# How will you turn Friends away....this is a hard one.



## vulf (Feb 8, 2013)

Many of my Friends know I Prep and know my Home is in a great location when SHTF, and so many don't Prep at all let alone own a flashlight.

What will you say to the ones that come that you can't keep or help, this gives me a sick feeling in my gut when I think about it. I can talk all the Macho I want but its gonna be hard either way.


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## SARGE7402 (Nov 18, 2012)

Just remember we all deep down in our souls believe that things will get better and back to normal after a SHTF event. Those that you turned away will remember and probably seek payback. Also remember that no matter how well prepared you think you are, no one or single family can go it alone for more than a short while. You are going to need others (like doctors or dentists, or chicken farmers or dairymen) just to name a few. Far better for a small community (Village is what we called our commuinities in the town i grew up in) to band together and and ride out the bad times. We are all stronger when we work together than when we try and go it alone. Don't get me wrong, I've got my farm and a basic stock pile of goods and tools etc, but


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## Dr. Prepper (Dec 20, 2012)

Vulf - to me, the best time to start discussing your prep-sharing limitations with your family, friends, and neighbors is TODAY. Do not wait until it's crisis time. But first you also must make up your own mind, on no uncertain terms, what you want to do. Do you want everyone to come to your house? Do you want only certain ones to come? Do you want nobody to come? Make up your mind and stick to it. There are pros and cons to any decision you make but only YOU can make that call.

Don't be timid with your notification. Just tell your people your intentions straight up and let them do with it what they want. Let them know that your decision is not up for discussion. Depending upon what type of emergency situation your decision could mean life or death to you and your immediate family.

You're faced with a big decision - make that decision and move on. Indecision will cause long ranging problems for you and your friends and family.


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## usmc0311 (Jan 15, 2013)

I have thought about this as well. I was always taught it is about the team, not the individual, so in a way I would want to help. However, can you really prep for all of your friends too? I prep for my family, and my supplies are to sustain us in case SHTF. To a point I think it would be hard to say no, however I look at my family and would rather feed my kids, than a friend who failed to prep. I do however have a few select friends and we have contingency plans, so I would have a few of them with me, or close to me, but turning someone away would be tough, and hard to answer...great question.


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## bennettvm (Jan 5, 2013)

Mentioned this in another post - I have so few friends - and the ones I have would all be able to contribute - they are military or law enforcement and one doctor, and these are people I have known a minimum of 20+ years.

Casual acquaintances? No chance they are coming into my house.


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## Old Man (Dec 10, 2012)

oswegoscott said:


> Horse manure. You're going to jeopardize your family's food and security because someone you turn away MAY remember in a year or 5 or 10??


I agree. If your worry about you friends, then they need to start their prep's or start helping with yours. Remmeber the twiligth show the the bunker. The friends turn into animals. Your friends may not be friends when the SHTF!


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## Chipper (Dec 22, 2012)

I think it's more of a level of friendship for me. 
Friends I can call right "NOW" and they would drop whatever they are doing and come over and help me. Will be helped.
Friends that just say Hi. Will come over for a party etc. Mysteriously won't answer the phone when they know something is up. Only hear from when "they" need something. Well they are on there own. 
People that won't take NO for a answer will be dealt with in a very harsh manor if need be. I don't care if they have a problem and want to try and seek revenge later. "Friends" that know me won't be that foolish. It's there own fault they aren't ready and I won't risk my families safety for some idiot.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

Long ago and far away I learned not to let anyone become a good friend and get close to me.
Today I have aquaintances, but only one neighbor would rise to the level of me sharing stuff with - and it just so happens he's an old Southeast Asia hand himself. Imagine that!:mrgreen:


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## Pir8fan (Nov 16, 2012)

In a SHTF scenario, friends and family (other than my immediate family) would have to bring some resources or serious skills to the table. Otherwise, they would be sent on their way.


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## AquaHull (Jun 10, 2012)

My only friend I have, is someone downstate near DeToilet, I've known him 30 years , he has guns and ammo. His family is down there , so there he stays. They may all come up here but I doubt it.


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## miho (Jun 10, 2012)

I would prob hand out a ziploc sandwish bag with rice and one with beans and give the sad puppy eyes and say sorry i can't do more. to family .... well my family are my kids and they come first.my ex and his family they can starve for all i care or if they got any useful skills i might make em work for food but thats a big maybe .


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

It is amaizing to me how many people have no preperation of any kind, my dad for instance 80 years old, has no food of any kind in his house and depends on SS checks to eat out at the local resterant one or two times a day. My sisters family of four has cat, dog and horse food, but no groceries, likely enough for three days at any time.

I have tried to convey the message by explaining, people buy, health, life, car, home, dental, optical, insurance.

But they will not make a decision to keep a few hundred in food and water insurance on hand.

An education is the most expensive thing you will ever gain. You can lead a horse, well you know the saying.

The way that I intend to turn away family and friends in a real no bull shit SHTF situation, GTFO, followed by self explanitory, vulgar display of power.


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

If it actually comes down to WROL (without rule of law) does anyone really believe that someone who has not even made the attempt to secure food and other stuff could be depended upon in a firefight?
It's not anything like the movies.


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

vulf said:


> Many of my Friends know I Prep and know my Home is in a great location when SHTF, and so many don't Prep at all let alone own a flashlight.
> 
> What will you say to the ones that come that you can't keep or help, this gives me a sick feeling in my gut when I think about it. I can talk all the Macho I want but its gonna be hard either way.


Define friends, I have about 15 people I call friends and that might be overestimating the number. There's 4 guys I've known since I was about 6 or 7 that I would do anything for, they can have the shirt off my back. There's maybe 5 or 6 guys at work who's hands I'd put my life in (and have). Anyone else that shows up is on their own. All of those people possess skills that would be particularly useful in a survival situation also so having them around is a no brainer.

-Infidel


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## dwight55 (Nov 9, 2012)

South East Asia taught me that no man is an island, . . . and if we are going to get through this, . . . it WILL BE a team effort. Rambo won all the wars on the silver screen, but his lard butt would not have lasted 30 seconds in the middle of a true fire fight.

I don't have much, . . . certainly not enough to feed my whole neighborhood for months on end, . . . but we will get through it together, . . . or not at all.

I respect everyone else's feelings, . . . but some day I will have to give account for my life on Terra Firma, . . . no matter how long or short the stay here, . . . and I'd kinda like that account to be favorable to me.

Running off the riff raff, thieves, etc. is one scenario, . . . turning away a starving friend is another. I'll do the first, . . . but hell will be frozen about 6 feet deep and the devil will be handing out ice cream cones in 27 flavors before I'll do the second one.

May God bless,
Dwight


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## Verteidiger (Nov 16, 2012)

Here is my philosophy on the issue of friends showing up.

Back in the Sixties, for those of you who remember back then (I was just a boy), there used to be a bumper sticker that said "Ass, gas, or grass, no one rides for free" that usually was placed on the bumpers of multi-colored vans that were mobile party vehicles ("sin bins"). In other words, you could ride, but you better bring something to the party with you, or your a$$ is walking.

If my friends show up, and they are toting their gear, and they want to join forces, I will welcome them in. If they come begging, and have a good reason why, I might let them slide. If they come begging and they are looking for handouts, I am going to turn them away. There will be no place for freeloaders in my life then, just like there is no place for them in my life now.


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## Meangreen (Dec 6, 2012)

I started my career in law enforcement for two reasons, I wanted to protect America and I wanted to help people. I have saved entire families from death. The most memorable was a polish family robbed and left to die by smugglers in 115 degree heat in the west desert. They wouldn't have made it if I hadn't found them. It's the one feeling that keeps me going at a job that I increasingly hate. I won't endanger my family but I won't turn good people away without helping them. I keep increasing my preps and include small survival packs that I will give out if it's all I can do. I will help so that others may live.


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## Lucky Jim (Sep 2, 2012)

vulf said:


> Many of my friends know i prep.....What will you say to the ones that come that you can't keep or help, this gives me a sick feeling in my gut when I think about it. I can talk all the Macho I want but its gonna be hard either way.


A friend who comes trying to leech off you is no friend..
Our cycling club once entered a 100-mile Endurance Ride in midwinter but to my disgust many of my clubmates kept coming up trying to beg food and drink off me because they hadn't bothered to fill a small rucksack like i had (dumb shits), so i told them "Sorry i can't help, i've only got enough for myself", and they were dropping out like flies all round the course, and only me and a few others pedalled on to complete the distance.
I'm partly to blame because before the start I was stupidly showing my ruck full of stuff around, no wonder they descended on me like vultures later on.
The moral?- maybe we shouldn't tell our friends and neighbours that we're preppers, because when it hits the fan they'll come hammering on our door to be sheltered and fed.

These stills from a Twilight Zone episode called 'The Shelter' explore the theme nicely-

1_- A happy neighbourhood birthday party, what could possibly go wrong?
2- Radio announcer- "Incoming enemy missiles. get in your shelters!"
3- "Lemme in, I'm your mate"......."F*ck you Jack!"
4- "None of us have got a shelter, let's bust into his!"
5- Radio announcer-"False alarm"
6- "Get out of my house you motherf*ckers!"_


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

I watched the entire episode on you tube.

Man this was really well done. Very tame for the era. Our time, it won't be this tame.


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

This is how I feel. Plus I need people. I'm hoping to find ranch hands, people that can hold their own and help me to protect ourselves, property and ideally crops. Having small packages to hand out can help determine how a recipient will respond. If they offer their help, labor or anything valuable in return then we might be able to build on that...particularly if I know them from before SHTF.



Meangreen said:


> I started my career in law enforcement for two reasons, I wanted to protect America and I wanted to help people. I have saved entire families from death. The most memorable was a polish family robbed and left to die by smugglers in 115 degree heat in the west desert. They wouldn't have made it if I hadn't found them. It's the one feeling that keeps me going at a job that I increasingly hate. I won't endanger my family but I won't turn good people away without helping them. I keep increasing my preps and include small survival packs that I will give out if it's all I can do. I will help so that others may live.


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## Deebo (Oct 27, 2012)

Im not sure yet, If they were my friends, they are alrteady preppers, or at least starters, all have guns, and 4 wheel drive trucks.
Regarding "aquantances" I like the idea of offering a small pack, and will think about supllying some in my ever groing stash, but youve also got to remember "the ant and the grasshopper", and I guess It all boils down to EXACTLY what you have "after" the shit goes down. I will never walk so someone else can drive my truck.


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## Deebo (Oct 27, 2012)

And yes, Ripon, I think I would give most people some help, and see what they offer in return. Only if it isnt taking from my kids or my fiance.


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## Scotty12 (Jan 5, 2013)

I don't have enough friends to worry about now that I sobered up.


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## Scotty12 (Jan 5, 2013)

Good video. If that was my bunker the next sound that they would hear is the discharge of 5.56


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

Scotty12 said:


> Good video. If that was my bunker the next sound that they would hear is the discharge of 5.56


I have actually thought about this contingency, in my mental blue prints for a future "storm shelter"

A couple of thoughts,

In another thread it was discussed the ability to light a fire at the entrance or at the air inlet tube,

Also I have a fear of creating a "storm shelter" inside the square foot of my basement for instance in case their was a fire and you were in their.

I came to the conclusion that a seperated structure would be prefered, if under ground like the wise ground hog, a second point of entrance adds a security problem.

Solutions???

Under ground bunker with one entrance door, and a hatch mounted in the ceiling of the underground portion that opens in, so it could allow the dirt to cave into the bunker and be dug out in case the main entrace becomes blocked by debris. Also the main door should always open in, not out as the door opening could become obstructed by a falling tree, building etc.

As for the intruders outside, I thought a pipe nipple welded to the center of the door 30" from the floor with a ball valve threaded to it would provide a sealed peap hole, that would allow the barrell of a "personal defensive weapon" to be discharged through it to dispel a ram shackle crew of bad intentions to not attempt entry.

Thoughts, for securing your perimiter and escape from inside a storm shelter.


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

dwight55 said:


> South East Asia taught me that no man is an island, . . . and if we are going to get through this, . . . it WILL BE a team effort. Rambo won all the wars on the silver screen, but his lard butt would not have lasted 30 seconds in the middle of a true fire fight.
> 
> I don't have much, . . . certainly not enough to feed my whole neighborhood for months on end, . . . but we will get through it together, . . . or not at all.
> 
> ...


I agree 100% but I answered the question as if it were a choice between taking them in or turning them away. There's a big difference in my eyes between helping someone out and taking them in, to me taking them in implies that they will be staying with me and my family for an extended period of time, this would be reserved only for the people I call friends which isn't a very large portion of the population. Acquaintances I'll help out if they need it (maybe give them a crash course in how to hunt, give them medical attention if needed, give them some clothes or maybe a hot meal) and then send them on their way. I don't think I could live with myself if someone came to me for help and I turned them away and something happened to them.

-Infidel


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## rice paddy daddy (Jul 17, 2012)

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Make it too hard for the enemy to get in and it will be too hard for you to get out.
I prefer freedom of movement myself.


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

oswegoscott said:


> So,weak defensive positions are the way to go?


I'm not sure that's what he meant, I took it to mean you need to leave yourself some options. You need a secondary egress or even a tertiary egress. If you barricade yourself in you may never get out.

-Infidel


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

Yeah you're right about that for sure. Guess we all need to weigh the risks and decide for ourselves, personally I want a way out in case I get over run. I think a lot of it will depend on how close to civilization you really are. I'm pretty close to town even though it's a small one I figure I may have to deal with people looking for things they need and may have to run them off. If I get over run I need a way out. I'm not planning on bugging out unless I absolutely have to.

-Infidel


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

Infidel said:


> I agree 100% but I answered the question as if it were a choice between taking them in or turning them away. There's a big difference in my eyes between helping someone out and taking them in, to me taking them in implies that they will be staying with me and my family for an extended period of time, this would be reserved only for the people I call friends which isn't a very large portion of the population. Acquaintances I'll help out if they need it (maybe give them a crash course in how to hunt, give them medical attention if needed, give them some clothes or maybe a hot meal) and then send them on their way. I don't think I could live with myself if someone came to me for help and I turned them away and something happened to them.
> 
> -Infidel


Have you ever fed a stray cat a couple of times, "and then send them on their way" ...?


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## Deebo (Oct 27, 2012)

i have always thought about a long tunnel, with 12 gauge shells inside some welded nipples, set off by a rattrap, as some way to end a intruders intentions, but they would need to be from outside the tunnell, reloadable, resetable. dreamed them up after seeing one of the jigsaw movies where theres a gun at the peephole. Creepy, the things my mind comes up with. 
I guess it is a matter of what you feel will work, 2 or more exits, I would like an above ground concrete bunker somehow disguised, with a seperate underground one, but figure out a secret acces from inside the top.


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## Infidel (Dec 22, 2012)

alterego said:


> Have you ever fed a stray cat a couple of times, "and then send them on their way" ...?


I have no intention of feeding strays, I was talking specifically about people I am friendly with. Strays will be run off on sight. I'm not above using violence to run off freeloaders either especially in the event that they begin to affect my family and their security.

-Infidel


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## vulf (Feb 8, 2013)

Thank you for sharing your thoughts all, lots to think about and lots put into perspective.


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## alterego (Jan 27, 2013)

oswegoscott said:


> I think that a "safe room" is a good idea as a last resort to hole up in. If bad guys come for food,etc they are unlikely going to spend time and effort trying to ferret you out.
> Leave some food in cabinets ---they'll likely grab that and go. Why risk a load of buckshot when trying to break into your room?
> Now,if it's the military or similar you're screwed wherever you hide---they'll have explosives and big guns and guys covering all exits


I think you are very correct, in regard to "leave some food in cabinets" any distraction in a situation like that would be a welcome one.


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## The Fark Knight (Nov 16, 2012)

This is a darn good question. Living where I do, for as long as I have, I have grown up in a 50/50 mixture of mountain men and college hippies. The mountain men are family, the college hippies are friends. The discussion of prepping has come up several times between either party. I am content that if my family showed up at my dwelling after SHTF, I would not hesitate to let them in because they would have what they need to sustain themselves. My FRIENDS on the other hand....... would most likely "Prep" by stocking up on pot and Doritos :lol: SO- When my friends bring up the SHTF scenarios, I tell them very loud and clear that I will not sustain them for five minutes if they show up at my place. I try to tell them different reasons as to why, and I hope they will understand :roll:


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## Ripon (Dec 22, 2012)

If I turn someone away you can bet the reason why is simple - I don't have anything to give you. Now if they are stupid enough to call me a liar then we have other issues but at least that way they go forth and should they encounter someone seeking "intelligence" on where the goods are they don't go - hey Joe has plenty but won't share.



The Fark Knight said:


> This is a darn good question. Living where I do, for as long as I have, I have grown up in a 50/50 mixture of mountain men and college hippies. The mountain men are family, the college hippies are friends. The discussion of prepping has come up several times between either party. I am content that if my family showed up at my dwelling after SHTF, I would not hesitate to let them in because they would have what they need to sustain themselves. My FRIENDS on the other hand....... would most likely "Prep" by stocking up on pot and Doritos :lol: SO- When my friends bring up the SHTF scenarios, I tell them very loud and clear that I will not sustain them for five minutes if they show up at my place. I try to tell them different reasons as to why, and I hope they will understand :roll:


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## burkecj (Mar 27, 2013)

In our situation we'll most likely be encouraging all friends and family to relocate to where we are rather than turning them away. What we stand to gain from their labor and loyalty far outweighs the cost of feeding them.


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## rickkyw1720pf (Nov 17, 2012)

I could turn away my brothers and sisters and relatives my own age easier then my younger nieces and nephews. You can't tell a 7 or 8 year old they should have seen the writing on the wall and trying to convince myself that I can wash my hands of the situation because they are their parents responsibilities doesn't work either. Actually I have thought this may be the biggest reason I would bug out. Split up with the ones that are healthy and think it best to bug to another location and leave everything else to those that stay in which I would know that I gave them a much better chance than they would have had on their own.


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## brandonnash (Mar 11, 2013)

Being that most of my prepping is involving knowledge rather than stockpiling I doubt I would turn friends away, but rather explain that if they wanted help I would teach them how to provide on their own. I did that today with someone at work who is going camping this weekend.


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## Lucky Jim (Sep 2, 2012)

vulf said:


> Many of my Friends know I Prep and know my Home is in a great location when SHTF, and so many don't Prep at all let alone own a flashlight.
> What will you say to the ones that come that you can't keep or help, this gives me a sick feeling in my gut when I think about it. I can talk all the Macho I want but its gonna be hard either way.


Look at it this way- A friend who comes trying to leech off your supplies is no friend, he's a cheeky beggar who should have prepped himself, so GET MAD and tell him "Sorry there's only enough for me and my family" and shut the door in his face.
As a hub and dad your FIRST DUTY lies in protecting your wife and kids and nobody else, and every mouthfull of food you dish out to beggars means your kids will starve to death sooner rather than later.
Scenario- This kids parents quickly ran out of food because they were a soft touch by handing it out to every beggar that came along and have given her the last few morsels to keep her alive, and then they starved to death leaving her all alone in the big bad SHTF world, that's just plain BAD PARENTING!










Shakespeare's Henry V gives some good survival advice- _"In peace, there's nothing so becomes a man as modest stillness and humility, but when the blast of war blows in our ears, then imitate the action of the tiger!"_
In other words when it hits the fan we'll have to be tough to survive.. 
_"Don't you ever try begging food from me again or i'll give you a war you won't forget!"_


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## Kidzthinkimahoarder (Feb 11, 2013)

The thought of my boys having to do without in anyway would kill me..I'd starve myself first before they did without food.


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## JPARIZ (Feb 25, 2013)

rice paddy daddy said:


> Long ago and far away I learned not to let anyone become a good friend and get close to me.
> Today I have aquaintances, but only one neighbor would rise to the level of me sharing stuff with - and it just so happens he's an old Southeast Asia hand himself. Imagine that!:mrgreen:


We all tried that but someone always seems to sneak past the radar.


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## JPARIZ (Feb 25, 2013)

I'm pretty good at saying "get off my lawn" so most who didn't bother to prep are SOL. Kids who had no choice is another matter. I'd give up my last square of TP & cup of coffee for a kid. And yes, I've made provisions for that.


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## breakingcontact (Mar 25, 2013)

I'm new to this forum and find it comforting that there are people out there who even consider this sort of thing. Most are so worried about American Idol or paying their next debt induced bill. Sorry for the sidebar. Just felt an actual sense of calm reading this thread. Hope some of y'all are my neighbors.

Most of my friends know I'm into guns, most don't know about my other preparations. I do encourage them to consider what they have and how long it wouldn't last and to get the basics at least.

The notion from the movies is that there is some ultimately armed and prepared loaner who can make it on his own. Such a fantasy. That guy is going to fall asleep, get sick, get injured, have bad luck strike and so on. You need at least a small group to pull security, have different skill sets together, provide psychological motivation, provide force multiplication if you have to defend yourselves. Of course there are down sides to banding together but there are far more benefits.

That being said I need to connect closely to more like minded people.


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