# Legality of Stay At Home Orders



## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

I'm curious to other members opinions of the rash of stay at home orders which have been issued. The mayor of my city along with the county judge executive just signed one that reinforces the order given by our governor and is making "social distancing" of 6 feet mandatory at businesses that remain open as well as establishes a curfew of 9pm for juveniles. At the state level our governor has "banned" out of state travel except for necessities such as employment, medical purposes, or "essential services" not available in your locality. If you go out of state for anything unapproved or travel in from out of state you have a mandatory 14 day quarantine.

I'm kind of torn. On one hand I've already put into practice most of what each of these orders entails before the orders where in place and I believe they are the smart things to be doing at this time. On the other hand I don't believe its the governments place to "order" me to do these things and they've even acknowledged that its not going to be 100% enforceable. I just feel like this is a huge slippery slope when it comes to limits on personal freedom and liberty in the name of "the greater good."


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

I'm right there with you.
As long as I see these "suggestions", I'm willing to go along with it. Especially when they come with a very clear intent to end them as soon as reasonably possible.
Some countries are extending their orders "indefinitely". That would be equivalent to a declaration of war in the U.S., as far as I'm concerned.

I will endure TEMPORARY restrictions on my rights, within reason, for the "greater good".
The caveat being, *I* get to determine what is "within reason".

If daddy gubmint tells us we should give up our guns to stop this pandemic, even if only for a week, I would hope he'd get a big ol' middle finger and a hail of freedom seeds heading his way, care of We The People.
Some things are just unreasonable...


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Social distancing and good hygine are no brainers. There are still slobs who don't wash their hands after pissing/shitting. Money probably has plenty of germs on it, I put mine in a plastic bag rather than my wallet or pocket, wash my hands later. US mail/packages are also suspect.

Forcing people to curfew I don't see as a helpful, in fact when out at night there are less people out and about and risk of disease transmission.

Travel restrictions are unconstitutional.

I do as I will when at home, as little if any contact with others for a few weeks now. Wash clothes at home and hang them in the sunshine (UV light kills germs), saves on gas/electric bills too

I keep paper towels,a detergent bottle of soapy bleach in the bed of the pickup and a gallon of rinse water. Cheaper and more available than alcohol/hand sanitizers. Clean up before putting hands in pockets or opening the door.


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Say your infected and don't know it. But travel all over the place cause it's your god given constitutional right. How many people do you infect and possibly kill?? Are you or should you be held responsible for their deaths or sickness??

Yeah I don't like anybody telling me what to do especially the guberment. However the general public is just to stupid to use a little common sense for a month or two. So apparently the big hand of guberment is needed for a while. Live with it and lets get through this mess. IF the powers that be think for a minute that they can pull any crap on us we all know how it will end. Deal with it for Christ sake.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

Chipper said:


> Say your infected and don't know it. But travel all over the place cause it's your god given constitutional right. How many people do you infect and possibly kill?? Are you or should you be held responsible for their deaths or sickness??
> 
> Yeah I don't like anybody telling me what to do especially the guberment. However the general public is just to stupid to use a little common sense for a month or two. So apparently the big hand of guberment is needed for a while. Live with it and lets get through this mess. IF the powers that be think for a minute that they can pull any crap on us we all know how it will end. Deal with it for Christ sake.


You're not going to spread a lot of virus if asymptomatic, wash your hands, and are not coughing/sneezing. I don't think bars should be open, restuarants, nor entertainment/sporting events.

I wash my hands even after pumping/paying for gas.

I'm looking forward to lots of outside work, fishing, and spring turkey season.

BTW, the tigers in NYC zoo have the virus, maybe keep the cats and dogs outside too? How about the cows, pigs and chickens we buy parts of at the store?

P.S. Chipper, don't use God's name in vain, Sunday is Easter. Peace be with You


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

I'm willing to voluntarily restrict my movements and so far, that's all that our governor has asked us to do. There's no way I would forego travel because someone ordered me to. I'm a free-born American citizen, not a serf.

Did y'all see that the governor of Michigan has closed down the garden centers of Home Depot and Lowe's? She is either insane, incredibly stupid or purely evil.


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## Mad Trapper (Feb 12, 2014)

paulag1955 said:


> I'm willing to voluntarily restrict my movements and so far, that's all that our governor has asked us to do. There's no way I would forego travel because someone ordered me to. I'm a free-born American citizen, not a serf.
> 
> Did y'all see that the governor of Michigan has closed down the garden centers of Home Depot and Lowe's? *She is either insane, incredibly stupid or purely evil.*


*
*

All three.

I've got my seeds but short on onion starts. I might put some leftovers back in. I have plenty of leftover taters, reds and whites. A bunch of fruit trees and blueberries to set out.

I'm doing as big a garden as I can. And I plow it with a 2-bottom then harrow it. Pretty well stocked on bug stuff, I need to start wacking the rodents soon. I was lucky this winter some fishers came in and hit the rabbits hard. Still have chipmunks, woodchucks, mice/voles, and tree rats to deal with


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## Elvis (Jun 22, 2018)

In the Tom Clancy book "Executive Orders" the US faces a bio-threat where Jack Ryan as the President decides to close all state boarders for a few week to limit the spread. He says something like "The constitution is how we govern but it's not a suicide pact". But it was very clear that it would only be for a few weeks.

Without declaring Martial law I doubt these rules are legal, both federal and state, but I'm willing to accept these stay at home "rules" for a short time. It's a common sense solution.

I'd like to hear @RedLion opinion on this topic.


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## schpier (Aug 9, 2015)

In my opinion, the USA is already under martial law, only it is disguised under the pretext of “social distancing”. To me that is so very obvious. Undoubtedly it is illegal, but we the sheeple are too timid to do anything. 
Although the ideas for controlling the pandemic seem to carry merit, the gubmint’s infringement on freedom of movement must be challenged at least. We are all too apathetic to do so, regardless of political leanings. 
Claiming that it won’t happen in my backyard and something to the effect that there are “ trillions of guns to stop this” is ludicrous! We are already under siege by the gubmint but are too blind too recognize it.. 
If y’all do ascribe to the true intention of the 2nd, then get off your behinds and prove it ( I include myself).


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

schpier said:


> In my opinion, the USA is already under martial law, only it is disguised under the pretext of "social distancing". To me that is so very obvious. Undoubtedly it is illegal, but we the sheeple are too timid to do anything.
> Although the ideas for controlling the pandemic seem to carry merit, the gubmint's infringement on freedom of movement must be challenged at least. We are all too apathetic to do so, regardless of political leanings.
> Claiming that it won't happen in my backyard and something to the effect that there are " trillions of guns to stop this" is ludicrous! We are already under siege by the gubmint but are too blind too recognize it..
> If y'all do ascribe to the true intention of the 2nd, then get off your behinds and prove it ( I include myself).


"Martial" law means under military rule.


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## schpier (Aug 9, 2015)

See, another blind one! I don’t care what the definition states. Go tell that to the next Nazi asking you for your papers


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

I agree with the new girl @schpier that the US is under a modified version of martial law.

I was thinking about visiting Son2 this weekend in GA and reviewed the GA Governor's Executive orders and decided that risking a misdemeanor arrest was not worth the risk.

FUBAR


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

The legal challenges begin.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/mississi...-congregants-ticketed-during-drive-in-service


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Good Saturday Morning! Welcome to Slippy's time to piss off any LEO's tuning in!

Any Law Enforcement Officer who stops an otherwise legal vehicle in order to enforce these local or state "Executive Orders" as LAW are violating their oaths and should be fired and tried in a court of law.

There are way too many laws on the books, most of which need reversed, but adding more and more limitations to our freedoms is absolutely appalling.

I haven't heard one press conference from a governor or Pres Trump that hasn't sounded like some "compassionate" version of NAZI-ism.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

Slippy said:


> I agree with the new girl @schpier that the US is under a modified version of martial law.
> 
> I was thinking about visiting Son2 this weekend in GA and reviewed the GA Governor's Executive orders and decided that risking a misdemeanor arrest was not worth the risk.
> 
> FUBAR


No clue what the culture is like where you are or GA but the vibe I got after talking to some local LEO's is they aren't too keen on enforcing some of these executive orders.


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

While I doubt this China bug was a manufactured crises it does play perfectly into the hands of those that have the real power. Incremental lock downs, State to state border checks, tracking private citizens, curfews, and the ever popular attempt at gun confiscation, all in the name of national safety and the peoples well being. All of this over a bad case of the flu in which 98% plus will live. And let's remember the influenza kills roughly 30 to 40 thousand a year, every year, in this country alone. 

It's happening all over the world. Italy just extended their lock down, Michigan has banned travel between residences, LA has extended their shut down, they are talking about canceling 4Th of July celebrations now. The list goes on and on an and grows more expansive with each passing day. We have put millions out of work and into the street and we are now standing in line to get food and water. Sounds a lot like the old Soviet Union to me. 

They are also warning of the virus coming back around in the fall and a second wave in the summer. Why? So they can justify their taking more control for a longer period of time perhaps? 

Governments, all governments, never give power, control, or money back. Ever!


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Prepared One said:


> While I doubt this China bug was a manufactured crises it does play perfectly into the hands of those that have the real power. Incremental lock downs, State to state border checks, tracking private citizens, curfews, and the ever popular attempt at gun confiscation, all in the name of national safety and the peoples well being. All of this over a bad case of the flu in which 98% plus will live. And let's remember the influenza kills roughly 30 to 40 thousand a year, every year, in this country alone.
> 
> It's happening all over the world. Italy just extended their lock down, Michigan has banned travel between residences, LA has extended their shut down, they are talking about canceling 4Th of July celebrations now, the list goes on and on an and grows more expansive with each passing day. We have put millions out of work and into the street and are now standing in line to get food and water. Sounds a lot like the old Soviet Union to me.
> 
> ...


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

We live in a country were people pick and choose what laws they obey or not. Middle class working type it will be enforced. Hood rat or rich it will not. Nothing much has changed. Life goes on in Milwaukee and Madison . Stealing cars , killin, dope it is a wind fall for them. Letting a lot of very bad folks out of jail .


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## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

All in all I think we have it pretty good here. My in-laws live in Lima, Peru, men and women alternate days when they can be out in public and no one is allowed out Friday, Saturday or Sunday. Long lines to get necessities.

Quite a few years ago when I was there it was the norm to see Police directing traffic carrying Uzis.


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## 1skrewsloose (Jun 3, 2013)

Not saying I agree at all with the gov telling me what I can and can't do.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

It's sad that so many think they need to government to tell them how to act. They should have enough brains to figure out what the proper course of action is on their own.


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## KUSA (Apr 21, 2016)

Back Pack Hack said:


> It's sad that so many think they need to government to tell them how to act. They should have enough brains to figure out what the proper course of action is on their own.


Most people are just plain stupid.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Speaking of stupid, I just read that some towns/municipalities and HOA's are banning Leaf Blowers for fear of spreading the Chicom Virus...:vs_OMG:


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)




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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Stay at home orders are Illegal/UnConstitutional in my opinion and I ignore it where I live. With that said, I do try to avoid getting close to strangers when out and about and wash my hands frequently.


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## Back Pack Hack (Sep 15, 2016)

KUSA said:


> Most people are just plain stupid.


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## KUSA (Apr 21, 2016)

RedLion said:


> Stay at home orders are Illegal/UnConstitutional in my opinion and I ignore it where I live. With that said, I do try to avoid getting close to strangers when out and about and wash my hands frequently.


Same here.

I do hate it when other people invade my 6ft area though. I think someone else posted this here. I'm about to try it.


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## Hemi45 (May 5, 2014)

All I've seen thus far are 'guidelines' ... such 'orders', in this country of free men, would need to be enforced at gunpoint. 

I happen to think the guidelines are smart and began incorporating them before they were formally issued. Be smart and safe out there!


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Slippy said:


> Speaking of stupid, I just read that some towns/municipalities and HOA's are banning Leaf Blowers for fear of spreading the Chicom Virus...:vs_OMG:


:vs_lol:


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Slippy said:


> I agree with the new girl @schpier that the US is under a modified version of martial law.
> 
> I was thinking about visiting Son2 this weekend in GA and reviewed the GA Governor's Executive orders and decided that risking a misdemeanor arrest was not worth the risk.
> 
> FUBAR


As most know, I live on the Florida side of the Florida/Georgia border.
This is a rural area, with not much traffic in regular times, so it would be real easy for police to stop anyone they choose.
In fact, the Georgia cops hold "driver license check points" every few months. But nothing since the Chinkflu started.

I still go into town every day - "town" meaning the one nearby in Florida or the one nearby in Georgia.
There is no more police presence than usual.
I still go three times a week to my AA meetings in Georgia, no cops have kicked in the doors yet.

The "powers that be" seem to be concentrating on major metropolitan areas and leaving us country folk alone.

@Slippy, I believe that if you cross into Georgia on a back road rather than an Interstate, you will have no problem.
I happen to use US1/US301 because it is convenient - it is a 4 lane divided highway with lots of truck traffic between Middle Georgia and the Florida East Coast and is not far from the homestead.


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

@schpier @Slippy Words have actual meanings. You may not like what's going on. You may think that government officials are overstepping their authority. I agree with both those statements BUT until we have military administrators running the show, we don't have military, i.e. martial law or any form of it. It's nit-picky, I know, but effective communication of complex ideas requires common definitions for words. It's a progressive trick to use words in ways at odds with their actual definitions.


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## Slippy (Nov 14, 2013)

Slippy said:


> I agree with the new girl @schpier that the *US is under a modified version of martial law.*
> 
> I was thinking about visiting Son2 this weekend in GA and reviewed the GA Governor's Executive orders and decided that risking a misdemeanor arrest was not worth the risk.
> 
> FUBAR





paulag1955 said:


> @schpier @Slippy Words have actual meanings. You may not like what's going on. You may think that government officials are overstepping their authority. I agree with both those statements BUT until we have military administrators running the show, we don't have military, i.e. martial law or any form of it. It's nit-picky, I know, but effective communication of complex ideas requires common definitions for words. It's a progressive trick to use words in ways at odds with their actual definitions.


First off, I clearly wrote "modified version of martial law".

And I understand GENERALLY what you are saying.

We all know that our local, states and federal governments have been militarizing our law enforcement ranks for the last many years. And I would say that the militarization of local police forces have ramped up exponentially since the events of 9/11/01.

Today, the overall amount of tax payer funds provided to local, state and federal agencies for law enforcement is HUGE!. Many many times more than ever in history.

Agree?

And if you do agree or don't agree that's OK.

Regardless, I've never been shot by a 7.62 NATO round, but my question to you is; Does it make a difference if that round originates from a Barney Fife Local yokel LEO or the most highly trained Military Sniper when they perceive We The People not conforming to unconstitutional orders as law?

Call it what you will, but the feds and the politicians have done an excellent job of getting many many different levels of local law enforcement hooked on their gubment crack and many will do as their crack dealer tells them to do so they can keep getting their fix...


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)

@Slippy We have a semantical disagreement. You did clearly indicate that you felt we are now under a form of martial law. And I disagree that it can be called any form of martial law until we have military administrators sitting in for governors and/or mayors and military courts trying civilians. That doesn't mean I don't find what we're seeing to be very concerning; I do.

We probably don't disagree on much else. xoxo


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## MI.oldguy (Apr 18, 2013)

We dont mind so much.we are outliers anyway.......I'm a sheepdog and wifey is a mf'r if somebody bugs her.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

it is unconstitutional for the federal government to issue stay at home orders..

so therefore it is illegal for any state to infringe on peaceful assemblies, violate freedom to worship, or restrict other freedoms. Period. Exclamation point!

I am all for (as mentioned before) voluntary adherence to the REQUEST... however, any police officer that enforces an ORDER, or tickets an offender.. should be tarred and feathered!!!!


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

Pot smokers don't care about laws they break them all the time. So often they are not enforced. Stealing cars is no longer a crime in many places. Breaking into one is not a crime. Shop lifting under $950 is not a crime. Just what the heck are they going to do if people give them the finger and do as they please. Nothing.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Maine-Marine said:


> it is unconstitutional for the federal government to issue stay at home orders..
> 
> so therefore it is illegal for any state to infringe on peaceful assemblies, violate freedom to worship, or restrict other freedoms. Period. Exclamation point!
> 
> I am all for (as mentioned before) voluntary adherence to the REQUEST... however, any police officer that enforces an ORDER, or tickets an offender.. should be tarred and feathered!!!!


Yes. Any "order" that mandates people stay at home violates a number of rights, at least 5 in fact.
Amendment I, Amendment IV, Amendment VI, Amendment VIII and while not in the Constitution, the Declaration of Independance clearly states we are endowed by our creator with certain inalienable rights, among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

I'm really curious on how today goes. There are pastors that have said they are holding services today and that elected officials are not their god. Our governor has said if you attend a large service then you will have a mandatory 14 day quarantine. 


I will not be going to a service today, I do think social distancing is smart (not to mention exhausted after working a midnight shift) but that is my decision to make.


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

NotTooProudToHide said:


> I'm really curious on how today goes. There are pastors that have said they are holding services today and that elected officials are not their god. Our governor has said if you attend a large service then you will have a mandatory 14 day quarantine.
> 
> I will not be going to a service today, I do think social distancing is smart (not to mention exhausted after working a midnight shift) but that is my decision to make.


 As is your right. Others have a right to follow as they see fit. Why is it Church is shut down but if it is PC it can go on?


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## paulag1955 (Dec 15, 2019)




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## Old SF Guy (Dec 15, 2013)

Chipper said:


> Say your infected and don't know it. But travel all over the place cause it's your god given constitutional right. How many people do you infect and possibly kill?? Are you or should you be held responsible for their deaths or sickness??
> 
> Yeah I don't like anybody telling me what to do especially the guberment. However the general public is just to stupid to use a little common sense for a month or two. So apparently the big hand of guberment is needed for a while. Live with it and lets get through this mess. IF the powers that be think for a minute that they can pull any crap on us we all know how it will end. Deal with it for Christ sake.


I think there is a huge gulf between "Stay at home" and practice responsibility. Protecting oneself or others from stupidity is not within the power of the government. The provide for the general welfare...and that means to me they can enforce curfews and quarantines etc, under the appropriate laws on the books. But simply saying stay at home and issuing tickets is not whats on the books as lawful.

Giving up liberty to gain security is shaky ground. They want to control this, fine...I agree with staying away from people. But saying I have to stay at home.... a little too invasive.


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