh:


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## Coastie dad (Jan 2, 2016)

Cricket said:


> We have 270 of them.
> 
> If that isn't enough, I doubt I am gonna be able to find the ones you think ya need. :vs_laugh:


Maybe if he gave a dollar for the emoticons he wanted....


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## inceptor (Nov 19, 2012)

Cricket said:


> We have 270 of them.
> 
> If that isn't enough, I doubt I am gonna be able to find the ones you think ya need. :vs_laugh:


I've got one for him.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Coastie dad said:


> Booze and two dances.
> 
> You know....
> Whiskey
> ...


:vs_lol:

My eyes glazed over and my brain went numb after just a couple paragraphs. :vs_laugh:


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Huuah to the OP


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## MisterMills357 (Apr 15, 2015)

I can't read that hard and long stuff, it gives me migraines.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

MisterMills357 said:


> I can't read that hard and long stuff, it gives me migraines.


You didn't miss anything.


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