# Getting Started With SHTF Self Defense?



## PrepperForums (Nov 21, 2014)

How prepared are you in regards to self defense in a SHTF type of a situation?

What advice would you offer for someone just getting started with thinking about this?

How many different types of self defensive should someone focus on learning?


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## baldman (Apr 5, 2016)

I am ordering two genuine slippy pikes.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

As an old timer, I would suggest that anyone new to firearms who is concerned about the times we live in and is considering buying a gun, is to first do some research. 
Find out what the laws are in your state. Then decide if you want a firearm to defend your family in the home, or if you want to carry a concealed handgun when out in public.

For an absolute newcomer, I would recommend visiting a local range to see if you can rent a gun. Many ranges do, you can see what fits you, what you are comfortable with. Most ranges offer, or can suggest, a trainer to teach you the basics. ESPECIALLY SAFETY. Many people are injured or killed because of a lapse in judgement, or safety.

If you have a friend that shoots, that would be a positive. AS LONG as that person has a commitment to firearms safety. 

Now, I'll step off my soapbox.


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## Prepared One (Nov 5, 2014)

If your just starting out there are three guns. A good shotgun, a good pistol, and a good long rifle. If your on a budget they don't have to be super expensive. You can by all three of fair quality for roughly $1,200.00. learn to use them and practice with them. Know them like the back of your hand. learn to shoot center mass and save the heads for Slippy's genuine Slippy pikes. Nothing more satisfying then head on a pike. Buy ammo, lots of ammo. Learn to be aware. That's a bare bones foot in the pond start. You will be responsible for your own defense. The cops are called to tag the bodies and clean the scene.


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## gyro_cfi (Jan 12, 2016)

Never buy junk guns. S&W, Glock, Springfield XD, and Sig Sauer striker guns are popular for a reason.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

There is nothing wrong with revolvers, either.


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## bigwheel (Sep 22, 2014)

The main thing that drove me crazy about trying to carry around a mid sized to smallish revolver in the concealed mode is its sorta like trying to carry around a baseball in your pocket. Semis pack much flatter and are easier to hide..holds more ammo..easier to reload etc. I have one wheel gun left in the arsenal..and its a little NAA five slinger. That can fit in the shirt pocket without an issue..and should be better than a handful of rocks in a tense close range situation. Before smart folks invented all the newer carry methods..it was part of a two prong approach..designed to keep the bad guys ducking till the .380 could be drug out of the boot.


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## Denton (Sep 18, 2012)

gyro_cfi said:


> Never buy junk guns. S&W, Glock, Springfield XD, and Sig Sauer striker guns are popular for a reason.


Buy what you can afford. What you might consider junk might be all another can afford. That "junk gun" might be the tool used to fold up a bad guy.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Denton said:


> Buy what you can afford. What you might consider junk might be all another can afford. That "junk gun" might be the tool used to fold up a bad guy.


Yep. Not everyone can afford to throw down $500+ on a handgun.
My police trade in S&W Model 15 Combat Masterpiece 38 Special cost me half that - $250. And it will put a bad guys face in the dirt just as well as a Glock.


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## Camel923 (Aug 13, 2014)

While it is better to have junk gun than no gun, all things being equal, dependability is clutch. If it fails to go bang when needed most, you have a big time problem because you bet your life on it. Do your research and get the most reliable shotgun, rifle, pistol/revolver you can afford. Used in great shape is more than acceptable.


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

PrepperForums said:


> How prepared are you in regards to self defense in a SHTF type of a situation?
> 
> What advice would you offer for someone just getting started with thinking about this?
> 
> How many different types of self defensive should someone focus on learning?


I'd say firearms and some type of hand to hand combat would be a good jumping off point. Obviously the more of both you have practiced the better off you'll be. Self defense can also be getting out of a bad situation. Someday you may have to run just so you'll have a chance to fight another day. That's why I believe cardio is a good self defense.

Sent from Tapatalk (aka Uranus, not to be confused with the Anus' at Survivalist Board)


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## sideKahr (Oct 15, 2014)

I'm more prepared than some for SHTF, but there are experts on this board that make me feel like a child. I hope some of them weigh in here.

Advice? In a SHTF situation, having a gun is not the only preparation you must make. Your brain is your most important prep. Having thought about, before hand, where the greatest risks are and AVOIDING that situation is the best defense. For instance, if you have food in the house, then you don't have to go to the grocer where desperate people are rioting. You will win EVERY gunfight by not being there. 

Having said that, I still carry a gun because I know I can't control everything. When faced with violence, de-escalation of the threat is always the best course of action. If that isn't possible, then flight. I like the philosophy of one of our members: "I know how to fight, but I'm not too proud to hide." As the last resort use dispassionate overwhelming force against your assailant to end the threat.

Types of defense? Have as much expertise in as many forms of combat as possible. If firearms are involved, at the very least take a basic safety course and learn the law. Having the time and desire to learn and practice the many methods of self defense and your physical capabilities are some limiting factors. The expense of purchasing training, firearms/ammunition, and edged weapons may present itself.


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## admin (Apr 28, 2016)

rice paddy daddy said:


> ...
> For an absolute newcomer, I would recommend visiting a local range to see if you can rent a gun. Many ranges do, you can see what fits you, what you are comfortable with. Most ranges offer, or can suggest, a trainer to teach you the basics. ESPECIALLY SAFETY. Many people are injured or killed because of a lapse in judgement, or safety...


The range that I normally go to with my son, doesn't rent guns, so for some reason it never crossed my mind that some ranges might do this. I did some searching and found a few in my area that DO rent them. Thank you for the tip!


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## gyro_cfi (Jan 12, 2016)

rice paddy daddy said:


> Yep. Not everyone can afford to throw down $500+ on a handgun.
> My police trade in S&W Model 15 Combat Masterpiece 38 Special cost me half that - $250. And it will put a bad guys face in the dirt just as well as a Glock.


Agree 100%. Since OP did not mention price as an issue, I made the preemptive suggestion to buy quality and avoid disappointment.

There are though lots of quality low cost ways too buy a SHTF personal arsenal. Used, as you've done and great weapons with excellent reputations that are clones. I like Canik tp9v2 ($350), Maverick 88 shotgun ($220), and you can't go wrong with Palmetto State Armory AR-15. You can purchase upper and lower blems for under $500 and the barrel is made by FN.


PrepperForums said:


> How prepared are you in regards to self defense in a SHTF type of a situation?
> 
> What advice would you offer for someone just getting started with thinking about this?
> 
> How many different types of self defensive should someone focus on learning?


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

Most have focused on guns but there are plenty of other ways to defend yourself. Concentrate on one method and get very proficient at it first before moving on. Martial arts, knifes, clubs, tasers, pepper spray or even running. Whatever works for you physically and for your location or situation. It will do you NO good to flail around not sure of what your doing if your life is on the line. 

Eventually you will build up your skill and confidence then move into a firearm. Just going for a gun isn't always the best or feasible option.


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## Maine-Marine (Mar 7, 2014)

The Post begs the question... Self defense from what/who?


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

The great equalizer is the gun no question about it.

For us older folks it is the only option other than hide or die.

Of course some here are immune to aging. 

I knew a state trooper who had earned a black belt on Okinawa and operated a cow dung poo school on the side.

His first reliance was on his gun not chop, chop, he always thought he would get capped by a 95 pound BLM ghetto rat type.

IMHO, if a SHTF EVENT occurs the gun will rule, this has proven out worldwide for decades.

Not everyone can afford, have time or physically able to learn any martial arts, further they take years to master.

The scum trying to break into your home most likely has a gun and little else includng any value for you or your families life.

I do not think you will see predators roaming the streets unarmed, WORL, quickest way for them to earn a Darwin award.

Conclusion, firearm is the quickest to master, can be the final arbitor in a fight with little physical prowness needed.

A good used 12 ga. defense gun can be had for around a 100- 150,


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

RPD and Gyro hit it on the head with the fact that you can arm yourself with QUALITY inexpensive guns.

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/2072413

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/79

Those are almost direct copies of the Glock 19 and the Glock 23 to the point that Smith and Wesson paid royalties when they where still named the Sigma. You can get either for under 300 bucks new

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/374

Ruger SR series, this one happens to be a 9mm available for under 300 bucks and are good guns.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog...ducts_id/42605/Maverick+88+12GA+18.5"+CYL+6RD

Maverick88 by mossberg 12 gauge pump under 200 bucks new

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog...46907/Mossberg+54169+500+COMBO+12+28AC18CB+PG

Mossberg 500 12 gauge pump combo. Includes a barrel with 3 changeable chokes and a rifled slug barrel. Yours for 350 new

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/342

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/1112027

Entry level Ar-15's both new around 500 bucks

You can still find SKS's laying around pawn shops, gun broker, and arms list as low as 250 to 300 bucks and Mosin Nagants are going for around 200 bucks now, still a bargain even at that price. As RPD suggested you can find stuff cheaper than what I posted on the used market if you look long and hard enough for it.

Getting the gun is only part of defending yourself too. You need to get safety training at the minimum and preferably a pistol/shotgun/carbine course if you can afford it, if you can't then attend a hunters safety course and spend as much time as you can at the range.

Another thing is you have to know how to avoid and deescalate situations when you can. An ounce of prevention is worth a ton in cure when it comes to these types of things. If you make yourself a hard target by keeping everything locked up then most of the time your house/car are going to be passed up simply because most thieves are lazy and will go for the easy pickings. In some situations the right situation may be to retreat or give the guy what he wants then go to the authorities later.  A 20 buck loss and police report is still a lot cheaper than the disruption to your life for taking a shot at somebody justified or not.

In addition to having a gun, a low profile, and knowing how to deescalate situations you should also consider having a dog around if your living situation permits it and if your a dog person. If you don't like dogs and won't take care of one then you shouldn't get one, they are loyal companions and family members and not just another piece of hardware laying around. Any dog that barks or looks like it might be able to bite are great for home defense. Thieves hate barking dogs because they draw attention and despise big dogs because they don't want to risk getting but. I personally have heard from a guy who got busted for breaking into houses state that if he saw a German Sheppard he would go to the next house, if he ran into a yappy dog he would go to the next house, if he saw a pit bull he would go to the next block. You can also get dogs pretty cheaply too, the shelters are overrun so you'll be saving a life, gaining security, and getting a valued family member all in one. If you can afford the training a trained defensive dog is almost as good as a gun, notice how the police and military use them.


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## Sasquatch (Dec 12, 2014)

PrepperForums said:


> How prepared are you in regards to self defense in a SHTF type of a situation?
> 
> What advice would you offer for someone just getting started with thinking about this?
> 
> How many different types of self defensive should someone focus on learning?


And for the record, the Alien Gear concealed carry holster shown in the pic is a fine piece of equipment to own. I thank @Kuaboy and a few others for the recommendation.


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## Coastie dad (Jan 2, 2016)

Guns good. No argument.

Martial art called rhundahegawy is always good to know.

But learn to use a knife with either hand as well as a gun. I carry a one hand opener both right and left side. I live to tell you it is a worthwhile endeavor taught to me by a DI we discussed in another thread. Not just for "combat" but in any emergency which may require a sharp blade.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

I have always been a po' boy. Even during the economic hey days of the booming economy when I was getting quarterly bonuses, I could rarely afford a NEW gun.
If you know what you are looking at, and stick with well known American brand names, you can score some good used guns cheap. A few examples from my collection:
A pristine, fairly late model (1999), Ruger Mini 14 Ranch Rifle - $400
Remington 870 Super Magnum Express 12 ga - $185
Winchester 1300 20ga pump - $165
Colt Police Positive 38 Special, circa 1970 - $250
Sporterized Mauser K98k, (8X57 Mauser) - $188 (OK. That one is NOT American, but still the best bolt action rifle ever made.)
And more, such as an M1 Garand for $600. One of the greatest battle rifles ever made.

The deals are out there, but you have to know what a good price is versus over priced, and know when to walk away.


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## SDF880 (Mar 28, 2013)

I took 4+ years Karate (Chito Ru) way back when and had made it to a brown belt level. Fast forward to 2 years ago I got attacked in my house by a relative
who just snapped (dementia?) and attacked me and my daughter. Everything happened in a second and I was armed but old training kicked in and in a second I had him
on the floor and held him there till he calmed down. I quickly recognized he was out of his head but he slowly returned to a rational self. The guy had no memory of attacking me
or going after my daughter. I had no idea this would kick in like it did! I stretch and practice punching/kicking/blocking almost daily for years but never thought it would come in handy!
I'm 60 next year but considering getting into Kung Fu or Taekwondo and continue with that till I can't do it anymore.


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## Boss Dog (Feb 8, 2013)

rice paddy daddy said:


> I have always been a po' boy. Even during the economic hey days of the booming economy when I was getting quarterly bonuses, I could rarely afford a NEW gun.
> If you know what you are looking at, and stick with well known American brand names, you can score some good used guns cheap...
> 
> ...The deals are out there, but you have to know what a good price is versus over priced, and know when to walk away.


+1 here, only 3 of mine were bought new by me. Save some money this summer, guns that some bought with their tax "refunds" will become available again just before Christmas because the remorseful buyer is short of cash.


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## NotTooProudToHide (Nov 3, 2013)

There are "seasons" to buying good used guns rather cheaply. After deer gun season is over until it begins again keep an eye on your local armslist, hunters that missed the big ones blame their equipment and try to dump it to get a percieved upgrade (just like golf). You can find a good deer caliber rifle pretty cheaply but you have to be careful because people do overestimate what their gun is worth. Christmas after a big panic is also another good time when people who bought multiple 500 dollar ar-15's for 1000 dollars need to get some cash for the kids presents.


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## Targetshooter (Dec 4, 2015)

gun shows are a good place to buy , I bought a real nice 410 a few years ago for $75 . gave it to my grandson .


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## Smitty901 (Nov 16, 2012)

To old for the bad ass stuff. Either my dog is going to eat you or I my wife or one of the family will shoot you. That is just how it is now days. When it comes to the dog trust me on this the bite is much worst than the bark.


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## Medic33 (Mar 29, 2015)

keep it simple, be cost effective don't get carried away with the tacticool crowd .
a simple handgun-and a shotgun would be enough
learn to be aware of what is going on around you and your environment.
learn to go from sleep to fully awake at a moments notice and be prepared to fight or flight.


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

Sasquatch said:


> And for the record, the Alien Gear concealed carry holster shown in the pic is a fine piece of equipment to own. I thank @Kuaboy and a few others for the recommendation.


I recommend Alien Gear. Great equipment.


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## Montana Rancher (Mar 4, 2013)

Geeze people what the crap

you can get a "Stevens" 12 gauge "tactical" shotgun for $199 brand new, you can get a decent used Remington 870 or Mossburg 500 around $299, you can get a brand new Remington or a Benelli for $399.

Any of which is the better choice for a home defense weapon than anything mentioned before.

IMO get a 12 gauge shotgun as your first defense gun, the sound of the action being racked will probably send your attacker off, its also a rifle which is easy to point and shoot, and it will drop anyone on the spot, weather they are using drugs or not.


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## jchavasu (Aug 13, 2016)

Montana Rancher said:


> IMO get a 12 gauge shotgun as your first defense gun, the sound of the action being racked will probably send your attacker off, its also a rifle which is easy to point and shoot, and it will drop anyone on the spot, weather they are using drugs or not.


I have heard this many times, but IMHO if they are close enough to hear you racking a shell into the chamber than you are way late in charging your weapon. You may find that they are armed as well and didn't wait to put a round in theirs. I would much rather have the advantage than make the assumption that they will turn tail and run. A motivated and/or trained opponent will likely not be scared off by racking a shotgun.

That said, I agree a shotgun can be a fine weapon for home defense and it has many other purposes such as putting food on the table. My choice would not be a shotgun for home defense just because of the longer barrel and the possibility of having to clear corners with it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## A Watchman (Sep 14, 2015)

jchavasu said:


> I have heard this many times, but IMHO if they are close enough to hear you racking a shell into the chamber than you are way late in charging your weapon. You may find that they are armed as well and didn't wait to put a round in theirs. I would much rather have the advantage than make the assumption that they will turn tail and run. A motivated and/or trained opponent will likely not be scared off by racking a shotgun.
> 
> That said, I agree a shotgun can be a fine weapon for home defense and it has many other purposes such as putting food on the table. My choice would not be a shotgun for home defense just because of the longer barrel and the possibility of having to clear corners with it.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Hey jchavasu,

So you wanna be a prepper huh? Well here at PF in order to have an opinion ....... you see we have standards you know.
So, bite the bullet and post in the Intro thread why and how you prepare. Then share, teach , and learn here on the PF board.


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## CWOLDOJAX (Sep 5, 2013)

rice paddy daddy said:


> I have always been a po' boy. Even during the economic hey days of the booming economy when I was getting quarterly bonuses, I could rarely afford a NEW gun.
> If you know what you are looking at, and stick with well known American brand names, you can score some good used guns cheap. A few examples from my collection:
> A pristine, fairly late model (1999), Ruger Mini 14 Ranch Rifle - $400
> Remington 870 Super Magnum Express 12 ga - $185
> ...


RPD has taught me a great deal, especially about pistols and the surplus rifles. He personally has contaminated me with an obsession to get a Mini 14... among a 100 other guns. ;-)
Personally, I think I am a better shooter with that than an M-16, yet they cost more than an entry-level M-16... but if I can handle it better, shoot it better then it's the rifle I should get.
I am smarter shopper thanks to his coaching.

Listen to this guy when he speaks... his wisdom will last longer than the current trends. That's important.

By now he's probably embarrassed. Sorry, RPD, you earned a good word now and then.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

CWOLDOJAX said:


> RPD has taught me a great deal, especially about pistols and the surplus rifles.
> 
> By now he's probably embarrassed. Sorry, RPD, you earned a good word now and then.


You are a good man, my friend. And a true natural shot with any rifle you pick up.

And now you have seen Ol' RPD, who owns no head space gauges, do the official Red Neck Head Space Check on a 1944 Turkish Mauser. :vs_lol:

PS - Don't tell SOCOM about this, he would not approve.:vs_shocked:

(I pronounced it within specs after examination of the fired case)


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## SOCOM42 (Nov 9, 2012)

RPD, I AM watching YOU!

Too many Betel Nuts?


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Awww, it really wasn't THAT dangerous. It was a Model 1938, made in 1944 and not a rework of an earlier GEW98. AND it was all numbers matching, especially the bolt. That part was important.


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## warrior4 (Oct 16, 2013)

Self defense starts with situational awareness. Since I got my concealed pistol licence I've found I'm being a lot more observant of the world around me since I now have a weapon on me. I have my weapon, I know how to use it, I don't want to ever have to use it, so I'm trying to be more aware of how I can avoid having to use it. Here's a link to a very good article on how to start developing one's situational awareness.

How to Develop the Situational Awareness | The Art of Manliness


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

gyro_cfi said:


> Never buy junk guns. S&W, Glock, Springfield XD, and Sig Sauer striker guns are popular for a reason.


Buying used is a valid way to get a great reliable firing gun, at used price. Police turn ins, etc.
I paid 550 for a used Sig P226 357SIG. Changed some springs, cleaned it up, shoots everytime..
Also, CZ makes excellent pistols and rifles..


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