# Ebola "No Risk" outside west Africa



## Ripon

https://www.yahoo.com/health/ebola-outbreak-how-worried-should-you-be-93130718497.html

Who trusts that statement?

1100 infected and 660 dead! That's 5x the last time I saw the MSM even report on it. So what's next 10 countries instead of three? 3,300 over 660?

I hope everyone keeps watching closely!


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## TG

The affected cities' airports are still open, international flights are still happening and not much monitoring is going on. I'm not worried as much about Ebola as I did about SARS, Ebola is transferred through blood and bodily fluids, it's not airborne. Here in Toronto, we dealt with two SARS outbreaks because even with Hong Kong's raging SARS outbreak, the airports were still kept open and no serious monitoring was being done.


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## dsdmmat

As long as our borders are not sealed and there are planes, vehicles and boats leaving the continent of Africa they cannot make that claim.


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## Notsoyoung

People who are affected with Ebola can go up to 21 days before the symptoms appears, although they can infect others before the symptoms appear, which starts out with flu-like symptoms before they start bleeding out of every orifice in their body. Think maybe someone might get on a plane and fly into New York or Chicago before they known to have the disease? Yeah, be worried.


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## SARGE7402

WE'RE safe cause CDC says so! Right!

Fears of Ebola spread in West Africa as 2nd American infected with virus | Fox News


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## Fuzzee

That falls into the straight bullshit zone to me, not trying to worry the public. There's very little you can trust from the government and media in the first place and so many possibilities of it spreading. They've had people run already. People will do all kinds of things they wouldn't normally do too when they know they're dying. And many with no concern for how it may effects others. Not trying to say I wouldn't either. In part this world is a shithole and to hell with it.


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## TG

I remember when SARS hit here, everyone was talking about it but no one was taking any precautions not to spread it or catch it except for hospitals and medical clinics. I took 2 weeks off work and made my hubby do the same, turns out his boss died from SARS and he kept on coming to work until he collapsed. This ass endangered hundreds of people.
If we hear of any Ebola cases in Toronto, hopefully we can sit tight at home for as long as possible again..


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## Kauboy

Just this morning, the TV news headline said "Ebola only a plane ride away from US".
Somebody didn't get the memo. :lol:


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## MI.oldguy

Kauboy said:


> Just this morning, the TV news headline said "Ebola only a plane ride away from US".
> Somebody didn't get the memo. :lol:


Saw that,I guess the media cares more than the cdc!.


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## firefighter72

What does SARS and Ebola do?


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## Dalarast

Great. Being in east Africa seems a lot safer than in west Africa... At least back home you guys are all a plane ride.. I just got over a cold over here and my command kept dropping the Ebola joke on me. Even had one of my soldiers asked if he could have my kit if I become patient x.


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## TG

firefighter72 said:


> What does SARS and Ebola do?


Google is a useful tool


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## StarPD45

Notsoyoung said:


> People who are affected with Ebola can go up to 21 days before the symptoms appears, although they can infect others before the symptoms appear, which starts out with flu-like symptoms before they start bleeding out of every orifice in their body. Think maybe someone might get on a plane and fly into New York or Chicago before they known to have the disease? Yeah, be worried.


And, of course, there might be those who want to spread it intentionally to further their religious/political aims.
(Ya know. The 72 virgins)


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## Maine-Marine

I did a College paper on Ebola... It is scary stuff...Even though the thought is, it is only passed by blood... once it gets into the hospitals and starts spreading via nurses and doctors dentist, etc...

or into the drug community or homosexual community

people coughing blood, sneezing blood,

doctors, nurses, ambulance drivers, and crew, dentist, morticians, first responders off all kinds, air plane flight crews, police, there are lots of folks that potentially could come into contact and spread the illness...

joe or cindy jones that just CAN NOT miss a day of work...


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## TG

Maine-Marine said:


> I did a College paper on Ebola... It is scary stuff...Even though the thought is, it is only passed by blood... once it gets into the hospitals and starts spreading via nurses and doctors dentist, etc...
> 
> or into the drug community or homosexual community
> 
> people coughing blood, sneezing blood,
> 
> doctors, nurses, ambulance drivers, and crew, dentist, morticians, first responders off all kinds, air plane flight crews, police, there are lots of folks that potentially could come into contact and spread the illness...
> 
> joe or cindy jones that just CAN NOT miss a day of work...


It's spread by bodily fluids, which include saliva, any kind of mucous, diarrhea, vomiting, blood.. etc


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## Ripon

Why be a suicide bomber and kill a dozen when you can be a suicide host and kill thousands 



Notsoyoung said:


> People who are affected with Ebola can go up to 21 days before the symptoms appears, although they can infect others before the symptoms appear, which starts out with flu-like symptoms before they start bleeding out of every orifice in their body. Think maybe someone might get on a plane and fly into New York or Chicago before they known to have the disease? Yeah, be worried.


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## Ripon

Can't speak to SARS....Ebola gives one a flu like symptom, they then hemmoriging blood until they die. Current outbreak is killing 66-70% which is down from the normal 90%



firefighter72 said:


> What does SARS and Ebola do?


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## TG

More on SARS Severe acute respiratory syndrome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Mike45

They probably won’t shut down flights out of there until someone brings it here. Or worse, they’ll fly to Mexico and spread it there-meaning it is guaranteed to make it up here.


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## microprepper

One thing we have to realize is that control of any kind of serious contagion risk requires a strong existing infrastructure of control. When disease breaks out in failed-state or corrupt or poorly-governed areas then there is really no means of preventing its spread.

This is a basic fact of life, so basic it is included in some of the oldest writing in the world, in which the "pale horse of death" (plagues) appears _after_ the horse of war has ridden through (Four Horses of the Apocaplypse)

The question for me is, how do I change my own lifestyle to protect myself and my loved ones against an outbreak, since I do not believe any government today is up to the task?

Personally, I am trying to keep abreast of what is known about the contagious path of ebola (body fluid). There are lots of ways we can come into chance contact with a stranger's body fluids and so we all need to consider our personal habits out in public. I do believe gloves may come back into style. Scarves are already showing up in fashion stores and they can be very useful against air-borne pathogens. (For one thing, altho the ebola is not "air-borne" I think we all know that a bad sneeze can send_ fluids _out onto surfaces all around a public area!)

In general, I think modest clothing is an important protection because skin surfaces don't need to be exposed to all kinds of chance contacts with chair-backs, doors, railings, etc.

Shrinking down the number of trips to do errands is another step in self-protection. I am doing that, too. ASAP.

It sounds selfish, but if we all do this kind of thing, it helps everyone and in a peaceful manner, too.


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## Pir8fan

Since the authorities and media are already saying there is little to no risk, I think the risk is significant. The only good thing is that this virus can only be contracted through contact with body fluids. Unlike the flu, it can not be contracted by breathing in the virus.


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## TG

Canadian Dr who was treating Ebola patients in Liberia just came back home, not in quarantine 
Group says Canadian doctor who treated Ebola patients not in self-imposed quarantine | CTV News


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## tirednurse

Pir8fan said:


> Since the authorities and media are already saying there is little to no risk, I think the risk is significant. The only good thing is that this virus can only be contracted through contact with body fluids. Unlike the flu, it can not be contracted by breathing in the virus.


If someone sneezes and you are within 50ft you are going to be breathing in their bodily fluids. Think about it. any time some one infected is in public they are spreading the disease. wipe your mouth, there is spit on your hand, touch a shopping cart, touch a product on a shelf and leave it, touch your money and hand it to the cashier, touch the key pad after you swipe your debit card. you have either passed off the virus or will be on the receiving end when you follow them. 
Drives me crazy when I see it but it happens all the time. see people using the bathroom without washing hand afterwards. people have been educated enough to know what they are doing they are just plan lazy and could care less if they are spreading their germs.

Be careful out their people. It a dangerous world


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## TG

High alert for Ebola needed in Hong Kong, health minister says after emergency meeting | South China Morning Post
If Hong Kong gets Ebola, Toronto will get it almost automatically... Thousands of people from Kong Kong arrive in Toronto every week, this is how we got SARS twice... Canadian government refused to shut down flights both times even at the height of each outbreak.


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## Notsoyoung

Ebola can be transferred by touching the surface that has already been touched by someone with Ebola up to 2 hours previously. When someone gets Ebola it starts out with flu-like symptoms such as aching muscles or feeling nauseous. They can infect others at this stage.

Someone has just stated at the infectious stage of Ebola and uses the bathroom on a plane. Everyone who comes behind him and touches the same door hand, or faucet the he touched get infected. 

Be very worried about this.


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## TG

Smart In China, a single plague death means an entire city quarantined | Cities | theguardian.com


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## tirednurse

people not thinking this is not a deadly threat are idiots. Start taking precautions now before it's to late


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## Kauboy

Countries in Africa are already saying their government cannot contain the threat.
Liberia is calling it a "global pandemic".
If you've not already, make your preps NOW!

To the nurses of the site, what are your recommendations for avoiding this? Gloves? Masks? Anything?

EDIT: Hey, post 500!


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## TG

My "outbreak" preps that I started storing after our first SARS outbreak:

Inaddition to usual emergency preps:

3 types and sizes of surgical gloves
Anti-viral face masks for all family members
Protective eye-ware
Vodka
Rubbing alcohol in spray bottles
Gatorade and a few other things..

But we learned to simply take time off work and school and just stay home for 2 weeks.


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## Kauboy

tirednurse said:


> See people using the bathroom without washing hand afterwards. people have been educated enough to know what they are doing they are just plan lazy and could care less if they are spreading their germs.


Oh gosh, you've hit my *biggest* pet peeve.
The worst offenders, to me, are the ones who splash water on their fingers for 2 seconds, dry them off with paper towel, then use the paper towel on the handle to open the door, like the rest of us are nasty.
Seriously? YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, you gross people! You are doing NOTHING to help. You are faking sanitation. Makes me feel ill to watch.

Sorry... carry on.


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## 2Tim215

Kauboy said:


> Oh gosh, you've hit my *biggest* pet peeve.
> The worst offenders, to me, are the ones who splash water on their fingers for 2 seconds, dry them off with paper towel, then use the paper towel on the handle to open the door, like the rest of us are nasty.
> Seriously? YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, you gross people! You are doing NOTHING to help. You are faking sanitation. Makes me feel ill to watch.
> 
> Sorry... carry on.


Reminds me of a old joke:

A navy man and a army man use the rest room. 
Navy man finishes off and starts to wash his hands. 
Army man zips up and walks off towards the door.
Navy man says: "In the navy they teach us to wash our hands!"
Army man looks over, smiles and replies: "In the army they teach us not to piss on our hands"


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## Dalarast

Some of the streets I walk in around Eastern Africa maintain that flushing the toilet as tossing the bucket into the street. Shared shower facilities that match the dirtiest porta-poty at a music festival as their means of personal hygenie.. Its easy to see how Ebola can spread in this region of the world and could easily spread into the Western world. 

Best precautions I know one could prepare for... wash your darn hands.. cover your mouth when you sneeze.. and stay out of peoples personal space. The last one is just my pet peeve of people who violate my personal space; but it rings true.

Problem with the a disease like this spreading to the US? If people could fail pre-school or basic hygienic practices I'm sure he/she is on a plane somewhere.. or works at an airport....


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## SARGE7402

Don't know if any of you have seen it but either fox or drudge had an article posted that spoke of the bringing the two USA volunteers that have the disease but are in stable condition back to the USA for treatment. Just went to find it and it seems like it was pulled.

If that happens, it becomes a whole different ball game for us here in the states

Sorry it was on cnn http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/31/health/ebola-isolation-treatment/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Talk about Madness.

Sorry folks leave them in Africa. Let them get well or die there. Do not bring this disease to our shores.


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## PaulS

The aircraft used to transport them is a specially equipped hospital aircraft with quarantine facilities on board. The patients can be transported in a quarantine field from the plane into the quarantine room, of the special hospital, that was set up for this very reason. The only way that this is dangerous is if it was to crash in a large metropolitan area.


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## Dalarast

The only thing bad to really happen is if the cdc brought them to Atlanta. I mean let's say the virus mutates and starts infecting people into a crazy zombie outbreak..... Oh wait I turned a channel and was watching walking dead....


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## Kauboy

Dalarast said:


> The only thing bad to really happen is if the cdc brought them to Atlanta. I mean let's say the virus mutates and starts infecting people into a crazy zombie outbreak..... Oh wait I turned a channel and was watching walking dead....


But... but... Atlanta was supposed to be a safe zone!!!


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## TG

Atlanta has CDC, meaning they have every virus known to man


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## Kauboy

TorontoGal said:


> Atlanta has CDC, meaning they have every virus known to man


And at least according to the mentioned show, one heck of an impressive failsafe. (BOOM!)


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## TG

It never ceases to amaze me how much Canadians and Americans love films/TV about zombies! I'm Russian/Ukrainian (I'm 38 now), we were forced to be atheists but our grandmas took us to government-watched and underground churches (they couldn't suppress religion no matter what they did), and as Slavs, we are naturally very superstitious people by no fault of our own haha
So when I turned on season 1, episode 1 of "Walking Dead" on Netflix and saw the face of that little girl in white… I WAS DONE  I just can't bring myself to watch it.. so much irrational fear.


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## tirednurse

Kauboy said:


> Countries in Africa are already saying their government cannot contain the threat.
> Liberia is calling it a "global pandemic".
> If you've not already, make your preps NOW!
> 
> To the nurses of the site, what are your recommendations for avoiding this? Gloves? Masks? Anything?
> 
> EDIT: Hey, post 500!


The only way to not get this in to not come into contact with any one or any thing infected. stay away from public places and if you have to be there don't touch anything some one else did. "STRANGER DANGER!" 
hand sanitizers are probably not effective against this virus and you need to wash your hand vigorously with soap and water often. also remember bleach is your friend and will kill viruses so use on any surface that is suspected to be infected and that means any thing except what you positively know has not been in contact with a person with the disease. Which in my opinion is nothing. you can't see a virus so you don't know if it is there or not. 
If you see or suspect someone is sick stay away from them


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## PaulS

As I understand it, Ebola is only spread through body fluids. Surface contact is only viable for about 30 minutes. You would have to come into intimate contact with body fluids of an infected person to get Ebola. Wearing a mask, goggles, gloves and ear guards should protect you from infection. If you have open wounds they should be covered with a barrier like plastic wrap. These precautions are only necessary when it public - not at home. Disposal of protective devices can be in bleach or an enclosed fire. Reusable items can be washed in bleach, dried in the air and reused.


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## Will2

firefighter72 said:


> What does SARS and Ebola do?


I fly tomorrow so I am going to have to be way safer around airport washrooms.


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## SARGE7402

WHO | Ebola virus disease

with a 65% mortality rate over a 40 year period, do we dare risk it getting loose here in the states.

And remember the folks that are calming us by saying it's safe are those that let Veterans die to get bonuses for clearance rates; the ones that couldn't predict how long to make the flu vaccines last year; and the same folks that are shipping sick illegal aliens all over the USofA without treating them.


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## tirednurse

PaulS said:


> As I understand it, Ebola is only spread through body fluids. Surface contact is only viable for about 30 minutes. You would have to come into intimate contact with body fluids of an infected person to get Ebola. Wearing a mask, goggles, gloves and ear guards should protect you from infection. If you have open wounds they should be covered with a barrier like plastic wrap. These precautions are only necessary when it public - not at home. Disposal of protective devices can be in bleach or an enclosed fire. Reusable items can be washed in bleach, dried in the air and reused.


This is not correct PaulS "SURVIVAL OUTSIDE HOST: The virus can survive in liquid or dried material for a number of days (23)." Ebola virus - Pathogen Safety Data Sheets

Many viruses can live on surfaces for several hours and some for days. Remember these viruses have evolved to be able to survive and thrive. They can not always be killed by the normal cleaners or alcohol based sanitizers. Bleach is one of the only cleaning agents you can rely on.

NOTE to women. the virus can be found in semen for 2 months after a man has the disease. be careful who you sleep with. even if they don't appear sick they may be spreading it.


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## Dalarast

PaulS said:


> As I understand it, Ebola is only spread through body fluids. Surface contact is only viable for about 30 minutes. You would have to come into intimate contact with body fluids of an infected person to get Ebola. Wearing a mask, goggles, gloves and ear guards should protect you from infection. If you have open wounds they should be covered with a barrier like plastic wrap. These precautions are only necessary when it public - not at home. Disposal of protective devices can be in bleach or an enclosed fire. Reusable items can be washed in bleach, dried in the air and reused.


Hence why the virus is spreading so rapidly throughout Africa.... Surface to surface contact is not guaranteed to spread the virus due to bodily fluids not being exchanged... Africa you sweat... I sweat in the morning I sweat in the afternoon.. I even sweat at supper time  So obvious bodily fluids are apparent; but also a simple clammy handshake and the rate of infection could increase. A sneeze can travel across rooms.... biggest fear in America outside of airlines will also be school... aka the ground zero of all viruses.

Make sure your kids are aware of proper hygenie... be it ebola or just a cold... they are like a chemist/biologist dream dish of virus waiting to happen.

Zombie shows are okay... I do love me some walking dead. But if thats not your think there was a Brit show that is avialble on netflix called Surviviros... pretty good virus scenario (probably no basis on fact) and no zombies.


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## Kauboy

I'm pondering the idea of investing in Lysol's parent company after this bleach discussion. Thoughts?


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## Dalarast

Don't forget 3M... they make alot of the masks and filters that are used around the world.


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## charito

It will be hard to contain the disease if there are flights out of affected countries. Infected people don't have to come directly to the USA either for the disease to reach our shores.....it's the people they come in contact with in planes/terminals (from stop overs and connecting flights) who'll unknowingly bring it home.

When you're in the airport how many of us really know what person(s) came from Africa?


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## PaulS

Why would anyone go to an airport?
If I feel the need for an X-ray I go to my doctor.
If I want to be frisked, I can insult a police officer.
If I want to be around a large number of unclean or ill kept people I can go to Wallmart.

OK, satire off.


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## keith9365

Notsoyoung said:


> People who are affected with Ebola can go up to 21 days before the symptoms appears, although they can infect others before the symptoms appear, which starts out with flu-like symptoms before they start bleeding out of every orifice in their body. Think maybe someone might get on a plane and fly into New York or Chicago before they known to have the disease? Yeah, be worried.


I think you are looking at the new suicide vest. How many "American" jihadists are out there willing to be infected with the disease so they can come home and spread it among the infadels? Think about it. They still get their virgins. It's coming people.


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## PaulS

I believe that a diseased body is "unclean" and doesn't get you into heaven - it's like the whole pork idea.


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## Ripon

They wouldn't need to be American. Its pretty easy to get in the US I hear kids can do it. Imagine a trained terrorist on a mission.



keith9365 said:


> I think you are looking at the new suicide vest. How many "American" jihadists are out there willing to be infected with the disease so they can come home and spread it among the infadels? Think about it. They still get their virgins. It's coming people.


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## Kauboy

PaulS said:


> I believe that a diseased body is "unclean" and doesn't get you into heaven - it's like the whole pork idea.


This would depend on which interpretation said terrorist decided to follow. If they followed the traditional version, you'd be right and they would not try this method. However if they follow the new version driven by nothing but evil and hate, then little details like that can be overlooked in order to kill infidels. Just like the 9/11 terrorists going out for drinks and strippers the night before.


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## Titan6

Just keep a eye on the Story since it has never been on our shores since now we will wait and see nothing we can do but prep for the worst hope for the best!! They brought it here by their own choice so the people would have the best treatment available. I don't know why they couldn't have treated the exposed people over there but they have us the people and our nation at risk without any input from the people.


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## PaulS

The Ebola virus has been "on our shores" for decades. This is no different, except there are people with the disease that could die.

This is the biggest "non-event" in recent history.


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## PrepperLite

Although i think some people are making this out to be a bigger deal than it is i did pick up 2 jugs of bleach (and a few other things) while at the store today in case i'm wrong!!


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## SARGE7402

Guess I was really worrying over nothing. Ebola terror at Gatwick as passenger collapses and dies getting off Sierra Leone flight - Mirror Online


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## TG

SARGE7402 said:


> Guess I was really worrying over nothing. Ebola terror at Gatwick as passenger collapses and dies getting off Sierra Leone flight - Mirror Online


Thankfully

"At around 11pm on Sunday, the Department of Health said that tests for the deadly Ebola virus on the woman who died at Gatwick had proved negative"


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## SARGE7402

Do you believe them?


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## Kauboy

You seem predisposed to believe hype, and not medical professionals. At this point, your hysteria has already set in. I guess we'll hear from you in a month or so.
I hear you can catch viruses from the internet...


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## microprepper

wow.... what spreads fastest, the virus or the hysteria?

Not that hysteria is unwarranted. But it is inneffective.

One of the things that makes me sick is watching the media spin this. Like "body fluids" are NOT something we all come into contact with all the time. I just handed a packet of tissue to the person at the next computer who has been sneezing for ten minutes. I doubt the ebola is here yet and so I did not leave, but every cough and sneeze is an opportunity to consider our own actions. I have decided finally to allow the internet back into my home so that I can scratch this particular site of public contact off my list of necessary exposure risks.

Haven't any of those media people ever seen how many surfaces a teething toddler can contact in ten minutes? What is the circle in which a sneeze radiates microscopic droplets? 

And why do they pretend the ebola victim has control over fluids? haven't any of them EVER suffered a bout of diarhea, runny nose, heavy menstruation, or copious sweating? (sorry to gross you out, but life is GROSS!)

One of the things they look for is bleeding via the cuticles. If someone has ebola to that level, then the sweat and other fluids have already spread the virus.

Really, I do believe that all we can do is reclusify our lives as much as possible. Stock up not only on foods and other necessities in order to minimize errand-running, but also stock up on activities one can enjoy. Households need to establish their own re-entry protocols because no one can control the protocols of public areas.

There are peripheral effects of this outbreak. Social tension and economic changes. People can lose jobs either because they are considered a risk or because they promote safety procedures and it becomes "PC" to pretend no procedure is necessary. But even when procedures are not nece4ssary, they should be practiced, and the media is too busy promoting the response of whistle-in-the-dark to make it safe for the more concerned people to actually start acting defensively.

I think paper jackets for public places should become a style. I am highly conscious of that guy who just sneezed all over my left side. I chose to ignore him and just hand him a packet of tissues because I did not want to offend, but even if I had left right away, it would have been too late in an ebola exposure. Now, droplets from my sleeve will get onto the bus seat. If I had some kind of shawl on at least I could choose to fold it up before spreading the fluids any further. I am not really concerned, but just playing out the scenario in my head. We all need to develop polite but effective responses to siutations like this. The media is not our friend.


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## microprepper

Titan6 said:


> Just keep a eye on the Story since it has never been on our shores since now we will wait and see nothing we can do but prep for the worst hope for the best!! They brought it here by their own choice so the people would have the best treatment available. I don't know why they couldn't have treated the exposed people over there but they have us the people and our nation at risk without any input from the people.


It will come here via some unseen entrance anyway. At least this way, they are setting up a good teaching-network for our own health aids as well as fast-tracking that serum that was already in the works.


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## SARGE7402

Kauboy said:


> You seem predisposed to believe hype, and not medical professionals. At this point, your hysteria has already set in. I guess we'll hear from you in a month or so.
> I hear you can catch viruses from the internet...


No I don't believe in hype. And as for believing what medical professionals say in this thread. Well all of my postings so far have come from respectable sources. Not just what someone types here on this thread.

What I do not see is any guidelines sent out from reputable sources on a) what to do if you think you've come in contact with an Ebola case, and you have the symptoms; b) preventative actions you can take to limit your risk - mask, alcohol/bleach wipes, not shaking hands, etc; c) how long a quarantine period would last if one were imposed.

I'm really disappointed in some of the flippant answers being put out there by "Senior Preppers". I'd expected better from this group.


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## Kauboy

The medical professionals I was referring to were not ones from this board.
The flippant answers are in response to your instant belief in the worst possible outcome being pushed by folks who aren't in the medical field.


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## PaulS

I laugh at the emotional response to "having the Ebola virus on our shores". People tend to make very bad choices in response to emotional stimuli. Some examples are; semi-automatic weapons bans, Founding of the DHS and initiating the TSA searches at airports. None of these actions have produced any real effect other than stripping Americans of their rights. They haven't made anything "safer" but they have encouraged the dangerous loss of rights and freedoms.

We have two people in a special facility who are being treated for Ebola. They have been physically isolated from the rest of the population since they left Africa. They don't present any danger to the public and may provide hope for a vaccine that will keep us all safe in the future. There is no evidence that this is a government sponsored "trigger" event wherein the population will be exposed to create a pandemic, which would give the government the reason to enact martial law.


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## SARGE7402

PaulS said:


> I laugh at the emotional response to "having the Ebola virus on our shores". People tend to make very bad choices in response to emotional stimuli. Some examples are; semi-automatic weapons bans, Founding of the DHS and initiating the TSA searches at airports. None of these actions have produced any real effect other than stripping Americans of their rights. They haven't made anything "safer" but they have encouraged the dangerous loss of rights and freedoms.
> 
> We have two people in a special facility who are being treated for Ebola. They have been physically isolated from the rest of the population since they left Africa. They don't present any danger to the public and may provide hope for a vaccine that will keep us all safe in the future. There is no evidence that this is a government sponsored "trigger" event wherein the population will be exposed to create a pandemic, which would give the government the reason to enact martial law.


Paul never said it was a trigger event. Said I wouldn't put it past the folks at 1600 PA Ave to use something like this for their own ends. Remember didn't one of them say to never let a crisis go to waste.

I also said it was not a smart Idea to bring two infected folks back to this country.

I also made the link to the canadian data sheet that said the virus was most likely able to be transmitted by airborne.

Now with a 21 day period when the symptoms develop and the symptoms being very similar to the common flu, one would like to think that there ought to be some guidelines for Americans for triggers that they could use to determine if they've possibly been infected.

I'll use Mr. Sawyer as an example. a) were you on the same plane with Mr Sawyer; b) were you at the airport the same day mr sawyer was; c) did your flu symptoms begin 1) before 2) at the same time or 3) around 14 - 21 days after being at a) or b).

That would give the average intelligent individual an idea as to it's just a common flu or something more serious.

The last thing we'd want to do is overload an already overloaded health care system


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## Notsoyoung

I just heard on the news that the CDC is in the process setting up quarantine rooms with medical personal to detain people suspected of having Ebola symptoms flying into the United States, willingly or not. So how much is that going to cost to have a quarantine room with a medical staff standing by at all of those airports? 

Nothing to worry about. Don't be a bunch of Nervous Nellies.


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## microprepper

Notsoyoung said:


> I just heard on the news that the CDC is in the process setting up quarantine rooms with medical personal to detain people suspected of having Ebola symptoms flying into the United States, willingly or not. So how much is that going to cost to have a quarantine room with a medical staff standing by at all of those airports?
> 
> Nothing to worry about. Don't be a bunch of Nervous Nellies.


How will they handle a scene in which a suspected carrier vigorously resists detention? How many of the TSA or other agents will be compromised in the process of accomplishing the detention of an out-of-control passenger? How will they react when four or five of the fellow-passengers suddenly realize they've been spat on or sneezed-on or otherwise contacted by the suspected passenger, and they also panic?

How will normal vigilance against ISIS or similar jihadists be maintained in the process of dealing with the above? (Thinking here of the concerns on the southern border about what is going on with border agents being distracted by needs of youngsters while adult criminals waltz right past...)

I frankly believe we have only a month or two before entry-incidents become common. There are populations of African immigrants in this country now who most certainly must be trying desperately to get their loved ones here before air travel gets harder for them.

I did watch c-span yesterday, and what struck me most out of it was the statement by the Samaritan's Purse official that "exposure of one millimeter of skin" is enough, and none of the testimony at that hearing was re-assuring against any of the woeful pictures he painted. He seemed extremely reasonable an un-emotional, being blunt and scientific as far as I could see.


----------



## Jeep

Look, clean freaks are killing me, its why you get sick so much, you have no resistance to anything, germophobes are the biggest hinderance to their own survival, learn to live in the dirt, dummies


----------



## TxBorderCop

As far as restraining a supposed Ebola carrier? Tase his ass. NO one has to touch him, and the probes can be removed by properly equipped medical personnel.

This is going to get far worse. Martial law may even get declared. Whomever earlier posted never let a crisis go to waste is spot on.


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Monsanto invests in Ebola virus with Dept of Defense.
Why? Weapon grade Ebola, perhaps? Would you want them working on that in your town?

Monsanto invests in Ebola Virus with DOD

Monsanto, that lovely company who brought us Agent Orange, which is still killing veterans today.
Those bastards can rot in hell.


----------



## microprepper

TxBorderCop said:


> As far as restraining a supposed Ebola carrier? Tase his ass. NO one has to touch him, and the probes can be removed by properly equipped medical personnel.
> 
> This is going to get far worse. Martial law may even get declared. Whomever earlier posted never let a crisis go to waste is spot on.


tasing usually also involves close-contact follow-up. I admit my only experience is watching those "cops" shows on tv, but I can't see how using a taser prevents contact. Consider, for example, that a possible carrier might already realize he is going to be restrained before he gets off the plane because he suddenly recognizes his own symptoms or at least the weird looks he is getting from airline personnel while they whisper into their microphones?


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Suppose a new campaign of jihadists. They can not get bombs through as easily as they once could, so they just recruit some suicide virus carriers to get visas and bring it into the country.


----------



## microprepper

rice paddy daddy said:


> Suppose a new campaign of jihadists. They can not get bombs through as easily as they once could, so they just recruit some suicide virus carriers to get visas and bring it into the country.


Something to consider: protective clothing is likely to resemble Sharia-law garb. I have thought about this a lot lately as I do use public transportation and face lots of possible contact-points as well as live in a border-compromised part of the country. I once attracted anti-muslim insults from a stranger when I was on my way to a traditional Catholic Mass that required the wearing of a veil...

So, some people can't tell the difference between a woman in a Catholic mantilla and a Muslim woman, and soon we may be safe only if we have a veil ready to cover our faces which will resemble Muslim garb even more... in a certain respect, the Muslim neighborhoods may become safer zones for surviving ebola if a pandemic erupts here.

Ironic, isn't it?


----------



## Kauboy

rice paddy daddy said:


> Suppose a new campaign of jihadists. They can not get bombs through as easily as they once could, so they just recruit some suicide virus carriers to get visas and bring it into the country.


The problem to this plot would be the fact that the victim is not contagious until signs are already present.
They would be fairly easy to avoid.
Just don't go near the guy who can't control his bowels, vomits profusely on everything, and is bleeding from every orifice.


----------



## AquaHull

Just was listening to the EIB Network with Rush. He was reporting that the French medical Guys were saying that an epidemic is sure to happen in the US,and that even touching a Ebola corpse can transmit the virus.

Now that's some shat there, and not what popular opinion is by any means. 
If you can get it by just touching a corpse,it doesn't seem like much of a stretch to think it can/has become airborne.
Stay safe,it you can't be safe,be careful at least.

We need some internet / medical guru to find out about this since it came from Rush's mouth.


----------



## AquaHull

Here it is,I was mistaken,it wasn't the FROGS,but the WHO

PressTV - Ebola outbreak international health emergency: WHO

Imagine a terrorist getting a hold of some contaminated body parts,smuggle them in,give a dog a bone,dog gives "Kisses" to it's owner and it's on like Donkey Kong.


----------



## Kauboy

The body of an Ebola victim will be incinerated.
The touching of the body is why the pandemic is so bad in Africa, where the family buries the body themselves.
We don't follow any of the same protocols here.
Also, you must still contact body *fluid* for the virus to pass.
A corpse does not sneeze or cough, so you would need to actually contact vomit, urine, feces, blood, or saliva in order to contract the virus from the body of a dead victim.
This is extraordinarily unlikely in the US where a death would be investigated before a body was touched, and once a determination was made, handling procedures would dictate that no direct contact be made.
Heck, gloves are used on corpses even when the cause was natural death from organ failure. How much more would this be stressed when the body was found covered in vomit, blood, and possible fecal matter?


----------



## AquaHull

Kauboy said:


> The body of an Ebola victim will be incinerated.
> The touching of the body is why the pandemic is so bad in Africa, where the family buries the body themselves.
> We don't follow any of the same protocols here.
> Also, you must still contact body *fluid* for the virus to pass.
> A corpse does not sneeze or cough, so you would need to actually contact vomit, urine, feces, blood, or saliva in order to contract the virus from the body of a dead victim.
> This is extraordinarily unlikely in the US where a death would be investigated before a body was touched, and once a determination was made, handling procedures would dictate that no direct contact be made.
> Heck, gloves are used on corpses even when the cause was natural death from organ failure. How much more would this be stressed when the body was found covered in vomit, blood, and possible fecal matter?


You are missing the target and badly at that.


----------



## SARGE7402

You're missing the point. They are contagious once the symptoms materialize. Runny nose, Achey joints, diareaha, etc. No one was talking about the virus not being contagious until the symptoms develop like you speak of - can't control bowells, vomit profusely - that bring someone to the hospital. 

Right now how many folks have you run into today that were sneezing, coughing, look like theyre trying to keep from crapping their pants?

If you're like a lot of us that work in a city, ther'es quite a few like that aren't there?


----------



## Kauboy

AquaHull said:


> You are missing the target and badly at that.


Kindly point out what I'm missing.



SARGE7402 said:


> You're missing the point. They are contagious once the symptoms materialize. Runny nose, achy joints, diarrhea, etc. No one was talking about the virus not being contagious until the symptoms develop like you speak of - can't control bowels, vomit profusely - that bring someone to the hospital.
> 
> Right now how many folks have you run into today that were sneezing, coughing, look like they're trying to keep from crapping their pants?
> 
> If you're like a lot of us that work in a city, there's quite a few like that aren't there?


There has yet to be any confirmed cases of anyone contracting this disease via coughing or sneezing.


----------



## SARGE7402

Kauboy said:


> The body of an Ebola victim will be incinerated.
> The touching of the body is why the pandemic is so bad in Africa, where the family buries the body themselves.
> We don't follow any of the same protocols here.
> Also, you must still contact body *fluid* for the virus to pass.
> A corpse does not sneeze or cough, so you would need to actually contact vomit, urine, feces, blood, or saliva in order to contract the virus from the body of a dead victim.
> This is extraordinarily unlikely in the US where a death would be investigated before a body was touched, and once a determination was made, handling procedures would dictate that no direct contact be made.
> Heck, gloves are used on corpses even when the cause was natural death from organ failure. How much more would this be stressed when the body was found covered in vomit, blood, and possible fecal matter?


I get the impression that you've never done an unattended death investigation. And for those that are under a doctor's care - say for the flu - there is usually no death investigation before the undertaker shows up.

Oh and on your bodily fluids you left out mucus - normally found in klenex - and sweat that can soak into the bedding.


----------



## SARGE7402

Kauboy said:


> Kindly point out what I'm missing.
> 
> There has yet to be any confirmed cases of anyone contracting this disease via coughing or sneezing.


Read the canadian data sheet all the way down. The link is there as suspected not confirmed.


----------



## Kauboy

SARGE7402 said:


> Read the canadian data sheet all the way down. The link is there as suspected not confirmed.


I'll repeat, there has yet to be any confirmed cases of anyone contracting this disease via coughing or sneezing.


----------



## Kauboy

SARGE7402 said:


> I get the impression that you've never done an unattended death investigation. And for those that are under a doctor's care - say for the flu - there is usually no death investigation before the undertaker shows up.
> 
> Oh and on your bodily fluids you left out mucus - normally found in klenex - and sweat that can soak into the bedding.


In which of these investigations are no sanitation/sterilization protocols followed?
The undertaker uses his bare hands to pick up an uncleaned body?

You're really reaching here...
Stop trying to stir up a panic over *SPECULATION*.


----------



## Jeep

As I said sanitation and the people that abuse it are the problem. IF your a nurse, EMT or other and feel the need to clean constantly, your dead. And don't show up to my place, get dirty and get some immunity in you


----------



## Notsoyoung

Jeep said:


> As I said sanitation and the people that abuse it are the problem. IF your a nurse, EMT or other and feel the need to clean constantly, your dead. And don't show up to my place, get dirty and get some immunity in you


As far as I know there is no "immunity" to Ebola or the flu either, no matter how dirty you get. Considering that the Ebola outbreak took place in Africa, not exactly known for it's sanitation, I would say that a lack of sanitation might be part of the problem and not the answer.


----------



## Jeep

It ain't coming, your watching the wrong channel, but to entertain you, don't let yourself around the public


----------



## Denton

Yeah, I am sure being overly clean is why the Africans are experiencing the worst outbreak in history. 

Besides, we all know it is Bush's fault, along with the conservatives and Matt Drudge.


----------



## TG

Wow this is 20 min drive from me..

Patient with Ebola-like symptoms in isolation at Brampton, Ont. hospital - The Globe and Mail

Hopefully it's just flu


----------



## Kauboy

Unfortunately, any similar symptoms must now be treated as possible Ebola thanks to media hype and general panic.
The good news is, with the quick isolation of potential Ebola patients, isolating any pending infection should prove an easy task.


----------



## Jeep

Yeah enton, the folks who got to wash after everything, you go ahead, I'll be dirty lol


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Kauboy said:


> The body of an Ebola victim will be incinerated.
> The touching of the body is why the pandemic is so bad in Africa, where the family buries the body themselves.
> We don't follow any of the same protocols here.
> Also, you must still contact body *fluid* for the virus to pass.
> A corpse does not sneeze or cough, so you would need to actually contact vomit, urine, feces, blood, or saliva in order to contract the virus from the body of a dead victim.
> This is extraordinarily unlikely in the US where a death would be investigated before a body was touched, and once a determination was made, handling procedures would dictate that no direct contact be made.
> Heck, gloves are used on corpses even when the cause was natural death from organ failure. How much more would this be stressed when the body was found covered in vomit, blood, and possible fecal matter?


How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US? 
Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it.


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Jeep said:


> Yeah enton, the folks who got to wash after everything, you go ahead, I'll be dirty lol


A Marine, I can understand that.
But the Army teaches field sanitation.


----------



## firefighter72

Don't forget the two americas who were infected with it. They are back in the states, but it's ok because the government gave them an experimental drug... that only two people in the world have tried. I'm sure everything will be ok.


----------



## Renec

My 2 cents? There are over a thousand reported cases of infection..in a country that is terrified of reporting anything to their government. Ponder for just a moment..it may be 3 times as bad there with unreported cases. And death by Ebola is not neat and clean..the virus is a waking nightmare..remember the "hemorrhagic" part? Blood..heavily contagious blood spilling form every bodily orifice. When a patient dies,he "crashes out"..the lining of his intestines,having been liquefied by the virus (major organs as well) is sloughed from the body..pouring extremely contagious bodily fluids everywhere.
This isn't the Flu.
go read "The Hot Zone" by Richard Preston,published in 1994. Sobering stuff.


----------



## Kauboy

rice paddy daddy said:


> How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US?
> Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
> How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
> I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it.


Good lord man. You're literally pulling things out of thin air to drum up hysteria. You are using an unprovable argument to make a wild claim.
Here, let me try one.
I carry a card in my wallet that keeps me from getting hit by meteors. I've never been hit by a meteor, so that proves it works. How could you possibly refute this fact?


----------



## Notsoyoung

Kauboy said:


> Good lord man. You're literally pulling things out of thin air to drum up hysteria. You are using an unprovable argument to make a wild claim.
> Here, let me try one.
> I carry a card in my wallet that keeps me from getting hit by meteors. I've never been hit by a meteor, so that proves it works. How could you possibly refute this fact?


What? Maybe you should re-read the post you are replying to.


----------



## TG

Renec said:


> My 2 cents? There are over a thousand reported cases of infection..in a country that is terrified of reporting anything to their government. Ponder for just a moment..it may be 3 times as bad there with unreported cases. And death by Ebola is not neat and clean..the virus is a waking nightmare..remember the "hemorrhagic" part? Blood..heavily contagious blood spilling form every bodily orifice. When a patient dies,he "crashes out"..the lining of his intestines,having been liquefied by the virus (major organs as well) is sloughed from the body..pouring extremely contagious bodily fluids everywhere.
> This isn't the Flu.
> go read "The Hot Zone" by Richard Preston,published in 1994. Sobering stuff.


Even CDC is saying that the infection rate is most likely 3 times what is reported because the locals are too afraid to report and lose their relatives.. Your description will probably prevent me from eating breakfast  We lived through 2 SARS outbreaks here, this seems a lot worse, even though it's not air-borne.


----------



## SARGE7402

From the CDC fact Sheet on SARS: *The main way that SARS seems to spread is by close person-to-person contact. The virus that causes SARS is thought to be transmitted most readily by respiratory droplets (droplet spread) produced when an infected person coughs or sneezes. Droplet spread can happen when droplets from the cough or sneeze of an infected person are propelled a short distance (generally up to 3 feet) through the air and deposited on the mucous membranes of the mouth, nose, or eyes of persons who are nearby. The virus also can spread when a person touches a surface or object contaminated with infectious droplets and then touches his or her mouth, nose, or eye(s). In addition, it is possible that the SARS virus might spread more broadly through the air (airborne spread) or by other ways that are not now known.*

Now for the red necks in this group the green is commonly refered to as snot. Now what is any different between SARS snot being a vector and Mucus from an Ebola infected patient. Just because one of these medical organizations doesn't "identify Ebola as Airborne Spread" doesn't mean that you can stand next to an Ebola infected person be sneezed on and your safe.

That just defies all logic


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Kauboy said:


> Good lord man. You're literally pulling things out of thin air to drum up hysteria. You are using an unprovable argument to make a wild claim.
> Here, let me try one.
> I carry a card in my wallet that keeps me from getting hit by meteors. I've never been hit by a meteor, so that proves it works. How could you possibly refute this fact?


Drumming up hysteria? What in the Sam Hill are you talking about?
I merely posed some rational questions.
If you are unable to see that, perhaps the fault lies with you.

Or you work for the government.


----------



## SARGE7402

rice paddy daddy said:


> Drumming up hysteria? What in the Sam Hill are you talking about?
> I merely posed some rational questions.
> If you are unable to see that, perhaps the fault lies with you.
> 
> Or you work for the government.


There's hysteria and then there's getting ready for a probable scenario.

In this case we have several of us that are strongly suggesting that all preppers need to take this very seriously and be ready for the very likely event. Such as stocking up on enough supplies to last several weeks in case there is a Government Lock Down.

Now what is the probability of an Ebola outbreak in the US? I'd say that it's going to be fairly high. Will it be wide spread? Depends on how the General population reacts.

Summer is not usually flu season. So it would probably be safe to err on the side of Caution and have all primary care doctors given a protocol for evaluating the likelyhood that one of their patients is infected with Ebola.

Haven't seen that. It could be just a fairly simple set of questions.

1. Have you been to Africa recently
2. do you have a close relative that has been
3. is that relative or friend or co worker sick with the flu
4. have you been to the airport lately
5.

That way the doctor's would have a uniform method to conduct an evaluation on the likelyhood that someone has Ebola.

but to just rely on the CDC's prononcements and just go blissfully down the road without a care in the world is just plain foolish


----------



## AquaHull

Or have you been to a sports arena ?


----------



## Jeep

If the treatment team of these two aid works do not start falling out I think you have your answer. Could there be people willing to carry it here ....yes, could thre be someone who gets through without intention yes. However the likely chance that it goes global is not a real concern, unless it is unleashed on purpose, in which case I am sure the CDC has cooked up some far nastier things in the lab. So I can not concern myself with every bug out there


----------



## TG

I know there are many people out there who are immune to several different strains of the Flu, I'm one of them. I have never had the flu of any kind, I've never had a cold either, I don't know why. I'm sure there must be at least a tiny percentage of people immune to Ebola, some are immune to AIDS.


----------



## Denton

Jeep said:


> If the treatment team of these two aid works do not start falling out I think you have your answer. Could there be people willing to carry it here ....yes, could thre be someone who gets through without intention yes. However the likely chance that it goes global is not a real concern, unless it is unleashed on purpose, in which case I am sure the CDC has cooked up some far nastier things in the lab. So I can not concern myself with every bug out there


I agree with your point not to worry about every disease out there. Matter of fact, I am more interested in the chickwassisname disease that is spread by mosquitoes. I work outside at night, and Alabama's state bird should be the mosquito, rather than the yellowhammer. Still, I am not worried about it; I use fabric softener sheets to keep them from biting me.

I wouldn't expect the staff at Emory to start getting ebola as their protection is far superior to what is being used in Africa. Other than some really stupid screw-up, the only way for them to get that or any other disease is if the disease is something out of a scy-fy movie.


----------



## Denton

Here's a crazy thought.

Ebola starts out with flu-like symptoms.

Because of an executive order, the government can apprehend and quarantine people with such symptoms.

Soon, we will be in the midst of flu season.

See the potential problem?

I trust government a lot less than I trust disease.


----------



## Jeep

Thank you Denton. I am not looking for kudos or atta boys, I am trying to keep people down to earth and not make everything a catastrophe. Being a 2 time combat vet, I already have to deal with my wife and family who have no experience and some that just don't care. Wasting time on Ebola is just that, a waste of time


----------



## Denton

Jeep said:


> Thank you Denton. I am not looking for kudos or atta boys, I am trying to keep people down to earth and not make everything a catastrophe. Being a 2 time combat vet, I already have to deal with my wife and family who have no experience and some that just don't care. Wasting time on Ebola is just that, a waste of time


Education allows one to not fret; assuming one is not prone to out of control emotions.

Here's the way I see it.

It is a lot easier to catch the flu than it is to catch Ebola. I haven't caught the flu since I was a kid. Simple hygiene and keeping clear of crowds goes a long way.

Then again, I suppose it is easy for someone who does not live in a large city to say such a thing. Even so, disease wouldn't be tops on my worry list if I lived in a large city. Maintaining sanity would be priority one. :lol:


----------



## Notsoyoung

I don't believe that anyone is being hysterical about it, just saying to pay attention and be cautious. You can hardly discount catching it because none of the people at Emory University who are providing the health care to those who caught it have come down with it themselves. They are taking all sorts of precautions both in the protective gear they wear and how they control the environment. Steps and precautions that are not available to the general public. As for not being concerned about "some bug", I suggest googling the Spanish Flu, which took place when there was no commercial air travel and almost 80% of the U.S. population was still rural.


----------



## Denton

Notsoyoung said:


> I don't believe that anyone is being hysterical about it, just saying to pay attention and be cautious. You can hardly discount catching it because none of the people at Emory University who are providing the health care to those who caught it have come down with it themselves. They are taking all sorts of precautions both in the protective gear they wear and how they control the environment. Steps and precautions that are not available to the general public. As for not being concerned about "some bug", I suggest googling the Spanish Flu, which took place when there was no commercial air travel and almost 80% of the U.S. population was still rural.


Yup. That bug hit hard.

Some easy reading for anyone who is interested...

The 1918 Influenza Pandemic


----------



## Jeep

I think a lot of energy is being wasted on Pandemics, Flu's and the like, its media. I won't even waste another comment on it


----------



## Smitty901

This is a man we should look up to and teach our children to look up to Not Obama.
Ebola-infected American doctor releases statement from isolation: 'I am growing stronger every day' | Fox News


----------



## Denton

Smitty901 said:


> This is a man we should look up to and teach our children to look up to Not Obama.
> Ebola-infected American doctor releases statement from isolation: 'I am growing stronger every day' | Fox News


Top, that was hard to read as the tears welled up.

He is a true hero and humanitarian.


----------



## Kauboy

rice paddy daddy said:


> Drumming up hysteria? What in the Sam Hill are you talking about?
> I merely posed some rational questions.
> If you are unable to see that, perhaps the fault lies with you.
> 
> Or you work for the government.


Your questions were not rational in the slightest as they are not based on *anything*. You literally fabricated those scenarios and then asked me how could I not know about them.
That's the most *irrational* logic I've seen in quite some time.


----------



## Notsoyoung

Kauboy said:


> Your questions were not rational in the slightest as they are not based on *anything*. You literally fabricated those scenarios and then asked me how could I not know about them.
> That's the most *irrational* logic I've seen in quite some time.


_"How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US?
Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it. "_

This is the original post. I don't see any similarity to what you replied. We don't know whether or not the virus isn't already here in the U.S., either by a carrier or a lab. I would be surprised if it wasn't being studied in a lab somewhere, and as far as that goes, there are to people with it in Atlanta. The experimental serum for Ebola was developed in the U.S., although little information about it has been made public.

Perhaps you should go back and re-read the original post. Your response does not appear to have anything to do with rice paddy daddy's post. It looks like there has been some kind of a mix-up somewhere. I don't see anything that has been fabricated or that is illogical.


----------



## SARGE7402

Notsoyoung said:


> _"How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US?
> Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
> How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
> I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it. "_
> 
> This is the original post. I don't see any similarity to what you replied. We don't know whether or not the virus isn't already here in the U.S., either by a carrier or a lab. I would be surprised if it wasn't being studied in a lab somewhere, and as far as that goes, there are to people with it in Atlanta. The experimental serum for Ebola was developed in the U.S., although little information about it has been made public.
> 
> Perhaps you should go back and re-read the original post. Your response does not appear to have anything to do with rice paddy daddy's post. It looks like there has been some kind of a mix-up somewhere. I don't see anything that has been fabricated or that is illogical.


Notsoyoung: Kauboy has been getting on just about everyone that even hints that Ebola could very shortly present a threat to the people of the United States. Hype, hysteria and basing our information on non medical statements all seem to be part of his mantra. One of his favorite is that Ebola hasn't been proven to have an airborne vector. Disregarding the facts that all of an infected persons bodily fluids - blood, mucus, urine semen and feces - all contain the virus. Or the fact that when one of these infected persons sneezes that the snot that is discharged contains the virus. Kind of like the way the flu virus is spread.

It's probably better for all of us old timers to just hit the ignore button for this laddie and go on about getting our folks prepared.

If a bunch of new comers listen to his line of don't worry be happy and so end up infected or dying that's all on him


----------



## RNprepper

SARGE7402;165323
It's probably better for all of us old timers to just hit the ignore button for this laddie and go on about getting our folks prepared.
[/QUOTE said:


> An honest question for you, SARGE,
> What are you doing to get your folks prepared that you haven't been doing all along? In other words, how are you preparing for Ebola vs any other infectious disease or pandemic?


----------



## SARGE7402

RNprepper said:


> An honest question for you, SARGE,
> What are you doing to get your folks prepared that you haven't been doing all along? In other words, how are you preparing for Ebola vs any other infectious disease or pandemic?


Good question. Under normal (I know normal in a SHTF scenario is a bit absurd) SHTF scenario, I'm not looking to really distance myself from the rest of my small community within a six mile radius of the house. In an Ebola outbreak, I can see the government establishing a lock down for upwards of say 6 to 8 weeks. My estimate is that during the first two or three certain functions - power, communications, law enforcement and fire rescue - will continue to function although at ever decreasing levels as the lock down progresses. By about the fourth week electricity and comm ought to have finally ceased functioning. So, I'm preparing by staging my supplies and Using those that require refrigeration first so that by the time power fails I won't lose much if anything.

With regards to other preps, I may begin converting a bunch of my PDF survival library to hard copy just to preserve it.

Also you have to understand, I'm better off than a lot of you folks that live in subdivisions or cities or small towns. I live on a 15 acre farm with only maybe 20 folks within a one mile radius of the house and I know all of them and two of my neighbors are relatively good sized farms (200 plus acres) in such nice things as squash, tomatoes, peppers and potatoes. Additionally there are several larger farms that grow field corn - while it may suck as far as taste is concerned i'ts a pretty good staple.

So am I set for riding out the lock down? Probably.


----------



## rice paddy daddy

Notsoyoung said:


> _"How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US?
> Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
> How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
> I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it. "_
> 
> This is the original post. I don't see any similarity to what you replied. We don't know whether or not the virus isn't already here in the U.S., either by a carrier or a lab. I would be surprised if it wasn't being studied in a lab somewhere, and as far as that goes, there are to people with it in Atlanta. The experimental serum for Ebola was developed in the U.S., although little information about it has been made public.
> 
> Perhaps you should go back and re-read the original post. Your response does not appear to have anything to do with rice paddy daddy's post. It looks like there has been some kind of a mix-up somewhere. I don't see anything that has been fabricated or that is illogical.


One of the revelations from the Snowden affair is that the federal government has agents actively participating in social media and attempting to steer people to the government accepted opinions.
We knew the feds monitored sites like this, but this goes beyond simple monitoring.
Is kauboy a government agent? I don't know, I could not say yes. Nor could I say no.
Generally I do not read what he posts.


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## SARGE7402

If we are really a prepper site, why don't we see threads that include items like this: What You Need to Do to Survive Ebola BEFORE the Panic Starts

And no I'm not being hysterical. This is a real world scenario that could crop it's ugly head in the not to distant future. Especially from our current Government if it sees an impeachment action likely once a new congress -with Republican majority in both houses - is seated in January.

Do you really think the King hasn't already thought of this?


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## Denton

rice paddy daddy said:


> One of the revelations from the Snowden affair is that the federal government has agents actively participating in social media and attempting to steer people to the government accepted opinions.
> We knew the feds monitored sites like this, but this goes beyond simple monitoring.
> Is kauboy a government agent? I don't know, I could not say yes. Nor could I say no.
> Generally I do not read what he posts.


I've suspected a couple people. Those who refuse to discuss topics with reason, do their best to derail conversations or attempt to disrupt a board to the point its members get fed up and move on, are the ones I suspect. Sure, they could simply be trolls are social misfits, but that doesn't mean they aren't getting paid to do what they do so well.


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## SARGE7402

Denton said:


> I've suspected a couple people. Those who refuse to discuss topics with reason, do their best to derail conversations or attempt to disrupt a board to the point its members get fed up and move on, are the ones I suspect. Sure, they could simply be trolls are social misfits, but that doesn't mean they aren't getting paid to do what they do so well.


We suspect more than a couple of others. Hey, wait a minute. Didn't someone claim me as a government plant? Well I'll confess. I'm not telling Ya:shock:


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## Denton

SARGE7402 said:


> We suspect more than a couple of others. Hey, wait a minute. Didn't someone claim me as a government plant? Well I'll confess. I'm not telling Ya:shock:


I'm still not sure about you. Government plants can also turn likable in order to dig in like a tick.

They also have to best avatars.

You have been made.


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## SARGE7402

Ya got me made


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## RNprepper

SARGE7402 said:


> So am I set for riding out the lock down? Probably.


So that is exactly what you should be prepared for in the event of any highly contagious pandemic, whether it is Ebola, avian flu, small pox, Ebolapox (yes, it has been worked on), or whatever comes your way. Social isolation and the ability to wait out an epidemic for months is what gives you a chance at survival. This is how whole towns avoided both the Black Plague in Europe and the 1918 flu. Isn't this just one of the scenarios we prep for? So I really don't care what the contagion is. Like most preppers, I am prepared to hunker down and wait it out. No need for either hysterics or denial - it's simply what needs to be done. In the meantime, we practice good hand hygiene, avoid sick people (unless you are a nurse), and use common sense.

i predict that there will indeed be some Ebola cases pop up in the US, but that they will be quickly contained. Compared to most places in the world, we have an abundance of resources, training, surveillance, staff, and facilities to handle this. Africa will continue to experience an exponential nightmare of horror and I cannot imagine how this is going to be contained there.


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## Kauboy

Notsoyoung said:


> _"How do you know the Ebola virus isn't already here in the US?
> Unless I missed the announcement, it is unknown where the secret Ebola serum came from that was administered to the two American missionaries.
> How do you know there are not labs here in the US working with the live virus to develop a vaccine?
> I'm personally not worried about it given where we live. But that does not mean that I'm going to ignore it. "_
> 
> This is the original post. I don't see any similarity to what you replied. We don't know whether or not the virus isn't already here in the U.S., either by a carrier or a lab. I would be surprised if it wasn't being studied in a lab somewhere, and as far as that goes, there are to people with it in Atlanta. The experimental serum for Ebola was developed in the U.S., although little information about it has been made public.
> 
> Perhaps you should go back and re-read the original post. Your response does not appear to have anything to do with rice paddy daddy's post. It looks like there has been some kind of a mix-up somewhere. I don't see anything that has been fabricated or that is illogical.


I know exactly what the post said. He asked questions that are unprovable to make a point. This is a logical argumeny fallacy where someone asks another to prove a negative, and because such a request is impossible to fulfill by the very design of the question, the person asking it feels they have made a valid point. When logical fallacies begin to crop up in arguments, it is about time to end the discussion.

We don't know, for a fact, if the virus is already here or not in an infected person, thus there is zero reason to panic over it.
We don't know, for a fact, that any lab is actively working with it, and even if they were, why would that be grounds for panic?

The post posed two questions to a community that can't possibly answer them. Why?
What possible reason could there be to post them?
The only reason I can see would be to incite fear.

I've NEVER once said people should not prepare for what they think might happen, not one single time, in any response.
I've simply been advocating that we not resort to reactionary panic.
As of yet, all fears of a pandemic in the U.S. are unfounded.

To Sarge, I would certainly hope you don't resort to ignoring me. I've always been cordial, and one disagreement over a single topic should not be grounds to write someone off entirely. You can't expect everyone to agree with everyone else and get upset when someone doesn't. We are all different, and reason differently. If everyone always agreed, this would be a pretty boring place.

We have to learn to compartmentalize topics. We can't take things on a personal level. There are a few people on here that I always seem to disagree with on specific topics, and then wholeheartedly agree with on others. I've liked a few of your posts, Sarge, on other topics.
We can get along with one another on a personal level, even if we disagree on a topical one.
I still can't figure out why you keep bringing up your age as a factor, referring to yourself as a dinosaur. I don't know, nor care how old an online entity is. I only judge their words by their content, not by the poster's demographic slant. Your age isn't a concern, mine shouldn't be either.


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## Kauboy

To settle things back down, I'll excuse myself from this discussion. I'll still check in on it, but won't respond unless asked to do so, and even that will be done in PM.
I hold no hard feelings gents. Carry on.


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## SARGE7402

RNprepper said:


> An honest question for you, SARGE,
> What are you doing to get your folks prepared that you haven't been doing all along? In other words, how are you preparing for Ebola vs any other infectious disease or pandemic?


Better question for you RN prep. Have you seen a decision tree for evaluating patients coming into an ER or Docs office with Ebola type symptoms?

If not why not?


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## SARGE7402

*i predict that there will indeed be some Ebola cases pop up in the US, but that they will be quickly contained. Compared to most places in the world, we have an abundance of resources, training, surveillance, staff, and facilities to handle this. Africa will continue to experience an exponential nightmare of horror and I cannot imagine how this is going to be contained there.*

Maybe you are right - when it comes to our English as a first language folks. But what of the 11 - 20 million illegals. A) most don't speak english all that well much less read it. b) a lot live in conditions that made 3rd world countries in the 70's and 80's look good (I know cause I inspect their homes, resturants, and bodega's and I'm here to tell you that hygine is a sometimes thing for them. c) and how about those on welfare that live in the projects - they're already infested with dirty needles and other drug paraphenalia not to mention prostitution and a bed bug and roach problem that just makes one want to scream. It's in these populations that disease will take hold and it'll be the firefighters, police and rescue squads that will be on the front line dealing with any outbreak not the folks in the hospitals. Yes you'll be doing your part and I understand the risks you take, but just remember there are others that will see the patients with Ebola like symptoms way before you and your staffs see them.

The decision tree's need to be out there for these folks to do a proper evaluation as to who is a high risk and who is a low risk.

I don't see that at my level


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## keith9365

If contracting ebola is such a low risk, why are the people treating patients wearing hazmat suits and not lab coats?


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## Denton

keith9365 said:


> If contracting ebola is such a low risk, why are the people treating patients wearing hazmat suits and not lab coats?


OSHA requirements. Don't want to get fined several thousand dollars a day. :lol:


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## RNprepper

No one ever said that contact with Ebola patients was a low risk activity. Patient contact is how the disease is contracted. Health care workers are at the highest risk, as they have direct contact with the patients and their body fluids. Health care workers not only provide medical treatment, but they are bathing patients, giving oral care, inserting IV lines, nasogastric tubes, drawing blood, changing urinary catheters, emptying catheter bags, cleaning up vomit and feces, and basically dealing with whatever comes out of every orifice. They may also be caring for multiple patients. This is why, Keith, the health care workers are garbed in personal protective equipment (PPE) form head to toe. I hope this helps.

And yes, as Denton mentioned, OSHA has very stringent infection control guidelines for any type of patient care. It may be as simple as using gloves to draw blood, using an N95 mask for TB patients, or the full-monty biohazard suit with negative pressure ventilators for cases like Ebola. There are different levels of precautions, each with different requirements. These are designed to protect health care workers and an institution can be fined very severely if the guidelines are not followed.


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## RNprepper

SARGE7402 said:


> Better question for you RN prep. Have you seen a decision tree for evaluating patients coming into an ER or Docs office with Ebola type symptoms?
> 
> If not why not?


Our hospital is asking all patients about recent travel history. I will investigate further and see what the decision tree looks like and get back to you.


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## Notsoyoung

Ebola is a virus. Viruses can mutate. The plague that was known as the Black Death and killed about 1/4 of the people of Europe started out being transmitted by the fleas on rats. It then mutated to being transmitted through the air and that is when is started spreading so fast. What is frightening about Ebola is because of it's extremely high fatality rate, not to mention the whole bleeding from every orifice of your body thing. 

There is nothing to get hysterical about at this time, but it is cause for concern and is something that people should keep an eye on if they have any sense at all. The only thing that my family and I have done is check on our food/water supplies, something that we do regularly anyhow,and buy some extra medical masks and latex gloves.


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## rice paddy daddy

A concern also is a group of Islamic terrorists coming across the southern border each with a vial of small pox in their pocket, then spreading out to large American population centers to wreak havoc.
This would be more realistic than terrorists spreading ebola.


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## Notsoyoung

rice paddy daddy said:


> A concern also is a group of Islamic terrorists coming across the southern border each with a vial of small pox in their pocket, then spreading out to large American population centers to wreak havoc.
> This would be more realistic than terrorists spreading ebola.


I don't believe that anyone has been saying terrorists spreading Ebola, just that it might spread naturally, and it IS realistic as is terrorists spreading weaponized small pox. In either case, taking what possible precautions that you can in the event of a pandemic, natural or man-made, is a good idea.


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## Denton

I have read articles by people who fear Ebola could be brought by people of infected African nations who are coming here through the porous southern border.

This doesn't make sense to me, as it takes 21 or so days before the infected person to become sick, and surely it takes a lot longer to get to the border from Africa!


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## rice paddy daddy

Notsoyoung said:


> I don't believe that anyone has been saying terrorists spreading Ebola, just that it might spread naturally, and it IS realistic as is terrorists spreading weaponized small pox. In either case, taking what possible precautions that you can in the event of a pandemic, natural or man-made, is a good idea.


Think outside the box.
Terrorists do.


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## rice paddy daddy

Did anyone read the link I posted in both ebola threads?
Monsanto, ebola, and the DOD. That is a much bigger item on my radar screen than anything else concerning ebola.


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## RNprepper

SARGE7402 said:


> Better question for you RN prep. Have you seen a decision tree for evaluating patients coming into an ER or Docs office with Ebola type symptoms?
> 
> If not why not?


OK, Sarge, I checked with our ER staff. All patients with infective symptoms are asked about travel history. If there is suspicion in infective disease, whether TB, Ebola, measles, etc, isolation precautions are immediately taken. We have negative pressure rooms in the Er and on every unit. The patient would be placed in one of these rooms with the appropriate category of isolation precautions - whether contact, droplet, or airborne. The decision tree is bases on the CDC guidelines which are spelled out in great detail. It would bore most people, so I am not posting them here, but you can look for yourself on the CDC website under Ebola, and under guidelines for healthcare professionals. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention


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## TacticalCanuck

Some Canadian researchers last year proved conclusively that ebola can most certainly be spread as air borne. Read it on cbc.ca. if i can drudge up the link I will share it.


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## SARGE7402

not to worrry TC. Transmission of Ebola virus from pigs to non-human primates : Scientific Reports : Nature Publishing Group


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## Denton

TacticalCanuck said:


> Some Canadian researchers last year proved conclusively that ebola can most certainly be spread as air borne. Read it on cbc.ca. if i can drudge up the link I will share it.


Airborne is when the virus travels through the air without a vehicle, such as spittle or snot. Technically, it is not airborne -yet.

Still, from a personal point of view, I think it is prudent to see it as an airborne virus and treat it like the flu. Makes sense to me, at least.


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## microprepper

Kauboy said:


> To settle things back down, I'll excuse myself from this discussion. I'll still check in on it, but won't respond unless asked to do so, and even that will be done in PM.
> I hold no hard feelings gents. Carry on.


They'd probly go easier on you if you didn't look so much like Ronald Reagan. I think that proves they are ALL gov't plants! ::rambo::

But anyway, about the southern border in some other posts ( I still need to learn to use the multiple-quote thingie) I think it is extremely likely that we've had crossovers already.

Why do I think this? Because I have known people in my church and in working with hospice that there is a growing population of African immigrants taking those jobs. American citizens have been systematically discouraged from such jobs for years specifically because of the natural human resistance to euthanizing people like yourself, and Black Americans are more American than African, thus the move to immigrants replacing our own people in nursing homes. ( I guess I should open a whole 'nuther thread on the topic of race and political manipulation of the language & labor force. )

Euthanasia, not an ebola pandemic, has been the reason for this political strategy, but it has this bit of collateral damage potential:

The African immigrants who have established themselves as well-rooted legal Americans will NATURALLY do whatever they can to get their people over here and once those people are here, they will probably take good enough care of themselves as refugees to avoid spreading the disease, but what of the trip itself?

They will not be able to easily make it through American airports and will face a widening net of restrictions in the islands, etc. They will seek out the weakest points and get into South American and Mexico and come northwards overland. It will appear first in those places as anyone carrying it from Africa most likely won't make it all the way, but once it is in South America or the islands, it is closer to here.

The southern land-border is porous. Anyone who is obviously not Mexican or Latino-looking will find a way through the night-entrances in the deserts or through tunnels. Maybe the Mexican cartels will try to discourage this for their own health, but who wants to trust in _their _common-sense? Our border guards are already picking up corpses in the desert all the time, especially during the hottest parts of summer when you can get heat-stroke in the middle of the night!

It will happen, probably within six months. Someone will turn up in a local ER with it through some random contact and that contact will be traced back to some poor innocent who was doing what any one of us would do, trying to get to our loved ones for safety and survival. Then any efforts to trace the contacts out through the various ethnic and economic communities that are touched by immigration will be characterized as racist and people like the genocidal democrat activists will foment as much violence as they can, in the interest of "political correctness". The republicans will attack those of us who try to live color-blind while the democrats will attack everyone, equally.


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## SARGE7402

The WHO latest bulletin still shows 128 new cases with another 50 plus deaths. Doesn't appear to be dying out.


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## Notsoyoung

Heard on the news last night that 2 more Doctors in Africa died from it yesterday.


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## Dalarast

Notsoyoung said:


> Heard on the news last night that 2 more Doctors in Africa died from it yesterday.


Remember it can take up to 21 days to show symptons of Ebola. So when this thread first started people could of been exposed to it and today still not show signs of exposure.

And as Sarge mentioned the WHO announced 56 more in the past two days: WHO: Ebola cases near 2,000, with more than half dead - Panorama | Armenian news

BBC has a nice Ebola watch on it:

BBC News - Ebola outbreak: Guinea declares emergency

Wife asked if I'm worried over here about Ebola. I explained there is bigger threats to me than Ebola; but I fear that it is a bigger threat to her back home due to the exposure of so many unknowns each day. It seems like it would be easier for Ebola to jump from the West coast of Africa into the U.S. via airways than the West Coast to the East.

Once more... WASH YOUR HANDS


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## microprepper

Most likely route of unauthorized entry to USA, IMHO, would be via Canada or New Orleans, via the francophone islands like Haiti, which include so many people outside the circle of western control who also have African connections. Whites would be more likely to depend on "authorized' entry because they would be more willing to trust treatment and quarantine methods and vice versa. Just sayin'....

BTW, I often pass over a harbor that contains all kinds of international ships. Considering the rough nature of ship crews from all those countries (particularly any that have to pass through Somalian pirated waters), one has to wonder about the steps the Merchant Marine and the foreign crews take to protect themselves. Who would know if a freighter carried it in? How many captains who had to dismiss an ailing crew member in some port would be honest enough to discuss this with authorities?

again, just sayin'.....


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## SARGE7402

Funny how Ebola has dropped from View. The WHO daily update shows that instead of dropping off that the number of new cases 152 and deaths 76 has increased. There is also talk of other doctor's groups pulling out. That ought to do wonders for the success rate at curing folks.


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## SARGE7402

Looks like conditions are really getting a whole lot better!

Ebola spread fears rise as clinic looted, Liberian officials say | Fox News


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## Ripon

I believe the death toll is 2x the OP, and the countries impacted have gone from 3 to 4. Ok so it's not spreading like WW Z showed us in holly wood form, but it's not diminishing either, and I still think the most serious threat is from a terrorist willing to go get himself infected and bring it to NY.



SARGE7402 said:


> Looks like conditions are really getting a whole lot better!
> 
> Ebola spread fears rise as clinic looted, Liberian officials say | Fox News


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## Notsoyoung

SARGE7402 said:


> Looks like conditions are really getting a whole lot better!
> 
> Ebola spread fears rise as clinic looted, Liberian officials say | Fox News


How stupid are these folks? They even stole bed sheets with blood and feces from infected people on them.


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## Slippy

Notsoyoung said:


> How stupid are these folks? They even stole bed sheets with blood and feces from infected people on them.


Pretty stupid.


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## SARGE7402

did you get the part where the forty or so patients being treated for ebola just up and ran away


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## Notsoyoung

SARGE7402 said:


> did you get the part where the forty or so patients being treated for ebola just up and ran away


Yeah, I saw that. The only thing "better" is if they said they saw them getting on airplanes.


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## microprepper

It is surreal... Yes, I heard something on tv about an attack on a hospital, and kept flipping around the channels to see what would be updated since, but now it is as if there was not any ebola outbreak in the first place: total absence, except for one bit on the PBS channel that was about the kind of protections people wear in treating ebola, not news at all but "education"!

hmmmmm.....


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## SARGE7402

In case everyone has forgotten. The folks in Liberia are ramping up to stop the spread no matter what. Keep this in mind with what could happen here in the not too distant future.

Liberian slums barricaded as Ebola sets new record


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## paraquack

I wonder how soon we'll know about these two people already here that exhibiting syptoms of ebola?
UNMH patient being tested for Ebola-like symptoms | KRQE News 13
Hospital: Calif. patient may have been exposed to Ebola


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## Ripon

When. Is our golfer in chief going to use his pen and instruct his minions to stop letting people from these four countries come in at will?



paraquack said:


> I wonder how soon we'll know about these two people already here that exhibiting syptoms of ebola?
> UNMH patient being tested for Ebola-like symptoms | KRQE News 13
> Hospital: Calif. patient may have been exposed to Ebola


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## Inor

Ripon said:


> When. Is our golfer in chief going to use his pen and instruct his minions to stop letting people from these four countries come in at will?


Why would he do that? That would be racist.


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## PaulS

The two health care workers that were brought back to the US for treatment are doing well. They are recovering faster than expected and one is likely to be released to go home with her husband soon.


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## Smitty901

PaulS said:


> The two health care workers that were brought back to the US for treatment are doing well. They are recovering faster than expected and one is likely to be released to go home with her husband soon.


 That is wonderful news and This house has been praying from them.
American doctor treated for Ebola virus has recovered, aid group says | Fox News


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## SARGE7402

Before everybody jumps up and declares victory. From WHO on the 20th.

Epidemiology and surveillance

Between 17 and 18 August 2014, a total of 221 new cases of Ebola virus disease (laboratory-confirmed, probable, and suspect cases) as well as 106 deaths were reported from Guinea, Liberia, Nigeria, and Sierra Leone.

And lets not forget what's happened in Liberia. Liberia quarantine creates 'plague villages' at Ebola epicentre - Health - CBC News

But not to worry. Be happy


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## Ripon

Since just before August when I first posted this there were 1100 cases now 7,700. 2 months and just a few days 7x the cases.

Let's assume they are doing their level headed best and can cut that growth in half? If they cut transmission in half in 5 months there would likely be almost 100,000 cases and in a year over a million.

That's if they cut it's growth in half.



Ripon said:


> https://www.yahoo.com/health/ebola-outbreak-how-worried-should-you-be-93130718497.html
> 
> Who trusts that statement?
> 
> 1100 infected and 660 dead! That's 5x the last time I saw the MSM even report on it. So what's next 10 countries instead of three? 3,300 over 660?
> 
> I hope everyone keeps watching closely!


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