# Forum 1 for silencers



## budgetprepp-n (Apr 7, 2013)

I know a form 1 is used for buying a silencer but what if you'r building one?
Anyone here ever legally build a silencer? What forum did you use?

The places that sell the silencers are more than glad to help until they find out you'r not
buying one from them.


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

Design it and fill out specs etc on a form 1, wait for permission.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/f...-and-register-firearm-atf-form-53201/download


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

Yeah, it's basically the same thing.
You give them the details, and you wait for your little stamp of approval that you've been a good boy.

Once you have that, you are free to begin construction.
Don't dare start beforehand.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> Yeah, it's basically the same thing.
> You give them the details, and you wait for your little stamp of approval that you've been a good boy.
> 
> Once you have that, you are free to begin construction.
> Don't dare start beforehand.


You can start building a silencer before the paperwork and approval is through. You just can not have a complete and useable silencer. Like having an SBR. You can have the complete upper and a complete lower, just do not have them together in a complete rifle.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

RedLion said:


> You can start building a silencer before the paperwork and approval is through. You just can not have a complete and useable silencer. Like having an SBR. You can have the complete upper and a complete lower, just do not have them together in a complete rifle.


Oh?
I read somewhere that you could not have *all* parts necessary to make one, silencer or SBR, or you would be in violation without the approved stamp.
It's like owning an automatic BCG for the AR. You can have the BCG, but you cannot also posses an auto sear, even if not installed, or you are breaking the law.

If that's not correct, I'd love a link to read so I can get up to date on the real legalese.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Kauboy said:


> Oh?
> I read somewhere that you could not have *all* parts necessary to make one, silencer or SBR, or you would be in violation without the approved stamp.
> It's like owning an automatic BCG for the AR. You can have the BCG, but you cannot also posses an auto sear, even if not installed, or you are breaking the law.
> 
> If that's not correct, I'd love a link to read so I can get up to date on the real legalese.


I could be wrong about the silencer, but not about SBR. Why do you think that complete AR uppers in barrel lengths under 16" are legal to sale without even a back ground check? It is not the actual firearm, but a component of a firearm, the lower receiver is the actual firearm. A SBR does not become an actual SBR until you mate the complete upper with the complete lower. 
By the way, even if you possessed a full auto BCG (the only ones that I use in AR's) and possess an auto sear, you can not actually use them to construct a select fire AR without having the proper lower receiver that can accommodate the auto sear. Yes I know that auto sears are NFA items.
I have an AR pistol with an 8.5" barrel and several other AR rifles with a variety of stocks and other parts. I can easily assemble a SBR, but do not. Having the parts does not equate to being illegal.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

More about about building a silencer......Ok to have parts, but not ok to take any steps to build without approval.



> To put it simply: You need an approved Form 1 before you can start building your suppressor. Do not attempt to machine parts, drill holes or otherwise do anything that would be construed as building an unregistered suppressor.
> That being said, you can purchase the parts necessary to build you silencer while you wait for your Form 1 to be approved. After all, the majority of these parts are commercially available at metal supply sources, auto parts stores, hardware stores or directly from a machine shop.
> 
> The key here is intent and common sense. Buying metal tubes is one thing; forming baffle cones and drilling bore holes is something completely different. For the most part, if your parts can be threaded onto a barrel and can suppress the sound of a fired shot, it's a silencer and needs an approved Form 1. When in doubt, wait for your Form 1 to come back approved from the BATFE.


https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/09/build-silencer-part-1/


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

RedLion said:


> You can start building a silencer before the paperwork and approval is through. You just can not have a complete and useable silencer. Like having an SBR. You can have the complete upper and a complete lower, just do not have them together in a complete rifle.


You can not have upper and lower in same residence while awaiting form 1, unless you already have one SBR in your residence.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Steve40th said:


> You can not have upper and lower in same residence while awaiting form 1, unless you already have one SBR in your residence.


You can when the upper is one a pistol lower.


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

RedLion said:


> You can when the upper is one a pistol lower.


Yes, very true. I am not buying anymore rifle lowers. I am doing pistols then applying later.. ATF policys are so archaic.


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Steve40th said:


> Yes, very true. I am not buying anymore rifle lowers. I am doing pistols then applying later.. ATF policys are so archaic.


Most stripped AR lowers are sold as firearms and not as a pistol or rifle, just so can use it as you like. My last 3 lowers have been completed 80% lowers.


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## Steve40th (Aug 17, 2016)

RedLion said:


> Most stripped AR lowers are sold as firearms and not as a pistol or rifle, just so can use it as you like. My last 3 lowers have been completed 80% lowers.


Damn it. I need to research stuff more. I assumed every lower you buy is a rifle lower. So, as long as I buy a stripped multi cal lower, I can make it a pistol, as long as there is not but stock on it, just a brace or tube. ?


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## RedLion (Sep 23, 2015)

Steve40th said:


> Damn it. I need to research stuff more. I assumed every lower you buy is a rifle lower. So, as long as I buy a stripped multi cal lower, I can make it a pistol, as long as there is not but stock on it, just a brace or tube. ?


Yes and a lower first used as pistol can then be used as a rifle, but not that other way around. I have the sig saur brace on mine and like it. ATF has even given guidance in the past year that an AR pistol with brace can essentially be shouldered. Basically if the brace touches your shoulder while you are shooting and resting your cheek on the brace, then the brace touching your shoulder is ok. This is of course as long as the brace is a brace and legal, meaning not too long (I do not remember the length limit off hand).


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

RedLion said:


> Yes and a lower first used as pistol can then be used as a rifle, but not that other way around. I have the sig saur brace on mine and like it. ATF has even given guidance in the past year that an AR pistol with brace can essentially be shouldered. Basically if the brace touches your shoulder while you are shooting and resting your cheek on the brace, then the brace touching your shoulder is ok. This is of course as long as the brace is a brace and legal, meaning not too long (I do not remember the length limit off hand).


I saw that clarification.
They basically wiped away any previous misunderstandings about braces.
Basically, a brace is a brace. The fact that one can put a brace up to the shoulder does not change the intent of the brace.
Therefore, the brace cannot be misconstrued to "create" an SBR simply by putting it to the shoulder.

I drooled a little after reading that letter.


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## Kauboy (May 12, 2014)

RedLion said:


> More about about building a silencer......Ok to have parts, but not ok to take any steps to build without approval.
> 
> https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/09/build-silencer-part-1/


This must be what I was remembering. Parts are ok, but assembly must wait. :tango_face_wink:


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