# Encouragement to Coolwater



## Inor

Coolwater said:


> Well, was not going to reply here again so it might kind of die down, but don't know where else to say this. I didn't get to go to a range today, nor look for a gun. Drove within sight of a huge pawnshop and just nearly pulled in but didn't. Maybe I have some kind of mental block I need to get over first, like when I was once thrown by my contrary horse; anybody ever slapped a horse? But, brother in law told me I could have his uncle's old shotgun if I want it; don't know what kind, but the uncle was born in 1915 so it might not even still work.


First off, do not go to a pawn shop to buy your first gun. - Buying guns at pawn shops is for folks that know what they are looking at and know how to value what they are looking at. No offense intended, but if you do not have a fair bit of experience shooting different weapons, buying from a pawn shop, you will: 1 - pay way too much 2- possibly get a weapon that is either worn out or unreliable or even dangerous to shoot 3 - the clerk will be absolutely worthless since he/she will not know any more than you do even if they sound like they do. So Inor's gun safety rule #7: NEVER buy guns from pawn shops unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing.

Inor's gun safety rule #8 is: rule #7 applies to gun shows too (but they are less likely to sell something unsafe than a pawn shop).

My best advice to get over the fear of walking into a gun shop is to just find a small mom and pop store near you. You have at least one. I travel extensively in North America for business. Other than when I am in New York City, I do not think I have ever been more than 30 miles away from a gun store in any place in the U.S. Go there during off hours, when they are not crazy busy helping other customers. The clerk/owner will be very friendly, likely morbidly obese, and be wearing a holstered pistol. That is how it is; get used to it. These folks are good people.

When he greets you, be open that you have no experience, have some fear of guns but want to explore the options. I can almost give you a 100% guarantee that he/she will bend over backwards to help. Of course, he/she is trying to sell you a gun. BUT as a rule, gun people are very much like horse people (at least the western style horse people), they are the friendliest folks you would ever want to meet if you just be honest with what you are after. Also, most gun store folks are not really pushy salesmen. They understand that a gun is a VERY personal decision and a lot of what you like or do not like about it is going to be how it feels in your hands. Be honest with them. If you are not prepared to buy on your first visit, tell them. They may excuse themselves from you when a paying customer comes in, but they will come back and they will appreciate your honesty.

Finally, get past this bullshit that you are doing something wrong by walking into a gun shop! It is not a porno store. This is something that our Founders felt strongly enough about to explicitly state it in the 2nd Amendment. There is nothing to be afraid or ashamed of. And anybody that tries to tell you different is a douche bag and deserves a whack in the face with a Louisville Slugger.

If any of ya'll can think of any encouragement or any facts that I have left out to encourage our friend Coolwater to take the plunge, please speak up.


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## Dubyagee

Id go to a range that rented guns and take a few for a spin.


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## BagLady

Coolwater. Don't rush into anything. Take your time to make a decision. 
The guys and gals here will help you with any questions you have, and you have our support.
Don't hesitate to ask.


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## Coolwater

INOR, that's really a super informative thing you just wrote, thank you. I really appreciate it too, and now I'll read it again.


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## Kahlan

Inor said:


> When he greets you, be open that you have no experience, have some fear of guns but want to explore the options. I can almost give you a 100% guarantee that he/she will bend over backwards to help.


When I called the instructor for my concealed weapons class that guy made me feel like I was some kind of special. He was just so damn excited knowing that I was ready to take that step. We talked on the phone at least 20 minutes. His questions were non stop but he made me feel like he was really there to help_ me_!

Just the self confidence I have gained since getting my first gun, I can't even describe it to you. As a woman and a mother.... I can't recommend it more. I'm still just a novice so I can't tell you like these guys can but just from me, woman to woman please consider it. Go to the range, take a class!


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## bigdogbuc

I second that. Pawn Shops can often be a place to get rid of broken or malfunctioning firearms that look alright, and get a bit of cash in your pocket walking away from a problem that will soon become someone else's. A pawn shop will rarely, if ever test the gun. I've never had an issue per say with anything I've ever gotten from one, but I know what I'm looking at and generally what they're worth. 

Also beware of the privately owned gun shops. Walk in on a Saturday, late morning, early afternoon and just listen. Beware the salesman who is "pushing a particular brand/type of gun". There's one at a store I no longer do business with that is like a car salesman. You walk in wanting a used red Chevy, drive out with a new green Volvo. 

He see's a "Newbie" walk in like a shark smelling blood in the water. When I did shop there, I wouldn't even acknowledge him. Get what YOU want, not what they want to sell you...better yet, if you were listening and watching, when you decide to look at something, you'll know to stay away from "that guy"; "that guy" is a fast, smooth talker and will be on you like green on grass before the door even closes...


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## Jeep

Coolwater, don't get hung up on models and brand names either, It can get horrible. Just try to figure out your needs then ask here maybe,


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## Coolwater

Thanks, Jeep, and yeah I don't care about brand names. Jeep, I had a cousin who moved way off to Montana from south texas; his name was Ronnie Kelso and he died up there a few years back. Might you have known him?


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## Coolwater

INOR, I need to get to bed before I fall from my chair; tiring day. But thank you so much for your help and advice!


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## Ripon

Dear Coolwater,

Guns are not for everyone. If you feel you can include them in your preps then read and research until you are comfortable with a choice, but don't be pressured into what's not for you. We all have wildly different opinions, needs, and abilities and only you can know your own. There is so much to read on the topic that you could never finish.


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## sargedog

When I first started with guns I bought a Jennings .22 and my wife and I went to shoot it. Every few rounds we would have a failure to feed the bullet into the chamber or a failure to eject the spent casing. I realized that this was not what I was looking for, I wanted to protect my family no matter what. I did research and asked questions of my friends, I decided to sell that one and buy a Ruger P-89. I never had a problem with that gun, now my daughter has it to protect herself.

I then purchased some Taurus firearms and caught a LOT of grief for my choice, but out of the 15-20 I have owned over the years I have only sent 1 back to the factory for a bad barrel. I agree if you can try several firearms and decide what you want it for home defense/conceal carry. Train with your firearm as much as you can, the more you train the better you will react in a bad situation.

I have always been a pistol/shotgun guy until recently when I purchased an AR-15. I knew absolutely nothing about them, but with the help of good people here and you tube I have learned so much. Well I hope once you get set and find what you want you might take the conceal carry class. Anyway I wish you the best in your search. BTW I have the best wife on planet earth, all I have to do is mention I want a new firearm and she is ready to get it.


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## Prepared One

Inor pretty much nailed it Coolwater so I back his play. I might perahps suggwest a friend, family member, coworker or neighbor who may be able to help you. They make great mentors. Here in Texas we have gun shops on just about every corner. ( Thank you lord ) I like the Mom and Pop's because I hate crowds and do tend to be more helpful, but I have shopped at all of them. And I have never lived in place here that I was not living next to a good neighbor that wasn't into hunting or firearms in general. Short of that check your gun shops. They have lists of qualified trainers and are always more then happy to make suggestions. Tell them your a novice and what your looking at. Most will bend over backwards to help. If they don't...walk....Remember your the buyer. The main thing....Stop the car and go in the front door! The rest will be easy.


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## Slippy

Inor said:


> First off, do not go to a pawn shop to buy your first gun. - Buying guns at pawn shops is for folks that know what they are looking at and know how to value what they are looking at. No offense intended, but if you do not have a fair bit of experience shooting different weapons, buying from a pawn shop, you will: 1 - pay way too much 2- possibly get a weapon that is either worn out or unreliable or even dangerous to shoot 3 - the clerk will be absolutely worthless since he/she will not know any more than you do even if they sound like they do. So Inor's gun safety rule #7: NEVER buy guns from pawn shops unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing.
> 
> Inor's gun safety rule #8 is: rule #7 applies to gun shows too (but they are less likely to sell something unsafe than a pawn shop).
> 
> My best advice to get over the fear of walking into a gun shop is to just find a small mom and pop store near you. You have at least one. I travel extensively in North America for business. Other than when I am in New York City, I do not think I have ever been more than 30 miles away from a gun store in any place in the U.S. Go there during off hours, when they are not crazy busy helping other customers. The clerk/owner will be very friendly, likely morbidly obese, and be wearing a holstered pistol. That is how it is; get used to it. These folks are good people.
> 
> When he greets you, be open that you have no experience, have some fear of guns but want to explore the options. I can almost give you a 100% guarantee that he/she will bend over backwards to help. Of course, he/she is trying to sell you a gun. BUT as a rule, gun people are very much like horse people (at least the western style horse people), they are the friendliest folks you would ever want to meet if you just be honest with what you are after. Also, most gun store folks are not really pushy salesmen. They understand that a gun is a VERY personal decision and a lot of what you like or do not like about it is going to be how it feels in your hands. Be honest with them. If you are not prepared to buy on your first visit, tell them. They may excuse themselves from you when a paying customer comes in, but they will come back and they will appreciate your honesty.
> 
> Finally, get past this bullshit that you are doing something wrong by walking into a gun shop! It is not a *porno store*. This is something that our Founders felt strongly enough about to explicitly state it in the 2nd Amendment. There is nothing to be afraid or ashamed of. And anybody that tries to tell you different is a douche bag and deserves a whack in the face with a Louisville Slugger.
> 
> If any of ya'll can think of any encouragement or any facts that I have left out to encourage our friend Coolwater to take the plunge, please speak up.


Did someone mention a Porno Store?


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## turbo6

I wouldn't necessarily rule out all pawn shops. Guns are a big part of some of their business and many sell new and used ones.

I considered buying my first gun at one but ended up buying elsewhere at a better price. However I would still buy one from my local shop, they aren't seedy and often run 10-20% off sales on their firearms, which are reasonably priced already. 

Just talking with them gave me a feel that they wanted to sell me something I could afford, steering me away from some of the low end stuff but not trying to talk me into some fancy $1800 1911 either.


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## DerBiermeister

Inor said:


> First off, do not go to a pawn shop to buy your first gun. - Buying guns at pawn shops is for folks that know what they are looking at and know how to value what they are looking at. No offense intended, but if you do not have a fair bit of experience shooting different weapons, buying from a pawn shop, you will: 1 - pay way too much 2- possibly get a weapon that is either worn out or unreliable or even dangerous to shoot 3 - the clerk will be absolutely worthless since he/she will not know any more than you do even if they sound like they do. So Inor's gun safety rule #7: NEVER buy guns from pawn shops unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing.
> 
> Inor's gun safety rule #8 is: rule #7 applies to gun shows too (but they are less likely to sell something unsafe than a pawn shop).
> 
> My best advice to get over the fear of walking into a gun shop is to just find a small mom and pop store near you. You have at least one. I travel extensively in North America for business. Other than when I am in New York City, I do not think I have ever been more than 30 miles away from a gun store in any place in the U.S. Go there during off hours, when they are not crazy busy helping other customers. The clerk/owner will be very friendly, likely morbidly obese, and be wearing a holstered pistol. That is how it is; get used to it. These folks are good people.
> 
> When he greets you, be open that you have no experience, have some fear of guns but want to explore the options. I can almost give you a 100% guarantee that he/she will bend over backwards to help. Of course, he/she is trying to sell you a gun. BUT as a rule, gun people are very much like horse people (at least the western style horse people), they are the friendliest folks you would ever want to meet if you just be honest with what you are after. Also, most gun store folks are not really pushy salesmen. They understand that a gun is a VERY personal decision and a lot of what you like or do not like about it is going to be how it feels in your hands. Be honest with them. If you are not prepared to buy on your first visit, tell them. They may excuse themselves from you when a paying customer comes in, but they will come back and they will appreciate your honesty.
> 
> Finally, get past this bullshit that you are doing something wrong by walking into a gun shop! It is not a porno store. This is something that our Founders felt strongly enough about to explicitly state it in the 2nd Amendment. There is nothing to be afraid or ashamed of. And anybody that tries to tell you different is a douche bag and deserves a whack in the face with a Louisville Slugger.
> 
> If any of ya'll can think of any encouragement or any facts that I have left out to encourage our friend Coolwater to take the plunge, please speak up.


That is just flat out the best explanation of a LGS that I have ever heard or read. Thanks Inor. You have helped Coolwater more than probably even you realize.


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## Slippy

Check out my friend Colion Noir on YouTube.
Here is one of his videos on Gun Store Salespeople;


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## Slippy

Another one from Noir about the different types of gun store customers;


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## csi-tech

Excellent post Inor, although gun store and porno store are synonymous in my head I concede that the problem is with me.


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## MI.oldguy

I must concur with Inor,Coolwater.my first firearm was bought at a local gun store.they were very informative.I was set on a certain handgun via a few different gun magazines.don't even read any!.I would start with reading reviews on something you may like online first,looking at the pros and cons,warranties,reliability and availability of spare magazines and parts for a certain hand gun if you pick a semi-auto.same goes for revolvers if thats your bag.

With the help of the fellow at the counter at the lgs,I was dead set on a certain gun, and it was about $300.00 more than the clone of it that I happened to pick and had a lifetime warranty,that makes a difference with buying ammo,cleaning supplies and any accessories you may want to budget.


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## TLock762x51

I worked at a gun shop for about 2.5 years full time, and another 3 years part time. Maybe I'm weird, but one of the things I most enjoyed was when a customer would come up and tell me that they knew absolutely nothing, or next to nothing, about firearms...but that they had come to the conclusion that it was time to acquire one, or more.

The first thing I would ask was what was the main intended purpose(s) for the gun? Was it to be used for home defense, CCW (generic term for the the concealed carry of a firearm), hunting, purely for plinking and punching holes in paper targets, any combination of these, or all of them? Once we had determined the purpose, I'd always ask if there was another person (husband, wife, BF, GF, S.O., elderly family member or children) who might also be using the firearm. After determining these things, I'd move on to their budget. What was their preferred price range, and what was their maximum? Did they see this as a one-time purchase, or did they anticipate that, if things went well, they might acquire a few other firearms? IOW, did this need to be a "one-gun-does-all", or can we break things down a bit...a .22 for training/plinking, a center-fire handgun for home-defense/CCW, a rifle or shotgun for hunting or for more serious "social encounters"?

At this point, I'd always explain that the firearm itself was just one cost to be considered. There were additional costs...for a home defense handgun, it might be as little as the cost of spare mags/speed-loaders to consider. For a CCW gun, there's also the cost of a quality holster and belt. For rifles, one must consider slings, optics, bi-pods, and a hard or soft sided carry case. For a shotgun, maybe just a sling and carry case, perhaps chokes. For all of these, of course, there is the ever-present cost of ammunition, and a need to safely store/secure the firearm. Also, eye and ear protection are required, and a basic gun cleaning kit.

Lastly (but probably most importantly), especially for a new/inexperienced shooter, safety and instructional classes are also advantageous and well-advised. Some formal training will not only provide a sound foundation for their shooting skills, it will also educate them as to the vitally important safety and gun-handling skills which will keep them and their loved-ones safe. Additionally, if they find an instructor who offers the opportunity to fire a variety of firearms, it may help point them in the right direction as to what type of gun will best suit their needs.

Now, they're often feeling overwhelmed, and having second thoughts about the whole thing. It takes only a moment or two to explain that they don't have to acquire all of these things today, or as soon as they purchase their guns...but simply that they are things of which to be aware. Now, as I present them with different firearm options, I can address these costs with each one...gun "A" might seem a reasonable, inexpensive choice...but the cost and availability of ammo, holsters, magazines, etc. might make it more expensive, in the long run, than gun "B", which has a higher purchase price, but might be a higher quality firearm, with less costly and more available ammo and accessories, and possibly a better warranty.

What this all boiled down to was this...I almost never sold a gun to a new shooter on that first visit. Oh, occasionally I would, but that was the exception. They would usually walk away, armed with the info I'd given them, and with a couple suggestions as to local instructors and/or ranges that rented guns. While it's impossible to prove, I feel fairly certain that quite a few of those customers came back and bought from us. I do know that quite a few new customers would come in, saying that they had a friend who had just started shooting, and that friend recommended that they come see us. I also heard from later employees that people were coming in asking for me by name for years after I had quit working there.

Well, I kinda started blowing my own horn there...wasn't my intention. But the point is, pretty much what *Inor* had posted...a good LGS (local gun shop) can be a great resource for you. The suggestion to try to go when they are not too busy is well made. If you can have some of these answers clear in your mind (intended purpose, budget, more than one gun, etc) before you get there, it can save time. If anyone else might be using the gun, take them along as well, or at least be aware of their physical characteristics/limitations, as opposed to your own.

Sorry this was so lengthy. Perhaps the reason I enjoyed instructing new customers was because I love the sound of my own voice? I guess that might explain why I just got my instructor credentials, as well.

Good luck! Let us know how your search goes, and don't hesitate to ask us more questions. Feel free to PM me with questions, if you'd like.

Tim


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## Inor

TLock762x51 said:


> I worked at a gun shop for about 2.5 years full time, and another 3 years part time. Maybe I'm weird, but one of the things I most enjoyed was when a customer would come up and tell me that they knew absolutely nothing, or next to nothing, about firearms...but that they had come to the conclusion that it was time to acquire one, or more.
> 
> The first thing I would ask was what was the main intended purpose(s) for the gun? Was it to be used for home defense, CCW (generic term for the the concealed carry of a firearm), hunting, purely for plinking and punching holes in paper targets, any combination of these, or all of them? Once we had determined the purpose, I'd always ask if there was another person (husband, wife, BF, GF, S.O., elderly family member or children) who might also be using the firearm. After determining these things, I'd move on to their budget. What was their preferred price range, and what was their maximum? Did they see this as a one-time purchase, or did they anticipate that, if things went well, they might acquire a few other firearms? IOW, did this need to be a "one-gun-does-all", or can we break things down a bit...a .22 for training/plinking, a center-fire handgun for home-defense/CCW, a rifle or shotgun for hunting or for more serious "social encounters"?
> 
> At this point, I'd always explain that the firearm itself was just one cost to be considered. There were additional costs...for a home defense handgun, it might be as little as the cost of spare mags/speed-loaders to consider. For a CCW gun, there's also the cost of a quality holster and belt. For rifles, one must consider slings, optics, bi-pods, and a hard or soft sided carry case. For a shotgun, maybe just a sling and carry case, perhaps chokes. For all of these, of course, there is the ever-present cost of ammunition, and a need to safely store/secure the firearm. Also, eye and ear protection are required, and a basic gun cleaning kit.
> 
> Lastly (but probably most importantly), especially for a new/inexperienced shooter, safety and instructional classes are also advantageous and well-advised. Some formal training will not only provide a sound foundation for their shooting skills, it will also educate them as to the vitally important safety and gun-handling skills which will keep them and their loved-ones safe. Additionally, if they find an instructor who offers the opportunity to fire a variety of firearms, it may help point them in the right direction as to what type of gun will best suit their needs.
> 
> Now, they're often feeling overwhelmed, and having second thoughts about the whole thing. It takes only a moment or two to explain that they don't have to acquire all of these things today, or as soon as they purchase their guns...but simply that they are things of which to be aware. Now, as I present them with different firearm options, I can address these costs with each one...gun "A" might seem a reasonable, inexpensive choice...but the cost and availability of ammo, holsters, magazines, etc. might make it more expensive, in the long run, than gun "B", which has a higher purchase price, but might be a higher quality firearm, with less costly and more available ammo and accessories, and possibly a better warranty.
> 
> What this all boiled down to was this...I almost never sold a gun to a new shooter on that first visit. Oh, occasionally I would, but that was the exception. They would usually walk away, armed with the info I'd given them, and with a couple suggestions as to local instructors and/or ranges that rented guns. While it's impossible to prove, I feel fairly certain that quite a few of those customers came back and bought from us. I do know that quite a few new customers would come in, saying that they had a friend who had just started shooting, and that friend recommended that they come see us. I also heard from later employees that people were coming in asking for me by name for years after I had quit working there.
> 
> Well, I kinda started blowing my own horn there...wasn't my intention. But the point is, pretty much what *Inor* had posted...a good LGS (local gun shop) can be a great resource for you. The suggestion to try to go when they are not too busy is well made. If you can have some of these answers clear in your mind (intended purpose, budget, more than one gun, etc) before you get there, it can save time. If anyone else might be using the gun, take them along as well, or at least be aware of their physical characteristics/limitations, as opposed to your own.
> 
> Sorry this was so lengthy. Perhaps the reason I enjoyed instructing new customers was because I love the sound of my own voice? I guess that might explain why I just got my instructor credentials, as well.
> 
> Good luck! Let us know how your search goes, and don't hesitate to ask us more questions. Feel free to PM me with questions, if you'd like.
> 
> Tim


+10 on that one!


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## DerBiermeister

It's kind of funny, but when TLock started going down his list of expenses, I started going Ka-ching in my head, adding up all the accessories I've bought over the years.

*HOLY CRAP!*


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## Slippy

Firearms are highly addictive. 

By the way, good post Tim.


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## Coolwater

TLOCK762, I absolutely LOVED your story, great information and I love stories, flat out love them. Thank you! You sound like the guy who sold me my first gun; he seemed thrilled yet honest and not pushy, to have a newcomer on guns in his shop. If you know of the Dallas/FtWorth metroplex, he owned "Jim's Guns" on Gus Thomason Rd., but he's retired now. Anyway, thanks a lot.


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## Coolwater

DerBiermeister, thanks for your cool post to Inor's explanation; I knew it was great information and very informative, even at my level of gun intelligence. And thanks again to Inor.


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## Coolwater

Wow, such a wealth of information here - I happen to cherish this in case nobody knows, and I don't deserve such kindness. On the other hand, I want to say that you all seem so sincerely nice and kind, I see wholeheartedly now that being a gun owner can in no way be a bad thing, so count me in as one, hopefully tomorrow! (had to work all day today, no chance). Maybe within a few weeks or months I'll be able to encourage some newby with some wise gun advice. And, just to be silly, when I get "mine", I'll be saying I lost it in the east fork of the trinity river, lol. And seriously, the first thing I want to shoot is a water moccasin! Those things have terrified me my entire life; used to watch my dad shooting at them in the river. Thank you all so much. Now, I want to tell a story, hoping it's not too depressing, but since I'm getting a gun, it's a story I want to tell.


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## Hemi45

Here's my suggestion, watch as many of Hickock45's videos on youtube as you care to (he has about a thousand) to get an idea of what's out there and how it works. This is one of the most 'grandfatherly' guys I've ever seen. Hell, I'd send my own dear Mom to him for shooting lessons if I could!

He has a video out for damn near any gun worth owning - I selected one of my favorites to give you a taste of what he's all about. I certainly wouldn't recommend a 1911 for your first pistol but you can scan through his myriad videos and look at the ones that interest you. Enjoy!


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## DerBiermeister

Hemi45 said:


> Here's my suggestion, watch as many of Hickock45's videos on youtube as you care to (he has about a thousand) to get an idea of what's out there and how it works. This is one of the most 'grandfatherly' guys I've ever seen. Hell, I'd send my own dear Mom to him for shooting lessons if I could!
> 
> He has a video out for damn near any gun worth owning - I selected one of my favorites to give you a taste of what he's all about. I certainly wouldn't recommend a 1911 for your first pistol but you can scan through his myriad videos and look at the ones that interest you. Enjoy!


You know .. HICK is a strong modinker. And he has big hands. An awful lot of that (strength and hands) goes into his shooting prowess. The man is just flat out the best all around shooter I have ever seen. I know there are trick shooters that surpass him, but after watching a hundred or more of his videos over the past few years, he's the one I want next to me when the SHTF.


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## DerBiermeister

Coolwater said:


> DerBiermeister, thanks for your cool post to Inor's explanation; I knew it was great information and very informative, even at my level of gun intelligence. And thanks again to Inor.


Thanks Cool
The small LGS is really a great place to get to know and to learn. Everytime I go in, I end up getting hooked on watching them explain things to customers, so I'm always spending a couple of hours more than I intended. I just kind of hang back and watch. I honestly believe they place the customer's well-being far ahead of profits.


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## Inor

DerBiermeister said:


> Thanks Cool
> The small LGS is really a great place to get to know and to learn. Everytime I go in, I end up getting hooked on watching them explain things to customers, so I'm always spending a couple of hours more than I intended. I just kind of hang back and watch. I honestly believe they place the customer's well-being far ahead of profits.


I always enjoyed going into ours and just chatting with some of the regular customers too. There was a group of 4-5 guys that would go there and hang out every evening. Those guys were almost as helpful as the owner when buying some of our guns. Unfortunately, he had to close his store a few months back because he could not get merchandise to sell.

Now we have a new Cabela's nearby. It is okay, because they have EVERYTHING in stock or can get it in a day or two. But it is not the same as our old LGS.


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## Coolwater

Here's a story about guns in my life:
One day a few years ago my mama walked up and rang the doorbell. When I went out, she was sitting in the porch swing, just sitting there with her head kind of hanging low. I said hi, Ma and went to hug her. She blurted out, "Your little cousin is dead". I said how, are you sure?, car wreck?, etc. Now this cousin was my life-time favorite cousin; we were the two little short hellcats of the family, both highly competitive, had to win at everything we did, from barrel racing to tight-rope walking, always fierce tomboys; looked so much alike, sometimes people said we should have been twins, and we both usually got whippings for being so rambunctious at family gatherings.

Well, her husband had shot her in her sleep, on her pillow, in their bed, just beside her ear. Her forever sweetheart, since they were both 16 years old. We went to her funeral and I stood there looking a minute or so and it dawned on me her head was misshapen and her eye sockets didn't match. Then I noticed her pretty blonde hair, one side shiny and wavy, the side away from me cottony looking, and they seemed to have left makeup into her hairline. Not to alarm her parents or sister, I motioned barely for my husband to come there beside me. Within less than a minute, he nudged me to move, back where the other family members were. I whispered this funeral home should be sued for leaving her looking like that. So, I can be so dense and dumb sometimes. He said more than half her head was gone, and I said but they ruined her hair on one side plus left makeup showing there, and he said it wasn't makeup it was flesh-colored wax, and that half her hair was probably from a wig. He's taller than I am so he could see her head better, plus, sometimes he thinks faster than I do. I actually had to ask him how was half her head gone, and he told me how the bullet had expanded going through her head. 

Well, I went and sat beside her sister. She wasn't crying, just sitting there, and she asked me, "Is that really my sister?" I thought oh no, now she's gone nuts over this. All I could say was yes, and she said, it sure doesn't look like her. So, no moral to this story, except that her husband was out of prison in just under 5 years, probably on some kind of puny insanity plea, and all he ever said was that they had argued over $50. She was 32 years old.


----------



## Inor

That's rough. Sorry.


----------



## Hemi45

That's an awful story and I'm sorry for your loss but the gun didn't murder her. In fact, the argument could be made that if she had her own, her killer might be dead.


----------



## BagLady

I'm so sorry to hear that. It's awful that he pretty much got away with murder. We know someone who lost a beautiful 26 yr old grandaughter the same way.
As Hemi said, it was the hand behind the gun.


----------



## Coolwater

BagLady said:


> I'm so sorry to hear that. It's awful that he pretty much got away with murder. We know someone who lost a beautiful 26 yr old grandaughter the same way.
> As Hemi said, it was the hand behind the gun.


 Thanks Baglady, and I know, it was the hand and messed up mind instead of the gun; same for all murders.  I know too, gun owners/users can't be stupid or careless or nuts in any way. My brother in law who hunts all the time won't even let certain young men go to the hunting sites with them; says they'd be dangerous to have along. When I was a teen and shooting with my dad, one dumb move and he'd say load em up we're going back now; that hurt me so bad so I didn't goof much.


----------



## Denton

Curious. You loved to shoot with your father but know nothing much about weapons.

What did y'all shoot? What did you enjoy shooting?


----------



## Coolwater

We just shot at homemade targets, beercans, sticks propped up on fenceposts, certain clumps of mistletoe; never shot birds or anything. He didn't even shoot much. Just pleasant ways to spend afternoons. It lasted only a few years until I discovered boys and began dating; must have hurt him when I quit going; teens don't always think of things like that.


----------



## Denton

Coolwater said:


> We just shot at homemade targets, beercans, sticks propped up on fenceposts, certain clumps of mistletoe; never shot birds or anything. He didn't even shoot much. Just pleasant ways to spend afternoons. It lasted only a few years until I discovered boys and began dating; must have hurt him when I quit going; teens don't always think of things like that.


My bad. Didn't mean what targets you shot, what were the weapons? Which did you enjoy shooting?


----------



## Slippy

Denton said:


> My bad. Didn't mean what targets you shot, what were the weapons? Which did you enjoy shooting?


Its sort of like when I meet a client out of town (for example in Denver) and he says "What brings you to Denver?" and I say, "The airplane".


----------



## MrsInor

Denton said:


> My bad. Didn't mean what targets you shot, what were the weapons? Which did you enjoy shooting?


Might help you to figure out what kind of gun you might be comfortable with.


----------



## Denton

Slippy said:


> Its sort of like when I meet a client out of town (for example in Denver) and he says "What brings you to Denver?" and I say, "The airplane".


I can relate. My boss thinks I am a smartass. Not true. I am just a lot smarter than him. :lol:


----------



## bigwheel

Coolwater said:


> Here's a story about guns in my life:One day a few years ago my mama walked up and rang the doorbell. When I went out, she was sitting in the porch swing, just sitting there with her head kind of hanging low. I said hi, Ma and went to hug her. She blurted out, "Your little cousin is dead". I said how, are you sure?, car wreck?, etc. Now this cousin was my life-time favorite cousin; we were the two little short hellcats of the family, both highly competitive, had to win at everything we did, from barrel racing to tight-rope walking, always fierce tomboys; looked so much alike, sometimes people said we should have been twins, and we both usually got whippings for being so rambunctious at family gatherings.
> 
> Well, her husband had shot her in her sleep, on her pillow, in their bed, just beside her ear. Her forever sweetheart, since they were both 16 years old. We went to her funeral and I stood there looking a minute or so and it dawned on me her head was misshapen and her eye sockets didn't match. Then I noticed her pretty blonde hair, one side shiny and wavy, the side away from me cottony looking, and they seemed to have left makeup into her hairline. Not to alarm her parents or sister, I motioned barely for my husband to come there beside me. Within less than a minute, he nudged me to move, back where the other family members were. I whispered this funeral home should be sued for leaving her looking like that. So, I can be so dense and dumb sometimes. He said more than half her head was gone, and I said but they ruined her hair on one side plus left makeup showing there, and he said it wasn't makeup it was flesh-colored wax, and that half her hair was probably from a wig. He's taller than I am so he could see her head better, plus, sometimes he thinks faster than I do. I actually had to ask him how was half her head gone, and he told me how the bullet had expanded going through her head.
> 
> Well, I went and sat beside her sister. She wasn't crying, just sitting there, and she asked me, "Is that really my sister?" I thought oh no, now she's gone nuts over this. All I could say was yes, and she said, it sure doesn't look like her. So, no moral to this story, except that her husband was out of prison in just under 5 years, probably on some kind of puny insanity plea, and all he ever said was that they had argued over $50. She was 32 years old.
> .


So sad. I have gave strict orders to be cremated and dumped in the backyard. I aint pleasant to see living let alone deceased. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Prayers of healing headed up for you. None of us are going to get out of here alive unless the Rapture comes soonish. Hang in there. There will be a joyous reunion one Fine Day.


----------



## Coolwater

Denton said:


> My bad. Didn't mean what targets you shot, what were the weapons? Which did you enjoy shooting?


 No, probably my bad; I go too fast. I honestly remember only one in particular, and I think it was a 303 magnum, but might have been a 357 magnum. He had 5 or 6 guns, but the one I remember best would really knock you down when fired if you were not standing properly, plus, he always reminded me to keep it very snug to my shoulder or it would bust up my shoulder. -- Something funny is, one Christmas at my father in law's farm, all the guys were out back shooting a new rifle he had bought. Of all 3 fairly new wives for his sons, he thought I was the funniest; we pulled lots of pranks on each other. Within about an hour, he walked back up to the house and asked me if I wanted to try his new gun. Somehow I sensed it was a prank and was just a little worried, and he said see that clump of mistletoe at 2 o'clock, on the middle oak, that's what I want to see you hit.

New father in law had no idea I had shot a bad kicking gun before, so I had the thought maybe that was the prank; he wanted to see it knock me on my can, and I was wearing a short velvet party dress and heels. Well, I remember the bracing thing dad had taught, and braced very well. We were all lined up about 5 feet out from the front of the garage, about 6 family guys. Sure enough, when I fired that thing, whatever it was, it knocked me back 5 or 6 tiny, very hard steps, all the way back to the garage doors. But I didn't fall and I was shaking a little, but very proud, and the guys looked disappointed. I never knew, but I do remember my mother in law chewing him out for letting me shoot that particular gun.


----------



## Coolwater

bigwheel
bigwheel is online now -- BIGWHEEL, you're the funniest poster I've ever seen. Thanks for the chuckles! :lol:


----------



## MrsInor

Sorry I am having a hard time with this thread and the other one Coolwater started about what guns we all have. For someone who has questions about what gun to get when you have a family (father shooting afternoons for fun) and a father-in-law that has guns and some off the cuff remarks about (paraphrasing here) a 303 or 357 magnum - you certainly are not coming across as being a newbie with guns.

My opinion.


----------



## Denton

I agree. Something is surely amiss. Something has seemed quite wrong from the beginning. 

I don't get sidetracked by stories; I stick to facts and evidence. Sorry, an old line of work is peeping out.


----------



## Deebo

You guys have guns?


----------



## Dubyagee

Nope. No weapons at all.


----------



## hawgrider

MrsInor said:


> Sorry I am having a hard time with this thread and the other one Coolwater started about what guns we all have. For someone who has questions about what gun to get when you have a family (father shooting afternoons for fun) and a father-in-law that has guns and some off the cuff remarks about (paraphrasing here) a 303 or 357 magnum - you certainly are not coming across as being a newbie with guns.
> 
> My opinion.


I keep getting the smell of something under a bridge.


----------



## DerBiermeister

MrsInor said:


> Sorry I am having a hard time with this thread and the other one Coolwater started about what guns we all have. For someone who has questions about what gun to get when you have a family (father shooting afternoons for fun) and a father-in-law that has guns and some off the cuff remarks about (paraphrasing here) a 303 or 357 magnum - you certainly are not coming across as being a newbie with guns.
> 
> My opinion.


Ok .. my opinion. I think she is legit. She shot a few guns as a young teen. She is now ...?? .. but let's assume around 30. She has fleeting memories of a few experiences around guns -- nothing of a real, serious involvement or real training. Her story of her cousin is something that just can't be made up.

As for identifying various guns -- I have several friends who own a LOT of guns (pistols, revolvers, rifles, etc.). Occasionally, we'll spend a few hours handling these beauties and talking about them. Well, within weeks -- let alone many years like Coolwater -- I can't remember exactly what the guns were. Hell, I can't even remember the make.


----------



## Notsoyoung

I think that some of the accusations against Coolwater are borderline both rude and paranoid. Even if she is not what she says she is, and I believe that she is, I don't really see any harm in answering the questions that she is asking. I see allot more harm in answering the questions the guy posted about making some type of jury rigged shotgun out of pressure pipe. When someone comes on here and asks advice on doing something illegal, I think that you are asking for a visit from the authorities is you say anything besides it is illegal and a very bad idea. 

My two cents on some of the comments, first, stick with name brands. I don't mean a specific brand, but one that has a good reputation and that you have heard of. If you are new to firearms, go to the net and check out the manufacturer, model, and look for reviews on the firearm. There are some firearms out there that are pieces of junk. Pawn shops: I as a rule don't buy firearms from a pawn shop. They are not gun smiths and you could be buying a gun that doesn't operate properly and in the worst case, may be dangerous to fire. Gun Shops: Like everything, there are good ones and bad ones. If you find a good one they will answer your questions, try to help you make a selection, and are generally friendly and informative places to hang out. I am fortunate in the gun store I hang out at. It has an indoor and outdoor range, has a classroom for safety, hunting, conceal carry, and advanced firearms classes, does gunsmith work, and is just a friendly place to go to and fire off some rounds.


----------



## Coolwater

Well, and LOL to the paranoids and rude commenters, but I don't even know where to start here to defend my honor. Starters, I'm just an ordinary person who owns no gun whatsoever, yet. Maybe a BB gun leaning up in a closet somewhere. This will be my last mention of guns but would like to say I am going to get one, hopefully today or tomorrow. There are hundreds of things I'd rather speak of here than guns; I had stated once I only asked the question because of a 70 year-old's post about driving from the city only until he ran out of gas and I wondered if he had a gun and couldn't just wait in the car instead of starting out walking.

Now, I am exactly anything I have said I am; I'm a newspaper reporter but I am not doing any kind of expose' about guns. I don't mention guns at all in my work. I'm not after any kind of fame or notoriety; I can create that any day of the week in my work and be reprimanded for it -- it's called sensationalism in reporting, same as for using cliches, which I don't. News work is very hard; very high paying but very hard meeting daily deadlines, goof offs not coming in, playing sick, and loyal ones having to finish up sports stories, murders, wrecks, on and on and on. It's worse when you're the fastest typist there and everybody knows it, worse yet when you have the knowledge of developing film and have to finish up photos too from the big pentaxes and nikons.

I'll keep this short because the whole thing seems a little creepy to me now, too; I have lots more to say but I won't. Will simply say I was once a country girl, born in a little town by the Llano River but have been citified big time for nearly 3 decades, have had 3 separate careers here in Dallas, type over 130 words per minute, and I do indeed love stories but I indeed don't remember what kinds of guns I have shot.

But, I'm in the middle of making a food forest with newspapers of all things, cardboard, all kinds of things for mulch to avoid having to water - permaculture is all about mimicking the floors of forests, and I am into hydroponics and our fall season here is the most glorious and busy time, this and spring, so I'm busy and have not nearly enough preps or knowledge to be at ease.

One little favor to ask, please? Any powers that be, moderators who even might think I'm a weirdo, will you please delete my post about my cousin Ruth Ann? I didn't change names to protect an innocent since she is gone, but in case any of my other cousins join here and might read that story. Please do that for me. And I won't be mentioning guns again.

I've been interrupted 4 times during this, lo and behold, a neighbor is having something delivered and he's not home. I'm having to watch for the delivery truck since I'm holding his house key. Life goes on.


----------



## Denton

OK, let's go back a little so we can understand where you are with regard to this issue....

How old were you when you were shooting the 303 and the 357, which did you shoot most and why? What did you find enjoyable about the firearm?


----------



## DerBiermeister

Coolwater
No problems here.

You definitely have an interesting, but hectic job. Love to hear some of your war stories! ::clapping::


----------



## Coolwater

Denton, I know for sure it was either a 357 magnum or another 3-- number, didn't care at the time and really don't care now. I do know I loved the power of it, not just little holes in the cans, etc., but exploding cans, and here I go again. But my dad was a hilariously fun guy to be with, and that one made us both laugh. He is dead now too, and I have no idea what my mother or brothers did with his guns.


----------



## hawgrider

> I'm a newspaper reporter


 The hairs on the back of my neck are standing straight out. Sorry if I'm wrong but.....

Well gotta go now:shock::lol:


----------



## Coolwater

Oh sorry, had to jump and look out the window again! Age: probably from about 10 to 15 years old. We had 200 acres and lots of really cool places to go shooting.


----------



## Coolwater

DerBiermeister **** Thank you. My best one, here in a super rush, is my night of total burnout. It happens. I didn't know where I was, think I had made it to my car, and I remember a train passing by, and next thing I was aware of was being home and waking up from about a 15 hour sleep; in a total daze. Another super-quick one was nearly being knocked off an overpass, central expressway, one of the few times I was on tv to top it all off. One more, running up to a wreck that just happened, the poor man was off into a deep ditch and I hurried for a couple of photos until I saw the steering column run through his chest. NO pictures, actually shaking climbing back up the hill. Oh so many. I got yanked off the religion page, was doing two churches a week - all that each church had going on, pics and all, for covering a story of an 18-wheeler devoted to God at Truckstops of America, out by big town s/c. Magnificent set up of folding chairs, little party lights inside the trailer, truckers from all over coming in to hear a sermon. Idiot me, had been doing this only a couple of years, and quoted the pastor on his mother praying for burned out light bulbs to come back on and they did, another story of a man who prayed for his washer to work just one more time and it did. ----------- I was pulled immediately for sensationalism, controversial reporting, etc., and got put in charge of the society section. I was punished through all the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays that year, had to report on what all the big wheels in town were doing, serving, for holidays. I begged for my old job back and got it.


----------



## Denton

Coolwater said:


> Denton, I know for sure it was either a 357 magnum or another 3-- number, didn't care at the time and really don't care now. I do know I loved the power of it, not just little holes in the cans, etc., but exploding cans, and here I go again. But my dad was a hilariously fun guy to be with, and that one made us both laugh. He is dead now too, and I have no idea what my mother or brothers did with his guns.


Long gun or pistol?


----------



## Coolwater

Gotta run now, sorry. Denton, please undo my story on my cousin or tell me how, please? Thanks


----------



## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> The hairs on the back of my neck are standing straight out. Sorry if I'm wrong but.....
> 
> Well gotta go now:shock::lol:


What is hilarious is that we do have a comparatively new member to the forum whose posts have made me very suspicious of him, and it's YOU.


----------



## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> What is hilarious is that we do have a comparatively new member to the forum whose posts have made me very suspicious of him, and it's YOU.


Good..... my plan is working then.

Edited : Id certainly like a reference of one of my post that make you ...uneasy LOL


----------



## hawgrider

Bah.. double tap


----------



## ntxwheels

Me thinks Coolwater = crock of sh**


----------



## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> What is hilarious is that we do have a comparatively new member to the forum whose posts have made me very suspicious of him, and it's YOU.


I know I bet it was my pickled egg recipe wasn't it? ....yep that it for sure.:-D


----------



## MrsInor

Coolwater said:


> Well, and LOL to the paranoids and rude commenters, but I don't even know where to start here to defend my honor. Starters, I'm just an ordinary person who owns no gun whatsoever, yet. Maybe a BB gun leaning up in a closet somewhere. This will be my last mention of guns but would like to say I am going to get one, hopefully today or tomorrow. There are hundreds of things I'd rather speak of here than guns; I had stated once I only asked the question because of a 70 year-old's post about driving from the city only until he ran out of gas and I wondered if he had a gun and couldn't just wait in the car instead of starting out walking.
> 
> Now, I am exactly anything I have said I am; I'm a newspaper reporter but I am not doing any kind of expose' about guns. I don't mention guns at all in my work. I'm not after any kind of fame or notoriety; I can create that any day of the week in my work and be reprimanded for it -- it's called sensationalism in reporting, same as for using cliches, which I don't. News work is very hard; very high paying but very hard meeting daily deadlines, goof offs not coming in, playing sick, and loyal ones having to finish up sports stories, murders, wrecks, on and on and on. It's worse when you're the fastest typist there and everybody knows it, worse yet when you have the knowledge of developing film and have to finish up photos too from the big pentaxes and nikons.
> 
> I'll keep this short because the whole thing seems a little creepy to me now, too; I have lots more to say but I won't. Will simply say I was once a country girl, born in a little town by the Llano River but have been citified big time for nearly 3 decades, have had 3 separate careers here in Dallas, type over 130 words per minute, and I do indeed love stories but I indeed don't remember what kinds of guns I have shot.
> 
> But, I'm in the middle of making a food forest with newspapers of all things, cardboard, all kinds of things for mulch to avoid having to water - permaculture is all about mimicking the floors of forests, and I am into hydroponics and our fall season here is the most glorious and busy time, this and spring, so I'm busy and have not nearly enough preps or knowledge to be at ease.
> 
> One little favor to ask, please? Any powers that be, moderators who even might think I'm a weirdo, will you please delete my post about my cousin Ruth Ann? I didn't change names to protect an innocent since she is gone, but in case any of my other cousins join here and might read that story. Please do that for me. And I won't be mentioning guns again.
> 
> I've been interrupted 4 times during this, lo and behold, a neighbor is having something delivered and he's not home. I'm having to watch for the delivery truck since I'm holding his house key. Life goes on.


You can edit your own post. You don't need a mod to do that.


----------



## Coolwater

Thank you, and a moderator just told me how to delete it, but said it was frowned upon here and affects anyone else's comments to it. Guess I'll just hope it goes away with time.


----------



## MrsInor

You could edit the post and just delete her name.


----------



## Coolwater

Denton said:


> OK, let's go back a little so we can understand where you are with regard to this issue....
> 
> How old were you when you were shooting the 303 and the 357, which did you shoot most and why? What did you find enjoyable about the firearm?


 Denton, I have my buddy hubby here now, watching out the bay window for neighbor's delivery, lol. But he's a storehouse of info. Here goes on what he knows about my dad's guns: The one I liked shooting was an "Army Issue" 303, and he says the magnum deal was with the shells ... ? Greek to me. And his dad's new gun was a 10 gauge shotgun. Now he just asked me, "why? are you gonna kill someone over a can of pork and beans?" Ahh, life in the fast lane (cliche'), but, now the door on me wanting a gun is wide open so all is good. When I had once said he helps me prep, I should have only said he is my carrier of heavy things, lol. NOW, he just said I should be able to get any kind I want for around $300. LOL, maybe I am a weirdo.


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater said:


> Thank you, and a moderator just told me how to delete it, but said it was frowned upon here and affects anyone else's comments to it. Guess I'll just hope it goes away with time.


What post are you referring? I must have missed it.


----------



## Coolwater

MrsInor said:


> You could edit the post and just delete her name.


 MrsInor, thank you, but I'll bet I can't edit a post where a sweet guy quoted the whole story, can I?


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater said:


> Denton, I have my buddy hubby here now, watching out the bay window for neighbor's delivery, lol. But he's a storehouse of info. Here goes on what he knows about my dad's guns: The one I liked shooting was an "Army Issue" 303, and he says the magnum deal was with the shells ... ? Greek to me. And his dad's new gun was a 10 gauge shotgun. Now he just asked me, "why? are you gonna kill someone over a can of pork and beans?" Ahh, life in the fast lane (cliche'), but, now the door on me wanting a gun is wide open so all is good. When I had once said he helps me prep, I should have only said he is my carrier of heavy things, lol. NOW, he just said I should be able to get any kind I want for around $300. * LOL, maybe I am a weirdo*.


----------



## Coolwater

Slippy said:


> What post are you referring? I must have missed it.


 Slippy, I told the story of my cousin being shot in her sleep and used her name -- I thought no harm since she's dead. Now I'm thinking if this might be a new site and some of my other cousins might join and read that, I want to delete now for that reason, but someone had already commented on it and quoted it.


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater said:


> Slippy, I told the story of my cousin being shot in her sleep and used her name -- I thought no harm since she's dead. Now I'm thinking if this might be a new site and some of my other cousins might join and read that, I want to delete now for that reason, but someone had already commented on it and quoted it.


Sorry CoolH20, I must have missed it. I rarely read any post over a few paragraphs...But sounds like you've got yourself in a pickle. You've stepped in some doo doo







and need some help cleaning it up right?









Well I'm just like the Harvey Kietel Character in Pulp Fiction. If you got a dead hmmm...person...in the car in the garage, I'll help you clean it up

Click on EDIT POST and start deleting







then click SAVE. WaaLaa. Dead person cleaned from car in garage.


----------



## MrsInor

Edit your post and one of us mods will edit the copy.


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater,

Just in case you didn't see Pulp Fiction and not familiar with The Wolf;


----------



## Coolwater

MrsInor said:


> Edit your post and one of us mods will edit the copy.


 Wow, thank you so much!


----------



## Coolwater

Ok did it MrsInor, thanks. One more comment here then I'm through with comments on guns. Husband said my cousin was shot with a 45.


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater said:


> Ok did it MrsInor, thanks. One more comment here then I'm through with comments on guns. Husband said my cousin was shot with a 45.


Damn
A .45 makes a huge ass hole! Is she OK?


----------



## MrsInor

Slippy said:


> Damn
> A .45 makes a huge ass hole! Is she OK?


Slippy you been drinking again? Or didn't you read the whole thread?


----------



## Coolwater

Slippy said:


> Damn
> A .45 makes a huge ass hole! Is she OK?


 Slippy, she's my cousin who was murdered while she slept. At her funeral it didn't even look like her anymore, and my husband said they had rebuilt her head with wax. He also said that one side of her hair was glued on blonde hair from a wig. Here I go again, but want to ask, could anybody survive being shot with a 45?


----------



## Slippy

MrsInor said:


> Slippy you been drinking again? Or didn't you read the whole thread?


Answer to Q1-Cough Syrup and Benydryl, but nothing stronger. I know they counter-act each other but I've never been one to UNDER-Medicate if you know what I mean. I'm a bit under the weather. (Advice to the children; Read the Directions on all medicine.

Answer to Q2-Yes and No, I struggled to read some of the posts but many of them were painful and since I had a headache I stopped. Then I saw where CoolH20 needed some stuff cleaned up and tried to help with a nice little video from Pulp Fiction. 

Did I do good?


----------



## MrsInor

I am shocked, shocked I tell you. I never knew Slippy was a druggie.


----------



## Slippy

Coolwater said:


> Slippy, she's my "FRIEND" who was murdered while she slept. At her funeral it didn't even look like her anymore, and my "SPOUSE" said they had rebuilt her head with wax. He also said that one side of her hair was glued on "LIGHT COLORED" hair from a wig. Here I go again, but want to ask, could anybody survive being shot with a 45?


Oh shit! 
I'm sorry. I didn't know. Why in the world did they have a Viewing? 
As far as being shot with a .45, I guess it depends on where one is shot. If like your "FRIEND", you take a .45 acp in the head or chest... well you're probably gonna end up in a casket for sure.
If you take one in the foot, you might make it but I think you'd fall down and the person shooting you would finish you off in the head or chest. I would.
I hope I was helpful

Before my firearms fell victim to Mother Mother Ocean, I carried these rounds in my .45


----------



## DerBiermeister

Coolwater said:


> MrsInor, thank you, but I'll bet I can't edit a post where a sweet guy quoted the whole story, can I?


Send the guy a PM and ask him to delete or edit the specific post.


----------



## MrsInor

Already edited.


----------



## hawgrider

So Looks like notsoyoung isn't going to provide a reference to the post/posts that make me a suspicious character. Why am I not suprised ....... 
What ever you do notsoyoung don't add the allspice until the eggs float or the whole jar will explode. Now you cant say I didn't warn you.


----------



## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> So Looks like notsoyoung isn't going to provide a reference to the post/posts that make me a suspicious character. Why am I not suprised .......
> What ever you do notsoyoung don't add the allspice until the eggs float or the whole jar will explode. Now you cant say I didn't warn you.


Here you go ace, just a few.
" Certainly are a lot of misconceptions about Free Masons. My Grandfathers, father are 32nd degree Mason's Don't believe everything your hearing. Most people get there undies in a bunch for nothing.... "
"Thread: More coffee club crap than prep/survival talk"
"And your an expert at being a dick. I have 35 years experience in the mechanical fields of electrical, plumbing, HVAC, boilers, absorption chillers, centrifugal chillers so yeah I might know a..."
"I'm confused is this facebook? Drama:roll"

It makes me wonder when someone comes onto the forum and spends so much time attacking others..... plus I don't trust anyone who sticks up for the Masons, and my Grandfather and three of my uncles were Masons. While you are so busy attacking and proclaiming to anyone who will listen not to trust Coolwater for asking questions because she is new to firearms you make me much more suspicious of you then her. .


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## MrsInor

Turtle. Take it to PM's you two.


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## Notsoyoung

Coolwater said:


> Slippy, she's my cousin who was murdered while she slept. At her funeral it didn't even look like her anymore, and my husband said they had rebuilt her head with wax. He also said that one side of her hair was glued on blonde hair from a wig. Here I go again, but want to ask, could anybody survive being shot with a 45?


Yes, someone could survive being shot with a .45. There is an old saying about shot placement being more important then the caliber. Basically that means it depends on where she was hit. The thing with a caliber like the .45 is that it does allot of damage so placement isn't as critical as a smaller caliber to a slighter degree. There have been people who have actually survived getting hit a .50 cal, but that is usually because they got hit somewhere like a leg and someone put a tourniquet on their stump before they bled out. As for a .45 to the head, someone has probably survived it, but I have never heard of one.


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## hawgrider

Since I can't reply here. I'll simply say I'm flattered you care. Nice to make a new friend:twisted:


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## Denton

Notsoyoung said:


> Yes, someone could survive being shot with a .45. There is an old saying about shot placement being more important then the caliber. Basically that means it depends on where she was hit. The thing with a caliber like the .45 is that it does allot of damage so placement isn't as critical as a smaller caliber to a slighter degree. There have been people who have actually survived getting hit a .50 cal, but that is usually because they got hit somewhere like a leg and someone put a tourniquet on their stump before they bled out. As for a .45 to the head, someone has probably survived it, but I have never heard of one.


I have heard of someone who survived a .45 to the head. He has a tattoo on his head that says, "#$/k the .45"


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## ntxwheels

I am so damned glad I wear high topped boots. It's deep as crap in here!


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## Denton

It was in a gun magazine about 20 or so years ago. Pictures and all.

You calling a gun magazine a place of false information?


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## ntxwheels

Denton said:


> It was in a gun magazine about 20 or so years ago. Pictures and all.
> 
> You calling a gun magazine a place of false information?


No. I'm saying this entire thread horse sh**, just as coolwater is.


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## Denton

ntxwheels said:


> No. I'm saying this entire thread horse sh**, just as coolwater is.


Whew! Good. Call me a liar and all is good. Bad mouth gun mags, on the other hand.....


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## dannydefense

Denton said:


> Whew! Good. Call me a liar and all is good. Bad mouth gun mags, on the other hand.....


Guns&Ammo is a liberal rag.


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## Slippy

ntxwheels said:


> No. I'm saying this entire thread horse sh**, just as coolwater is.


Hell,
I tried my best to liven it up! Must be losing my touch.


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## Hemi45

denton said:


> whew! Good. Call me a liar and all is good. Bad mouth gun mags, on the other hand.....


lol!!!


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## Notsoyoung

Denton said:


> I have heard of someone who survived a .45 to the head. He has a tattoo on his head that says, "#$/k the .45"


At first glance I would say "no way" but when you hear something like that you assume that if was a regular load and the distance was about 5 feet. But when you consider all of the factors, maybe the round had already gone through something or was nearly spent when it hit and only went in and inch or two, or maybe it hit at an angle and just barely clipped the brain, then there are factors that would make it possible. Maybe not likely, but possible. As for the tattoo on the forehead.... someone needed to shoot him again.


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## Hemi45

OMG ... if the X Flies and Twilight Zone had a lovechild, this thread would be it!


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## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> At first glance I would say "no way" but when you hear something like that you assume that if was a regular load and the distance was about 5 feet. But when you consider all of the factors, maybe the round had already gone through something or was nearly spent when it hit and only went in and inch or two, or maybe it hit at an angle and just barely clipped the brain, then there are factors that would make it possible. Maybe not likely, but possible. As for the tattoo on the forehead.... someone needed to shoot him again.


A "regular load" You mean a 230 grain ball round? Lmao


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## Inor

Coolwater said:


> DerBiermeister **** Thank you. My best one, here in a super rush, is my night of total burnout. It happens. I didn't know where I was, think I had made it to my car, and I remember a train passing by, and next thing I was aware of was being home and waking up from about a 15 hour sleep; in a total daze. Another super-quick one was nearly being knocked off an overpass, central expressway, one of the few times I was on tv to top it all off. One more, running up to a wreck that just happened, the poor man was off into a deep ditch and I hurried for a couple of photos until I saw the steering column run through his chest. NO pictures, actually shaking climbing back up the hill. Oh so many. I got yanked off the religion page, was doing two churches a week - all that each church had going on, pics and all, for covering a story of an 18-wheeler devoted to God at Truckstops of America, out by big town s/c. Magnificent set up of folding chairs, little party lights inside the trailer, truckers from all over coming in to hear a sermon. Idiot me, had been doing this only a couple of years, and quoted the pastor on his mother praying for burned out light bulbs to come back on and they did, another story of a man who prayed for his washer to work just one more time and it did. ----------- I was pulled immediately for sensationalism, controversial reporting, etc., and got put in charge of the society section. I was punished through all the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays that year, had to report on what all the big wheels in town were doing, serving, for holidays. I begged for my old job back and got it.


If somebody came to me and said "Inor, is it possible to write a single paragraph that includes sleeping for 15 hours, trains, being knocked off an overpass, being impaled by a car, an 18 wheeler devoted to God, folding chairs, party lights and praying for a washing machine"?

My response would emphatically be "Not without suffering a brain aneurysm!"

And that is why you are the professional.


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## Arklatex

Inor said:


> If somebody came to me and said "Inor, is it possible to write a single paragraph that includes sleeping for 15 hours, trains, being knocked off an overpass, being impaled by a car, an 18 wheeler devoted to God, folding chairs, party lights and praying for a washing machine"?
> 
> My response would emphatically be "Not without suffering a brain aneurysm!"
> 
> And that is why you the professional.


Add beer, jail, and momma and you will have the perfect country and western song!


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## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> A "regular load" You mean a 230 grain ball round? Lmao


Ever see ammo at the store marked "range"? That means that it is a low velocity round that has a lighter "load" (that black stuff called gun powder) instead of a load that would give the bullet the standard velocity that 230gn FMJ military round calls for. The load and bullet weight are two different things. Most hand loaders and regular shooters understand the term, sorry if it confused you. LMAO.


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## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> Ever see ammo at the store marked "range"? That means that it is a low velocity round that has a lighter "load" (that black stuff called gun powder) instead of a load that would give the bullet the standard velocity that 230gn FMJ military round calls for. The load and bullet weight are two different things. Most hand loaders and regular shooters understand the term, sorry if it confused you. LMAO.


Nope its not marked "range"..... they call that "target" LMAO


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## Slippy

Arklatex said:


> Add beer, jail, and momma and you will have the perfect country and western song!


"I was drunk the day my mama got out of prison and I went to pick her up in the rain..."


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## Arklatex

Slippy said:


> "I was drunk the day my mama got out of prison and I went to pick her up in the rain..."


But before I could get to the station in my pickup truck, she got runned over by a danged ole train.


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## Slippy

I've always enjoyed using the word "runned" over.


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## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> Nope its not marked "range"..... they call that "target" LMAO


I have seen both, and have a box of Winchester .45 marked "range" on it on my closet.....once again "load" and bullet weight are two different things. Sorry if it confuses you LMAO


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## Inor

And it spills into the street...


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## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> I have seen both, and have a box of Winchester .45 marked "range" on it on my closet.....once again "load" and bullet weight are two different things. Sorry if it confuses you LMAO


Oh you burn the quality ammo eh! got yourself some clean burn WWB whatever keep trying......


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## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> Oh you burn the quality ammo eh! got yourself some clean burn WWB whatever keep trying......


What has the fact that I have a box of Winchester ammo in my closet got to do with anything?


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## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> What has the fact that I have a box of Winchester ammo in my closet got to do with anything?


 I dunno but you brought it up guess its about the same as a news reporter trolling you for gun information. I can see the headlines- Infiltrated preppers main headquarters. They are nuts and they have guns oh my!


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## Mish

Sorry the other thread was closed before I could add this. hehe


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## Notsoyoung

hawgrider said:


> I dunno but you brought it up guess its about the same as a news reporter trolling you for gun information. I can see the headlines- Infiltrated preppers main headquarters. They are nuts and they have guns oh my!


What kind of gun information is she asking about? Did she ask anyone if they had illegal firearms? Did she ask anyone how many firearms they own? Did she ask anyone if they want to or are looking forward to killing people? Would anyone here be stupid enough to tell her if they did? If she was trying to "trap" anyone would she say she was a reporter? She was asking some pretty basic questions about firearms. Are ALL reporters anti-gun? What kind of reporter is she? Could it be that it is just as she says and she is concerned about her personal safety? If we are going to be paranoid about folks, should we be paranoid about motor cycle riders because maybe they belong to a motor cycle gang and are just trying to find out where we live so that they can raid our homes for food and weapons? We had a poster on the forum recently saying that a member of a motor cycle gang is planning on robbing preppers if the SHTF, so should we put all motor cycle riders on ignore?

I will do my best to answer basic firearms questions from anyone who asks, and until proven otherwise I will believe their motives are what they say they are. In this case, if it is someone looking for a new story, the way I look at it, they can get their facts from us or they can go to someone like Bloomburg for it. Just don't embellish things.


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## Mish




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## hawgrider

Notsoyoung said:


> What kind of gun information is she asking about? Did she ask anyone if they had illegal firearms? Did she ask anyone how many firearms they own? Did she ask anyone if they want to or are looking forward to killing people? Would anyone here be stupid enough to tell her if they did? If she was trying to "trap" anyone would she say she was a reporter? She was asking some pretty basic questions about firearms. Are ALL reporters anti-gun? What kind of reporter is she? Could it be that it is just as she says and she is concerned about her personal safety? If we are going to be paranoid about folks, should we be paranoid about motor cycle riders because maybe they belong to a motor cycle gang and are just trying to find out where we live so that they can raid our homes for food and weapons? We had a poster on the forum recently saying that a member of a motor cycle gang is planning on robbing preppers if the SHTF, so should we put all motor cycle riders on ignore?
> 
> I will do my best to answer basic firearms questions from anyone who asks, and until proven otherwise I will believe their motives are what they say they are. In this case, if it is someone looking for a new story, the way I look at it, they can get their facts from us or they can go to someone like Bloomburg for it. Just don't embellish things.





> *Does everyone here own guns? Rifles, Pistols?


Nuff said.


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## Notsoyoung

Does everyone here own guns? Rifles, Pistols?[/QUOTE] Nuff said.[/QUOTE]

If you are thinking of becoming a prepper, would one of your questions be whether or not you should be armed and if so, what type of firearm? I don't know how many times we've had debates on what type of firearms you should have if the SHTF. It is possibly one of the most common questions that new preppers ask. IMO it would be more suspicious if she DIDN'T mention anything about firearms. Did she ask how many firearms everybody owns? Did she ask about fully automatic firearms? No. She asked a basic and common question. Start a new thread asking people if the SHTF what is the one firearm they will have with them, and then sit back an watch as the thread fills page after page.


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## TG

Slippy said:


> "I was drunk the day my mama got out of prison and I went to pick her up in the rain..."


Lyrical


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## MrsInor

Again - TURTLE. Take it to PM's. Or better yet put each other on ignore.


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## hawgrider

MrsInor said:


> Again - TURTLE. Take it to PM's. Or better yet put each other on ignore.


Yes ma'am.


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## Coolwater

Just a couple of things to say this a.m.; I'm in a hurry again. Mainly, I'm so thankful I had no new PM's! And wonderful thanks to kind members here who don't think I'm some kind of spy, especially grateful to msinor, inor, notsoyoung (several thanks to notsoyoung!), slippy, and a few others - my eyes hurt this morning from working most of night on some small do do hitting a small fan in the big d.

A special note to hawgrider: news reporting is very rewarding, something that gets into your blood and doesn't go away, something different each am and each pm and always "live action". If you might possibly be a people person, you might give it a try. Start with selling a few interesting photos you might take while on your rides. Papers always need fillers and pay good $$ for interesting photos plus, if the editor likes your style, he'll tell you what he would like to have; gives you an incentive to take more and sell more, and soon you'll get to see your name in lights. Just keep the pics timely, don't try to sell 4th of july pics at thanksgiving. And use ordinary words, speech, nobody wants to have to figure out words in each sentence, ie, saying you have a propensity for people is trying to act smart, just say people person or like people.

One more then I gotta run again. Are we allowed to say asshole here if we don't name the person? Just curious because of a certain fellow texan I'm truly sorry to think the thought that we might be inhaling in the same wonderful breezes.


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## TG

I say the word asshole a lot because this is one of the few English "bad" words that I'm comfortable with. Do so cautiously and try to stick to private messaging as much as you can


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## Denton

Back to the general topic...

Was the weapon a rifle or a handgun. What about the weapon did you find enjoyable? What about the weapon did you find difficult and not so enjoyable?

What do you intend to do with a weapon?


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## DerBiermeister

It is time to put a stop to this silly nonsense -- the subtle accusing of Coolwater being a troll. Some of you people are just flat out paranoid. I know people, I am a good judge of character -- hell, I ought to be after 71 years. Coolwater is a welcome addition to our family .. one man's opinion.


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## Denton

DerBiermeister said:


> It is time to put a stop to this silly nonsense -- the subtle accusing of Coolwater being a troll. Some of you people are just flat out paranoid. I know people, I am a good judge of character -- hell, I ought to be after 71 years. Coolwater is a welcome addition to our family .. one man's opinion.


Another man's opinion - Wow! You are OLD! :lol:


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## Inor

DerBiermeister said:


> hell, I ought to be after 71 years.


Hey Beer Man -

Did you see the world in color when you were a kid or was it all black and white like we see in the photos? :lol:

(Sorry just messin' with ya to break the tension.)


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## DerBiermeister

Denton said:


> Another man's opinion - Wow! You are OLD! :lol:


Shoot (no pun intended) --- YOU GOT THAT RIGHT!


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## Mish




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## DerBiermeister

Inor said:


> Hey Beer Man -
> 
> Did you see the world in color when you were a kid or was it all black and white like we see in the photos? :lol:


Speaking of that ... I just watched a GREAT movie in black and white. "Nebraska". If you ain't seen it, you are behind the times. :grin:


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## 7052

Coolwater, don't be too down on "old guns". Yes, sometimes they are broken, work out, and/or dangerous. Other times, they're perfectly fine. People may laugh, but I still use my Grandfather's Winchester Model-12 shotgun when I go trap shooting. It was manufactured in 1926, and she still look great, and shoots like a dream. WAY smoother action than my Remington 870. Yes she's heavier, and yes she is a bit longer (30" barrel I believe), but she knocks birds out of the sky all day long.


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## turbo6

Whatever you end up getting make sure it's something that YOU want, not what a salesman wants to sell you. 

When buying my first gun I thought long and hard about what I wanted, what it's purpose would be and what I'd expect it to be capable of. 

I figured out the price point, read endless reviews, weighed the pros and cons and confidently walked out with what I settled on was the perfect pistol for my needs.

Best of luck. :thumbup:


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## Hemi45

One more thing to bear in mind; it's a gun not a marriage, child or some other huge commitment. If you change your mind, sell it (or don't ) then buy the next one. Rinse, repeat until you get it dialed in. I've parted with many guns over the years. I didn't keep my first one for more than six months IIRC. Almost twenty years later, I finally have a great, albeit humble, collection. Sure, there are a couple I'd like to add but for the first time, nothing I'd like to get rid of. Of course, I like guns but have friends that haven't bought (or sold) anything in many years. I also have about six pairs of shoes while my wife has about sixty ... different interests.


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